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The Ed Show for Monday, August 13, 2012

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Guests: Joan Walsh, E.J. Dionne, John Nichols, Terry O`Neil, James Hoffa, Larry Cohen, Sen. Bernie

ED SCHULTZ, HOST: Good evening, Americans. And welcome to THE ED
SHOW from New York.

Eighty-five days until the 2012 election. Mitt Romney has picked the
most radical vice presidential candidate in the history of the Republican
Party. I love it. Tonight, I`ll remind you why.

This is THE ED SHOW -- let`s get to work.


got to get straight --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Stop the war on the middle class!

RYAN: One thing we`ve got to get straight --

SCHULTZ (voice-over): The Paul Ryan backlash begins in Iowa. And the
vice president is on the attack in North Carolina.

giving millionaires another tax break? What`s gutsy? What`s gutsy about
gutting Medicare, Medicaid, education?

SCHULTZ: Mitt Romney goes hard right with a guy who says
progressivism is a cancer on America.

PAUL: What I have been trying to do is indict the entire vision of


PAUL: Exactly.

SCHULTZ: Tonight, John Nichols of "The Nation" magazine tells us
exactly who Paul Ryan is. Joan Walsh and E.J. Dionne on the president`s
counterpunch today on the campaign trail.

NOW`s Terry O`Neill on what Romney/Ryan means for women. James Hoffa
of the Teamsters and Larry Cohen of the CWA on what the Ryan pick means for

And Vermont Senator Bernie Sanders on Paul Ryan`s Medicare lie.

MITT ROMNEY (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: There`s only one president
that I know of in history that robbed Medicare $716 billion. Paul Ryan and
I talked about saving Medicare.


SCHULTZ: Good to have you with us tonight, folks. Thanks for

The choices in the 2012 presidential election have never been as clear
as they are tonight. Mitt Romney`s announcement of Congressman Paul Ryan
to be on the ticket as his running mate has the Republican base all
excited. The roll-out no doubt positive, probably the best thing Romney
has had because he`s had a rough summer.

And the choice takes any controversy off the table that might have
come up at the Republican convention later this month. They`re going to
like this. Conservatives are happy.

But President Obama wasted no time today defining the stark difference
voters face with a Romney/Ryan ticket.


know Congressman Ryan, a good man, a family man. He`s --


OBAMA: He`s an articulate spokesman for Governor Romney`s vision.
But the problem is that vision is one that I fundamentally disagree with.



SCHULTZ: Well, the election is no longer a referendum on President
Obama. It`s a choice over a vision and a future for America.

Now, Ryan has a vision of the future President Obama called deeply
pessimistic well over a year ago. Vice President Joe Biden says we finally
know exactly what Mitt Romney will do as president.


BIDEN: Congressman Ryan has given definition to the vague commitments
that Romney has been making. There is no distinction between what the
Republican Congress has been proposing the last two years -- actually the
last four years -- and what Governor Romney wants to do. So let`s cut
through all this.


SCHULTZ: Now, if you watch THE ED SHOW, none of this should be a
surprise to you. We have been talking about Paul Ryan and his agenda for
the last two years on this program. This is not a pretty picture.


SCHULTZ: The Ryan plan, which of course the Republicans voted on, the
Ryan plan would grease the skids for major corporations to outsource
profits so they can get away with not paying their fair share of taxes.
Today, a group of religious leaders signed a joint statement condemning
cuts. One signature was from Father Thomas Kelly of Wisconsin.

He wrote, "As a constituent of Congressman Ryan and a Catholic priest,
I`m disappointed by his cruel budget plan and outraged that he defends it
on moral grounds."

RYAN: I sleep soundly knowing what I`m trying to do is help fix the
country`s problems.

SCHULTZ: You know what? For years, people who had Medicare and
Medicaid, they slept pretty well at night, too. But now they`re under
attack from you, and yes, you can sleep well at night because nobody is
going to be touching your pension, nobody is going to be touching your
health care.


SCHULTZ: But you don`t have to listen to me if you wasn`t to know
where Paul Ryan stands on America. You can just listen to the candidate

Here`s -- I want you to listen to this. This is a very fascinating
clip of Paul Ryan when he was on a right-wing radio show explaining what he
thinks of liberals and progressivism.


RYAN: What I have been trying to do is indict the entire idea of
progressivism because I see progressivism as the source, the intellectual
source for the government problems plaguing us today. And so to me, it`s
really important to flush progressives out into the field of open debate.

BECK: I love you.

RYAN: So people can actually see what this ideology means and where
it`s going to lead us and how it attacks the American idea.

BECK: OK, hang on just a second. Did you see my speech at CPAC?

RYAN: Yes, I`ve read it. I didn`t see it. I read a transcript of

BECK: I think we`re saying the same thing.

RYAN: We are saying the same thing.

BECK: It`s a cancer.

RYAN: Exactly. Look, I come from -- I`m calling you from Janesville,
Wisconsin, where I`m born and raised, where we raise our family, 35 miles
from Madison. I grew up hearing about this stuff. This stuff came from
these German intellectuals to Madison, University of Wisconsin, and out
from there, the beginning of the last century.

So, this is something we`re familiar with where I come from. It never
sat right with me. And as I grew up, I learned more about the Founders and
reading the Austrians and others, that this is really a cancer, because it
basically takes the notion that our rights come from God and nature, and
turns it on its head and says, no, no, no, they come from government, and
we here in government are here to give you your rights and ration,
redistribute, and regulate your rights. It`s a complete --


SCHULTZ: That is a priceless piece of audio. Progressivism is a
cancer. Now, if you`re watching tonight and you`re a liberal and you watch
THE ED SHOW, you know who I am. I`m a lefty. I`m not a cancer on America.
I work hard, I pay my taxes, I take offense to that. But this is who Paul
Ryan is. He thinks that liberals shouldn`t be in the decision making
process. He thinks that we come from some German elitist attitude about
how America should be run.

I thought that the Republicans were all about big ideas. Social
Security, Medicare, Medicaid was a big idea when this country needed it.
And there`s no march in Washington saying that we need to change all of
that. I`m not going to go so far as to say that Mr. Ryan is a cancer, but
I will say that he is deeply out of the mainstream. Conservatives now have
a voice on the ticket to deliver the agenda of the 1 percent in America.


RUSH LIMBAUGH, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: We now have somebody on a ticket
who is us, somebody is on the ticket who can explain all of this, believes
all of this in his heart, and in his soul. His name is Paul Ryan.


SCHULTZ: Conservatives believe this message is broad enough to work
in a general election. We`ll see. If people hear what Paul Ryan believes,
they will vote for Republicans? Well, today, the Romney campaign found out
-- well, it might not be that easy.

Let`s go to the middle of the country. At the Iowa state fair, pretty
American there, isn`t it? Paul Ryan was shouted down by protesters telling
Ryan to stop the war on the middle class. Ryan dismissed them.


PAUL: Iowans and Wisconsinites like to be respectful of one another,
peaceful with one another, listen to each another. These ladies must not
be from Iowa or Wisconsin.


SCHULTZ: Be respectful of one another, but it`s OK to go on the talk
show of a right winger and say, you know what? Those liberals are nothing
but a cancer on society. Actually, those people are from Iowa, and they
are from an organized group called Iowa citizens for community improvement.

And it was interesting, ironically, this exact same location a year
ago the Iowa state fair when Mitt Romney made this gaffe a year ago.


ROMNEY: We have to make sure that the promises we make in Social
Security, Medicaid and Medicare are promises we can keep. And there are
various ways of doing that. One is we could raise taxes on people.


ROMNEY: Corporations are people, my friend.


SCHULTZ: Oops, the reaction to the Ryan selection should really
surprise no one. It was not an etch-a-sketch moment for the Romney
campaign. I tweeted this, this weekend. Romney has picked a running mate
that`s from a Congress that has a 7 percent approval rating. Now, you tell
me how is that change? It`s not, and it`s no game changer either.

The Ryan rollout is probably the least popular vice presidential pick
in 12 years. Just go to the numbers. "USA"/Gallup poll today, 42 percent,
they say it`s fair or poor, 39 percent say it was an excellent or good

I mean, Sarah Palin, Joe Biden, John Edwards, Joe Lieberman, and Dick
Cheney -- they all polled a heck of a lot better than that when it was
first announced they were going to be on the ticket.

Even if Americans don`t know exactly who Paul Ryan is, they know his
ideas are way out of the mainstream. Seventy-nine percent of Americans do
not want to change Medicare. Almost 8 in 10 say leave it alone. Preserve
it the way we always have.

I mean, folks, if you look at his premier issues, they poll terribly
with the American people. Turning Medicare into a voucher program, nobody
wants to do that. Huge tax cuts for the rich? Show me a model where we
are going to tax ourselves into prosperity to pay for record debt, record
foreign debt, and record trade deficit. It`s not going to happen.

Huge programs cut for the poor. What are you picking on them for?
Conservatives say Paul Ryan is their modern day version of Ronald Reagan.
They got it wrong again. He`s more of a closer version of this guy, a
modern day version of Barry Goldwater, the conservative standard bearer who
was rejected by Americans in a landslide.

Americans of the past have rejected any attempts to undo the social
contract that we have had with the middle class and the poor in this
country. A rising tide lifts all boats. Well, Ayn Rand, that philosophy,
it doesn`t view it that way.

There`s going to be people left behind, and that`s OK. That`s what
that philosophy is. We now have an opportunity to reject it once again.

Get your cell phones out. I want to know what you think. Tonight`s
question, is this the most radical presidential ticket we have ever seen?
Text A for yes, text B for no to 622639.

You can always go to our blog at and leave a comment. We
encourage you to do that. We`ll bring you the results later on in the

Isn`t it interesting how Wisconsin has been like the lifeblood of big
political stories in the last couple years in this country? Well, now it`s
cast into the presidential campaign.

Joining me tonight is John Nichols, Washington correspondent to "The
Nation" magazine and author of the book "Uprising."

Who is Paul Ryan? I think, you know, people who follow politics know
exactly who this guy is. But he believes that he wants to get into the
entire vision of progressivism and he goes so far as to label it a cancer.
Isn`t this damaging for America?

JOHN NICHOLS, THE NATION: It`s a pretty remarkable statement,
especially for a Wisconsinite. You know, Paul Ryan comes from Janesville,
Wisconsin, the same town that Russ Feingold comes from. They went to the
same schools and their dads were both lawyers in Janesville.

And one of the things that is important to understand about Paul Ryan
is he`s a son of privilege. He was raised in a very nice house in a very
nice street. He didn`t come from a blue-collar family. He didn`t come
from a working class family.

And he was raised in the embrace of the conservative wing of the
Republican Party of Wisconsin, which has always had a problem with

The thing that you should understand, though, is progressivism came
out of the Republican Party. It didn`t come from German philosophers.
Progressivism came from the veterans of the civil are, who back to
Wisconsin and said, if we can end the sin of slavery, then we can change
our economics to be fair --

SCHULTZ: He wants to indict the entire vision of progressivism. What
kind of message does that say about bringing the country together?

When President Obama was elected, he wanted to be the president of all
people. This man sounds like he only wants to lead the people that are
going to think the way he thinks.

NICHOLS: I think that`s incredibly right. This is an incredibly
divisive platform. And a lot of people say that Paul Ryan is a nice guy.
One-on-one, he`s very amiable. But when you`re writing off, not just a
whole philosophy, not just ideas, but what came from those ideas -- you`re
really ripping into the core of the country.

SCHULTZ: Well, it`s easy to figure out his budget when you listen to
what he says. When he is in speak about his philosophy, it`s easy for him
to put something like that down on paper which is attack the poor, attack
the elderly, attack the downtrodden, cut all of the programs we have had
that have helped this country be great, what it is today.

This man has no foreign policy experience. He has no private sector
experience. He`s never been elected to a state office. He represents one
eighth of the state of Wisconsin and he has no major market in his

NICHOLS: No TV market.

SCHULTZ: No TV market.

Has he kind of gone under the radar?

NICHOLS: Absolutely he has. And remember that statement about
progressivism, that came from 2010, a couple years ago. If you listen to
the whole interview, Glenn Beck says, I don`t really know you. And -- so,
even two years ago, national right wingers weren`t that familiar with Paul
Ryan. He`s a guy who has been hanging around Washington for a very long

But he has inserted himself into the debate over the last two years
with, I think, a great deal of ambition, trying to get himself exactly to
where he`s gotten.

SCHULTZ: So, who stands on the stump with this man with the radical
vision, this Ayn Rand vision of America, this vision of tearing apart
institutions that have helped this country be great and give people an
opportunity? Who stands with him? How -- is he going to be toxic on the
campaign trail?

NICHOLS: It`s got the potential to be this, Ed. Already, there are
Republican candidates for the U.S. senate who have been airing ads in
states like Montana, making a point that they voted against the Ryan
budget, because they know how unpopular it is.

One of the things we`re going to be watching for is that first
Republican candidate who when Paul Ryan comes into his district or her
state, says I`m not going to be around that day because they`re not going
to want to stand next to a guy when he indicts progressivism, indicts the
philosophy that Franklin Roosevelt said helped to build the New Deal and
Social Security.

SCHULTZ: John Nichols, great to have you with us tonight. There`s so
much to talk about. It`s going to be a very interesting week.

Remember to answer tonight`s question. Share your thoughts on Twitter
@EdShow, and on Facebook. We want to know what you think.

Coming up, the Obama/Biden team comes out swinging. The Democrats
deliver a unified message today. You won`t believe what Paul Ryan said in

Stay with us. That`s next.


SCHULTZ: Coming up, the president went after Paul Ryan today on the
stump. E.J. Dionne and Joan Walsh on how Democrats are handling the new
man on the ticket. That`s next.

Mitt Romney`s problem with women voters will only get worse with his
new running mate. National Organization of Women`s Terry O`Neill is ahead
with us tonight.

And later, Vermont Senator Bernie Sanders on this unbelievable lie
they have been talking about all weekend long since this announcement. And
now, Mitt Romney and Paul Ryan are pedaling this stuff about Medicare all
across America.

Share your thoughts with us on Facebook and on Twitter using #EdShow.

We`re coming right back.


SCHULTZ: Welcome back to THE ED SHOW. Thanks for watching tonight.

President Obama and Vice President Biden got their first chance to
talk about Mitt Romney`s new running mate. Tonight, the Obama campaign is
united in its message. Bottom line, Paul Ryan, hey, he`s a nice guy. He`s
got real bad ideas.

Pundits call Ryan a gutsy choice for Romney? Joe Biden fired back.


BIDEN: What`s gutsy about giving millionaires another tax break?
What`s gutsy -- what`s gutsy about gutting Medicare, Medicaid, education?
What`s gutsy?


SCHULTZ: At the same time, both President Obama and Paul Ryan were
making stops in central Iowa and both spoke at the state fair. They`re
both getting a firsthand look at what is essentially become ground zero for
the worst drought in 50 years in this country.

Ryan will have to explain why he is blocking a farm bill that would
provide disaster relief for farmers and ranchers. President Obama asked
supporters in Iowa to pass along this message.


OBAMA: Unfortunately, right now, too many members of Congress are
blocking the farm bill from becoming law.


OBAMA: I am told that Governor Romney`s new running mate, Paul Ryan,
might be around Iowa in the next few days. He`s one of it leaders of
Congress standing in the way. So, if you happen to see Congressman Ryan,
tell him how important this farm bill is to Iowa and our rural communities.


SCHULTZ: So, not far down the road in Iowa, here is Paul Ryan`s


RYAN: We`ll get into all of the policy things later, Alex. Right
now, I just want to enjoy the fair.


SCHULTZ: Just enjoy the fair. You have a disaster, a drought that`s
taking place, the worst in 50 years, you`re in the backyard where farmers
and ranchers are having a hard time, they`re worried about what kind of
disaster relief is going to be there. And all Ryan wants to do is just
enjoy the fair.

President Obama did exactly the right thing today. You go to a part
of the country, what`s on the minds of the people, and what`s on the minds
of the people is their economy and what is happening to the ag community
right now with this terrible drought that`s taking place. Actually, Mr.
Ryan, the Iowa state fair is the perfect place to talk about the farm bill
and those other policy things.

Let`s bring in Joan Walsh, editor at large, and author of
the upcoming book, "What`s the Matter with White People?" And E.J. Dionne,
MSNBC contributor, "Washington Post" columnist, and also author of the book
"Our Divided Political Heart."

Great to have both of you with us.

Joan, you first. No doubt, we have a distinction here. We`ve got a
choice. But is this the way Ryan is going to be on the campaign trail?
They can`t define what`s going on with Medicare and Medicare and what the
differences are between the two candidates. I`m talking about the
presidential candidate and vice presidential --


SCHULTZ: -- candidates, Romney/Ryan. Yet when he`s asked something
in detail about -- is he campaigning in disguise?

WALSH: I mean, I -- that was remarkable, you know, I want to enjoy
the fair. That was such a remark of entitlement, Ed. You know? You
really are pressed to discuss policy at state fairs when you`re running for
vice president.

So it was one of those moments where we really don`t know what Paul
Ryan is going to be on a national campaign. He grew up in Janesville.
He`s liked by people in his community. He`s gone to Washington.

He`s got a very narrow purview. He`s liked by the Koch brothers. You
know, he`s got some friends in high places.

But that retail campaigning, there was just a touch of entitlement
there that I think he`s going to have to work on. That was not a good
answer for the people of Iowa.

SCHULTZ: E.J. Dionne, how do you answer a question like that without
definition? You would have to say we`re going to get these farmers and
ranchers relief but not put it in the budget. I mean, that`s basically
where he would be coming from.

And I also find it very interesting that just two hours after Romney
named Paul Ryan his running mate, the National Republican Campaign
Committee released a memo and a video warning members not to talk about
entitlement reform, not to use that term, not to use the term
"privatization", or every option is on the table. Don`t ever say that.

Now, what does this say about Ryan and the campaign? What are we
seeing here early on?

E.J. DIONNE, WASHINGTON POST: I actually think you have an
interesting split in the Republican Party between Republicans on the
ballot, particularly in congressional races and a lot of professionals and
the party base in the ideologues. The ideologues love this.

And, by the way, let`s give Romney some credit. He has brought
liberals and conservatives together, because how often does a decision win
cheers from both sides like the Ryan pick did? But I think the
professional Republicans know that Ryan`s positions are real problems for
their party.

I think what you`re seeing today from Obama and Joe Biden, and Biden,
is they`re trying to put Romney in a box. First, he wants credit for
boldness, but he wants to back away from some of Ryan`s positions. Well,
that`s going to be a problem for him.

And they`re really trying to sort of tie Romney now to the Republican
Congress. Last I looked, their approval rating was around 17 percent.

President Obama was very careful to say that Ryan is one of the
leaders of congress standing in the way. How often are we going to hear

And as Joan said, we don`t know what kind of campaigner Ryan is going
to be on the national level.

SCHULTZ: Evasive. That`s the word we have to come up on the first
day. He`s not definite about Medicare, exactly what is going to happen
there. And he`s not definite about how he would help people in the worst
drought in 50 years in this country.

Joan Walsh, who is going to stand with this man on the campaign trail?
If he`s such a radical and it`s in his -- what moderate Republican is going
to stand up there and say I can get independent voters with this guy at my

WALSH: Oh, I think they`re going to be terrified. I think they are
going to run away from him, and, you know, E.J. makes the point this was
such a bold move bomb the man of mystery, Mitt Romney, who won`t define
anything and he`s told us that, people might not vote for me if they knew
what I was going to do, is now married to that man who -- for better or
worse -- has really carved out a far right program.

SCHULTZ: So does it help Democrats?

WALSH: I think it helps Democrats, yes. I think it helps Democrats.

SCHULTZ: E.J., what do you think? Does it help Democrats? I mean,
is this the golden goose to carve up?

DIONNE: I don`t know if he`s the golden goose -- I don`t believe in
the gold standard. But I think he is of immense help in defining the
issues. I think he really makes it much easier for Democrats to say that
the Republicans are radical.

I don`t think that`s an inappropriate word, and Ryan helps make that
clear. The kind of cuts he wants to make really remind people that they
are not as anti-government as the Republicans are. Americans are often
anti-government in theory, but they are in practice in favor of the
government doing a lot of things. And Ryan is against the government doing
a lot of things that the Americans want government to do.

SCHULTZ: Joan Walsh, E.J. Dionne, thanks for joining us tonight on

DIONNE: Good to be with you.

SCHULTZ: Paul Ryan`s policies are bad for women. How bad? Well,
I`ll ask Terry O`Neill, president of the National Organization for Women.

And the Paul Ryan pick has big labor in this country up in arms.
James Hoffa and Larry Cohen will tell us exactly what the union ground game
is going to be against this ticket.

Stay with us.



SEN. BARBARA BOXER (D), CALIFORNIA: This is really a sick proposal, a
sick proposal. That`s what it means to the average woman.


SCHULTZ: California Senator Barbara Boxer just slamming the Ryan
Budget. Mitt Romney is having a tough time with women voters already. He
trails President Obama by double digits across the country. Selecting Paul
Ryan as his running mate, well, it`s not going to help the ticket at all, I
don`t think.

Simply put, Paul Ryan`s policies are bad for women. And his record
proves it. Ryan voted against equal pay for equal work. He wants to gut
Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, the big three, which would
disproportionately affect women in this country.

His budget would also hurt families. He wants to slash Food Stamps,
which is in the Farm Bill, by 18 percent. He wants to ban abortions even
in the case of rape or incest. Ryan wants to eliminate abortion care, even
when the life of the mother is at risk. Is that radical?

He wants to defund Planned Parenthood. He even proposed giving legal
rights to a fertilized egg, which would essentially outlaw abortion, intro-
V fertilization and some forms of contraception.

And of course, both Ryan and Romney promise to repeal the Affordable
Care Act, leaving millions of women uninsured and taking away their access
to affordable care and all of those preventive clinics across America.

I`m joined tonight by Terry O`Neil, president of the National
Organization for Women. Terry, good to have you with us. When you see
what Paul Ryan has actually done in the Congress, what he believes in and
what he is proposing, how dangerous is this for women in our society?

young girls all the way to the very oldest women, Paul Ryan`s vision for
the United States is fiercely and harshly anti-female. You know, Medicare,
his proposal to convert Medicare to a private voucher system, on average,
would cost seniors about 6,000 dollars per year extra for their health care
costs. But women are in a -- it`s much tougher for women to afford that
because they work a lifetime at unequal pay.

When people 85 years old and older, 70 percent of them on Medicare are
women. So this attack on Medicare really is an attack on women. And the
same thing is true of his attacks on Social Security and his attacks on
Medicaid; 50 percent of Medicaid dollars support nursing homes.

SCHULTZ: So do you think that this pick drives women, independent
women, into the Obama camp?

O`NEIL: There`s no question about it. What is really surprising to
me is that Romney, who really does need the women`s vote in order to win
this election, I predict that the gender gap amongst independent women
voters is going to swell into the double digits, as more and more women
begin to pay attention and to really see the vision that Romney and Ryan
have for us.

SCHULTZ: So obviously, he wants to roll back Roe v. Wade. He would
be the real political disciple to do all of that.

O`NEIL: Oh, yes.

SCHULTZ: With that, isn`t there going to be a resurgence of
conservative voters that would say, OK, our guy is on the ticket now. This
is our time to move? Isn`t it going to help the base get out to vote for
the Republicans?

O`NEIL: You know, it`s not. Because not only is Paul Ryan adamantly
opposed to women having access to abortion care, including care that is
necessary, for example, if the woman has heart disease or diabetes or
cancer, and needs to terminate that pregnancy; Paul Ryan would say no.
Paul Ryan is also anti-birth control. And again, you know, even
conservatives believe in birth control; 98 percent of women in this country
who are sexually active have utilized birth control.

That includes women who are extremely conservative. It includes 98
percent of sexually active Catholic women. So no, this is -- his anti-
abortion stance might have moved the base, but will depress the base is
that he`s not just anti-abortion; he`s also very firmly anti-birth control.

SCHULTZ: How would women move forward in our economy with this kind
of thinking and these kinds of policies?

O`NEIL: You know, we can`t. The problem is that if women don`t have
access to birth control, they will face greater health risks and that`s
costly. And as long as Paul Ryan`s vision -- if his vision actually got
enacted into law, women would have less access to the very things, the
resources that they need in order to meet the expenses.

So you know, when you deprive women as a class of access to the health
care that they need most, and you`re opposed to equal pay, and you want to
gut Social Security and Medicare and Medicaid, women really have almost
nowhere to go. But that`s exactly what women are going to understand as
they take a careful look at what this guy is proposing. And that`s why
they`re going to lose that election.

SCHULTZ: Terry O`Neil, National Organization for Women, thanks so
much for joining us.

O`NEIL: Thank you, Ed.

SCHULTZ: There`s a lot more coming up in the next half hour of THE ED
SHOW. Stay with us.


RYAN: You can`t lift people out of poverty if you don`t have a
growing economy.


SCHULTZ: There`s a new republican leader in the party`s war on the
middle class. James Hoffa of the Teamsters and CWA`s Larry Cohen react to
the Ryan pick.

Two percent Tim Pawlenty thanks Mitt Romney for passing him over by
keeping the tax issue on the table.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How many years of tax returns did you provide to
the Romney campaign?

exact number, George, but I -- there were several years, I believe.


SCHULTZ: And it`s the GOP versus the Big Three. Vermont Senator
Bernie Sanders helps us debunk the big lie coming from the new Romney/Ryan


SCHULTZ: Welcome back to THE ED SHOW. Mitt Romney`s choice of Paul
Ryan proves that he is not worried about the problems of the working middle
class in this country. All you have to do is look at Ryan`s record. Ryan
supported Governor Scott Walker`s radical plan to end collective bargaining
rights for public sector workers.

That`s just the tip of the iceberg. Under Ryan`s watch, his Wisconsin
district has seen a number of manufacturing plants close. For instance, in
2010, a Chrysler plant in Kenosha closed, 575 jobs were lost. In 2008, a
Delphi plant was closed in Oak Creek, Wisconsin. Hundreds of people lost
their jobs.

Also in 2008, a General Motors plant in Janesville was shut down.
Roughly 5,000 people lost their jobs there. You know what Ryan did? He
stood silent on the sidelines -- that`s what he did -- while all of this
was going on. Bottom line, this guy is an outsourcer. He`s not a fighter
for workers. He`s not a fighter for the middle class.

He has no record of showing anything like that. For more, let`s turn
to James Hoffa, general president, International Brotherhood of Teamsters,
and also with us tonight, Larry Cohen, who is president of the
Communication Workers of America.

Gentlemen, great to have you with us tonight.


SCHULTZ: Let me just say that it has to be stated, President Obama
can`t win without labor. The Democrats can`t win without labor. You have
the infrastructure. You have the communication. You have the boos on the
ground. But now you also are facing a ticket, whether you agree with
everything President Obama has ever done for the labor, if you have any
sins that need to be forgiven, now is kind of the time, isn`t it, Mr.
Hoffa? I mean, with this ticket, this is a radical push-back at labor, is
it not?

JAMES HOFFA, TEAMSTERS PRESIDENT: This is probably the most anti-
labor slate you have ever seen before. Romney/Ryan is unbelievably anti-
labor. Romney is for national right to work. He`s against card check.
He`s against project labor agreements. He`s already said that.

On top of that, you put Ryan who voted against extending unemployment.
He`s against OSHEA. He`s against fair pay for women who do equal work. He
voted against the Bring the Jobs Home Act. He`s basically anti-labor.

You have two anti-labor people out there right now. And that`s what
we`re going to tell our members. That`s what we`re going to go out and
articulate to our members and say, this is a clear choice. If you want
somebody that is out to end the union that protects you, to end your
ability to be in the middle class, then you better make sure that you vote
for Barack Obama.

SCHULTZ: Mr. Cohen, what about what Mr. Hoffa just said? Wouldn`t
this be a big motivated moment for wage earners in this country to get out
and do what they have to do?

LARRY COHEN, CWA PRESIDENT: Absolutely. I think, again, politics is
about choices. And the choice is more clear now than it was last week.
American workers want more and better Social Security, not less. Income
replacement is already among the lowest in the world here in retirement.

They want better Medicare, not less and not more attacks on their
health care. They want better job security, not more offshoring of work;
500,000 customer service and tech jobs have left in the last five years. I
do think, though, Ed, as you mentioned earlier, we need a clear return to
progressivism and populous politics in the Democratic party as well.

We can`t be complacent and just say the choice is clear. We need
Democrats to come out for workers` right, for employment security, for
retirement for America`s workers, for better health care. But it is clear,
the choice could never be starker.

SCHULTZ: Well, it`s also very clear in an interview that he`s done on
right-wing radio that he views the progressive movement in this country as
a cancer. Progressivism and labor unions in this country walk hand in
hand. Mr. Hoffa, do you have a response to that? Are you a cancer?

HOFFA: It`s unbelievable. This man, it`s like he`s from the 1890s.
He doesn`t see -- he`s from the gilded Age, the rich get richer. He wants
tax cuts for the rich. And he basically wants to keep down the workers,
make sure they can`t have unions. That`s how he sees the work.

They want to get rid of the New Deal. They want to get rid of the
Fair Deal. They want to get rid of the Great Society. They resent
everything that has been done that helps the average worker out there or
the average person, the average American that`s trying to get by. And
that`s a clear choice.

I have never seen a ticket like this. And I think that this is a big
enhancement for Barack Obama. I think we have to articulate this to our
members. But it`s clear that they basically want to keep down working
people and people that are trying to make it in America. And they want it
all and they don`t want us to have anything.

SCHULTZ: Mr. Cohen, they keep talking about how this is going to put
Wisconsin in play. What is the pushback from labor on that?

COHEN: Well, I think, you know, there`s always going to be some truth
to that, when they have a native son. But I think as we have been doing in
Midwestern states in the last year, we will speak out about workers` rights
and the choice is clear. We will speak out about health care rights, and
the choice is clear.

We will speak out about civil rights versus voter suppression, and the
choice is clear. So again, I think politics is about choices. And for
working Americans, whether they`re in a union or not, the choice is clear.
We have to keep people focused on what it means to have a 21st century
democracy verses, as Jim said, a 19th century oligarchy.

I think working people in this country, whether they have a union or
not, are smart. And they`ll see the difference.

SCHULTZ: James Hoffa, Larry Cohen, great to have you both with us
tonight on THE ED SHOW. Thank you so much.

COHEN: Thank you.

SCHULTZ: And you won`t believe who told Tim Pawlenty that he was
being skipped over for vice president.

Plus, Paul Ryan keeps quiet on his tax return debate. We`ll bring you
the latest. Stay with us.


SCHULTZ: Welcome back to THE ED SHOW. One years ago today, poor
Governor Tim Pawlenty of Minnesota received only 13 percent of the vote at
the Iowa Straw Poll. A year later, well, things just don`t seem to be
getting much better for T-Paw. Pawlenty was again not chosen to be the
number two spot on the GOP ticket.

And this time, he didn`t even get a phone call from Romney. Romney
didn`t even call him? He outsourced that to -- Mitt`s oldest son, Tagg,
was given the assignment of breaking the bad news to Pawlenty. This didn`t
stop T-Paw from being a loyal soldier for the Romney campaign. He
immediately hit the airwaves praising the Romney/Ryan ticket.

However, one question seemed to catch him off guard.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How many years of tax returns did you provide to
the Romney campaign?

PAWLENTY: I don`t know the exact number, George, but I -- there were
several years I believe.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Several years, so more than two?

PAWLENTY: Well, we don`t get into the details of the vetting process,
but I gave them a bunch of tax returns. I don`t remember the exact number
of years.


SCHULTZ: Oh, come on, Tim. You`re a stickler for details. You know
exactly how many you gave Mitt Romney. I bet you know it`s exactly what --
you know, I tell you what. I think that you gave John McCain just as many
four years ago.

Now to be fair, Pawlenty isn`t the only republican dodging this


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How many years of tax returns did you turn over to
the campaign?

RYAN: It was very exhaustive vetting process. It`s a confidential
vetting process, so there were several years. But I`m going to release the
same amount of years that Governor Romney has. I have to tell you, Bob --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How many was that?

RYAN: Two. I`m going to be releasing two, which is what he`s


SCHULTZ: The one thing the Paul Ryan VP pick hasn`t changed is we
still don`t know what is in Mitt Romney`s tax returns. At this point, we
may never know. And that`s, I think, just the way they like it.

That `08 and `09 must be a dandy for Romney.

Tonight in our survey, I asked is this the most radical presidential
ticket ever. Ninety four percent of you said yes; six percent of you say

Coming up, Mitt Romney says that he and Paul Ryan are going to save
Medicare. Now, we`re going to break down the latest big Republican lie.
This is what`s out there, that Obama took so many billions of dollars from
seniors. Not true. Bernie Sanders joins us next. Coming right back.



ROMNEY: There`s only one president that I know of in history that
robbed Medicare 716 billion dollars to pay for a new risky program of his
own that we call Obamacare. Think of that. What Paul Ryan and I have
talked about is saving Medicare.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This president stole -- he didn`t cut Medicare.
He stole 700 billion dollars from Medicare to fund Obamacare. If any
person in this entire debate has blood on their hands in regard to
Medicare, it`s Barack Obama.


SCHULTZ: Folks, they will stop at nothing. Republicans are already
playing offense on the issue of Medicare. And they`re doing really what
they do best. They just are repeating a lie. Here`s Mitt Romney on the
stump today about it.


ROMNEY: My plan for Medicare is very similar to his plan for
Medicare, which is do not change the program for current retires or new
retires, but do not do what the president has done, and that is to cut 700
billion dollars out of the current program.


SCHULTZ: Romney and the Republicans failed to mention, get this, the
700 billion dollars reduction in the cost of Medicare under the Affordable
Care Act, what they call Obamacare, didn`t come at the expense of
recipients where people are going to be getting screwed -- they`re not
going to be getting the right kind of care. It came from cutting federal
subsidies to insurance and drug companies that were overcharging the

They also failed to mention that Paul Ryan`s own budget keeps the 700
billion dollar cut in place, in addition to slashing benefits through a
voucher program. When it comes to Social Security, Ryan isn`t giving
specifics. Yet Ryan wanted to privatize the program along with the Bush
administration back in 2005. Ryan`s plan saves the biggest budget cut in
Medicaid. OK?

Now, he wants to cut federal Medicaid spending by over 700 billion
dollars in the next 10 years. That means cutting funds for the poor, the
elderly, and disabled children. That`s what they`re going to do. That`s
their priority, while they want to give tax cuts to the rich.

Let`s turn to Bernie Sanders, independent senator from Vermont, a
fighter for the people. Senator, good to have you with us tonight. You
just heard those sound cuts. This was from the stump today. Republicans
are saying that they are saving Medicare. What do you call it?

SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (I), VERMONT: Well, everybody understands that
they are destroying Medicare as it is currently constituted. What they
intend to do is convert Medicare, over a period of years, into a voucher
program. So what they`re going to say to a 70-year-old senior who is
dealing with cancer or heart disease, here is a check for 8,000 dollars.
Go out, get the best private insurance policy you can, and lots of luck.

Now, you tell me, Ed, if somebody is dealing with cancer or heart
disease or a serious illness, what 8,000 dollars is going to do. Everybody
knows what it means is that, A, seniors are going to have to come out of --
come up with more money out of their own pocket or their kids are going to
have to help them. Or worse, they`re not going to get the care that they

SCHULTZ: Senator, what they are doing is they are playing this 700
billion dollars bullet point, saying that -- you heard Reince Priebus, that
President Obama stole this money, that they`re going to be shafting
seniors. That simply isn`t the case. And I like the fact --

SANDERS: No, it isn`t the case. It isn`t the case, Ed. And the
point to be made is, as I hope most people know, in the United States
today, we spend almost twice as much per capita on health care as do the
people of any other country. We have a wildly inefficient and wasteful

So what we were trying to do and what we did is not cut benefits for
seniors, but make the system more efficient. That`s a good start. I`m a
single payer advocate, because I think we could do a lot more.

SCHULTZ: If it`s turned over to the states, that, of course, is a
whole different ball game. But selling the American people on Obamacare
and making them understand exactly, you know, that this is a lie -- this is
a major lie. They`re using this money --

SANDERS: Ed, I want to say a word on Medicaid and the massive cuts
that they are proposing. Let`s be very clear. A lot of people don`t
understand this. This year alone, we`re going to be losing about 45,000
people who die because they don`t get to a doctor when they should. These
are people who don`t have any health insurance.

If Medicaid is significantly cut, that number will increase
significantly. And what that means is a death sentence for a whole lot of
people all over this country. We have 50 million people who have no health
insurance today; 45,000 are dying because they don`t get to a doctor. The
idea that you would make devastating cuts in Medicaid, leave people,
children, working people, out there with no access to health care at all,
is criminal. And it cannot be allowed to happen.

SCHULTZ: Your thoughts on the Ryan pick? Now that you heard a sound
bite earlier tonight, he thinks progressivism is a cancer.

SANDERS: Well, I happen -- as a strong progressive, I think what the
fight here is about is the feeding the oligarchic form of government that
Romney and Ryan want. What they believe government should be is a handful
of wealthy people controlling the economics and politics of the country.
That`s what they believe.

I happen to be old fashioned, and believe that we need to have a
strong middle class, happen to be old fashioned and believe that instead of
Citizens United, you have a democracy where ordinary people can be heard
rather than just billionaires.

SCHULTZ: Senator, great to have you with us tonight. Keep up the
fight. Thanks so much.

That`s THE ED SHOW. I`m Ed Schultz. "THE RACHEL MADDOW SHOW" starts
right now. Good evening, Rachel.


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