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'The Last Word with Lawrence O'Donnell' for Monday, November 14, 2011

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Guests: Gloria Allred, Victor Zuckerman, Maggie Haberman, Ed Goeas, Ed Rendell, Bob Costas, Goldie Taylor

LAWRENCE O`DONNELL, HOST: Newton Leroy Gingrich was the forgotten
candidate until Rick Perry and Herman Cain had trouble remembering.


AL SHARPTON, "POLITICS NATION" HOST: Can you believe we have a guy
running for president talking about sissy pizzas?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I forgot, and then I was reminded, and then I
remembered and then I forgot having remembered.

O`DONNELL (voice-over): Gloria Allred is here to help Herman Cain

GLORIA ALLRED, ATTORNEY: I`m Attorney Gloria Allred. One of our
witnesses agreed to come forward.

SHARPTON: Gloria Allred brings out a former boyfriend of the accuser.

CHRIS MATTHEWS, "HARDBALL" HOST: Sharon Bialek`s then-boyfriend backs
her story.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is the man we met so many years earlier.

MATTHEWS: She told him that Cain grabbed her.

ALLRED: Herman Cain held his own news conference and stated about
Sharon, quote, "I don`t know who this woman is."

HERMAN CAIN (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I don`t even know who this
woman is.

ALLRED: We look forward to Mr. Cain`s response.

O`DONNELL: There are other things that Herman Cain can`t remember.

REPORTER: Do you agree with President Obama on Libya or not?

CAIN: OK. Libya --

DANA MILBANK, WASHINGTON POST: This goes on for five minutes like

CAIN: Got all of this stuff twirling around in my head.

MILBANK: I got a lot of stuff twirling around in my head right now.

CAIN: No, that`s a different one.

SHARPTON: Cain has fallen from front runner this third.

O`DONNELL: And it`s time to make way for Newt.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The neutron bomb.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Now we are talking about the rise of Newt

SHARPTON: Republicans like Newt on their pizza pie.

MATTHEWS: Newt Gingrich is surging in the polls.

DEBATE MODERATOR: Would you care to evaluate Governor Romney`s
ability to think outside of the box?



SHARPTON: If Willard Mitt Romney could be any ice cream, he would be
banana nut, cookies and cream, pink bubble gum, rum raisin, rainbow
sherbet, coconut pistachio, mint chocolate chip, strawberry with rainbow
sprinkles on top.


O`DONNELL: Last night, Herman Cain`s wife Gloria taped her first
public appearance since her husband announced his presidential candidacy.
Mrs. Cain had this reaction to the graphic allegations by Sharon Bialek
about what Herman Cain did when they were alone in his car.


GLORIA CAIN, WIFE OF HERMAN CAIN: To hear such graphic allegations
and know that that would have been something that was totally disrespectful
of her as a woman. And I know that`s not the person he is. He totally
respects women.


O`DONNELL: Today, Sharon Bialek`s boyfriend at the time, pediatrician
Victor Zuckerman, appeared at a news conference to confirm Ms. Bialek`s
account that she told him about the alleged incident after it happened.


in previous interviews her account of what happened in D.C. I can confirm
that when she returned she was upset. She said that something had happened
and that Mr. Cain had touched her in an inappropriate manner. She said she
handled it and didn`t want to talk about it any further. I respected her
request and this issue was never brought up until recently.


O`DONNELL: Tonight in Milwaukee, Herman Cain said this.


CAIN: So, they are going to have to decide whether or not they want
to believe these trumped up accusations or believe me. My wife is 200
percent behind me. Not just because she wants to stand by her man, she
knows me and that`s what the statement reflects.


O`DONNELL: Joining me now are: Dr. Victor Zuckerman, the former
boyfriend of Sharon Bialek who has accused Herman Cain of sexual
harassment, and Gloria Allred, attorney for Sharon Bialek.

Thank you both for joining me.

ALLRED: Thank you.

O`DONNELL: Doctor, you basically today backed up Sharon Bialek`s
statement that when she returned home after a all of this, she told you all
about it.

ZUCKERMAN: That`s correct.

O`DONNELL: And, Doctor, did she go in to graphic detail with you that
we heard when she made her public announcement about this?

ZUCKERMAN: No. In fact, all she would say is that something
happened. It was inappropriate and she didn`t want to talk about it.

Sharon`s a strong woman. She said she handled it. At that point,
when she told me don`t discuss it anymore. It`s been dropped and only came
up recently.

O`DONNELL: Now, let`s listen to how Sharon Bialek actually described
what happened in Herman Cain`s car in 1997.


time, I had on a black pleated skirt, suit jacket and a blouse. He had on
a suit, with his shirt open. But instead of going in to the offices, he
suddenly reached over and he put his hand on my leg under my skirt and
reached for my genitals. He also grabbed my head and brought it toward his

I was very, very surprised and very shocked. I said, "What are you
doing? You know I have a boyfriend. This isn`t what I came here for."
Mr. Cain said, "You want a job, right?" I asked him to stop, and he did.
I asked him to take me back to my hotel, which he did.


O`DONNELL: Dr. Zuckerman, how did you feel when you heard those

ZUCKERMAN: Well, most of those details were never shared with me
immediately so many years ago. So, I was, as surprised with the details as

O`DONNELL: And you said in your statement today that you and Sharon
had met Mr. Cain. That Sharon had introduced you to Mr. Cain. You were at
a big event that that had a smaller after party and in that after party,
you had conversations with him that you still remember.

ZUCKERMAN: Yes, very much so. You know, what was the part that was
most interesting for me was that he was -- his persona was warm, was kind,
was endearing. It brought you in -- specifically for me was his comment
about him making a gospel album.

And I just thought, boy, he can do all of these other things and he
can sing, too. It always stuck with me.

Years later, I had come to find he had made "Sunday Morning" which was
in 1996 and this was 1997. So it`s just -- it`s just something that I
always remembered that puts me there, period.

O`DONNELL: Do you think it is possible that Herman Cain did forget
meeting Sharon Bialek and forget this incident in the car?

ZUCKERMAN: I can`t speak for him.

ALLRED: I think it is unlikely, however.

O`DONNELL: Go ahead, Gloria.

ALLRED: I think it`s highly unlikely because it is not the only
occasion when she was speaking with Sharon. And, by the way, he was
speaking with Sharon and with Dr. Zuckerman at the dinner preceding the
after-party, and that`s why invited them to come upstairs to that select
smaller group.

But in addition, Sharon alleges and had told Dr. Zuckerman at the time
that she had spoken with Herman Cain a number of times that week at the
convention prior to that night. I also think Dr. Zuckerman`s points are
very important because not only does that totally contradict what Herman
Cain said about not to knowing Sharon Bialek, but it also shows that she
indicated -- that he was very nice that night and that is why Dr. Zuckerman
suggested that she go to meet with Herman Cain in Washington because he
thought that Herman Cain was the kind of man who would help her to find an
employment opportunity.

In a million years, he never thought and she never thought that Herman
Cain would do what Sharon alleges ultimately was done to her, the improper
sexual advances, which she feels was like a sexual assault in that car.

O`DONNELL: Gloria, what is your response --

ZUCKERMAN: If I can also comment --

O`DONNELL: Go ahead, Doctor.

ZUCKERMAN: Oh, I was just going to say, I also just comment on the
fact that when we called -- let me take that back. When I suggested that
Sharon call Mr. Cain to see if he could help her with employment, that
employment was set up fairly rapidly. I just can`t imagine that someone
just calling off the street that shook his hand at a thousand-person dinner
could call his office and get a meeting with him to get her a job.

O`DONNELL: Gloria, I`d like you to respond directly to what Sharon
said in the taped interview that she take last night, where she said she
listen to what Sharon Bialek had to say and that is simply not the Herman
Cain that she knows.

ALLRED: Well, it probably isn`t the Herman Cain that she knows. I
mean, what wife wants to believe that her husband is out there and making
sexually improper advances in words or conduct or both to women in the
workplace or women seeking employment. Obviously, his wife Gloria is not
at his workplace, is not -- was not there the night that Sharon alleges
this happens.

And she`s been married to him more than 40 years. I`m sure she wants
to think the best of him.

But, you know, to trot her out and try to use her as a cover is really
rather sad. And I`m sure in her heart, she wouldn`t want to believe it.
Maybe she doesn`t believe it. I don`t know.

But we have the allegations of four women and my client doesn`t even
know the other three women, saying that he sexually harassed them against
the word of one man, Herman Cain, who has every motive to deny this.

O`DONNELL: Attorney Gloria Allred and Dr. Victor Zuckerman, thank you
very much, both of you, for joining me tonight.

Coming up, Sandusky speaks, an NBC News exclusive. The man accused of
raping at least eight young boys, Jerry Sandusky at the center of the Penn
State sex abuse scandal, speaks exclusively to Bob Costas of NBC News. Bob
Costas is going to join us.

And, Newt Gingrich is surging in the polls as Perry and Cain drop
back. Wonder why? That`s next.



a lot of chutzpah.

CAIN: Ubecky, becky, becky, becky, stan, stan.

of cheese?

MITT ROMNEY (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Who let the dogs out, who?

there? Let`s see.

approved this message.




UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There are three, three agencies I cut immediately:
Commerce, Education and -- what`s the third one there? It`s got away from
me. Oops.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But, seriously, Governor, what is the third
department you`d cut?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Come on, man, I said oops.


O`DONNELL: A new poll out today shows Herman Cain`s candidacy sinking
fast, and the big benefactor from Cain`s collapse in the polls is former
disgraced speaker of the House and Washington lobbyist, Newt Gingrich.

A new CNN poll shows Gingrich in a statistical tie for the top spot
with Mitt Romney, Romney at 24, Gingrich at 22, with Herman Cain support
plummeting from 25 percent last month to 14 percent this month, which is
good enough for third place in this field. And Rick Perry remained stalled
at 12 percent.

Today in Iowa, Gingrich reacted to his sudden surge in popularity with
Republican voters.


GINGRICH: It`s better than when I was at 4. Look, this is the most
volatile race of my lifetime. Who knows what the polls will be two months
from now. I mean, I`m not going to tell you I`m on the way, but I have to
say I`m very humbled that millions of people watch the debates and the
general conclusion was that, in fact, that I had real substance and
solutions that they prefer my approach of being positive to the kind of
consultant-driven negativities that I think actually hurt the candidates
who are negative.


O`DONNELL: Joining me now, senior political writer for "Politico,"
Maggie Haberman, also Republican pollster and strategist, Ed Goeas.

Thank you both for joining me tonight.



O`DONNELL: Maggie, Republican voters really don`t like Newt Gingrich.
I mean, isn`t this -- I`m sorry, Mitt Romney. Isn`t this the final proof -
- I mean, these unknown candidates like Cain get in to trouble and you
would expect them to gravitate to the safe bet, the front runner, the
leader and they don`t. They find some other iceberg to jump to and now
it`s Gingrich.

HABERMAN: Look, I think that Mitt Romney seems to have a ceiling in
all of these polls. We have seen this reportedly. I think that Ed could
speak to this a bit better than I could. But certainly, you know,
conservatives don`t like Mitt Romney. I think we`ve seen this over and
over. There are some, my colleague, Alex Burns, wrote about this today,
there are conservatives who are certainly, you know, conservative leaders
who are grudgingly starting to see Mitt Romney is likely to be the nominee,
and we`re going to have to accept it at some point that they are not going

And I think that the more you see Mitt Romney looking inevitable, the
likelier it is that Iowa caucus-goers are going to nominate a conservative,
someone who they think should be a nominee because it is a cross shot
across Romney`s bow.

O`DONNELL: Ed, in your experience as a Republican pollster, at what
point does this the failure to attract by Mitt Romney start to lend some
doubt to whether he can really get this nomination?

GOEAS: Let me restate it a little bit. I very early on saw both in
focus groups and the data kind of a feeling that the voters, the Republican
voters, and this may be revisionist history to some extent, but the
Republican voters didn`t want to fall prey to picking the next in line.
That`s what created this kind of temporary ceiling for Mitt Romney. It
wasn`t that they didn`t like him. It wasn`t that they had any strong
feelings negatively about him, his ideology, whether he was conservative or
moderate, had nothing to do quite frankly with Mormonism.

It had nothing to do they felt in 2008, they picked the next one in
line and that didn`t work out well. So, they weren`t going to fall in to
that trap this time.

It`s interesting the poll that we released today with "Politico." It
shows him with 25 percent of the vote. But we asked two other questions
that were very interesting. One was -- what was your second choice if your
candidate didn`t win or wasn`t an option? And he got another 20 percent on
that, going up to 45 percent.

We also asked a question -- who do you think will win the nomination,
and he was at 48 percent. Cain was at 22. Perry was at six. And even
though he was surging in our own polls, if you looked Newt Gingrich, he was
only at 3 percent.

So I think the 25 percent is more of a floor for Romney than a
ceiling. And the ceiling is more in that 48, 49 percent range. But he`s
not going to get to that until you get in to the real campaign, which is
about 52 days away.

O`DONNELL: Maggie in the "Politico" poll that Ed did for you, there is
the bad news for President Obama that he is tied 43-43 with a generic
Republican, Obama versus Republican, 43-43.

As soon as you put in a name there, it gets better. A Republican
name, it gets better for the president. He leads Romney by six points, 49
to 43. He leads Cain by more, by nine points in this.

And so, is -- should the Democrats and President Obama be eager to
have that individual opponent identified so that they can more pointedly
campaign against him, or does this dragging out of the Republican
nomination process help the president?

HABERMAN: I think that the feeling among Democrats and among people
close to the campaign, has been that the longer -- you would normally think
a longer the race would drag out the better it would be for the president.
They would like this to drag it out as long as possible.

That being said, what they are not seeing in most of these contests
that we`ve seen in these debates, these matchups where they are all on
stage, Mitt Romney escapes without anyone laying a glove on him, every
single time. We saw it again on Saturday night at a foreign policy-themed
debate hosted by CBS and the "National Journal."

So, at this point, the Democrats feel like they do have to start
jumping in and trying to define Mitt Romney. They need to have an actual
opponent to fire up their base, to fire up their donor base, their voting
base. They need to have somebody realize -- and people who they are
appealing to realize: this is who we are facing, this is what it looks

And Mitt Romney, of course, is seen as the best general election
candidate other than Jon Huntsman, who is obviously not doing very well
right now. If he catches on, there`s a possibility but it`s an outlier
chance right now.

So, they need to make Mitt Romney seem as extreme as possible, as
scary as possible, and you are starting to see that.

O`DONNELL: Ed, your poll, as many others have found, a high number of
people think the country is on the wrong track, 75 percent in your poll.
That`s normally a very bad indicator for the president.

But can both sides try to exploit that number? Can the president try
to exploit that wrong track number by shifting blame for the wrong track on
the Republican House of Representatives?

GOEAS: Well, he can attempt to. But I think one of the fallacies in
their attempt to blame Congress and I think earlier, you were talking about
the disapproval of Congress or they were talking about the disapproval of
Congress being at 82 percent, which is what our poll found, only 11 percent
approving of Congress.

But the kind of second half of that equation is we asked a question,
do you approve of your congressman? And found that by a 46 to 38 margin,
they, in fact, approved of their congressman. And approval of the
congressman was higher in the tossup states, electoral state and higher in
the Republican areas than in the Democratic areas.

So, running against the institution isn`t going to necessarily
redirect that blame. I think what we did see is not only on job approval
for the president, but if you look at the job approval on the economy and
jobs, he also didn`t approve. So, he`s going to be looking for and he`s
going to need that person to point the blame at.

O`DONNELL: Maggie Haberman and Ed Goeas, thank you very much for
joining me tonight.

HABERMAN: Thank you.

O`DONNELL: Coming up, Herman Cain`s kryptonite. We have found it and
we will show you it in the "Rewrite."

And Jerry Sandusky breaks his silence. He talks exclusively with
NBC`s Bob Costas tonight. Bob Costas will be here with more on his
Sandusky interview.


O`DONNELL: Still to come tonight, in an exclusive interview with
NBC`s Bob Costas, Jerry Sandusky admits to showering and horsing around
with young boys. We`ll bring you the breaking news in the Penn State child
abuse scandal. Bob Costas will join me.



O`DONNELL: We have breaking news tonight in the Penn State sex abuse
scandal. Jerry Sandusky, the former assistant football coach accused of
sexually assaulting eight young boys over a time period of 15 years, has
just given his first interview to NBC sports correspondent Bob Costas.


count indictment. The grand jury report contains specific detail. There
are multiple accusers, multiple eyewitnesses to various aspects of the

A reasonable person says where there`s this much smoke, there must be
plenty of fire. What do you say?

innocent of those charges.

COSTAS: Innocent. Completely innocent and falsely accused in every

SANDUSKY: Well, I could say that, you know, I have done some of those
things. I have horsed around with kids. I have showered after workouts.
I have hugged them. And I have touched their leg without intent of sexual


O`DONNELL: Sandusky flatly denied the allegations by then graduate
assistant Mike McQueary that he witnessed Sandusky sexually assaulting a
boy in the Penn State showers. Joining me now, NBC`s Bob Costas.

Bob, thank you very much for joining me tonight.

COSTAS: Thank you, Lawrence.

O`DONNELL: Bob, what is the version of that shower scene that
Sandusky gives? And how is it different from what we understand to be the
McQueary version?

COSTAS: Oh, it is massively different. He says that he and the young
boy were horsing around, snapping towels, that the boy turned on all of the
shower heads and was sliding around the shower floor, as if it was some
kind of water slide, but that nothing even remotely resembling a rape --
and that`s what McQueary says he saw.

He saw a forcible rape, not horsing around, not inappropriate
touching. In the grand jury report, he says he witnessed a rape. And
Sandusky flatly denies that. And when asked what motive McQueary would
have to possibly fabricate such a horrific thing, his answer is you would
have to ask him.

O`DONNELL: And what are the things in this story that you heard
tonight from Sandusky that you think possibly do not line up with what we
already think we know?

COSTAS: Well, most of it wouldn`t line up with what most people seem
to have concluded. He says -- and I apologize for the graphic nature of
this, but I felt that we had to get it out in an unambiguous way. He says
he never touched any of these boys genitals. He said he was never was
involved in oral sex.

He said certainly he never raped anyone. He says the worst that he
did was he tickled them. He may have put a hand on a leg. He showered
with them, which he says he now regrets. If there was any incidental
contact with private areas, it was accidental. He had no sexual intent.

I asked if he considered himself a pedophile. He said absolutely no.
I asked if he was attracted sexually to under aged boys. He seemed to
hesitate for a while. He said I enjoy the company of young people, but
sexually attracted to them, no.

In a less graphic but still pertinent area, I asked if he believed
that Joe Paterno had any knowledge of any objectionable activity or
allegations of objectionable activity by Sandusky prior to 2002, when
McQueary reported the shower incident. And he said he couldn`t be 100
percent sure, but he believed that Paterno did not.

And his attorney, Sandusky`s attorney, Joseph Amandola (ph), also said
that he did not believe that Penn State was involved in a massive cover-up.
Now people may be skeptical of that, but that is what Amandola told me.

O`DONNELL: Did he have any conversations with Paterno about any of
this? Did Paterno ever speak to Sandusky about this?

COSTAS: It`s a good question and I asked Sandusky. He said no, that
Paterno never asked about his behavior, never expressed disapproval, never
suggested counseling, never treated him, when their paths crossed, as some
sort of pariah.

He said that we weren`t perhaps as close once I was no longer coaching
as I had been, and we didn`t socialize. But when he saw me, which I take
it was fairly frequently, there were no questions, no expressions of

O`DONNELL: Mike McQueary put out an e-mail that we have obtained --
other news organization have obtained to friends explaining himself. He
says, "I did the right thing. You guys know me. The truth is not out
there fully. I didn`t just turn and run. I made sure it stopped. I had
to make quick, tough decisions."

COSTAS: Yeah, the way I understand that, Lawrence, is that he`s
saying that once he stumbled upon this scene, as he describes it, either
his mere presence or maybe he said hey or something like that, that that
got Sandusky to stop, and that he is satisfied that the incident ended

He didn`t physically restrain Sandusky. He didn`t hold him for
authorities obviously. He didn`t punch him in the nose, as you might
expect somebody might have. Who knows how anyone would react in such a
shocking situation. But all the things that people theorize that could
happened, he didn`t do those things.

But he apparently is satisfied that simply his presence stopped the
incident. He then went down the hallway to his own office in the same
facility and called his father and asked him what to do. His father said
he should speak to Paterno. It was a Friday night. He went to Paterno`s
house the next morning. It wasn`t during the football season, Saturday

He went to Paterno`s house, told Paterno. And then Paterno, the next
day, Sunday, told Tom Curley, the athletic director. But law enforcement
was never notified. Child protective services never notified. And there
is reason to believe that there were subsequent objectionable incidents
with other young boys that, in theory, could have been averted if more
affirmative action was taken at the time.

O`DONNELL: Bob, you know the culture of this world that we`re
speaking of. Your assessment of how this could be allowed to fester
uninvestigated? It seems unexamined to the extent it should have been for
so long.

COSTAS: You know, in many ways, what went on for the better part of a
half century at Happy Valley is the opposite of the stereotype of the
football program, the athletic program out of control at so many big
universities. In fact, they graduated their players. Their players were
by and large legitimate students, nothing perfect but -- no program is
perfect, but it was pretty close to that.

They didn`t routinely recruit criminals and thugs. Paterno did give
millions of dollars to the university and raised millions more. He was a
positive influence on the lives of hundreds and hundreds of his players.
And he was a benign presence on campus.

So you might think that everything was fine. But even in such a
benign circumstance, Joe Paterno became, in many ways, the most powerful
and revered man in the state of Pennsylvania. And the football program was
the signature of a truly great university.

The football program helped the university grow. It is an outstanding
research university. And the image of that football program is very
important to everyone in and around Penn State. So could there have been -
- in fact almost certainly there was, something that took hold? It may not
have taken hold for the same reasons that it did at football factories
where there were different values at play or no values at all at play.

But did something take hold where the idea of protecting an image was
more important than doing what most of us would see is the right thing? I
think you could make a pretty good case that that is what happened,

O`DONNELL: Also joining us now is former Pennsylvania Governor and
MSNBC contributor Ed Rendell. Ed, this is pretty surprising to me, that a
lawyer would allow a client in a situation like this to do this interview
with Bob. What`s your reaction to it?

very much. I guess the lawyer is trying to influence the court of public
opinion. If you read the entire indictment, Lawrence, what he says is a

There were two janitors who claimed and testified before the Grand
Jury that they witnessed him having oral sex on a young boy. So it just
doesn`t add up. It doesn`t make sense. I don`t understand what the lawyer
is doing. But I don`t understand what Mr. Sandusky is doing.

But the point that Bob made, Penn State is a great university. It`s
more than a football program. It`s one of the three or four best public
universities in the country. And was there some sort of agreement to try
to cover it up? It appears so. But that`s what we are going to have to
look at as the facts unfold.

O`DONNELL: Ed Rendell, thank you for your invaluable perspective on
this. And Bob Costas, thank you very much for your exclusive report on

COSTAS: You are welcome, Lawrence. The whole thing will be soon on-
line. There was more of it. We included as much as we could, but there is

O`DONNELL: Thank you very much for joining us. Bob.

COSTAS: You got it.

O`DONNELL: Coming up, Herman Cain`s Kryptonite. We found it and we
will show it to you in the Rewrite.



UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Mr. Cain, as more women come forward, you have
repeatedly changed your story. How do you explain your inconsistent
responses to these allegations?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There`s been no inconsistency. My story has never
changed. To recap, I forgot. And then I was reminded. And then I
remembered. And then I forgot having remembered. And then pizza break.
One thing is for every woman who has come forward, there are two who have



O`DONNELL: In tonight`s Rewrite, we have found Herman Cain`s
Kryptonite. No, it has nothing to do with the women who have accused him
of sexual harassment. Super Herman just shrugs them off. And no, his
Kryptonite is not tough questions from the media.

Herman Cain has shown us he knows exactly how to handle the tough


HERMAN CAIN (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: And when they asked me who
is the president of U-Becki-Becki-Beckie-Stan-Stan, I`m going to say, I
don`t know. Do you know?

This is why I have proposed a bold plan of 9-9-9.

Victory is not clearly defined. As president, I will make sure the
mission is clear and the definition of victory is clear and that simply
does not exist right now.

A dollar must be a dollar when we wake up in the morning. Just like
60 minutes is in an hour, a dollar is a dollar.

It is fair. The reason it is fair is because of the definition in
"Webster," which says everybody gets treated the same.

Because that`s the person Herman Cain is. Is to take my message
directly to the people.

The American people deserve better than someone being tried in a court
of public opinion based on unfounded accusations.

I have never acted inappropriately with anyone, period. The fact is
these anonymous allegations are false. And now the Democrat machine in
America has brought forth a troubled woman to make false accusations.


O`DONNELL: That is the Herman Cain America has come to know and some
truly lost Republican voters have come to love. This was Herman Cain today
trying to answer a very simple question on whether he agreed with President
Obama on Libya.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So you agree with President Obama on Libya, or

CAIN: OK. Libya -- President Obama supported the uprising, correct?
President Obama called for the removal of Gadhafi. Just want to make sure
we`re talking about the same thing before I say yes, I agree, or no I
didn`t agree.

I do not agree with the way he handled it for the following reason --
no, that`s a different one.

I got to go back. See, got all this stuff twirling around in my head.
Specifically, what are you asking me did I agree or not disagree with


O`DONNELL: That brain freeze lasted 11 full seconds longer than the
previous record holder for Republican brain freezes, set just last week by
Rick Perry.


see. I can`t. The third the one I can`t. Sorry. Oops.


O`DONNELL: Now, remember, the Perry brain freeze, which was by far
the most wildly entertaining moment in presidential debate history,
occurred under the enormously crushing pressure of a nationally televised
presidential debate. Herman Cain managed to break that record in a cozy
sit down with the editorial board of the "Milwaukee Journal Sentinel," not
a group known for intimidating presidential candidates.

The political world has spent the day wondering how could it happen?
How shoot from the hip Herman could fire blanks for one minute and four
seconds? You could see there was a problem before the questioner finished
his question.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So you agree with President Obama on Libya or not?


O`DONNELL: A red necktie? I have never seen Herman Cain in a red
necktie. Where was his yellow tie?


CAIN: U-becki-becki-becki-stan-stan.


Victory is not clearly defined.

A dollar must be a dollar.

The reason it is fair is because of the definition in "Webster."

Because that`s the person Herman Cain is.

The American people deserve better.

I have never acted inappropriately with anyone, period.

The Democrat machine in America --


O`DONNELL: Look at how sharp the guy is in the yellow tie. Looks
sharp, sounds sharp. Look at what the red tie did to the man.


CAIN: OK. Libya.


O`DONNELL: I don`t know. I smell a dirty trick here. Who gave him
that red tie? The Democrat machine? I didn`t think the guy owned a red
tie. That yellow tie has been everywhere. Someone must have tricked him
in to wearing that red tie.

Let`s run a clip of Rick Perry again. Let`s look at the tie he was


PERRY: Commerce and let`s see -- I can`t. The third one I can`t.
Sorry. Oops.


O`DONNELL: OMG! OK. What color necktie does that robot Romney wear,
the guy who hasn`t had a single brain freeze this season? Look at that.
Romney, oh, OK. He really knows how to play this game. He won`t go near a
red tie. That tie right there makes him suspect number one on who planted
the red tie in Herman Cain`s wardrobe.

Here`s the best Herman Cain could do today when he was asked whether
his response to the Libya question shows he does not have a deep
understanding of foreign policy.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. Cain, do you think the Libya comment
reinforces that you don`t have a thorough understanding of foreign policy?

CAIN: 9-9-9.


O`DONNELL: The poor man is never going to make any sense until he
gets rid of that red tie. James Carville, one of the leaders of Bill
Clinton`s brilliant campaign staff in 1992, put a sign on the wall of the
campaign headquarters urging staff to remember simply this, "it`s the
economy, stupid."

The smoking guy, Herman Cain`s campaign manager, needs to write on his
palm, right now, "it`s the yellow tie, stupid."



TOM CORBETT (R), PENNSYLVANIA: If there are more victims, we
encourage them -- the state police, the attorney general`s office and I
encourage them to come forward, let us know. And we are going to work to
do everything we possibly can to help you. This is about the victims.


O`DONNELL: That was Pennsylvania Governor Tom Corbett encouraging
anyone who may have been a victim of sexual abuse at the hands of former
Penn State defensive coordinator Jerry Sandusky to come forward and tell
that story.

Joining me now is friend of the show Goldie Taylor, a contributor to, which is a division of NBC News. Thanks for joining me
tonight, Goldie.

GOLDIE TAYLOR, THEGRIO.COM: Thank you for having me, Lawrence.

O`DONNELL: Goldie, I am a devoted Twitter followers of yours. And I
was following your Tweets yesterday afternoon. And I read one that made me
then pay attention to everything that followed.

You Tweeted yesterday, "at first I was angry that Penn State officials
covered it up. Now I`m a shamed that I never had the courage to tell my
own story."

You then went on through the day in Twitter to tell that story. Tell
us how this Sandusky story, how this Penn State story has changed the way
you look at your own history.

TAYLOR: I think first yesterday afternoon I saw a few Tweets about
the Sandusky case that said he was going to fight the charges and that the
children themselves may have to stand trial and tell their stories publicly
in a court of law.

And maybe that`s fair. But at the end of the day, what happened to
these children is something so deplorable, so unthinkably evil, that to
have them stand trial is I think just unimaginable. And it said to me if
I`m angry that adults did not speak out then, then why then aren`t I angry
at myself for not telling my story and helping other young women like me
combat predators who are in our high schools and our middle schools.

In my case, it was a high school football coach. I was a varsity
cheerleader in Missouri. And there were other women like me. And I knew
it at the time. And in my own fear of being shamed and blamed, even as a
growing person, as an adult, a mother of children now, I felt like I had no
safe harbor to tell it.

But if I were going to challenge these adults at Penn State to tell
it, if I were going to challenge other people to speak up and speak out, I
said yesterday afternoon, then why not me? So I started to Tweet about it.
And as people began to respond, I said, now`s the time. And I would not
wait another day.

O`DONNELL: It was the most dramatic unfolding of revelations I`ve
ever seen on Twitter or could expect to see. It was absolutely riveting to
learn of what you had been through. And the fact it linked specifically to
a football coach and that whole -- the way this story has made you realize,
perhaps more than -- many of us already had realized at some level these
things should be reported.

But the most difficult person involved in reporting is the victim,
isn`t it?

TAYLOR: Yes, it is. And even today. I`m 43 years old. Certainly I
have made a life for myself. I have made a life for my children. But I
recount back. This happened 26, 27 years ago. You know, I just know that
I have lived with it every day of my life.

I said on Twitter yesterday and again today that there really are no
survivors. There are just people like me who tuck it in and keep it
moving, and you know, try to make something better of it. But these guys,
these women, they pick children who are more susceptible, children from
single-parent homes, children who come from poverty, whose parents are
working two and three jobs, children who have a lack of self esteem, lack
of self worth, who are looking for somebody to love them.

And unfortunately, predators find children like me. People like
allegedly Sandusky find children like me and they groom us. And they put
themselves in a position to have more access to us.

I understand this coach is still coaching girls` track. So I have
decided to go home. For legal reasons I can`t name him. But I have
decided to go home and make the charge and tell the story. I just won`t
stop here.

O`DONNELL: Goldie, I don`t think you woke up yesterday morning
knowing that you were going to do this. As I read the Tweets unfolding, it
felt like you were making the decision of what to reveal Tweet by Tweet as
you went along through day.

TAYLOR: I was. I was making the decision in real time. And then I
had to stop, because I realized that the woman who had supported me, who
had tried to reach me, my mother, who when I stopped cheerleading, when I
dropped out of debate, when I stopped -- when I dropped out of high school,
that she didn`t know how to reach me.

And so I needed to call my mother. And when she said OK, I moved

O`DONNELL: Goldie Taylor, thank you very much for joining us tonight.
And thank you for your bravery in coming forward and talking about this
this way.

TAYLOR: Thank you for having me, Lawrence. Thank you.



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