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The Ed Show for Saturday, June 29th, 2013

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June 29, 2013
Guests: Jesse Jackson, George Takei, Nina Turner, John Nichols, Jim Moore,
Holland Cooke

ED SCHULTZ, HOST: Good evening, Americans. And welcome to THE ED
SHOW, live from Minneapolis.

Well, it`s 5:00. Let`s get to work.


STEPHEN COLBERT, COMEDIAN: Apparently, racism is over.

SEAN HANNITY, FOX NEWS: It`s a monumental decision from the highest
court in the land.

PETE WILLIAMS, NBC NEWS: This decision strikes down a key part of
the Voting Rights Act.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The act was a crowning achievement of the civil
rights movement and helped transform the South.

of Americans are denied the right to vote because of their color.

COLBERT: It was a 5-4 decision with Chief Justice Roberts joined by
Justices Scalia, Thomas, Alito -- and Deen.

PAULA DEEN, CELEBRITY CHEF: I is what I is and I`m not changing.

UNIDENTIIFIED MALE: That is precisely the mindset of the old
confederacy and why they merited extra scrutiny.

SCHULTZ: We don`t need to worry one bit about minority voters being
purged from the roles. We haven`t seen that in a long time.

BILL MAHER, COMEDIAN: Racism went from racism 1.0 to 2.0. There are
these voter ID laws.

HANNITY: Do you think in 1965, Barack Obama, a black American, could
be elected president?

JUAN WILLIAMS, FOX NEWS: No, of course not. So, the world changed.

HANNITY: But I think, I think, my point -- that`s Robert`s point.

WILLIAMS: No, that`s not the point.


SCHULTZ: Good to have you with us tonight, folks. Thanks for

If you think racism is dead in America, I would make the case that
you need to think again, because this is all about race.

Earlier this week, an unbelievable move -- the Supreme Court rolled
back the clock on voting rights in this country. These five justices
struck down Section 4 of the Voting Rights Act of 1965. They ruled local
voting districts with a history of racial discrimination nation. You know,
they don`t need to pre-clear changes to their voting laws.

Make no mistake: this ruling will have a huge negative impact on
black and minority voters in this country. It`s caused widespread outrage
from a number of prominent politicians who already fought this fight nearly
50 years ago.


REP. JOHN LEWIS (D), GEORGIA: In the 11 states of the old
Confederacy, and even in some of the states outside of the South, there
have been a systematic, deliberate attempt to take us back to another
period. And these men that voted to strip the Voting Rights Act of its
power, they never stood in unmovable lines themselves. They never had to
pass a so-called literacy test. It took us almost 100 years to get where
we are today.

So, will it take another 100 years to fix it, to change it?


SCHULTZ: Chief justice John Roberts argued America isn`t as racist
as it used to be back in 1965. It`s an absurd position considering
Mississippi finally got around to officially abolishing slavery in
February. Roberts argued, it`s up to Congress to redraw the map of the
nine states that need preclearance to change voting laws. Are you kidding
me? Congress?

There is no doubt, Boehner`s pattern of failed leadership will do
absolutely nothing to fix this problem and it is an absolute shame. It`s
an American shame.

Look at the numbers. From 1982 to 2006, over a 25-year period, the
act was used to block over 1,000 proposed changes to voting laws in this
country. Last year alone, there were a few. It was to -- it was used to
stop a voter ID law in Texas. A Florida law that eliminated early voting

Now, folks, we need to wake up to this. This is an element of
fairness here. It`s estimated the Florida law would have made it more
difficult for hundreds of thousands of minority voters to just cast
ballots. To many people around this country, they think racism is dead and
gone. It`s simply not.

The ruling of the Supreme Court -- you know, it seems to parallel the
thinking and the ways of Paula Deen and her followers. Interesting and
ironic how this came down. She visited the "Today" show this week to do,
what? Make excuses.


MATT LAUER, TODAY: Let me ask but this part of the deposition. We
were asked whether, you were asked whether using the N-word and telling a
joke was hurtful, and you said, quote, "I don`t know. Most jokes are about
Jewish people, rednecks, black folks. I didn`t make up the jokes. They
usually target, though, a group. I can`t myself determine what offends
another person."

That last sentence gets me, "I can`t myself determine --

DEEN: And I can`t.

LAUER: -- determine what offends another person."

Do you have any doubt in your mine that African-Americans are
offended by the N-word?

DEEN: I don`t know, Matt. I have asked myself that so many times.
Because it is very distressing for me to go into my kitchens and I hear
what these young people are calling each other. It`s very, very

LAUER: You`ve never joined in on that language.

DEEN: No. Absolutely not. It`s very distressing.

It`s very distressing for me because I think that for this problem to
be worked on, that these young people are going to have to take control and
start showing respect for each other. And not throw in that word at each
other. It makes my skin crawl.


SCHULTZ: Whatever language young people use in Paula Deen`s kitchens
is no excuse for her to use hateful words herself. Now, Deen didn`t end it
there. To close out the interview, she played the victim card.


DEEN: I`ve had wonderful support from Reverend Jackson. I`ve had
wonderful support. And I tell you what, if there`s anyone out there that
has never said something that they wish they could take back, if you`re out
there, please pick up that stone and throw it so hard at my head that it
kills me. Please. I want to meet you. I want to meet you.

I is what I is and I`m not changing. And I -- there`s someone evil
out there that saw what I had worked for and they wanted it.


SCHULTZ: Well, somehow Paula Deen turned herself into the victim.
And so people are just eating up her bogus tears. Her book sales are
through the roof and this week she added yet another Paula Deen cruise to
the high demand.

That`s right. Deen offers an eight-day cruise around the Caribbean
with fans.

Unfortunately, a large group of white Americans think racism is gone
in this country. They see people like Paula Deen as a victim of political
correctness. Listen to Bill O`Reilly just a few years back.


BILL O`REILLY, FOX NEWS: There are bigots and people who won`t like
you because of the way you look. They`re there. But that`s not the
overwhelming majority of the country. I don`t believe that.

But after 9/11, we pretty dropped that race stuff, did we not? We`re
pretty much all Americans there, right? All right?

I hear yes, I hear no. But to me from my perch, there were blacks
killed in that tower. All right? All right, look, if you don`t think we
dropped it, I do.


SCHULTZ: Bill O`Reilly was flat out wrong then and he is wrong
today. And his thinking is dangerous for the future of the country.

The facts are very clear. It`s harder for African-Americans to get
good jobs in this country and a good education. The current black
unemployment rate is more than double the unemployment rate for white
Americans in this country. The only way African-Americans can combat
inequality is with what? Their vote!

Now, their right is under attack from the Supreme Court.

Now, I told you on this program last week and we documented how
Republican governors have a major impact on the everyday lives of
Americans. Their mission now is to roll back the clock on voting rights.
The Republicans are scared to death about the demographics in this country.
Since the Supreme Court`s decision on Tuesday, Texas, Mississippi, Alabama,
Arkansas, South Carolina and Virginia, are already moving forward with
voting restrictions.

So, here you have a conservative Supreme Court -- I go back to making
this case that George W. Bush was the best conservative president this
country ever had. What did he do? Well, he concentrated the wealth by
giving two rounds of tax cuts to the wealthiest Americans. He deregulated
as much as he possibly could and, of course, he put I think two extremists
on the Supreme Court. Now, look what we have.

So, now, you have a conservative Supreme Court that I think is
contributing to the big divide in this country when it comes to race.

Basically what they`re saying in this ruling, we have archaic voting
laws. 1965 is yesteryear. Civil rights is not the issue today that it was
back then. And do you know what we`re going to do? We`re going to turn it
over to Tea Partiers and the Congress and we`re going on let them redraw
the map.

Do you think the Supreme Court knew what they were doing? You damn
right they did. You better believe they do what they were doing. This is
all about power and control. And the only thing that satisfies the
conservative movement in this country is when they can keep a liberal down,
when they can keep a worker down, when they can keep a minority down.

Do you really believe in your heart that John Boehner is going to
feel political pressure from fellow Republicans to do something about the
Voting Rights Act in America and make sure that there was going to be
fairness in every state? Do you think that there were any states who are
sitting on the edge of their seat, waiting to do something as soon as this
ruling came down?

Look at the states that I just listed off. There will be more.
Where are they going to come from? They`re going to come from wherever
there is a Republican governor.

Wherever there is a Republican governor, you can count on
conservatives and legislative sessions across the country to do what? Try
to suppress the vote. It`s on steroids.

Get your cell phones out. I want to know what you think.

Tonight`s question: are conservatives ignoring racism in America?
Text A for yes, text B for no, to 67622, and you can always go to our blog
at Leave a comment there. And we will bring you the results
of this poll later on in the broadcast.

I could not have a more credible voice. I could not have a more
important man on this program tonight than the Reverend Jesse Jackson who
has spent his life fighting for voters rights in this country. Founder and
president of the Rainbow PUSH coalition.

Reverend, good to have you on THE ED SHOW tonight. Thanks so much.


SCHULTZ: Your reaction to the Supreme Court ruling this week. How
deep does it go? How dangerous is it to the progress that this country has
made since 1965?

Well, it goes as deep as my father coming from World War II, a
veteran with an honorable discharge, having -- not having the right to
vote. Having to sit behind (INAUDIBLE) POWs on a military base.

It`s the most radical move since 1896. 1865, got right to vote,
1896. The Supreme Court took what we would have been on the battlefield.

We won the right to vote in 1965 on the battlefield. They took it
back in 2013. And it is astonishing, the pain that we`re going on feel.

I mean, you look at the Kaptur-Kucinich race in Ohio that took two
liberals and put them in one district and wipe them. You`re going to see
more of that. You`re going to see gerrymandering, annexation and roll-
purging schemes.

So, the move from private from protection for states rights abuse is
a very radical move, Ed.

SCHULTZ: The federal protections that are being stripped down by the
Supreme Court now opens the flood gates for conservative legislative
sessions to get together and ramp it up to suppress the vote. I mean, I --


JACKSON: Do you know what the big irony is, Ed? In 1965, when
blacks got the right to vote, why women couldn`t serve on juries in the
South? There`s no women on the Supreme Court. So, the `65 Voting Rights
Act, white women jurors in `67, and 18 years to vote in the 1970, students
could vote on campus in 1974. `75, you got bilingual voting.

So, the entire social fabric of the last 40 years has been attacked
by this decision.

SCHULTZ: Reverend, where does the African-American and the minority
communities in this country, what`s the recourse? What can you do? What`s
the game plan? You see how quickly these states have moved on this.

JACKSON: One recourse is to see how -- if the plank at the bottom of
the ship, if it drops out, the water begins to sink the whole ship. We all
inextricably bounded (ph). It affects black and Latinos in Texas and
Arizona affected by this. Blacks in the Deep South are affected by this.
White women are affected by this.

So our social labor, all of us must close ranks. I hope President
Barack Obama will do what Lyndon Johnson did finally. Went to the Congress
and made a national speech to the Congress and to the nation arguing the
morality and the legality of a comprehensive Voting Rights Act based upon


JACKSON: I hope President Obama will make such an emergency address
to the nation. We`ll be very busy trying to (INAUDIBLE) expensive
lawsuits. What we need is the highest level of national strength on this

SCHULTZ: Now, Nancy Pelosi today is calling top Democrats trying to
gather support and momentum right away do something about the Voting Rights
Act decision that came down. So, the Democrats are going to be very much
engaged in it. No question.

But the key player here is the speaker of the House. What confidence
do you have that John Boehner is going to recognize any political pressure
or need for social change to fix what has been destroyed? When he is a
conservative, the conservative court. We know how they work hand in hand,
we know what their ideological mission is.

What confidence do you have, Reverend, that John Boehner will be an
honest broker in this?

JACKSON: So far, he has shown none. But Mr. Cantor said the other
day, for example, his experience walking across the Edmund Pettus Bridge
showed him something different. Rather than that kind of anecdotal
observation, I really think we must challenge the whole nation.

And at this point, the attorney general has the documentation and the
president can call this special session of Congress. There`s no interest
in the nation more vital than the equal protection to vote. Only the
president has that kind of authority just as Johnson did.

SCHULTZ: And I want your response to Justice Roberts who says that
racism today isn`t what it was back in 1965.

JACKSON: The only reason why we`re getting better at voter elections
because of voter protection. It`s like the Heat play the Spurs, they have
a great game, right? Without the referees, the game would become a brawl.
Referees matter. Oversight matters.

And so, we`ve done well and the relative sense because of oversight.
But even that, it has taken 40 years to deal with the impact of
gerrymandering, annexation at large, roll-purging, the schemes, so you can
vote but your vote don`t count. You can vote but you can`t win.



JACKSON: The change (ph) will be ceaseless.

SCHULTZ: And, finally, I want to clear up this. Paula Deen said
that you are supporting her. Is that true?

JACKSON: When Paul Deen called me, I listened to her. I said and
recommended her, A, number one, you are not beyond redemption, but you must
address the affected workers. You must address your workplace environment,
and a plan for remedy. To that extent, she can be redeemed. But
redemption involves more than words. It involves a plan of action and
fundamental change.

I hope she makes it out of this. I`ve seen people come out of deep
holes before. Grace and mercy are very strong. But grace, mercy and a
plan of reconstruction.


Reverend Jesse Jackson, thanks for your time tonight. I appreciate
it so much.

Remember to answer tonight`s question at the bottom of the screen.
Share your thoughts with us on Twitter @EdShow, and on Facebook. We always
want to know what you think.

Coming up, a Texas legislator takes stand for women`s rights and gets
attacked by the governor of Texas, Rick Perry. A cheap shot. The rapid
response panel weighs in, ahead.

And the Supreme Court makes a big stand for equality. I`ll ask
George Takei what it means for California and the country. That`s next.
Stay with us.


GEORGE TAKEI, ACTOR: You can safely proclaim you are in support of
Takei marriage.



SCHULTZ: Time now for the trenders. Here at THE ED SHOW, we listen
to you. Every week before the show, we check our Facebook, our Twitter and
our blog. You decided and we are reporting.

Here are this week`s top trenders voted on by you.



SCHULTZ (voice-over): Our number three trender: Tammy`s takedown.

DUCKWORTH: Your foot hurt? Your left foot?


DUCKWORTH: It hurts. Yes, my feet hurt, too.

SCHULTZ: An IRS contractor gets served by Iraq war vet Tammy
Duckworth over his military disability claim.

DUCKWORTH: So I`m sorry that twisting your ankle in high school has
now come back to hurt you in such a painful way. My right arm was
essentially blown off and reattached. Twisting your ankle in prep school
is not defending or serving this nation, Mr. Costello.


SCHULTZ: Our second trender: Anthony Weiner`s three-way.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Threesome. Has Martha ever had a threesome,



UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Our exclusive poll finds Weiner leading the
crowded Democratic primary field with 25 percent.

SCHULTZ: The former congressman is on a roll as his bid for mayor

JIMMY FALLON, COMEDIAN: I`m sure they`ll provide some stiff

SCHULTZ: In this week`s top trender: down goes DOMA.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Marriage is what brings us together today.

WILLIAMS: The Supreme Court has just struck down the federal Defense
of Marriage Act.

SCHULTZ: While conservatives predict the worst --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There`s a storm gathering.

REP MICHELE BACHMANN (R), MINNESOTA: We are becoming a nation that
our founders would no longer recognize.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Society itself is at risk.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Haven`t you been listening? Traditional marriage
is dead. Everyone has to get gay married.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think that would hurt our children and I fear
for the future.

SCHULTZ: The rest of the country celebrates equality.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We now have the people, the Constitution and the
courts behind us.

should be very proud of today and through your courage, you`re helping out
a whole lot of people everywhere.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It feels good to have love triumph over

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I feel jubilation. I feel fabulous. I feel
every gay word I can think of.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No freedom until we`re equal, damn right I
support it.


SCHULTZ: Joining me now is actor George Takei. Mr. Takei has been
an activist in the gay rights movement in this country for a long time and
we really appreciate him being on the program tonight. Mr. Takei, thank
you for your time.

There was an interesting clip there, as far as the ignorance of the
country. What do you think? What did you sense before the ruling and how
did you feel after the Supreme Court`s decision?

TAKEI: Well, certainly after the Supreme Court`s ruling, our hearts
were soaring and our bodies were literally up in the air. We flew to
Raleigh, North Carolina, last Wednesday to work as a narrator with the
North Carolina Symphony. But we heard the news in Los Angeles. And we got
the details once we landed in Raleigh, which has a man and a woman
constitutional amendment.

But we got all the details and we were elated. It is a new day for
America. However --

SCHULTZ: A new -- go ahead.

TAKEI: Well, when I pledge allegiance to the United States, I say,
one nation indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. One-third of the
nation now has equality. Now, we have to work on the other two-thirds. So
we`re keeping sleeves rolled up.

SCHULTZ: Why do you think societal attitudes are changing? And yet
also on the conservative side, they seem to be much more pointed,
demeaning, fear-mongering. They talk about the future of the country and
the children.

What is your response to all of that rhetoric?

TAKEI: They`re fearful because they`re unaccustomed to it. They
don`t know that sexual orientation is an immutable quality, as immutable as
race. I mean, I am Asian. African-Americans are black and you can`t
change that. In the same way, our orientation can`t be changed.

However, we are coming out and we`re becoming more and more a part of
American society. And people are discovering that we`re bankers, we`re
sports heroes, we`re school teachers, we`re everywhere. And they`re
fearful of that.

It is none of their business, but nevertheless they want to have the
traditional marriage because they feel it`s icky. That thing called ick.
And that, too, has changed considerably, because in the latest field poll,
78 percent of people under 39 support marriage equality and equality for
the LGBT community.

So, it`s a generational changes occurring.

SCHULTZ: This is a big turn to end discrimination in this country.
There are end-of-life issues. There are so many things that are going to
be intricately involved in this change in America. Although the
conservative movement, I must focus on this. They`re staunchly opposed to

New Jersey Governor Chris Christie attacked the court`s ruling on
Wednesday. Here`s his response.


GOV. CHRIS CHRISTIE (R), NEW JERSEY: I don`t think the ruling was
appropriate. I think it was -- I think it was wrong. And it`s just
another example of judicial supremacy.


SCHULTZ: He says he`ll veto a gay marriage bill if it passes through
state`s legislature, New Jersey, just as he did in 2012.

What`s your response to Republicans who continue to fight against
discrimination and equality? I mean, they seem to turn a blind eye and act
as if this is something that is just totally and morally wrong and they
play the moral card a lot.

Your response to that, and Governor Christie.

TAKEI: Moral card and religion. They always come to religion.
Well, they have to understand that there is a strict demarcation between
the separation of church and state.

We are Buddhists. And we understand that we can`t write our faith
values into civil law which applies to everybody. What they don`t
understand is that if they want respect for their faith, they have to
respect that many different faiths in this country.

And so, we`ve got to get them to understand the demarcation point
between the separation of church and state. And I`m surprised that
Governor Christie still has yet to get that education.

SCHULTZ: George Takei, I appreciate you being on THE ED SHOW
tonight. Thanks so much for joining us on this vitally important topic.
Thank you, sir.

TAKEI: Thank you.

SCHULTZ: Republicans -- you bet.

Republicans try to fill their binders for the next election. The
panel weighs in on the GOP`s attempt to win over women and more. That`s
coming up.

And righties are cooling to Rush Limbaugh`s hot air. We`ll discuss
conservative radio`s waning influence.

But next, I`m taking your questions. "Ask Ed Live" is just ahead.

Stay tuned.


SCHULTZ: Welcome back to THE ED SHOW.

Here on THE ED SHOW, we love hearing from our viewers.

Tonight, in our "Ask Ed Live" segment, the first question comes from
Jamie Antonio (ph). "Will the hateful GOP ever pass an immigration bill in
the House?"

I`ve been on record time and time again, no. I don`t think they are.
They don`t have any political pressure to do so because of the
gerrymandering. They don`t believe in it.

They`re afraid of the demographics. And, of course, the best way to
control the demographics is to disenfranchise as many potential Democratic
and liberal voters that might come into the fold and would also, of course,
support union strength in this country. It would grow because there are so
many low wage workers who would be affected by immigration reform in

So, no, I do not think so. I think the conservatives have done a
heck of a job making everybody think they are the ones on border security.
They`re the ones in the Senate who have stemmed forward and said we are
really sure about securing the border. But when it comes to human rights
and family issues, no, they won`t do it because they`re afraid of the

Our next question comes from Wayne Snyder. "How can an anti-abortion
Republicans call themselves pro-life and still support capital punishment?"

They have an amazing innate ability to separate the two and easily do
it. I`ve always said that the Democrats are the ones that care about you
after you`re born. The Republicans never have.

They separate the two because I think the Republican Party and the
conservative movement has always had a very twisted view when it comes to
justice. They think the answer to everything is the death penalty. It is
a behavior that they are willing to address and pass judgment on despite
all of their faith connections. They show very little mercy when it come
to the death penalty. Yet on abortion, it is now become the real cultural
issue that they hold over the heads of the Democrats to help them win favor
and hold on to rural America.

And it ends up getting a lot people voting again their best interests
when it comes to economics.

Stick around. The rapid response panel is next.


SCHULTZ: Welcome back to THE ED SHOW.

Well, apparently, the governor of Texas, Rick Perry, has nothing
better to do than to pick on a public servant who simply stood up for
something she deeply believes in.

Democratic State Senator Wendy Davis has become a political Internet
sensation after staging an 11-hour filibuster this week to block a vote on
closing most of the abortion clinics in Texas. Her filibuster drew
national headlines and huge crowds of protesters.

Instead of discussing the legislation, Governor Rick Perry made the
politics personal, at the National Right to Life Convention on Friday.


GOV. RICK PERRY (R), TEXAS: In fact, even the woman who filibustered
the Senate the other day was born into difficult circumstances. She is the
daughter of a single woman. She was a teenage mother herself. She managed
to eventually graduate from Harvard Law School and served in the Texas

It`s just unfortunate that she hasn`t learned from her own example,
that every life must be given a chance to realize its full potential. And
every life matters.



SCHULTZ: That comment by Texas Governor Rick Perry has been judged
by most Americans as totally unfair.

Senator Davis was forced to defend her own personal choices.


STATE SEN. WENDY DAVIS (D, FORTH WORTH: I would say to him that I
had the privilege of making a choice about the path I chose for my life.
And I`m so proud of my daughters.


SCHULTZ: Later, Davis said this to a local reporter about the
governor`s nasty attacks.


DAVIS: I would just say that it really demeans the office that he
holds to make a personal statement like that.


SCHULTZ: Wendy Davis` filibuster killed the Texas abortion bill.
But the fight is far from over, folks. Governor Rick Perry has called a
special session to address this issue. One Republican said he fears the
next abortion battle will make the state capital in Austin, Texas, look
more like Madison, Wisconsin, before the Walker recall.

Joining me now on a rapid response panel, state senator from Ohio,
Nina Turner. Also with us tonight, John Nichols, Washington correspondent
of "The Nation" magazine, and Jim Moore, author of "Adios Mofo".

Jim, we`ve got to start with you in Texas.


SCHULTZ: Is there no stopping the attacks on women`s rights? Your
thoughts? What`s happening?

MOORE: Well, I think they have a problem on their hands. The
governor has complicated it for them, Ed.

We had a west Texas oilman here in the 1990 race case against Ann
Richards for governor who once said something similar to what he has said
about Wendy Davis. He made it personal. This cowboy oilman said, "I`m
going to head her and hoof her and drag her through the rough", and
basically diminishing it, making it personal -- making it a male/female
thing. And that`s what he has done.

That doesn`t mean he`s not going to keep up the attack. They`re
going to pass the bill again in a special session that starts Monday.

SCHULTZ: Nina Turner, is this what aware going to see under
Republican governors across America, them trying to outdo one another on
this issue?

NINA TURNER (D-OH), STATE SENATOR: Yes, Ed. They are trying to
outright one another. That`s what we get with the ridiculous redistricting
that has happened throughout this country.

What Governor Perry said about State Senator Davis is unacceptable.
She is a woman part of the fabric of the American dream -- and in my
estimation, a cycle breaker just as I am. And how dare he try to judge her
life experience with Senator Davis` standing up for and what women who are
pro-choice and men who are pro-choice. We are just standing up for folks`
right to have an opportunity to make a choice.

And so Republicans can get all the women together that they would
like. But it is all a charade and nothing more than an illusion. They
don`t really care about women.

SCHULTZ: John Nichols, will Austin end up looking like Madison,
Wisconsin? I mean -- and also, is this really the platform to propel Rick
Perry into the conservative movement to run again in 2016?

Your thoughts?

JOHN NICHOLS, THE NATION MAGAZINE: Austin already looks like
Madison, Wisconsin. Those crowds that came out spontaneously. You know,
certainly, there were groups on the ground, but you don`t get crowds that
big. You don`t get that intensity, that all-night feeling unless the issue
is very hot and very intense.

So I think you already have a Wisconsin moment in Texas. It is
likely to get more intense as the coming week plays out.

And the thing about Perry`s presidential candidacy, though, this is a
different game. He is essentially inviting Wendy Davis to take him on.
And if she does so, I will remind you. We`ve spent a lot of time over the
last 10 years, 15 years talking about that moment when Texas might make its
shift -- well, I think the Wendy Davis/Rick Perry race, even if Perry does
prevail will be so intense. It will take him down a few pegs. I don`t
think he is helped by he`s doing.

SCHULTZ: Jim Moore, your thoughts on that comment.

MOORE: I think there`s no question. She moved the needle
significantly the other night with what she did. There are a bunch of
single mom and suburban house wives, who are very quietly, I think made the
decision the other night to have a difficult time to ever vote for a
conservative white male in public office.

There is a window here between 2014 and 2018 when it looks like
probably the mayor of San Antonio or his brother, the congressman, the
Castro twins, are well poised --


MOORE: -- to run for governor.

But there is a moment where somebody like Wendy Davis can step in and
she has a chance to win. It`s a tough fight but it is not impossible. And
she could be very successful in moving things.

SCHULTZ: And topic number two: the new effort to recruit women for
the GOP in 2014. There is now a new group call Women on the Right Unite.
Just a note: both of the women`s Web site and the women`s section of the are outdated. One still mentions the upcoming 2012 election.

If they can`t even bother to update the Web site aimed at women, that
really doesn`t say too much.

This effort to recruit women, how can they do it, Nina Turner? For
instance, in your state, which is always a battleground state? What are
women thinking? How could they even associate themselves with the
conservative movement?

TURNER: It`s an illusion. And it`s not -- you know, we know how to
think for ourselves and I think the women understand who stand in for them.
Any time that you would put into a budget bill, under no circumstances
would a woman who was seeking to make a choice of abortion be able to have
a medical emergency. You want to put her life on the line.

Anytime you cannot stand up for women to have access to high quality
medical care and also, not stand up for their rights to have equal pay for
equal work, something is wrong with that, Ed. We need to elect folks to
office who care for everybody. We`re talking about mothers, daughters and
sisters. And women are not second class citizens.

So, I don`t think any woman in Ohio or this nation will buy the
illusion that the Republican Party is selling.

SCHULTZ: John Nichols, will this fight motivate progressives

NICHOLS: It already has. Look, Wendy Davis is a rock star
politically right now, not just in Texas but nationally. And I think this
is something that`s happened. It`s a big deal in America.

We have so much frustration with Washington. So many time things
don`t seem to happen in Washington. People more and more are looking to
the states and they are seeing these battles play out.


NICHOLS: And I think that Wendy Davis is the face of this state-
based resistance to the right.

SCHULTZ: Jim Moore is Rick Perry definitely running in 2016? What`s
the call?

MOORE: I don`t think anybody knows yet. But I`ll tell you what,
Rick, he likes his entourage, he like his security staff. He likes
traveling and living like a king. And I don`t see him walk away from it.

SCHULTZ: All right. Ohio State Senator Nina Turner, John Nichols of
"The Nation" magazine and Washington correspondent there and also, Jim
Moore, political analyst from Texas -- great to have all of you with us.
Thanks so much.

MOORE: Tonight in our survey I you asked, are conservatives ignoring
racism in America? Ninety-four percent of you say yes, 6 percent say no.

Up next: Paul Ryan is fighting the war on poverty but he is on the
wrong side.

Stay tuned.


SCHULTZ: And in "Pretenders" tonight, failed vice presidential
candidate Paul Ryan. Republicans needed damage control after the farm bill
didn`t pass. What an embarrassment. Instead, they got Paul Ryan.

While fumbling through what went wrong, he dropped yet another doozy.


REP. PAUL RYAN (R), WISCONSIN: I focus on poverty these days. We
get the 50th anniversary of the war on poverty coming up next year, but we
don`t have much to show for it.


SCHULTZ: Well, Ryan got one thing right: too many Americans still in
poverty. The congressman forgot to mention his focus has been making sure
it stays that way.

You see, the congressman proposed budget after budget, which guts
resources for the poor. He attacked the child tax credit, food stamps and
low-income family health care plans. It sounds so compassionate, doesn`t

The U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops sent a letter to Congress
criticizing Ryan`s plan, calling his attack on poor families unjustified
and wrong. This Ayn Rand disciple doesn`t want to help the poor. He wants
to vilify them.


RYAN: Takers versus makers in America. We`re coming to a country
where we`re getting more and more takers. Takers not makers. More takers
than makers in the society. Where we will turn our safety net into a
hammock. Takers versus makers.


SCHULTZ: If Paul Ryan wants us to believe he is going to start
flexing his muscles for the poor -- well, he can just keep on pretending.


SCHULTZ: Welcome back to THE ED SHOW.

This is the story for the folks who take a shower after work, who
have been vilified by right-wing talkers of America time and time again.

But wait a minute. The right-wing echo chamber is in trouble. For
the past 30 years, conservative talk radio has dominated the political
conversation and guided the thinking of many lawmakers.

Rush Limbaugh has been treated like a gift from God.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The people that listen to 10 hours of talk radio
a week or more voted Republican by a 3-1 margin. Those are the people that
elected the new Congress. That`s why this is the Limbaugh Congress.


SCHULTZ: All right. Conservative talk is still dominant, but its
influence is starting to fade. If you don`t believe me, trust GOP
messaging guru, Frank Luntz.

Luntz was caught on camera speaking to a group of young Republicans
at the University of Pennsylvania. Listen to this.


FRANK LUNTZ, GOP MESSAGING GURU: And they get great ratings, and
they drive the message. And it`s really problematic. And this is not on
the Democratic side. It`s only on the Republican side.

Democrats have got every other source of news on their side. And so
that is a lot of what`s driving it. If you take Marco Rubio`s getting his
(EXPLETIVE DELETED) kicked, who`s my Rubio fan here? We talked about it.
He is getting destroyed by Mark Levin, by Rush Limbaugh, and a few others.

He is trying to find a legitimate, long-term effective solution to
immigration that isn`t the traditional Republican approach, and talk radio
is killing him. That`s what`s causing this thing underneath and too many
politicians in Washington are playing coy.


SCHULTZ: Well, apparently, Frank Luntz didn`t learn anything from
Mitt Romney in the 47 percent mistake. He made the naive mistake of
telling college kids with iPhones in their hands that the conversation was
off the record. Really?

Luntz, you need to get updated with how kids use technology. They
have no loyalty, but only to the information.

This is what they`re saying behind closed doors. It`s a good thing
for liberals in America.

For more on all of this, let`s bring in talk radio consultant Holland

Holland, it`s great to have you with us.


SCHULTZ: Holy smokes, they are throwing sand in the sand box.
What`s going on here?

HOLLAND COOKE, TALK RADIO CONSULTANT: Of all people, you`d think a
media consultant would know that the camera never blinks. And, Ed, you`ve
known me long enough to know that I`m not much of a conspiracy theorist.
But this is enough to make you wonder.

I myself, a media consultant, can sympathize with Frank Luntz,
because there is nothing more frustrating than you do the research, you
formulate a plan, you outline it for the client, and then the client
doesn`t follow instructions. And the results are bad.

So, here`s the conspiracy theory. Did Frank talk himself blue in the
face trying to get the Republicans to do the obvious, and then end run them
by pretending that this whole thing leaked? He can`t be so naive as to
think that when he tells a roomful of college kids, now, everybody turn off
your wireless phone. We don`t want this recorded, that they`ll all do it.

His work is garden variety perceptual research. The kind of stuff
you and I were doing in radio 15 years ago.

Reince Priebus released the autopsy report they called it, the post-
mortem after the election -- same message there. This party of no thing is
not selling. The negativity has worn thin. They lost the war on women.
And they are extremely unfriendly to Hispanics who tipped the election.

But, talk radio is still the mantra.

SCHULTZ: Well, it`s interesting. Is conservative talk radio leading
the GOP down a path of destruction? I mean, have they really been -- have
they been the ones who have forged this big divide?

COOKE: The short answer, yes.

And you make an important distinction, because radio is fine. AM/FM
radio has over 243 million people a week age 12 and above listening in the
USA. It`s talk radio that has a problem.

Rush Limbaugh has 14 million listeners, used to have 22 million.
These numbers come from "Talkers" magazine, to which I contribute, the most
widely quoted source for the big talk radio scoreboard. So, do the math,
14 into 243 is about 5 percent, meaning 95 percent of people listening to
the radio aren`t listening. Glenn Beck has 7.5 million listeners, 3
percent of the radio audience, 97 percent aren`t listening.

Mathematically, this is fringe media. So who do you think they`re
talking to? The fringe, the Tea Party, and it`s all of this survivalist
and Chicken Little stuff that keeps their audience tuning in every day.
But they`re not talking to mainstream America.

SCHULTZ: And do you think that talk radio -- or should I say
conservative talk radio make the turn before the midterm to make a positive
impact on Republicans, to keep the House and win the Senate? I mean, do
they have that same influence that they had back in the early 1990s?

COOKE: Well, the influence is there. But the message is all wrong.
Frank Luntz himself is fretting that the GOP could lose the House because
Limbaugh and this legion of sound-alike talk hosts, all the local stations,
are saying ignore the research, steer hard right.

So they seem to be on course.


All right. Holland Cooke, always great to have you with us. is where you can find Holland Cooke`s work. Great to
have you with us.

COOKE: You bet.

SCHULTZ: That`s THE ED SHOW. I`m Ed Schultz. We`ll see you
tomorrow right here at 5:00 Eastern right here on MSNBC.

It`s THE ED SHOW. Have a good one.


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