updated 4/29/2010 9:19:55 AM ET 2010-04-29T13:19:55

Guests: Mike Honda, Brian Bilbray, Jesse Jackson, John Feehery, Laura

Flanders, Rep. George Miller, Katrina Vanden Heuvel.

HOST:  Good evening, Americans, and welcome to THE ED SHOW

tonight from New York.

These stories have got my hot buttons cranked up tonight. 

President Obama is taking the immigration issue head on, getting after

it.  He says Arizona‘s new immigration law will lead to American citizens

being harassed and having their civil rights violated. 

Much more on that in just a moment. 

The president‘s hometown of Chicago is in a state of emergency when it

comes to violent crime.  The Reverend Jesse Jackson is going to be sounding

the alarm on that.  We‘ll visit with him on the program. 

And the midterm momentum could be shifting to the Democrats, why one

Democratic leader is predicting a summer surge for the party. 

Plus, a new poll out shows racial profiling is not a good re-election

strategy for Republican Governor Jan Brewer.  We, of course, will have that

and a text poll coming up. 

This is the story that‘s got me fired up tonight. 

Racism, obviously, is never the way to go.  The Arizona anti-

immigration bill has ignited a firestorm of controversy across America with

copycat legislation on the way.  The president put it this way—

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES:  You can imagine if you

are Hispanic-American in Arizona, you‘re great grandparents may have been

there before Arizona was even a state.  But now, suddenly, if you don‘t

have your papers and you took your kid out to get ice cream, you‘re going

to be harassed.  That‘s something that could potentially happen.  That‘s

not the right way to go. 

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ:  You know, that sound bite really hit me.  I mean, the

magnitude of what the president just said. 

The president of the United States of America just talked to people in

a crowd saying you might be needing some papers to stay legal in America. 

Now, the president is a constitutional scholar and a person of color.  He

is uniquely qualified and understands why this law is un-American and

racist. 

The story also has the attention of America‘s top law enforcement

official.  He is Attorney General Eric Holder. 

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ERIC HOLDER, ATTORNEY GENERAL:  That law is an unfortunate one.  I

think that it is, I fear, subject to potential abuse.  And I‘m very

concerned about the wedge that it could draw between communities that law

enforcement is supposed to serve and those of us in law enforcement. 

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ:  I believe Eric Holder is absolutely right on that.  The

Arizona law abuses civil rights, equal rights, and the very Constitution

you conservatives for so many years have just wrapped yourselves in, saying

that the Democrats don‘t understand it. 

Republicans are starting to see the entire fake populist momentum die

because of this issue.  Tea Party golden boy and Florida GOP Senate

candidate Marco Rubio isn‘t on board.  Rubio said he was concerned about

the Arizona law‘s “reasonable suspicion provisions, where individuals can

be pulled over because someone suspects they may not be legal in this

country.”

Former Florida governor Jeb Bush understands why this isn‘t the way to

go.  He said, “It‘s difficult for me to imagine how you‘re going to enforce

this law.  It places a significant burden on local law enforcement, and you

have civil liberties issues that are significant as well.”

Amen to that. 

Even John McCain‘s buddy, Lindsey Graham, calls the law

unconstitutional.  The South Carolina senator said, “What happened in

Arizona is that good people are so afraid of an out-of-control border, that

they had to resort to a law that I think is unconstitutional.  It doesn‘t

represent the best way forward.”

OK.  So these Republicans are starting to warm up to the idea that,

you know, maybe this isn‘t a good idea.  Well, don‘t let Republicans fool

you.  They know immigration is what killed them in 2006 and in 2008.  The

grand old white party can‘t afford to look racist on immigration, can they? 

President Obama knows he has the righties cornered. 

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA:  I will bring the majority of Democrats to the table in getting

this done.  But I‘ve got to have some help from the other side. 

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ:  Don‘t bank on it.  The Republicans don‘t have the moral

character to do immigration right now. 

Their party is about one thing, and that is hating President Obama.  I

believe that.  That‘s my opinion.  I do not believe any way, shape or form

that Republicans want to see President Barack Obama have any success

whatsoever. 

The lack of Republican leadership at the federal level is opening the

door for racial, radical action at the state level.  Texas lawmaker Debbie

Riddle plans to introduce—now here we go—a similar bill in Texas. 

She said, “If our federal government did their job, then Arizona wouldn‘t

have to take this action, and neither would Texas.”

That‘s the mindset, the domino theory in all of this. 

This squandering political party has been smoked in the last two

election cycles because they don‘t have the guts to take on immigration

head on.  All they do is pander to the soft underbelly of the white,

uneducated, low-information voters.  They want them to be afraid.

Play the fear card.  Why?  Because it works. 

This is their chance to put the racist element of the Republican Party

in the past and move forward.  But I don‘t think they‘ve got the character

or the culture to do it. 

Get your cell phones out, folks.  Want to know what you think about

all of this tonight.

Tonight‘s text survey question is: Do you think the United States

attorney general should try to stop Arizona‘s anti-immigration law?  Text

“A” for yes and text “B” for no to 622639.  We‘ll bring you the results

later on in the show. 

Joining me now is California Congressman Mike Honda.  He co-sponsored

a comprehensive immigration reform bill in the House.  He strongly

denounces the Arizona bill. 

Congressman, good to have you with us tonight. 

We know where you stand on this Arizona bill.  You‘re against it.  You

think it‘s a racist bill. 

But what do you say to American workers who lose their jobs to

undocumented workers because they come in and do the job cheaper?  Is that

the free market at work, or is that an injustice?  What do you think? 

REP. MIKE HONDA (D), CALIFORNIA:  Well, it‘s neither.  I don‘t think

that‘s even true, that the undocumented are taking jobs away from other

folks.  We know in a lot of places in California, those who are

undocumented have gone back to Mexico or to other places where they came

from.  So it‘s a bogus argument. 

SCHULTZ:  Congressman, I have to challenge you on that.  There are

construction workers in this country who have lost their jobs because they

are demanding a higher salary.  And construction owners take the cheaper

labor which are undocumented workers. 

Now, respectfully, you don‘t think that‘s happening? 

HONDA:  Well, if it‘s happening, then they‘re not going to get the

high quality work that union or well-skilled men can provide. 

Getting back to the Arizona—the issue of Arizona—

SCHULTZ:  Well, wait a minute.  Before you get back to Arizona, I

really want to clear this up.  I want to make sure we‘re crystal clear on. 

You think American workers are not losing their jobs to undocumented

workers? 

HONDA:  Well, I was in Mexico, in Zacatecas, and I was visiting this

town, the city called Juarez.  And a lot of the folks there who admitted

that they had gone to the United States to find work, came back because

there‘s no work. 

And so those folks who are doing those—that used to do that work

have left.  And if there‘s any jobs left, I don‘t think that there‘s going

to be that kind of competition.  I don‘t think that it makes that kind of

economic impact.  And I think that the size of the problem that is being

pointed out is not—doesn‘t measure to this kind of complex problem that

we‘re faced with in the other areas of immigration reform. 

SCHULTZ:  Well, respectfully, Congressman, I‘d have to challenge you

on that.  I could bring in union leader after union leader on here telling

that you that there‘s a lot of folks that are out of work because we‘ve got

an illegal immigration problem. 

I don‘t agree at all with what‘s happening in Arizona, in the way

they‘re going about it.  I think it does set up the table for racial

profiling and a lot of injustices.  But in the same sense, we‘ve got

American workers who are not at work because it‘s all about cheap labor. 

What should Arizona do, in your opinion?  What should we do as a

country with this issue? 

HONDA:  Well, as a country, then, the issue of losing jobs to the

undocumented, let‘s, number one, provide a way for them so they can become

documented and legalized.  The other is, let‘s look at those folks who are

hiring folks who are not documented and do something about that.  And

that‘s probably one of the things that we want to—we‘re going to need to

address in the comprehensive immigration reform. 

SCHULTZ:  Do you think a lot of this stems from just a dislike for the

president of the United States? 

HONDA:  Well, I think that there were a lot of people who were

xenophobic before the president was there.  But it doesn‘t set aside the

possibility that they don‘t like a successful Democratic president that‘s

been there and stuck out some of the toughest issues that this country has

ever faced, and was successful.  And I think that they‘re afraid that he

may be successful on this one, and I would like to have that challenge put

before us. 

SCHULTZ:  Congressman—

HONDA:  And let me just make a real quick comment about Arizona. 

SCHULTZ:  Sure. 

HONDA:  The law is requiring or telling law enforcement folks that

they have to do certain kinds of things based upon suspicion.  Well, the

Arizona Association of Chiefs of Police and Sheriffs came out against the

Arizona bill, and they said that it‘s burdensome and an intrusion into a

federal role, and that the local police agencies, they depend upon having

confidence of the people in the community in order to get information about

crimes that are about to be committed.  And without that unput, you know,

crime is going to run rampant.  And so, you know, the police department

understands that trust and confidence with the community, regardless of

their situation, is critical in making sure that the people are safe. 

SCHULTZ:  Sure it is.

Congressman, good to have you with us tonight.  Thank you for—

HONDA:  Thank you very much. 

SCHULTZ:  -- bringing us that information tonight, although, I have to

say that I—doing a radio talk show, I have an opportunity to talk to a

lot of Americans across this country.  And I have heard phone call after

phone call in recent days since Arizona has taken this issue on at a state

level that one of the big things and one of the big issues for American

workers is that they are losing jobs to undocumented workers. 

Now, that‘s not left.  It‘s not right.  It‘s not center.  It‘s the way

it is. 

And if you have workers flooding our market, somebody isn‘t going to

be working.  And it is all about cheap labor. 

You have the Republicans over here who absolutely love cheap labor. 

And I‘m not quite sure I buy the argument that this is some kind of a

strategy that the Democrats are using so they can get more people and get

more votes.  I‘m not in that camp. 

Let‘s turn now to Congressman Brian Bilbray, who is the chairman of

the Immigration Reform Caucus. 

Congressman, good to have you with us tonight. 

You‘re from San Diego.  And I have been down in San Diego, and I would

venture to say that if you were to take all the undocumented workers out of

San Diego, you wouldn‘t have a restaurant industry. 

Is that a fair statement?

REP. BRIAN BILBRAY ®, CALIFORNIA:  Well, Ed, I was born and raised

literally on the border, so I have to say that the great majority of

foreign-born individuals who are working, most of our businesses, specialty

services, are legal.  We‘ve got the advantage that we‘re able to have

people come across the border legally, work through the day, and go back. 

So, our real problem is the violence, the crime, and the related costs

of that, that gets over there.  So, you know, somebody who has grown up

with this issue, I‘ve got to just tell you, it is kind of frustrating, the

way everybody wants to play brinkmanship here, but they don‘t want to admit

the terrible truths here. 

More people die every year trying to come into this country illegally,

and were killed in the Oklahoma explosion.  But everybody is hungry for the

cheap labor. 

I think you‘re legitimate, that a lot of this driving is because you

have got businesses that want to exploit cheap labor.  And that‘s the

number one source of illegal immigration.  If we did more to crack down on

those employers like Congressman Shuler wants to do, we really can nip this

in the bud. 

SCHULTZ:  All right.  Congressman, this crosses all party lines.  I

think we have found some common ground here. 

You think that it is imperative—and maybe that‘s too strong a word

but how you would describe what we have to do as a country to go after

those who are writing the checks for the cheap labor to the undocumented

workers?  I don‘t care what party you‘re in, it‘s wrong.  It‘s against the

law.  And it‘s creating a problem. 

Would you go along with that? 

BILBRAY:  Absolutely.  And, Ed, the way we do it is the way that

Congressman Shuler, a Democrat from North Carolina, and many Democrats and

Republicans sign on to, the SAVE Act, and use the E-Verify that the federal

government and even Congress—and let me tell you, if Congress can use a

system, anybody can use it. 

President Obama just implemented it for all federal contractors, and

it‘s a quick, simple way of knowing who‘s legal and who‘s not legal to work

in this country.  And once you do that, you separate those employers when

they accidentally hire somebody from those who are purposely doing it.  And

then you can really crack down on these guys. 

But the problem is it‘s just being held up.  We can do this bipartisan

if you allow us to get it done. 

SCHULTZ:  Well, I‘ll allow you to get it done.  I think it‘s long

overdue.  But I think it‘s interesting that, all of a sudden, it‘s boiled

to this point in Arizona.

I mean it‘s been this way for years, as you just said.  So why wasn‘t

this done on President Bush‘s watch?  It‘s almost as if they‘re trying to

target this problem because they don‘t like President Obama.  At least

that‘s my perspective. 

But let me ask you—we‘re starting to see some copycat legislation. 

Utah, Colorado, Texas, even Ohio is talking about this. 

Is this the right way to go?  Don‘t you think this sets the table for

racial profiling? 

BILBRAY:  Well, Ed, actually, we do this under a federal program

called 287-G all over this country.  And you have got to remember when you

read the law, you‘ve got to read—take a look at it.  But it says that

you can only use probable cause if you have a legal contact.  In other

words, you pull over somebody in a van, and all at once 35 people next to

the border runs out.  The law enforcement officer is going to think it‘s

suspicious.

SCHULTZ:  OK.  So is the president wrong?  I mean, the president

thinks—and the example that he gave was that you might be in this

country for a long time and, all of a sudden, you might be targeted by law

enforcement. 

Do you think the president is overreaching on that? 

BILBRAY:  I don‘t think the president‘s read the bill.  The president

is implementing the G program across this country.  So I think if the

president takes the time as Dan Lungren, who is a former attorney general

of California, read it, and said, boy, this is nothing like what is being

claimed it is. 

And so I think once the president looks at it, the quotes and the

conditions in this bill were actually taken right from the Supreme Court

rulings, that condition, when an officer can make contact or not, you have

probable cause, is by far the constitutional way.  And that‘s why it‘s

important that the governor—

SCHULTZ:  Well, reasonable suspicion and probable cause are two

different things. 

I‘m out of time in this segment.  Got to have you back to talk more

about it.  I appreciate you joining us tonight, Congressman.  Thank you. 

BILBRAY:  Thank you very much.  And keep standing up for the working

class jobs.  OK? 

SCHULTZ:  It is about the working folks.  There‘s no doubt about it. 

I mean, it‘s all about fairness, and it‘s about protecting the laws, but

not having racial profiling.  I think we can reach it. 

Coming up, Fox News founder Roger Ailes, he‘s become a bigger “Psycho

Talker” than O‘Reilly, Beck and Hannity all  rolled into one.  I‘ll tell

you about that.  Well, actually, you can decide in the “Zone.”

And the RNC is accusing the president and the party of shamelessly

race baiting.  Really?  It sure takes one to know one. 

More on that at the bottom of the hour. 

Plus, Rielle Hunter tells Oprah she‘s not a home wrecker. 

And the Coast Guard is setting that oil slick on fire.

You‘re watching THE ED SHOW on MSNBC.  Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCHULTZ:  Welcome back to THE ED SHOW and thanks for watching tonight.

This is a serious story, big-time.  Violent crimes have surged in the

city of Chicago this year.  So far, in 2010, murders are more than 10

percent higher than the same time this year of 2009.  Now, this equals the

number of American soldiers killed in Iraq and Afghanistan this year. 

Reverend Jesse Jackson says Chicago is in a state of emergency.  In a

piece in “The Huffington Post,” he emphasizes the need for government to

address the poverty that drives up crime rates. 

He writes, “Just as we have decided that Wall Street banks are too big

to fail, the growing number of poor and the unemployed are too big to

abandon.  They must no longer be told to wait.  Those in the zones of pain,

whether rural Appalachian or Alabama, are too big to fail as well.”

Reverend Jesse Jackson joins us to night. 

Reverend, thanks for taking this issue on.  It is huge.  And I think

it has a lot to do with the fact of gutting our infrastructure, outsourcing

jobs.  And it‘s all coming home to roost. 

Reverend, what do you think? 

REV. JESSE JACKSON, RAINBOW PUSH COALITION:  You‘re looking at the

cities, plants closing, jobs leaving, tax base eroding, homes facing

foreclosure, drugs and guns coming.  And there is no policy to offset that

rhythm. 

It‘s not just the number who are killed, but injured.  Last week, in a

12-hour span, 25 were shot, seven killed.  So the growth industry happens

to be emergency rooms and funeral homes.  And so this is now in the class

of a state of emergency.

We need right now to address it in a meaningful way.  And I‘m

convinced that part of it has to do with 25 percent adult unemployment, 50

percent youth unemployment, with no place to go.  We need targeted jobs and

job training, open up these trade unions for skilled development, and

organize adult recreation, and revive the ban on assault weapons. 

SCHULTZ:  OK.  A ban on assault weapons is what you‘re talking about. 

Also, targeted jobs and job training; organized and regulated recreation

for kids; a comprehensive urban policy plan. 

Do you think this will turn it around?  And where‘s the money going to

come from? 

JACKSON:  Well, the money—they have to determine priorities.  We

bail Wall Street out without linkage to reinvestment, without linkage to

lending.  And so now they‘re debating, how much of it should they have for

bonuses?  In the substance (ph) of abandoned urban America.

And these numbers keep rising.  There is a growing sense of

desperation. 

We‘re cutting teachers‘ jobs and closing schools.  We‘re cutting

public transportation.  Workers are being cut -- 1,100 workers were cut,

routes are cut and fares up.  We‘re cutting public housing.  And so there‘s

no plan that which is essential, jobs and development. 

SCHULTZ:  Yes.  What about bringing in the National Guard?  The city‘s

mayor and also the police superintendent, they‘re not in favor of that.  Do

you think that needs to be done? 

JACKSON:  Well, at least it ought to be a matter of discussion,

because it‘s embarrassing to the mayor.  But the people who are being shot,

it‘s painful. 

I sent 120 children to—on a tour of schools two weeks ago.  One of

the kids in front of his house and the recreation park was shot.  He‘s

still in the hospital.

And so, many kids would not go to school, are afraid to go to school. 

Others cannot open businesses, afraid people will not shop. 

So you have these zones of danger.  And we should not have to live

that way.  This is absolutely an emergency, and it must be declared as

such. 

SCHULTZ:  Is it as bad as the ‘60s, or worse?  What do you think?

JACKSON:  It‘s a different kind of—this kind of urban abandonment

terror is different. 

In the ‘60s, we were marching (INAUDIBLE).  That was one kind of a

reaction.  But the idea now of having so much—you know, in Chicago, it‘s

illegal to sell guns.  But they‘re about to—a ban that won the Supreme

Court. 

But there are nine gun shops around the city.  We know where the guns

are made.  We know where they‘re sold from. 

In Iraq, we would call these insurgents.  In Iraq, if we knew where

the guns were made and sold, we‘d break it up. 

Somehow, in America, we don‘t quite get it.  So we say, look at

Afghanistan.  We say—Kabul says it is urgent.  We need a budget,

security, targets and timetables. 

We need the same plan for urban America—urgency, budget, goals,

targets, timetables.  We can no longer abandon urban America without paying

a big price for it.  And it‘s just fundamentally wrong to leave people in

this predicament. 

SCHULTZ:  Reverend Jackson, we‘ll bring you back, obviously, to talk

about that immigration issue when we have more time.  I appreciate your

time on this issue tonight.

JACKSON:  Man, dragnet justice is just un-American, immoral and

unconstitutional. 

SCHULTZ:  Yes.  Good to have you with us, Reverend.  Thank you. 

Coming up, Roger Ailes may have spent too much time in the Florida sun

this week.  He‘s acting crazier than a fox in a hen house.  He‘ll bake in

the “Zone” next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCHULTZ:  And in “Psycho Talk” tonight, the head of the right-wing

network across the street, Roger Ailes.

Well, in a speech down in Florida the other day, he attacked the

health care bill as unconstitutional.  But then, afterwards, he tried to

pass himself off as an unbiased media guy saying, “I don‘t do politics, I

do news.”

Not only do you do politics, Roger, your people fundraise for the

Republican Party.  Didn‘t you notice? 

Last week, Media Matters identified 20 Fox News personalities who have

endorsed, raised money or campaigned for Republicans.  But Roger continued

to defend his network when he was asked about Hannity being yanked for

hosting a show at a Cincinnati Tea Party fund-raiser. 

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROGER AILES,  PRESIDENT, FOX NEWS:  Sometimes mistakes happen.  If

they happen, you go on the air quickly, say this is what happened, this is

what we did, and keep moving.  And that‘s what we do. 

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ:  Well, you may want to communicate that policy to the rest of

Fox News, because that‘s not what they do.  Hannity never addressed the

decision to cancel his Tea Party appearance.

And remember when Bill O‘Reilly threw this lie out?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BILL O‘REILLY, FOX NEWS:  We researched to find out if anybody on Fox

News had ever said you‘re going to jail if you don‘t buy health insurance. 

Nobody‘s ever said it. 

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ:  That‘s one of my all-time favorites.  Even after the other

media outlets pulled all the clips of people on Fox News saying that the

health care bill would send you to jail, O‘Reilly still didn‘t admit his

mistake.  In fact, he doubled down on the lie.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BILL O‘ REILLY, FOX NEWS ANCHOR:  What I said is absolutely true. 

Nobody at Fox News reported inaccurately about the Obama-care prison

situation.  Nobody. 

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ:  Roger, they‘re doing news, huh?  Even after all the crazy.

Roger still wasn‘t done.  The nut truly earned his wing by comparing Sarah

Palin to former vice-presidential candidate Geraldine Ferraro. 

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

AILES:  Geraldine Ferraro has been a contributor to Fox News for over

ten years.  We never had any problems with that.  Suddenly we sign Sarah

Palin in a similar position, and we have a problem.  Now whose fault is

that?  We think we are fair and balanced.  We think the others aren‘t.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ:  Roger, you thinking that what your network does is news, let

alone fair and balanced, is psycho talk. 

Coming up, aside from a whole lot of drama, I don‘t think the Congress

accomplished anything in their Golden smackdown yesterday.  I‘ve been

accused of being too hard on the Dems.  Hey, I‘m just calling it the way I

see it.  Put this to my panel coming up, with rapid fire response. 

And get this, the Coast Guard just approved a plan to light the oil

spill on fire.  I‘ll tell you how they‘re going to be doing that in the

Playbook.  Plus, righties are saying that the president is playing the race

card from the bottom of the deck.  I‘ll explain.  I‘ve got my thoughts on

that coming up next.  Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCHULTZ:  The Battle Ground tonight.  Welcome back to THE ED SHOW, and

thanks for watching.  Well, it looks like the Democrats have found the soft

underbelly of the Republicans.  They just can‘t pull an all nighter, can

they?  Now I‘m going to quote the Goldman Sachs here, “this is a bleeping

deal.”  Senate Democrats called three votes to start debate on financial

reform.  The GOP held the party line and voted against every single one of

them.  The third one was today. 

Today, the Democrats said, OK, all right, we‘ll stay here all night if

necessary, even if we have to rollout the cots.  Well, suddenly, the

Republicans, well, we can‘t do that.  That would screw up the country club. 

Just moments ago, the Senate voted unanimously to move to debate to

tomorrow afternoon, which is all good. 

All this nonsense and time wasted just to start the debate.  Then

we‘ll have another vote to actually pass the bill.  And the Republicans are

going to be obstructing that all over again, and again and again.  That‘s

why I just can‘t get too fired up about yesterday‘s dog and pony show on

the Hill!

(BEGNI VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. CARL LEVIN (D), MICHIGAN:  July 1, 2007, tells the sales force

the top priority is Timberwolf.  Your top priority to sell is that

(EXPLETIVE DELETED) deal. 

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  My comment is I didn‘t recall the sales. 

LEVIN:  OK, you‘re trying to sell a (EXPLETIVE DELETED) deal and it‘s

your top priority.  Come on, Mr. Sparks.  Should Goldman Sachs be trying to

sell—and by the way, it sold a lot of it after that date.  Should

Goldman Sachs be trying to sell a (EXPLETIVE DELETED) deal? 

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  Well—

LEVIN:  Can you answer that one yes or no? 

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ:  That‘s great stuff, isn‘t it?  We going to get any

legislation out that of that?  Maybe.  The Goldman hearing was nothing but

political grandstanding, in my opinion.  I don‘t believe financial reform

is going to get done.  I don‘t.  The Republicans don‘t want to rein in Wall

Street.  And they will never get onboard with anything this president wants

to do.  They‘ll take their chances in the midterm and vilify the Democrats. 

That‘s the plan. 

I want to get some rapid fire from our panel on this, plus these three

stories tonight.  In the Heartland, President Obama issues his harshest

criticism of Arizona‘s anti-immigration law.  He flat out says it will lead

to American citizens being harassed. 

The RNC is accusing President Obama and the DNC chair, Tim Kaine, of

race baiting to turn out Democrats in the midterms. 

And I‘ll get our panel‘s take on the Senate Republicans‘ caving on

debating the financial reform bill.

With us to night, Laura Flanders, author of “Blue Grit,” and host of

“Grit TV,” and John Feehery, Republican strategist, who I appreciate always

starts this show with a good smile on his face.  And then sometimes it goes

down hill from there. 

John, good to have you with us.  Laura, nice to have you with us. 

Always a spirited debate. 

All right, what‘s going on?  How, in your opinion—or maybe you

don‘t agree with the RNC here, John—is the president race baiting. 

JOHN FEEHERY, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST:  I think what the president is

trying to do is trying to turn out his base.  I think he sees that as the

African-American vote and Latino vote.  He said that.  And that, in a

sense, instead of appealing to all the American people, he is trying to

appeal to certain segments of the population.  In a sense, I think the RNC

is right.  He is trying to turn out his base, his base based on race.  I

think that‘s wrong.  He should try to appeal to al the American people. 

SCHULTZ:  Laura, what do you think? 

LAURA FLANDERS, “GRIT TV”:  You know, when you want to go up against

anti-racists, you call them racists.  Up against anti-sexists, you call

them sexists.  It‘s the oldest trick in the book.  The point here is that

Republicans don‘t have any actual policies to attract their voters to the

polls.  So, instead, they‘re going to sell them paranoia.  The Democrats

are doing nothing wrong except calling those who voted for them in 2008,

disproportionately, to turn out again for the midterms.  This is bunk. 

SCHULTZ:  All right, let‘s talk about the law in Arizona.  The

president has weighed in on this on the stump yesterday with his middle

class tour.  Here it is. 

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA:  You can imagine if you are a Hispanic-American in Arizona,

your great grandparents may have been there before Arizona was even a

state.  But now suddenly if you don‘t have your papers and you took your

kid out to get ice cream, you‘re going to be harassed.  That‘s something

that could potentially happen.  That‘s not the right way to go. 

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ:  Laura, it sounds like the president has made up his mind. 

What do you think?

FLANDERS:  I hope it‘s not like financial reform, a lot of

grandstanding and then no actual change comes out of it.  What Arizona‘s

going to go the way over this that it did over the Dr. King holiday. 

Eventually it‘s going to blink.  We‘re going to see a change.  It‘s going

to be declared unconstitutional, this law, I bet. 

In the meantime, let‘s think about those people and what their lives

are going to be like living there between now and then.  They say it‘s not

about race.  They say oh, no, we won‘t be racially profiling.  But that‘s

what this is, legal racial profiling.  And people are going to suffer until

it gets rolled back. 

SCHULTZ:  What do you think, John?  That was a strong statement by the

president. 

FEEHERY:  I think it‘s an unfortunate use of language.  I would like

someone to be sympathetic to the folks whose houses are getting broken

into, the rancher who got killed, the people who are being abused by folks

who are coming in from over the border and causing all the crime. 

(CROSS TALK)

FEEHERY:  -- two of most violent states in America.  That‘s because of

the influx of the drug war, really, over the border.  And it‘s really

unfortunate because the situation is desperate in Arizona.  And the

president needs to fix the problem and not try to make the situation worse. 

SCHULTZ:  The president has doubled the DEA agents.  He has doubled

the ATF agents.  They put more troops—should I say more law enforcement

officials on the border.  The fact is there is already laws on the books to

deal with all the crime that‘s taking place.  John, isn‘t this just a

manpower issue at this point? 

FEEHERY:  I think it is a manpower issue.  I think it needs some

focus.  The fact of the matter is it‘s not the focus.  The drug war is

spilling out over the border.  And it‘s putting our citizens in danger. 

FLANDERS:  Violent crime of 100,000 of the population in Arizona is

down in 2009 over 2005.  There are some facts out here that are simply

being misrepresented. 

SCHULTZ:  So, Laura, I have not heard that.  Violent crime is down in

Arizona? 

FLANDERS:  Compare 2005 to 2008.  There were more crimes per 100,000

population in 2005 than there are today. 

SCHULTZ:  So when you take a look at what the Arizona residents are

saying, 70 percent of the residents say that they‘re in favor of what is

taking place here with this law. 

FLANDERS:  Pandering works at the polls.  Let‘s face it, we‘ve had to

struggle against this kind of pandering our whole lives in this country. 

We‘ll keep moving in the direction of greater progress and diversity. 

People live in mixed communities today.  We‘re not going back.  But these

kind of laws don‘t help. 

SCHULTZ:  I tell you, the debate is hitting every state in the union. 

You‘re looking at Texas now talking about a copycat law, along with

Colorado, Utah, and Ohio.  And look what‘s happening down in Alabama in the

gubernatorial race, where the Republican Tim James went so far as to say

this: if he‘s governor, it‘s going to be speaking English.  Here it is. 

We believe it‘s coming.  Here it is. 

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TIM JAMES, CANDIDATE FOR GOVERNOR OF ALABAMA:  I‘m Tim James.  Why do

our politicians make us give driver‘s license exams in 12 languages?  This

is Alabama.  We speak English.  If you want to live here, learn it.  We‘re

only giving that test in English if I‘m governor. 

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ:  What do you think, Laura? 

FLANDERS:  The issues in the American mind today are the war, are

jobs, are the economy, Wall Street reform, health care, you name it. 

SCHULTZ:  But does that play—does that commercial play to a certain

sect of the population that would be so strong to get him elected? 

FLANDERS:  Who the heck knows what happens here?  But what I‘m looking

at and what I think is important is where are the policy proposals?  Where

are the response to American crisis?  This is, again, paranoia and

distraction.  Will it work?  Maybe.  But I don‘t think that‘s what we‘re

going to see really turn the tide in November. 

SCHULTZ:  Is it that, John?  What do you think? 

FEEHERY:  Well, I think it is jobs.  I think it‘s security.  I think

it‘s the future of the country.  I think that, for some folks, English is

an important—English as an official language is an important issue.  But

I think mostly it is jobs and the economy and the future of the country and

debt.  I think those are the bigger issues. 

SCHULTZ:  But that commercial, do you think that‘s a good thing?  I

mean, isn‘t that race baiting in that commercial, John?  I mean, we know

who doesn‘t speak English. 

FEEHERY:  I don‘t think it‘s race baiting.  I think English as an

official language has been an issue that has been in the American political

spectrum for a long time.  This guy is using it.  I don‘t think, you know,

it‘s race baiting whatsoever. 

SCHULTZ:  OK.  Laura Flanders, John Feehery, good to have you us with

tonight.

Coming up, Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid could be in for a major

surprise this November.  I think the health care bill is going to expand

their majority.  I‘ll ask a man who helped it make it happen.  He‘s

optimistic.  California Congressman George Miller is next on THE ED SHOW. 

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCHULTZ:  In our Playbook tonight, it‘s worker‘s memorial day, which

honors all workers who die, are injured or get sick on the job.  Today, the

president of the United States issued a proclamation recognizing the

occasion and mentioned the 29 miners who were killed in the explosion in

West Virginia mine earlier this month.  At a Senate hearing yesterday,

United Mine Workers President Cecil Roberts spoke about the unjust risk

miners face as they go off to work. 

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CECIL ROBERTS, UNITED MINE WORKERS:  A young man of 25 years old wrote

his mother and his fiancee a letter.  He has a young baby, which I happened

to meet on Sunday.  And said if I die in this coal mine, please tell

everyone that I love them.  That‘s the kind of letter people used to write

when they went off to Vietnam in my era.  That‘s not the kind of letters

they‘re supposed to write when they get their dinner bucket and go to work

in the United States of America. 

Congress should stand up and take a position.  We‘re not going to

tolerate this.  This is the United States of America. 

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ:  Joining me now is Democratic Congressman George Miller, a

Californian.  He is chair of the Education and Labor Committee and sits on

the Natural Resources Committee.  Congressman, good to have you with us

tonight on this very serious subject.  I don‘t think anybody could say it

any better than Cecil Roberts.  Is it time for action?  Will something

happen in the wake of this terrible travesty? 

REP. GEORGE MILLER (D), CALIFORNIA:  I think clearly it‘s time for

action.  I do believe that the Congress will respond.  The Senate has

started its hearings.  We have initiated our investigation.  And we‘re

fully prepared to do that.  We understand exactly what has taken place

here.  The mining laws, the mine safety laws have been controlled by the

mining industry.  The loopholes have been created by the mining industry. 

And too many administrations have looked the other way as those loopholes

have been created. 

You listen to the mine safety organization say yesterday in front of

the Senate how long it has been—and in some cases, they have never used

provisions of the law, because they knew if they use the provisions of the

law, there would be a political response from the mining companies, through

their elected representatives, and to the Congress of the United States, or

to the administration. 

That has got to stop.  These miners are right.  Cecil Roberts is

right.  When they go to work, they have to assume that they‘re coming home

safe at night and so do their families. 

SCHULTZ:  Congressman, what‘s it take to shut down a mine?  Is there

going to be any legislation put on the table that will change the criteria? 

Two or three violations in a row, you have to shut her down until you

address it?  Why can‘t Congress be more strict about that? 

MILLER:  It‘s the only penalty that they fully understand.  If you

look at the history of these mines, these miners are put up against the

corporate policy that is production over safety.  When in doubt, you choose

production.  If you don‘t, you‘re not a good miner.  You‘re not meeting

your responsibility to the corporation.  That‘s how you get into these

unsafe situations, because miners are terrified of telling about the

hazards that are present, afraid that they will be fired, the retributions

will be taken against them or their families. 

This has got to stop.  I mean, this is from the 17th century.  It‘ got

to stop in this country. 

SCHULTZ:  I think it speaks volumes that Mr. Blankenship did not show

up at the hearing or anybody on the mining company on the question on this. 

Let‘s switch subjects now.  I want to talk about health care for just a

moment.  This is Jim Clyburn, your colleague, talking about the health care

bill and how they‘re going to handle it on the road talking to

constituents. 

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. JIM CLYBURN (D), MAJORITY WHIP:  We‘re going to go out to the

American people and, as Terry has said, let them know exactly what‘s s in

this bill.  What we have to do now is go out and respond to a lot of these

questions that have been raised and misrepresentations that have been made

about this legislation.  We plan to do that. 

I think you‘re going to see a marked difference in this August than

what you heard last August. 

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ:  What do you think, Congressman Miller.  Is this just a

matter of time before you can really explain the benefits of this bill? 

Will there be a windfall for the Democrats? 

MILLER:  I think we‘ve been explaining since the bill is passed. 

Already, we have to catch up, because the insurance companies have fallen

in line and said they‘re going to keep children on the policies until

they‘re 26.  They said they‘re not going to yank policies away your policy

any longer just when you need.  They take you policy away.  Insurance

companies have agreed not to do that.  People with preexisting conditions

will be able to go to—

(CROSS TALK) 

MILLER:  Ed, these are benefits that are going to people realize right

now.  Right now, the insurance companies are saying, because they

understand that the public is against them, and against the activities that

they‘ve engage in the past that have been so expensive and have caused the

loss of insurance for millions of American families. 

SCHULTZ:  Congressman, great to have you with us tonight.  Thanks so

much.  I think it will help the Democrats in the midterm. 

Final page in our Playbook tonight, the oil spill in the Gulf of

Mexico is growing larger.  Crews are still unable to stop the leak; 42,000

gallons of oil a day continue to pour into the ocean.  The slick now covers

around 4,400 square miles, almost the size of Jamaica.  As of this morning,

it was 15 miles off of the coast of Louisiana. 

The Coast Guard has approved a series of small contained fires to help

burn off the oil off the surface.  The first test burn was just started

about 30 minutes -- 30 miles east of the Mississippi Delta. 

Coming up, Arizona Governor Jan Brewer‘s new immigration law could

land her in the unemployment line.  “The Nation‘s” Katrina Vanden Heuvel

will join me next to talk about this issue. 

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCHULTZ:  Finally, tonight on THE ED SHOW, I find it ironic that the

RNC is accusing Democrats of race baiting as Republicans in Arizona are

legalizing racial profiling.  The left doesn‘t have to scare minorities

into voting Democratic.  The Republicans are taking care of all of that by

themselves.  In Arizona, a new poll shows Hispanics are flocking to

Democratic candidate Terry Goddard for governor, who is challenging the

Republican Governor Jan Brewer. 

A new Public Policy poll shows Goddard with a slim lead over Brewer,

47 to 44.  Among white voters, Brewer leads Goddard by eight points, 49

percent to 41 percent.  She got a bump after signing the anti-immigration

law, but it‘s nowhere near the bump Goddard got from Hispanic voters.  He

now has a 46-point advantage over Brewer.  

Joining me now is Katrina Vanden H Heuvel, editor of “The Nation.” 

Katrina, is this just a sleeping giant that has awakened in Arizona in

favor of the Democrats? 

KATRINA VANDEN HEUVEL, “THE NATION”:  Well, we‘ve seen this giant

awaken over the last many years.  This is a political crisis for the

Republicans.   It‘s mostly a pale, male, stale party, and it‘s pushing

these mean, unjust, Draconian laws in the face of a unified, surging,

engaged Latino electorate.  Yes, we‘re going to see real gains.  It‘s a

moral crisis, too, but politically, you‘re seeing the over-reach, the

demagoguery of Jan Brewer in Arizona. 

You have Jeb Bush, you have Tea Partier Rubio in Florida, Mike

Huckabee, you even have right wing nativist Tom Tancredo saying this is

going to become a full-time employment program for constitutional lawyers,

and not bring any security to the citizens of Arizona. 

So, yes, it‘s a crisis for the Republican party.  But the vacuum that

was left by the failure to push through comprehensive immigration reform,

which is now a real priority, is what you‘re going to see in Arizona.  What

you see, that‘s what the consequences of failure to move on a clear pathway

to citizenship for 12 million undocumented immigrants. 

SCHULTZ:  It seems like the politically hip thing to do right now, if

you‘re a legislator, is to bring forth the same kind of bill Arizona has. 

They‘re doing that in a number of states.  What do you think? 

VANDEN HEUVEL:  I think it‘s going to kill them.  I mean, I look back

to history, Ed, look at 1994, prop 187.  Pete Wilson, he rides a short

little wave of racially ethnic grievance, but he then marginalized the

Republican party in that state into irrelevance.  This is a big mistake for

the Republican party.  I think this is a critical moment for the party to

think sorting moral and political seriousness, because those who want to

have any future for the Republican party in this country, which has a

demographic arc, bringing Latino voters, a surging new American majority in

these next decades—they‘re going to consign themselves to the dust bin

of history if they continue with these mean, ugly, Draconian policies that

do nothing, again, for the real problems and the security of citizens in

Arizona and around this world—this country. 

SCHULTZ:  I thought the president was really well defined on this. 

VANDEN HEUVEL:  Very human. 

SCHULTZ:  When he made that comment last night. 

VANDEN HEUVEL:  He‘s talking about the fact that you might see John

McCain, one of his daughters, be picked up in the streets of Arizona

because she has brown skin.  So I think this kind of state-sanctioned

racial profiling -- 

SCHULTZ:  It‘s dangerous.  Yes. 

VANDEN HEUVEL:  Dangerous, very dangerous for our country that prides

itself on being a decent, law-abiding country. 

SCHULTZ:  Katrina, great to have you with us tonight.  Thanks so much. 

Our text survey question, I asked you, should the United States

attorney general try to stop Arizona‘s anti-immigration law.  Seventy five

percent of you said yes; 25 percent of you said no. 

That‘s THE ED SHOW.  I‘m Ed Schultz.  “HARDBALL” with Chris Matthews

starts right now.  We‘ll see you tomorrow night, right here on MSNBC. 

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY

BE UPDATED.

END   

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