updated 1/22/2013 10:58:27 AM ET 2013-01-22T15:58:27

THE ED SHOW with ED SCHULTZ
January 18, 2013

Guests: Debbie Wasserman Schultz, Lawrence Wilkerson, Rep. Rick Nolan, Larry Cohen, Dr. Jeff Gardere

ED SCHULTZ, HOST: Good evening, Americans. And welcome THE ED SHOW
from New York.

Four years after plotting to destroy President Obama`s agenda,
Republicans are raising the white flag.

This is THE ED SHOW -- let`s get to work.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: But they will not
collect a ransom in exchange for not crashing the American economy.

SCHULTZ (voice-over): The Republican game of chicken is over. Eric
Cantor proposes a three-month deal on the debt ceiling. But some Democrats
are calling it a trap.

I`ll ask DNC chairwoman Debbie Wasserman Schultz what she thinks.

It`s do or die time for filibuster reform, and Democrats are about to
drop the ball.

Tonight, my message to Senator Harry Reid.

Plus, the American people are getting ripped off by a Congress that
just isn`t working. Congressman Rick Nolan was there 30 years ago. He is
back now and he can`t believe the difference. He is wondering, are we
getting paid for this?

And, is it really an admission of guilt if you don`t show any remorse?

OPRAH WINFREY, OWN NETWORK: It did not even feel wrong?

LANCE ARMSTRONG, FORMER PROFESSIONAL CYCLIST: No. It`s scary.

WINFREY: Did you feel bad about it?

ARMSTRONG: No. Even scarier.

SCHULTZ: Psychologist Dr. Jeffrey Gardere on Lance Armstrong`s
bizarre performance last night.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SCHULTZ: Good to have you with us tonight, folks. Thanks for
watching.

Republicans surrendered today in one of their biggest fights.

President Obama warned Republicans about taking the debt ceiling
hostage. It looks like they heard the message.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: The financial well-being of the American people is not
leverage to be used. The full faith and credit of the United States of
America is not a bargaining chip. And they better choose quickly because
time is running short.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Republicans made their choice today during a GOP retreat in
Williamsburg, Virginia. House Majority Leader Eric Cantor reportedly
announced plans to pass a bill extending the debt limit for an additional
three months. It`s a clearest sign yet Republicans have no intention of
ever defaulting on the country`s debts.

In a statement, the White House responding, saying, "We are encouraged
that there are signs congressional Republicans may back off their
insistence on holding our economy hostage to extract drastic cuts in
Medicare, education and programs middle class families depend on."

The temporary nature of the increase is somewhat troubling. A White
House official told NBC News, "It`s a terrible way to run the country."

But the aide gave no indication President Obama would veto a temporary
extension. If this is how congressional Republicans want to govern, so be
it. They already have an approval rating of, let`s see, 14 percent from
the American people. Can they do better than that? Maybe they just want
to see how low it can go.

The writing was on the wall yesterday when Republican Budget Chairman
Paul Ryan told members they need to be prepared for a debt ceiling
increase.

The attitudes from Republican leaders are a lot different today.
Senator Jon Cornyn of Texas wrote an op-ed in "Houston Chronicle" two weeks
ago saying it may be necessary to partially shut down the government in
order to secure the long-term fiscal well-being of the country." Now,
Cornyn tells "The Chronicle" editorial board, "We will raise the debt
ceiling. We are not going to default on our debt."

Two years ago, Republicans were gloating over their debt ceiling
hostage strategy.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. MITCH MCCONNELL (R-KY), MINORITY LEADER: No president in the
near future, maybe in the distant future, will be able to get the debt
ceiling increased without a re-ignition, a reigniting of the same
discussion of how do we cut spending and get America headed in the right
direction. I expect the next president, whoever that is, is going to be
asking us to raise the debt ceiling again in 2013. So, we`ll be doing it
all over.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Today, Mitch McConnell doesn`t sound so tough. Instead of
demanding spending cuts on entitlement reform, here`s McConnell`s new
demand. He says, "The American people expect the Senate to finally pass a
budget."

This is the new Republican leverage? It`s a pretty weak hand. Don`t
you think?

House Republican whip Kevin McCarthy was in full spin mode about the
new terms of the debt limit fight.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. KEVIN MCCARTHY (R-CA), HOUSE WHIP: The Senate has never even
passed a budget. It is the rule of the law that by April 15th, you have
to. So, we`re saying is, we will extend the debt limit until the timeline
where you have a budget, a road map. So, you stop digging yourself in the
hole and we get out of this problem. Part of not having the budget has
gotten us into this problem in the first place.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: The Senate is already operating under the 2011 Budget
Control Act. Demanding the Senate pass a budget really doesn`t do
anything. It also violates the so-called Boehner rule, which requires any
bill to have cuts equal to the rise of the debt ceiling.

Well, Republicans are making up for this by saying Congress will get
paid -- will not get paid unless the Senate passes a budget.

Well, let`s investigate this a little bit. Even Republican
Congressman Darrell Issa knows it`s a violation of the Twenty-Seventh
Amendment not to pay Congress. When told about the plan, Issa said,
"That`s unconstitutional." He wants a paycheck.

Now, Republicans are claiming the plan will just withhold pay for
Congress. So all of them will get paid, no matter what. What is it? It`s
just a big sham. It`s just a big game.

House Democratic Leader Nancy Pelosi rejected the plan as a gimmick.
She`s correct. But this gimmick is the only thing Republicans have up
their sleeves right now. John Boehner told everyone two years ago the
country would not default on its debt.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHRIS WALLACE, FOX NEWS: Do you agree with administration officials
and other economists that defaulting on the full faith and credit of the
United States would be a financial disaster?

REP. JOHN BOEHNER (R-OH), SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE: That would be a
financial disaster, not only for our country, but for the worldwide
economy.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: And President Obama reminded congress the economic damage
done by playing games with the debt limit.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: The last time Republicans in congress even flirted with this
idea, our AAA credit rating was downgraded for the first time in our
history. Our businesses created the fewest jobs of any month in nearly the
past three years and, ironically, the whole fiasco actually added to the
deficit.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Republicans basically had no choice but to retreat from
their hard line position, negotiating with the American people.

If the country defaulted, they would be responsible for a global
economic collapse. The new plan for a three-month increase guarantees
another debate in the next few months. OK, let`s have it. It also shows
Republicans never had any intention on carrying out their threats.

Get your cell phones out. I want to know what you think tonight.
Tonight`s question, do Republicans finally realize the consequences of
holding the economy hostage?

Text A for yes, text B for no, to 622639. And you can leave a comment
on our blog at Ed.MSNBC.com. We`ll bring you the results later on in the
show.

Joining me tonight, Congresswoman Debbie Wasserman Schultz of Florida,
chairwoman of the DNC.

Congresswoman, good to have you with us tonight.

REP. DEBBIE WASSERMAN SCHULTZ (D-FL), DNC CHAIRWOMAN: Thanks, Ed.
Good to be here.

SCHULTZ: Is this a big victory of sorts or is this a trap, as some
Democrats have labeled it?

WASSERMAN SCHULTZ: It`s a little bit of both, because while it is
good to hear that the Republicans are recognizing that we cannot play
chicken with our economy, that we cannot jeopardize the full faith and
credit of the United States, you know, this is the party that used to say,
for so many years, that the business community and our economy needed
certainty. And -- I mean, it is the furthest thing from certainty to
extend the debt ceiling for three months.

And, you know, I mean -- if they ultimately send a clean debt ceiling
increase to the president with no strings attached, that would be great.
But what they need to do is they need to do it where they give long-term
certainty for our economy, for our recovery, so that we can focus on job
creation and getting the economy turned around.

SCHULTZ: How do you --

WASSERMAN SCHULTZ: That is not what they are proposing, though.

SCHULTZ: How do you know the Republicans will come back in 90 days
and do the exact same thing they did this time?

WASSERMAN SCHULTZ: You know, I would expect that it would just be
continuing to do it in short increments. If they can even get it -- get
the support among their caucus members for another three-month extension.
I mean, they`re saying -- what they`re doing here is they`re saying, OK,
we`re going to wait for a budget from the Senate. And the budget from the
Senate better have the cuts that we`re expecting.

So, essentially, they`re basically trying to extend the time in which
they tie a debt ceiling increase to spending cuts.

SCHULTZ: Sure.

WASSERMAN SCHULTZ: And as speaker -- as Leader Pelosi said, that`s a
little too cute by half.

SCHULTZ: All right. Wall Street reacted well to the news of a
Republican plan today. The Dow hit a five-year high.

Now, do your colleagues finally understand that economic consequences
of holding the debt ceiling hostage? All this talk about stability in the
economy, well, today, you got 90 days worth of stability and the market did
pretty doggone well.

WASSERMAN SCHULTZ: I mean, how many more signs do they need?

SCHULTZ: Yes.

WASSERMAN SCHULTZ: That this is what the economy needs, the
certainty. But three months is definitely not certainty.

SCHULTZ: Will Democrats vote for this? Will you get Democratic votes
on this when Boehner brings this up?

WASSERMAN SCHULTZ: I think it`s going to depend on what it looks
like. I mean, this is really gimmicky, gimmicking garbage at the end of
the day. I mean, the responsible thing to do is to pass a debt ceiling
increase because we have to pay our bills. I`m, really, leaving this
uncertainty hanging over our already fragile recovery is irresponsible.

And to suggest that we are not going to pay our bills or tie the debt
that we have to pay to anything that the Republicans want to extract out of
President Obama is irresponsible.

SCHULTZ: Yes.

I mean, the Republican that I look to right now is John Cornyn. What
a reversal. I mean, this guy writes an op-ed in the hometown newspaper in
Houston and turns around and tells the editorial board something totally
different.

What does that say about their leadership?

WASSERMAN SCHULTZ: It says that they are all over the map. It says
that they are basically a rudderless ship and it says that they really
don`t get what is at stake for us economically.

President Obama clearly does. We`ve had 34 straight months of job
growth. We`ve begun to get this economy turned around, unemployment rate
is continuing to drop. The stock market is doing well.

But the Republicans could very easily throw all that into the trash
can if they continue to leave the market uncertain and potentially continue
to jeopardize the full faith and credit of the United States.

SCHULTZ: Congresswoman, does this now put some pressure on the
Democrats to deliver in the next 90 days? Show the spending cuts you`re
willing to make?

WASSERMAN SCHULTZ: Look, at the end of the day, when we deal with
this sequester, we deal with deficit reduction, it has to be in a balanced
way.

We have always said that we are willing to support spending cuts. We
put our money where our mouth is with the debt ceiling last summer. Like
I`ve said before, Ed, many of us on the Democratic side voted for $1.2
trillion in spending cuts with no revenue, no balance, and got a debt
ceiling increase.

President Obama made it very clear we are not negotiating over the
debt ceiling again because we have to pay our bills. We have to give
certainty to our economy. And we have to focus on deficit reduction in a
balanced way so we can protect the middle class and working families.

SCHULTZ: Doesn`t this give the progressive movement an opportunity in
the next 90 days to really send the message to Congress, leave the big
three alone? Go get your money somewhere else?

I mean, it would seem to me that the Republicans are going to go after
that in the next 90 days, make the case that the entitlements are really
the problem in all of this. So, this campaign is going to continue on.

WASSERMAN SCHULTZ: It will, absolutely, continue on. And I think we
have to acknowledge that Medicare and Medicaid is a contributor,
significant contributor to our deficit. And there are savings that we can
squeeze out. We`ve already -- we`ve already added eight years of solvency
into Medicare through the Affordable Care Act that we`re able to get.

SCHULTZ: Sure.

WASSERMAN SCHULTZ: And President Obama in his $4 trillion budget plan
for deficit reduction proposed another $360 billion, almost $400 billion in
entitlement savings.

We can do a lot better, but we need cooperation.

SCHULTZ: OK. Congresswoman Debbie Wasserman Schultz, thank you for
joining us on this Friday evening.

WASSERMAN SCHULTZ: Thank you.

SCHULTZ: Thank you.

We want to know what you think. Tonight`s question there at the
bottom of the screen. Share your thoughts with us at @EdShow, or Facebook
page. We always want to know what you`re thinking.

Coming up, House Republicans are trying to teach their members how to
talk to women and minorities. Better late than never. I`ll ask Lawrence
Wilkerson about the current state of his party.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCHULTZ: So you`re an American worker. You`re working harder, and
longer and making less money. Why isn`t Congress? I`ll ask Minnesota
Congressman Rick Nolan, what`s changed in Washington since his last term in
the House, which was 30 years ago?

And Lance Armstrong opens up to Oprah over his use of performance-
enhancing drugs. Psychologist Jeff Gardere joins me to discuss, what is
this guy all about and his admission?

Don`t forget. You can listen to my radio show on Sirius Radio XM
channel 127, Monday through Friday, noon to 3:00 p.m. Share your thoughts
with us on Facebook and Twitter using #EdShow.

We`re coming right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCHULTZ: Welcome back to THE ED SHOW.

Republicans wrap up their retreat today. They do this every now and
then, get together, figure out what`s going.

Unless they want to downsize into a further regional party, they had
better pay close attention to this very new poll that`s out. Only 26
percent of Americans have a positive opinion of the GOP, 49 percent have a
negative view. By comparison, 44 percent have a positive view of the
Democratic Party, 52 percent have a positive view of the president of the
United States.

It should be a wake-up call to the Republican Party. Four years ago,
House Republicans were at this very same retreat, planning their
obstruction of President Obama`s agenda on every single issue.

This poll, I think, is a report card. It didn`t work very well -- 26
percent of the American people think you`re OK. Republicans lost seats in
the Senate and in the House. And this poll really is a death knell, a
wake-up call, if they don`t make some kind of change.

Today, Republicans at the Virginia retreat held a panel discussion on
how to communicate with minorities and women. The panel included two
Hispanic women and three white guys. No African-Americans were on the
panel at all. It was an unfortunate coincidence. The meeting was also
being held at the Burwell Plantation room, named for a slave-owning family.
Good old Virginia.

The new chairman of the NRCC, Congressman Greg Walden, said, "We will
be building out further and deeper into the minority communities. We
recognize Republicans have good answers. We just have had bad
communication communications in many cases."

The Republican Party reached so far and so deep, they came up with a
six-member panel with no African-Americans to talk about minority outreach?
Republicans have reacted strongly to the words of former Secretary of State
Colin Powell, but he I think is doing them a favor by speaking out.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

COLIN POWELL, FORMER SECRETARY OF STATE: There`s also a dark -- a
dark vein of intolerance in some parts of the party. What do I mean by
that? What I mean by that is that they still sort of look down on
minorities.

How can I evidence that? When I see a former governor say that the
president is shucking and jiving. That`s a racial era slave term.

When I see another former governor after the president`s first debate
where he didn`t do very well, he said the president was lazy. He didn`t
say he was slow, he was tired, he didn`t do well. He said he was lazy.

Now, it may not mean anything to most Americans, but to those of us
who are African-Americans, the second word is shiftless and there`s a third
word that goes along with it.

Birther, the whole birther movement -- why do senior Republican
leaders tolerate this kind of discussion within the party?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Let`s to Colonel Lawrence Wilkerson, former chief of staff
at the State Department during General Colin Powell`s term and currently a
distinguished visiting professor of government and public policy at the
College of William & Mary.

Colonel, good to have you with us tonight.

You told us something parallel to that on this program the last time
you were with us. Is the Republican Party hearing this?

I mean, is this a wake-up call? I mean, are they paying attention to
what some long-time loyalists of the party are telling them?

LAWRENCE WILKINSON, COLLEGE OF WILLIAM & MARY: Ed, I think people
like Brent Scowcroft and others of a moderate ilk, as am I, are hearing it.
I think we`ve been saying it for some time now. And with the latest
results of the national elections, we`ve been saying it a little more
strenuously and a little more strongly.

But I will say that the bulk of the Republican Party seems not to be
listening, as you just pointed out. They call it a communications problem
or they call it a -- we`re just not getting the really hard core message of
the Republican Party across.

I`m afraid they are getting that message across. And that message is
tinged with intolerance for women, for minorities, for LGBT community and
for others who don`t, you know, measure up to the Mitt Romney image, for
example, of the other percent, the 47 percent that doesn`t count is what
Republicans simply don`t appeal to.

SCHULTZ: Colonel, are they on their way to being a regional party?

WILKERSON: I think they`re on their way to committing suicide, very
frankly. This has happened before in our history where an existing party
has either morphed into another or died and this might just be happening
again.

If they don`t adjust the way they`re looking at the rest of this
country, if they don`t adjust some of their very platform principles,
they`re done. They`re finished. We can put a fork in them. They`re
toast.

I hate to see that, because if it happens dramatically, we`re looking
at a problem for the two-party system for this country. It will probably
happen slowly, it will probably happen over time. But I hate to see the
party go away. That`s one reason I`m still in it, trying to save it.

SCHULTZ: So, you could be a development of a third party, which, of
course, would be much more right wing than what we`ve seen in the past of
the Republicans?

WILKERSON: Very much so. That could be the way it happens. It would
split off, be the extreme wing, and then those of us who are left would try
to resurrect the original Republican Party of Abraham Lincoln.

SCHULTZ: Well, those extremists were alive and well this week. There
were Republicans calling for the president`s impeachment and saying
President Obama was acting like a king with his executive orders on gun
safety.

This kind of extremism gets them a 26 percent rating. Do you think
that really is what it`s all about? Or is it the obstruction or both?

WILKERSON: I think the rating is going to go down, Ed. I think we`re
looking at potential for the Republican Party to be rated in the eyes of
the American people much the way the entire congress is rated -- do nothing
and down in the teens. And as I said, that`s suicide for the Republican
Party.

SCHULTZ: At the same retreat today, Republicans were told by a
pollster to stop talking about rape. Pretty good advice, I would say. Is
this because the extremism takes over the discussion when Republicans do
try to talk about issues as sensitive as that?

WILKERSON: In many respects, some of them do not know how to talk
about it, Ed. You heard what Colin Powell said, what you played there.
I`ve heard what Colin Powell has said for the past 20 years or so about
racism in America, about racism across the country, about what it means,
what intolerance means for Latinos, for women, for blacks and so forth.

And the signals that are sent by the Republican Party tell me that it
is still there, it is still there in a major way and if they can`t change
that, let`s face it, the country is going to be brown and black. And there
are people in the Republican Party who so emit that change that they`ll
never be able to adjust.

SCHULTZ: Colonel Wilkerson, here on THE ED SHOW tonight, thanks so
much for joining us.

WILKERSON: Thanks for having me.

SCHULTZ: Coming up, John Boehner and his do-nothing Congress, do you
know what they are doing, folks? They are ripping you off as a taxpayer.
They`re working less than ever and making huge amounts of money.
Minnesota Congressman Rick Nolan, he is speaking out. He tells us how
Congress can get back on track and do it for the people.

And later, the time for real filibuster reform is right now. Will
Harry Reid do the right thing? That is a big question mark. Larry Cohen
of the Communication Workers of America is part of the team to getting
directive correctly.

We`re right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCHULTZ: Welcome back to THE ED SHOW.

I want to let you know, tonight, about how you were getting ripped off
as a taxpayer. You know, this is my opinion, but I got numbers to back it
up. Congress is spending almost half its time on vacation. So when you go
to work on Monday, tell the boss I`ve got to get a deal like these guys
have.

But that`s not how it`s going to be for you at home. You see, you
actually have to work for a living. You can`t, you know, give yourself a
pay raise.

Now, we`ve shown you this chart many times here on THE ED SHOW.
Worker productivity has been going through the roof. However, pay leveled
off in the `70s. It leveled off in the `70s. It sure did. It hasn`t gone
anywhere since.

Here is a chart of congressional work productivity for the same period
of time. As you can see, their productivity is at the lowest level since
the 1940s -- 112th Congress passed just over 200 bills.

But take a look at their pay. It`s been skyrocketing. Right now,
it`s at an all-time high of $174,000 a year. So here`s the bills that
they`ve passed over the years, and this is where their pay is going.

Now, you tell me, who`s working hard? The man who leads this do-
nothing Congress makes $223,000 a year. Not a bad deal if you look at how
many days they actually work. 2012, the House was in session for 109 days.
They worked on average about two days a week.

Now, wait a minute, they`re really going to be cracking a sweat for
2013. They upped the workload to 126 days in 2013. That`s an average of
about 2 1/2 days a week.

Eric Cantor plans the two-day workweek, makes him $193,000 a year.

Now, members of Congress want to tell you they work at home in their
district, and doing all this glad handing and stuff. But how many federal
laws can you pass when you`re back home? None.

Meanwhile, when Congress is in session, most of their day is spent
doing what? Raising money.

The "Huffington Post" obtained this Powerpoint presentation for
incoming Democrats. Now I`m talking to the Democrats tonight, so we`re
bipartisan on this show, all of a sudden, huh? Here is how they suggest
they spend their day. Four hours of call time, which is actually fund-
raising; two hours of constituent visits; two hours on committee and floor
speeches; one hour of strategic outreach, which is also known as fund-
raising; and one hour of recharge the batteries, go put your head down,
take a nap, maybe go to lunch and raise some more money.

They suggest that you spend five hours fund-raising and four hours
actually doing the job that the taxpayers want you to do, all in a two-day
work week. Now maybe this is why the Congressional approval is sitting at
14 percent. Republicans are worse than this, by the way.

Our next guest knows how to get things done in Congress. I find this
to be an interesting story, a blast from the past. Minnesota Congressman
Rick Nolan was first elected in 1975 and he served three terms until 1981.
Well, he`s back. He was just re-elected to his fourth term after 32 years
of being in private business and doing some other public service work.

During Nolan`s first term, Congress passed 588 bills. And what was
their salary back then; 44,600 dollars. The 112th Congress was just ended,
passed 219 bills. And their salary is 174,000 dollars a year. Don`t you
feel like you`re really getting your money`s worth right now? It was the
least productive Congress on record.

So, what it comes down to, folks, is this. You, as an American
worker, are working harder and longer for less pay. I showed you what the
graph was all about. But Congress is working less and getting paid more.
So you know what? You and me as taxpayers, we`re getting ripped off.
We`re not getting our money`s worth.

Certainly they`re still great Americans, aren`t they? How could it be
that the work ethic was so strong back in the day, but now it`s not?
Because it`s all about the money.

For more, I`m joined tonight by Congressman Rick Nolan of Minnesota.
Good to have you with us tonight. Thanks for your time.

I think that you illustrate best what this is all about, because of
your experience of 30 years ago in the Congress. What`s the biggest
difference between then and now?

REP. RICK NOLAN (D), MINNESOTA: Well, Ed, I think you hit the nail on
the head here. Back when I served before, we worked 48 out of 52 weeks.
This Congress is going to work, you know, 31, 32 weeks out of 52 weeks.

We used to work four and five days a week. And we would be in
committee in the morning. We would be in session during the afternoon and
into the evening. And we got things done. And you know, when you`re
getting together and you`re working together, you get to know one another,
and you get to learn where those areas of opportunity are for cooperation,
for collaboration, for solving problems, getting things done.

But if you`re not going to work, you can`t run a business that way --

SCHULTZ: Congress isn`t governing, in your opinion?

NOLAN: No. You can`t run a business that way. You can`t run a
country that way. And Ed, the numbers that you pointed out are -- it`s
good for people to know that. But it`s even worse than what the numbers
indicate. You know, the number of days that are scheduled for this year,
you can already subtract one day from that. We were supposed to be meeting
last Wednesday and we decided not to.

And those first days of every week when we work, we don`t have any
votes scheduled until 6:30 at night. Then what we don`t finish up that
evening, we wrap up the next day. And if there`s anything else to do, we
wrap it up the following morning.

SCHULTZ: It`s the money. It`s the corporate money, isn`t it?

NOLAN: Well, it is. Money has really corrupted the entire political
process. The sad story, Ed, here is that the one with the most money
generally gets the most votes. So people have come to the conclusion --
and, quite frankly, understandably so, that there`s no sense running unless
you`re going to have at least enough money, and hopefully more than the
other person that you`re running against.

We need to change the way we do politics in this country. You can`t
run a country this way, Ed.

SCHULTZ: We`re not getting our bang for our buck, are we?

NOLAN: No, of course we`re not. Not at all.

SCHULTZ: Great to have you with us tonight, congressman. I
appreciate you speaking out on this. I know that a lot of people are going
to respond to it. Thanks so much.

NOLAN: You bet, Ed.

SCHULTZ: There`s a lot more coming up in the next half hour of THE ED
SHOW. Stay with us.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OPRAH WINFREY, "OPRAH": Did you feel bad about it?

LANCE ARMSTRONG, CYCLIST: No. It`s even scarier.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Coming up, Dr. Jeff Gardere on Lance Armstrong`s strange
apology and the psychology of a liar.

Donald Trump tries to return fire in his Twitter fight with Deadspin
and hilarity ensues.

And it`s do or die time for the filibuster reform in the Senate. And
Harry Reid and the Democrats, I think, are dropping the ball.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: As women earn less than men for the same jobs,
time in the Senate ticks by.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Larry Cohen of the Communication Workers of America joins me
for the discussion.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCHULTZ: We are back. When the Senate convenes on January 22nd,
Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid has the opportunity to change the rules
and fix the Senate and end all these filibusters. But according to
"Politico," Harry Reid doesn`t plan on advancing the talking filibuster
requirement found in the proposal put forth by Senators Jeff Merkley, Tom
Udall and Tom Harkin.

Reid is said to be considering more modest reforms, including changes
that would force senators to hold the floor in certain situations and
require those stalling legislation to deliver 41 votes. But those looking
for real reform say it`s simply not enough. I have to agree.

The heart of the problem lies in Republicans` use of the silent
filibuster. The push for comprehensive immigration reform, the sensible
gun safety legislation we`ve been talking about in recent days, these
efforts will mean nothing if they face the same Republican obstruction in
the Senate. One member of the Senate should not have the power to block
voting on legislation that affects 315 million Americans.

One of the Senate -- one member of the Senate should not be able to
stop what millions of those Americans voted for in the last election. How
many landslides do we have to have?

And Democrats can`t be worried about what happens if Republicans
regain control of the Senate. This is about now and moving the Obama
agenda forward. It deserves to be debated on the Senate floor. The Senate
has a responsibility to fix what is obviously broken. The Senate has a
responsibility to the Americans who want jobs, who are seeing them move
overseas, and women who earn less than men for the same job, and the
Americans still looking for work and the people looking for a path to
citizenship.

How in the heck are you ever going to get immigration reform done if
we have to put up with the Republicans with all their filibusters? These
are victims of what the filibuster has become. So if Harry Reid is going
to take steps to change the rules, he needs to make it count. Harry,
you`ve got to do this. Go for the jugular.

Since when do you trust Mitch McConnell on anything? He will stab you
in the back in a New York second, politically.

Let`s turn to Larry Cohen, president of the Communications Workers of
America. CWA is part of Fix the Senate Now, a coalition of progressive
organizations that support the reform effort championed effort championed
by Senators Merkley, Udall and Harkin.

Larry, good to have you with us tonight. I appreciate your time. How
important is this? Is there a chance, if this doesn`t happen, that the
113th will be just like the 112th?

LARRY COHEN, PRESIDENT, COMMUNICATION WORKERS OF AMERICA: There`s a
serious chance. And it`s up to us. I`m glad to say that there are -- over
a million Americans have signed petitions into their senators, over 100,000
phone calls, over 50 groups working on this day and night. Because as you
just said, it`s tied to everything we care about.

The question is, are we going to have democracy in the U.S. Senate,
which we actually had for many generations? Are we going to pretend that
there`s a filibuster that doesn`t even exist? As you said, one senator
calls up from anywhere. You don`t even know who it is.

So there are three or four parts to this. They are all critical.
Right now, you can`t get a conference committee. The president can`t get
any of his nominations through. Frankly, the majority leader can`t even
put the bill on the floor. And two Congresses ago, the Pelosi Congress,
there were 435 items passed by the House that never even got put on the
floor of the Senate, let alone debated.

SCHULTZ: Do the Republicans deserve this after 380 filibusters,
compared to when Lyndon Johnson was the Senate majority leader where he had
one filibuster?

COHEN: Yes, well, this is the point, right? We have a Senate that`s
frozen, broken, doesn`t work. Pick your favorite adjective or verb. It`s
not working. This is not what democracy looks like. It`s only on the
first day -- and technically we`re still in the first day of the Congress,
a two-year period, that this can be done by 51 senators, meaning in this
case there`s 55 in the Democratic caucus. It will take 51 of them.

We need all of those 51 to stand up to have a Senate that actually
discusses the issues of the day and allows the president`s nominations to
reach the floor, and allows conference committees to actually meet. So
when the House and Senate pass two different bills, there`s a way to
reconcile that. None of that is happening.

SCHULTZ: Well, Harry Reid said that he is to be negotiating with
Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell to avoid having the so-called
nuclear option. I would go so far as to say, does Mitch McConnell even
deserve to be in the position to negotiate what the Senate rules are going
to be, after what he has done in the last session of Congress? Why can`t
the Democrats, for lack of a better term, just grow a pair and get after it
and change the rules and do what the American people want?

Because the president deserves to have his agenda debated on the floor
for immigration reform, for taxation, for education, for more health care
and all of it. And you know what the Republicans are going to do. They`re
going to say no to that and, of course, new gun legislation. Why should
McConnell be involved in this?

COHEN: Well, he shouldn`t be unless they were going to come to a fair
resolution. There`s zero chance of that. I think what Senator Reid is
really saying on that score is, I`ve made every effort to do this in that
way. And so doing it by a majority, as the Constitution says -- the House
and Senate shall determine their rules. And you do that on the first day
of a Congress.

This is still the legislative first day. That`s been used many times
before. We need the Democrats, as you said, to move forward. That`s what
they got elected for, in the most expensive elections ever. If not now,
when?

SCHULTZ: Well, when you`ve got a party with a 26 percent approval
rating, you have a Senate that was retained by, no question, the Democrats,
and you have a landslide victory both in the electoral college and the
popular vote for the president, how much more evidence do the Democrats
need? Give me a number of how many filibusters you would actually put up
with before you go with the talking filibuster?

Larry Cohen, keep up the great work. You`re doing it right. There`s
no doubt about it. We`ve got to get this done. >

Coming up, the best Tweet ever. Deadspin really lets Donald Trump
have it. You won`t want to miss the story. Stay with us. We`re right
back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCHULTZ: The story of Manti Te`O`s fake girlfriend has captivated a
lot of people, including Birther king Donald Trump. Trump praised the
website Deadspin for its story about the hoax on Twitter. "Congratulations
to Tom Scocca and Timothy Burke of Deadspin for exposing the Manti Te`O
fiasco."

Deadspin immediately responded to Trump`s Tweet, "go blank yourself."

That response seems to have hurt Trump`s feelings a little bit. Trump
spent this Friday afternoon firing off a series of Tweets attacking the
website. "Deadspin guys are total losers. They had their story stolen
right from under their bad complexions and other media capitalized."

"Dummies at Deadspin had their big payday taken from them by others in
the media."

And "Deadspin will never make it. They don`t understand graciousness
or money."

And finally "Deadspin`s disgusting response will teach me and others
not to be nice anymore. A sad lesson."

So now, let me get this straight. So the guy who has made a career
out of heckling a sitting president and race baiting with his Birther
nonsense is now in the business of giving lessons in civility. Here is
Trump practicing his nice guy routine.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, "THE APPRENTICE": Rosie O`Donnell is disgusting, I
mean, both inside and out.

The unwanted and really disgusting porn star, Anthony Weiner --

Cher is somewhat of a loser. She`s lonely. She`s unhappy. She`s very
miserable. And her sound enhanced and computer enhanced music doesn`t do
it for me, believe me.

(CROSS TALK)

TRUMP: He`s a political hack.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: George Will and Karl Rove.

TRUMP: These are three people -- I have to tell you, they`re hacks.

Steve Schmidt is a lightweight. He is a guy who did a horrible job
running John McCain`s campaign.

: I always said the worst president was Jimmy Carter. Guess what.
Jimmy Carter goes to second place. Barack Obama has been the worst
president ever.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Oh Donald, little advice here tonight. Don`t take your
frustration out on Deadspin. They only told you what the rest of the
country has been thinking for years.

Tonight in our survey, I ask you, do Republicans finally realize the
consequences of holding the economy hostage? Thirty one percent of you say
yes; 69 percent of you say no.

Coming up, the controversy over coming clean. Find out why Lance
Armstrong`s confession is not impressing the people who matter most. We`ll
talk about that with a psychologist next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCHULTZ: And in the Big Finish tonight, well, we`re human. From time
to time, we will say things that aren`t true. Some people try to keep
their lives going, others come clean. This week, Lance Armstrong decided
to confess his lies to Oprah in front of about 3.2 million viewers.

Armstrong admits he cheated so he could win seven Tour de France
titles. He says he would do anything to win, including bullying other
riders to cheat with him.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

WINFREY: Were you a bully?

ARMSTRONG: Yeah. Yeah, I was a bully.

WINFREY: Tell me how you were a bully.

ARMSTRONG: I was a bully in the sense that you just -- that I tried
to control the narrative. And if I didn`t like what somebody said, and for
whatever reasons in my own head, whether I viewed that as somebody being
disloyal or a friend turning on you or whatever, I tried to control that.
I said that`s a lie. They`re liars.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: He is confessing, but he`s not really apologizing. In fact,
regulators and fellow cyclers think Armstrong`s talking to the wrong person
about his crimes.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DAVID HOWMAN, WORLD ANTI-DOPING AGENCY, DIRECTOR GENERAL: The right
place for Mr. Armstrong to come forward and be truly contritional is an
appropriate authority where he makes a full and frank, sworn statement
covering all the bases.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: As she always does, Oprah Winfrey conducted a great
interview. But Armstrong knows her living room is not a court of law.
Reporters and fellow cyclists and fans say this talk show interview is
simply not enough.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think he confessed the minimum, the minimum
that he might have thought that the world wanted to know, was that he used
performance-enhancing drugs. He really certainly left out a lot of
details.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: To get that second chance, you have to earn it.
You have to be magnanimous and contrite and really be sincere in your
apology. And I`m not sure if that was accomplished.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He was very good at sound bites. He was very
good at dismissing opposition. But to me his actions always spoke of a guy
who was lying and cheating.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I thought maybe he would step up and say that
yes, I was the head of this scheme, you know. It was wrong. I do
apologize. I didn`t hear apologizing -- an apology once.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Joining us tonight on THE ED SHOW, Dr. Jeff Gardere. He`s a
clinical psychologist and teaches at Toro College here in New York.
Doctor, great to have you with us tonight.

DR. JEFF GARDERE, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: Great to be here, Ed.

SCHULTZ: Was that a perfect conditional confession?

GARDERE: It was very conditional in that he told some truths, but we
saw a lot of walls that were up. It was so dispassionate. And as we know,
clinically, if you are going to confess, if you are going to come clean,
the emotions need to be there. And strangely enough -- or maybe not so
surprising -- the emotions just were not there.

It was something that was done by the numbers. It seemed to have been
planned. The fact that you have a script in your head that your people put
together as to putting your career back together again, somehow just
doesn`t ring true for something that should be coming from your heart.

SCHULTZ: What makes a person like this tick?

GARDERE: Well, I`ve worked with people like this. I think sometimes
you have to look at the narcissism, that it really is about them and no one
else. When anyone tries to attack them or tries to get them to tell the
truth, as they have done for the past 10 years, then instead of saying,
listen, what you`re saying is false, they do more than that, as he did.

He went out and attacked people, not just fellow riders, but also had
personal attacks against those who were trying to tell the truth about him.
So certainly he was a bully. We have to give him credit for saying that,
but it hurt a lot of people.

SCHULTZ: Did winning become addictive, like a drug addiction or a
sexual addiction or any kind of addiction? What about that?

GARDERE: People are asking why he did this. It was for the same
reason that he doped up, winning. It`s always about winning for Lance
Armstrong. Even the confessions now is about winning, because he wants to
rehabilitate the image and compete once again. You can`t blame him for
that.

But again, you see it`s something that is a plan that has been put
together by his team.

SCHULTZ: The fact that he was raising a lot of money for cancer and
has done a lot of good things for people, was this his justification for
his operation, the way his behavior and the way he was competing and
cheating and lying?

GARDERE: Again, we have to give him credit that he wanted to help
other people. But in many ways, that becomes a rationalization. We use
that as a way to shield ourselves from the cold, hard truth that perhaps we
are cold and hard by doing these things that may not be from the heart, but
to help us as far as the public perception.

SCHULTZ: Personally, does he need rehabilitation?

GARDERE: This is a man who I truly believe needs to feel what`s
inside. I think he has locked out a lot of those emotions, a lot of the
feelings, has bought in to his own hype about winning. That addiction that
you talk about I think is very, very real.

And like anyone who is addicted, he needs to be rehabilitated and he
can then be a much more honest feeling person. I don`t think Lance
Armstrong really knows who Lance Armstrong is.

SCHULTZ: Dr. Jeff Gardere, thanks for joining us tonight on THE ED
SHOW. Appreciate it so much.

That is THE ED SHOW. I`m Ed Schultz. "THE RACHEL MADDOW SHOW" starts
right now. Good evening, Rachel.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY
BE UPDATED.
END

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