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The Ed Show for Tuesday, March 4th, 2014

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March 4, 2014

Guests: Kate Sheppard, Steve Kretzmann, Daniel Dromm, Tim Ryan, Bill
Richardson, Joe Cirincione

ED SCHULTZ, MSNBC HOST: Good evening Americans and welcome to the Ed
Show live from New York.

Let`s get to work.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Chaotic scene at the White House Sunday.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Chanting crime and justice now. The group urges
President Obama to reject the pipeline.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They strap themselves to a fence to protest the
proposed Keystone.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Nearly 400 people were arrested.

SUSAN MCGINNIS, WASHINGTON D.C.: Destruction of this pipeline is on-
hold, pending a decision from President Obama.

AMERICA: How Keystone impact to the greenhouse gas emissions would affect
our decision.

WARREN BUFFET, CEO, BERKSHIRE HATHAWAY: I think probably the Keystone
Pipeline is a good idea for the country.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Secretary of State John Kerry says climate
change is the world`s most fearsome weapon of mass destruction.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is the largest construction project that we
see on the books.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Republicans have been calling to this and to speak
for the jobs.

JANE KLEEB, FOUNDER BOLDNEBRASKA.ORG: Have a single Republican leader
stood with us throughout this time? No.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The Obama Administration`s own folks have said no
this is not going to do damage.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What would hold him back from saying yes?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If they`re going to crack a leak that`s going to
be in that water.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We need to step up and do something about it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If putting your body against the gears of the
machine and saying this madness must stop.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We will stand in the ground, yes.


SCHULTZ: Good to have you with us tonight folks. Thanks for

When I was 11 years old growing up in Norfolk, Virginia, the Vietnam
War was rolling. Protests started to take place on campus at Old Dominion
University. In fact in Washington, things started to get a little heated
up. It was April of 1965, April 17th, there were 25,000 people who showed
to protest the Vietnam War, they wanted it over with. And then one month
later at U.C Berkeley in May of 65 there were 30,000 people. Roll fast
forward to 1967, there were 100,000 people in Washington D.C. who are
protesting to get us out of Vietnam. It was a bad deal. Guys were dying.
In fact, we lost 56,000 Americans in that war.

And it evolved to this day. November 15th 1969, that`s what a half of
million people look like when they`re on the mall (ph) in Washington D.C.
This is the largest anti-war demonstration in American history.

Is the pipeline that bad? I think it`s fantastic that there was a
demonstration on Sunday in Washington and there were 400 people. Maybe
it`s because of fax machines, maybe it`s because of the internet, maybe
it`s because of iPhones, maybe it`s because of text messaging and the
information age, maybe we`re just a different society today.

I don`t know what it`s going to take to stop the pipeline and get the
message to the president of the United States. But for reference, this is
what he had to do to stop war. So all of these folks across America who
want to stop the pipeline, you`re in the 11th hour. I think it`s great
that there are 80 campuses across the country that have mobilized some
protest, but this is what I think has to be done, that`s how big Big Oil
is. This is how strong the multinationals are.

So tonight, we start with some major news on the Keystone XL Pipeline.
A number of big names, they`re coming out in support of the pipeline.
We`ll give you both sides of the story.

First, it`s billionaire Nebraskan, yeah, from Nebraska, from Omaha,
Warren Buffet.

On Monday, he said the pipeline would be good for America.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What about the Keystone Pipeline? That question
was raised several times by shareholders .

BUFFET: Well, I think .

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: . and by others who say, "Wait a second, do you
really want the Keystone Pipeline to come because it`s a direct competitor
to what would happen at Burlington or is it .

BUFFET: It`s not that -- bigger the better. It`s moving -- it would
be moving crude down from Canada and that, you know, I think probably the
Keystone Pipeline is a good idea for the country.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Do you expect that the president might actually
pass it sometime soon?

WARREN: I had no idea.


SCHULTZ: Well, he also admitted there are risks involved with the
Keystone XL Pipeline.


BUFFET: There are leaks on pipelines and, you know, the occasional
explosion it might get. That`s very, very, very, very rare. But if you
measure moving millions of barrels for 100 years one versus the other, I`m
not sure how it will come out. It depends on what`s going on. They`re
going to change railcars obviously.


SCHULTZ: Well, Warren Buffet knew the Bakken Shale is going to be
productive because he bought Burlington Northern Santa Fe when the market
was a little soft back in 2009.

The numbers that I`m reading about Burlington Northern Santa Fe, their
net worth right now has gone from 12 billion over to 20 billion in just 36
months. Pretty good investment. He knew that oil was going to get moving.

Missouri Governor Jay Nixon also has come out in support of the
pipeline extension. The Democratic governor wrote a letter to Secretary of
State John Kerry on Monday endorsing the pipeline. He wrote, "The approval
and construction of the Keystone XL Pipeline will strengthen our economy,
create jobs, and promote North American energy independence."

I`d question the second one on creating jobs. It ain`t that many.

Now, on the flipside, opposition to the pipeline is also growing day
by day. I don`t know if it`s going to end up with a half of million people
in Washington D.C. but one of Nebraska`s biggest newspapers has come out
against the pipeline.

Today, the York News-Times, number three in the state, said Nebraska
should never support the pipeline in its current plan, the paper express
serious concerns about the possibility of contaminating the Ogallala

Now, it pointed out Nebraska really relies on this water source to
survive as a state in a region. And if the aquifer were compromised and if
were ever contaminated with oil the consequences simply would be
devastating for the entire region.

Meanwhile, a new report from the now profit, the non profit I should
say, the non profit Carbon Tracker Initiative. I have never heard of this
one before. The Carbon Tracker Initiative reveals possible flaws with the
State Department`s report and this is what lefties have been yelling about.
The State Department report is flawed.

Now, according to the Carbon Tracker, the State Department downplays
the significance the pipeline would have on tar sands development. Carbon
Tracker also argues the State Department underestimated the amount of
greenhouse gas emissions produced with production of the pipeline and we
can`t downplay this enough. Make no mistake.

The State Department report is being hotly contested on a lot of
fronts. Although on Friday, on this program, Canadian Ambassador to the
United States Gary Doer told me the Canadian Government trust the State


SCHULTZ: There`s been some questions by environmentalists about the
integrity of the State Department.

GARY DOER, CANADIAN AMBASSADOR TO U.S.: Yeah. I think that`s really
unfair and I`m not the secretary of state.


DOER: But this is the second time they`ve questioned the integrity of
the scientists and the experts in the State Department.


DOER: That are not political appointment.

SCHULTZ: What if the .

DOER: And I respect their integrity. You know, we may not have liked
the State Department report but we would never -- and we do think it`s a
good report by the way, we think it`s very accurate, but we would never
attack the integrity of those scientists that prepared that report.

SCHULTZ: They say -- the environmentalists are saying there`s been a
conflict of interest .

DOER: Well, they .

SCHULTZ: . the inspector general says no.

DOER: It fell like a house of cards by an independent review the inspector



SCHULTZ: Not everyone agrees with the Canadian Ambassador.

This Sunday, students from more than 80 colleges staged a protest. I
don`t know if it`s massive but it was a protest at the White House against
the pipeline.

Now, maybe by modern day standards because of the information age,
maybe this is a massive protest but it ain`t anything like what was
happening during the Vietnam War.

More than 1,000 students took part of the protest. It`s being
described as one of the largest youth protest on the environment in a


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We have thousands of young people here in the
streets of Washington D.C. marching to the White House to risk arrest, to
demand that President Obama say no to Keystone XL.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We probably change it from the most important
issue that we`re facing and it`s going to affect millions and millions of
people all over the world.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is the march to show that young people care,
that we care about our future, that we`re willing to come together and
we`re willing to act and now he needs to act. We came here, we acted,
we`re here together to show a chorus and President Obama now needs to make
a decision and reject this pipeline.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We hope to show President Obama that a lot of the
people who gotten them elected, the youth vote, the student vote, they
really want to take a stronger stance on climate and reject this Keystone

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If we get arrested, you know, the first thing
that, you know, this is not going to do anything. But as you go forth and
you see people come to you and they tell you, "You`re a president, use
that." It has a huge impact. And the most important thing it does is
getting your body against the gears of the machine and saying this madness
must stop.


SCHULTZ: I think what`s very profound about one of the sound bites in
that clip we just played was that the young lady said that this is going to
affect millions and millions of people.

Well, if that`s the case, how come we`re not seeing a global push to
save the environment? How come we`re not seeing a huge effort into the
hundreds of thousands to stop the pipeline? Where is it?

Protesters wore mock Hazmat suits to block the side walk and strap
themselves to the White House fence. Did all the right stuff to get
attention but overall, roughly 400 people were arrested, the protesters`
message was very clear, many of them voted for President Obama to tackle
the tough environmental issues.

If the president approves this pipeline, there is no doubt that there
will be an abandoning of the youth vote coming up for the Democrats.
That`s my analysis. That`s my opinion. That`s what I sense.

I could be wrong. I do think that this is going to have an effect but
the bottom line here in all of this is that I think in modern day
standards, more people are going to have to speak out against this pipeline
for the president to step up and say, "You know what? I`ve heard thousands
and millions of Americans say that this isn`t what we want." And I have to
report to you tonight in my gut anyway, I just don`t think it`s there yet.
God bless those kids for getting out there and doing what they`re doing.
The environment is very important and we`ve got to make the right call. We
need to hear more voices. You might hear mine later.

Get your cellphones out. I want to know what you think tonight`s
question. "Will President Obama alienate his base if he approves the
Keystone XL Pipeline?" Text A for Yes, text B for No to 67622, you can
always go to our blog We`ll bring you the results later on
in the show.

For more, let me bring in Kate Sheppard of
Kate, good to have you with us tonight. Tell us about the Carbon Tracker
report, why is the State Department report flawed?

looks that specifically this question of whether the emissions from the
pipeline are going to be significant. And it argues that the State
Department takes it as pre-assumed that all of this oil is going to be
extracted from the tar sands and burn.

They say that that`s not the case, that the pipeline would essentially
facilitate greater development of the tar sands because transportation by
pipeline is cheaper than transportation by rail. And that that would lead
to increased emissions because we have facilitated that greater

SCHULTZ: So after the inspector general`s report, will the State
Department care about further criticism? This most recent one that I just
cited, the Carbon Tracker, are any of these environmental impact studies
that might favor not approving the pipeline do you think have an effect on
President Obama? It`s down to one guy right now.

SHEPPARD: Well, I think what`s important here is two things.

One, Carbon Tracker isn`t some fly by night organization. Actually,
in the State Department`s environmental analysis they cite Carbon Tracker`s
methodology in their own market analysis of the pipeline. So obviously,
they`ve looked at their reports before. So I think that`s important.

Number two, when we look at the president`s decision, the president
said in his speech last June that he`s going to base his decision on
whether or not the pipeline is significantly exacerbates the problem of
carbon pollution.

And this report would argue that, yes, it actually does exacerbate it
quite a bit and I think that the president will probably consider those
kinds of questions when he makes this final decision on this pipeline.

SCHULTZ: In your reporting, do you get a sense of where this is

SHEPPARD: You know, Ed, I get asked that question all the time. I
think that is still to be determined. I think that right now, the question
is going before President Obama and Secretary Kerry for the very, you know,
they`re really looking at it now. And there are two people who have said
that they care very much about climate change and about the legacy that his
administration`s going to have on that issue.

So I think that they will be looking at these questions about
emissions when they consider their final decision.

SCHULTZ: All right. Kate Sheppard, good to have you with us tonight.
Thank you so much.

I want to bring in Steve Kretzmann, the Executive Director of the
Price of Oil. Steve, good to you with us.

Who`s winning this battle right now, this PR batter that is out there?

heated battle for sure but this recent entry by Carbon Tracker is an
absolute blockbuster report. It`s technical for sure, but it amounts to
the fact that building the Keystone Pipeline is tantamount to building 46
new coal plants. That`s the emissions equivalent that Carbon Tracker was
able to uncover here, but -- just by taking a part states analysis and
looking at some very flawed assumptions they made.

So it`s a big deal and I think that, you know, we`re able to use that
factually coupled with the kind of movement strength that you talk about in
the intro, you know, I mean it`s not only a question of -- it`s not only a
question of just who has the facts, it`s also a question of how the
politics is going.

And I think you`re right, I mean I think the president is definitely
running the risk of alienating his base and the key critical voting block
in the youth if he decides to approve the pipeline.

SCHULTZ: Well, Carbon Tracker, I mean I can go in my research -- I
can find for every study I find for I can find against. How does an
Average Joe up the street pick up any report and say, "Yeah, I think the
president ought to do this."? You know, how good is Carbon Tracker versus
the State Department report is what I`m asking.

KRETZMANN: So, for the State Department report, you have -- it was
written by adoze (ph) paying member of the American Petroleum Institute
which is why environmentalist have raised concerns about conflict of
interest here.

For Carbon Tracker the prime author was a former head of research for
Deutsche Bank who we think has some real expertise in predicting how
markets will react, and how a new piece of infrastructure will affect the
upstream piece here.

So, you know, we certainly think that this is a much more objective
analysis. But, you know, you could say we would think of that, but so I
think it`s real.

SCHULTZ: So, how important are these protests?

KRETZMANN: The protests are incredibly important, right? I mean, I
think that the power comes unfortunately in Washington from two major
places, money and people. And the fact of the matter is the fossil fuel
industries always going to be able to outspend pretty much everybody else
in their advocacy.

But, you know, what we`re really seeing now is a ground swell of
opposition to the pipeline across the country, you know, it`s not only what
we saw with 400 youth being arrested here in Washington a couple of days
ago. It`s also 70,000 people who have pledged civil disobedience if the
president and Secretary Kerry decide the wrong thing.

It`s a huge, you know, it`s the most energizing force.

SCHULTZ: But wouldn`t it be more important to do it before they
decide? If -- I mean, if that what their plan is? Once it`s over it`s

I mean, you know, look, if global warming and climate change or
whatever politically correct term we`re supposed to be using these days,
you know, the earth is changing, the earth is being impacted by greenhouse
gases, OK, and carbon emissions.

If it`s going to affect the globe how can it not be more important
than the Vietnam War? I mean, what it is? Are we just different society
today when it comes to communication or a different people in the way we
get our messages across?

I mean back in the day when I was a kid and I saw that that was a real
impact. And I think that if they want to stop this pipeline strengthen the
number is huge, agreed?

KRETZMANN: Yes, strengthen the numbers is everything. I mean -- and
I think you`re absolutely right. I think that we will get to that level
for the pipeline and for the climate movement in general, you know. We`re
seeing polling numbers particularly among the people who are less than 30
and says that climate change is the single most motivating thing for them
to actually get out and get on the street and get to the .

SCHULTZ: OK. So, if there`s not going to be a half a million people
who are going to be in the Washington mall to protest this then maybe
they`ll do it at the ballot box and take it out on the people that let them
down. We`ll see.

Steve Kretzmann, great to have you with us tonight. I appreciate your

Still ahead, Secretary Kerry was in Kiev today. We`ll have the latest
developments from the Ukraine.

Coming up, the state of steel in this country, we`ll talk about what`s
happening to steelworker jobs in Lorain, Ohio and I`ll be there this
weekend. Stay with us. We`ll be right back.


SCHULTZ: Time now for the Trenders social media action, very heavy
out there. Thanks for responding to us. This is where you can find us
everyday at, and I`m
yakking on the radio, Monday through Friday, noon to three at Sirius XM
radio channel 127 and liberal talk stations across the country. You can
get my podcast of the radio at

Social media nation has decided, we`re reporting. Here are today`s
top Trenders voted on by you.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yo Mr. Plow, that`s my name, that name again is
Mr. Plow.

SCHULTZ: The number three Trender, Kaplow.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The plow just went by here about two minutes ago
and it looks like it hasn`t been plowed. So there goes a couple of plows
demonstrating what I .

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That`s got to hurt.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What I said hitting us -- all right, there you go.
Here comes another one. You`re going to be OK. That is the beauty of
breaking news.

SCHULTZ: A Philly news reporter gets a winner wallop.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did you know that you hit Steve?

MICHAEL WYATT, PLOW DRIVER: And I didn`t see him because, you know,
the snow was blowing and I stopped. I`m just glad nobody got hurt.

JIMMY FALLON, THE TONIGHT SHOW HOST: The reporter is safe while the
driver of the snow plow was injured from high fiving all of his co-workers.

SCHULTZ: The number two Trender, Ford focus.

JIMMY KIMMEL, JIMMY KIMMEL LIVE HOST: Why are here? What good could
come of this?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This one ain`t well.

KIMMEL: People seemed very angry that I was having you on the show
tonight, having our embarrassment of a mayor and you show us the slap to
all Torontonians.

MAYOR ROB FORD, TORONTO: Is that all they got?

SCHULTZ: Toronto`s mayor gets grilled by Jimmy Kimmel.

KIMMEL: You have to apologize a lot, right?

FORD: I`ve had to a couple of times.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Or you can stuff your sorries in a sack, mister.

KIMMEL: You are sweating a lot. Let me get you some tissues here.
Do you mind if I dab you, Mr. Mayor?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is more than Nixon every sway (ph).

FORD: I wasn`t elected to be perfect, Jimmy. I was elected to clean
up the mess that I inherited and that`s exactly what I done.

SCHULTZ: And today`s top Trender, steel away.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where are the jobs?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You can`t have a manufacturing industry if you
don`t have a steel industry.

PETE TRINIDAD, VICE PRES.USW LOCAL 6787: When it comes to the quality
of work on a level playing field, we can now produce and now worth any
worker in the world.

SCHULTZ: Ohio`s steel industry faces threats about sourcing.

What`s happening in Lorain, Ohio?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: With the Department of Commerce on the OCTG with
not putting any tear us on South Koreans is after that really came out.
The U.S. had announced immediate lay offs.

SCHULTZ: What`s it do to the workers?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The morale goes down very quickly. They get
worried. It`s devastating.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Look, and I think we have to fight for a level
playing field.


SCHULTZ: Joining me tonight is Congressman Tim Ryan of Ohio.
Congressman, good to have you with us tonight.

We`re going to be doing .

REP. TIM RYAN, (D) OHIO: Always a pleasure.

SCHULTZ: . a documentary later on coming up here on MSNBC in the
coming months, The Steel Industry: America`s Middle Class. I mean, we keep
talking about saving the middle class, we allow industries like this to get
hit with an unequal playing field with folks like the South Korea where
we`ve got a trade agreement. You wonder what the future is. How bad is
the Department of Commerce`s decision for the American steel industry as it
is now?

RYAN: Well, it`s very hurtful. I mean, you heard it from Leo Gerard
and our friends in the steel worker union up in Lorain. It`s important to
remember, those jobs are $22 an hour. We`re talking about getting the
minimum wage up to 10. These guys make $44,000 a year, Ed, and that`s
without any overtime. You could make 50, $55,000 a year if you have a
spouse working, making another 20 or 30, you can have a decent life by
making 75 or 80 grand a year.

That`s what`s important about the steel industry. And so this
omission here by the Department of Commerce is very hurtful because it lets
Korea off the hook and I don`t know why that happened. And we saw in
Youngstown just down the road from Lorain when the ITC put terrors on
Chinese tubing, same oil country tubular goods. We saw a billion dollar
steel mill get invested in Youngstown, Ohio. That`s what happens when have
firm trade policies with these countries. And now we`re seeing the
opposite of what happens when you don`t enforce trade laws and level the
playing the field, you get job loss and good solid middle class job loss.

SCHULTZ: Well, John Boehner runs around and he`s from Ohio saying --
asking the question, "Where are the jobs?" But he never talks about bad
trade agreements and this is a product of a lousy trade agreement.

Now, let`s talk about the quality. How about the product coming from
South Korea versus the product here made in America? What about quality?

RYAN: Well, I don`t think anyone can compete at this point especially
in oil country tubular goods. And we have a competitive and comparative
advantage in this field right now and we see what`s happening with the
exploration in Ohio, in Pennsylvania, in upstate New York the steel
companies would prefer to be around where that`s happening right now.

And the bottom line is that these policies hurt investment in the
United States. There`s absolutely no question about it and you`re going to
get an inferior product. And the bottom line is when you`re talking about
oil and gas you have to make sure that it is well regulated and you have to
make sure that the products are solid or that`s when you end up having

SCHULTZ: You know, this is just isn`t about steelworkers. Here`s the
ripple effect.


SCHULTZ: What`s the response of the people in the community when news
like this comes out? They`re middle class jobs, they`re manufacturing

TRINIDAD: Something as simple as going to get your haircut. You hear
the lady -- the hairdresser say, "I hear there`s lay offs coming." And
then she has it prepared because her business is going to go down. At the
restaurants, at the gas stations, it`s a decent paying living wage job
affects three to four people in the community automatically, right away.


SCHULTZ: So, Congressman, this is a product of the South Korean trade
deal and here we are watching the corporatist and watching the Republicans
tell us that we got to do the TPP. Your thoughts.

RYAN: Right. Same, we`re going to go down the same road here if we
continue with the bad trade deals and the lack of enforcement. It`s one
thing to have trade deals when there`s firm, solid enforcement, immediate
enforcement, but not only do we have to make the right decisions. We`ve
got to expedite the decisions because the steel industry and the
steelworkers it takes gobs of money to even try to get this heard, hire the
lawyers, go through the entire process and it never seems to be done in a
timely fashion.

So that`s one of the issues as well. We should not go down the road
with the other pacific countries there. And if we do, which I`m afraid
we`re going to, we better damn well be ready to enforce these in

SCHULTZ: It`s a race to the bottom. Congressman Tim Ryan of Ohio
with us tonight. Thank you so much. I`m going to be in Lorain, Ohio this
weekend working on that documentary.

Coming up, we`ll have the latest from Ukraine.

Still ahead, New York City Mayor Bill de Blasio is leading the charge
to stop the privatization of public schools. One charter school CEO is not
happy about it.

But next, I`m taking your questions, Ask Ed Live, just ahead. Stay
with us.


SCHULTZ: Thanks for staying with us tonight. Love hearing from our
viewers with the questions in our Ask Ed Live segment.

Our first question comes form Marylin. She wants to know "Why are the
Republicans and their media so in love with Putin?"

Well, Putin is a pretty good tool for the Righties right now because
it gives them a good spring board to beat up the president. We know they
don`t like him. So, Putin is really a tool for the Righties all over in
the sound chamber.

Next question is from Eugene (ph), wants to know, "Why don`t Senators
McCain, Graham, and Rubio fly to Ukraine and fight the Russians in person?"

Well, I think your question pretty much illustrates the frustration of
a lot of Americans when they hear nothing but criticism of the president.
The president said very little time to navigate through all of this and
there`s criticism everywhere.

I think in Senator McCain, you have a guy who certainly has paid his
price for America, but he`s a little upset he`s not president.

I think Graham is from South Carolina, everybody down there hates the
president, unless you`re black, right? All the conservatives in South
Carolina, they can`t stand President Obama. So, obviously, it`s popular
for him to go after the president.

And Marco Rubio is interesting. He`s America`s new example about how
fast you can become an expert on something.

Stick around, Rapid Response Panel coming up.

SUE HERERA, CNBC ANCHOR: I`m Sue Herera with your CNBC Market Wrap.
Stocks rally as worries about Ukraine start to ease. The Dow jumps 227
points, rousting (ph) its biggest game of the year. S and P up 28 hitting
a record, and the NASDAQ surged 74 points.

Delta shares rose about 6 percent after the airline said passenger
traffic rose last month.

CoreLogic says home prices rose in January for bursting three months
of declines. It also says the prices are up 12 percent over the last year.

And RadioShack posted a bigger than expected loss, shares fells 17

That`s it from CNBC. We are first in business worldwide. And we`re
back after a quick break.



JOHN KERRY, SECRETARY OF STATE: We`re in the new phase of the
struggle for freedom. In the United States, reaffirms our commitment to
Ukraine`s sovereignty and territorial integrity according to international
law. We condemn the Russian Federation`s act of aggression and we have
throughout this moment an evidence of a great transformation taking place,
and in that transformation, we will stand with the people of Ukraine.


SCHULTZ: Welcome back to the Ed Show. Secretary of State John Kerry
arriving in Kiev today, Ukraine, of course on Tuesday -- that happened
today, and reaffirm the United States to support for the country`s new
leaders. Kerry made it clear. Russia will face consequences from the
International Community if Russian President Vladimir Putin continues to
act in aggression. President Obama addressed the situation in a budget
meeting earlier today.


OBAMA: Above all, we believe that the Ukrainian people should be able
to decide their own future, which is why the world should be focused on
helping them stabilize the situation economically and move towards the fair
and free elections that are currently scheduled to take place in May.
There have been some reports that President Putin is pausing for a moment
and reflecting on what`s happened.


SCHULTZ: Earlier today, the Kremlin reported, Putin ordered tens of
thousands of Russian troops participating in military exercises to return
to their bases. Moscow has denied the military exercises were linked to
the situation in the Ukraine. So, it`s unclear if Putin`s move was
actually an attempt to deescalate the situation.

It seems like a step in the right direction but Putin still would take
responsibility. Putin repeated the claim that troops spotted in Ukraine
wearing unmarked uniforms are not Russian forces but local self-defense
groups. Putin said Russia reserves the right to use all means necessary to
protect Russians in Ukraine and military force would be a last resort.
Putin also warned that western threats to punish Russia with sanctions will

For more on this, let`s go to our Rapid Response Panel tonight.
Former Governor Bill Richardson of New Mexico. Governor Richardson, good
to have you with us tonight, the former ambassador with much success. And
also Joe Cirincione, President of Ploughshares Fund. Great to have you
with us as well.

Governor, you first. Was this a good day for the United States that
the Secretary of States presentation, the president`s demeanor and focus on
this, what do you think?

FMR. GOV.BILL RICHARDSON, (D) NEW MEXICO: Well, it`s a day that moves
us in the right direction. I think Secretary Kerry identifying with the
Ukrainian people with their Democratic movement pledging a billion dollars
in aid. They`re going to need a lot more, maybe 20 hopefully, from the
International Monetary Fund. I think the president being steady, resolute,
firm -- and it could be that you can`t trust President Putin, but, you
know, it could be deescalating. He is going to see the cost of what he`s
done. He is now denying that he had any troops in Crimea. That`s -- I
recall when he said there were no chemical weapons in Syria.

So you got to watch him very carefully, but it could be that he
recognizes that the cost for him if he continues going beyond what he`s
done is going to be extensive.

SCHULTZ: OK. So, Putin today did not seem as confident in his
position. Do you think he`s getting the world message here governor?

RICHARDSON: I do. You know, when the European community talks about
sanctions and France and Germany and Britain, they have a lot of commercial
relations with Russia. When a lot of the nearby Russian -- I won`t call
them Republics, but countries like Poland, like Estonia, and Latvia, say
that this is a threat to them. When NATO is talking about possibly
rebuilding the missile system in Poland, they haven`t exactly said that but
did been threats of that. When the United States contemplates, and I think
we should, exporting natural gas thus kind of stop this Russian
blackmailing of their former Republics, I think Putin is getting a message
that diplomatic isolation and the sanctions he might get might be a little
too much. He has proven his point but he still has to pay for what he did.

SCHULTZ: Joe Cirincione, your thoughts on the economic possibilities
of not good days for Putin.

JOE CIRINCIONE, THE PLOUGHSHARES FUND: And this was not a good day
for Putin. You know, every U.S. president since World War II has faced
Russian military aggression including Truman, Eisenhower, Kennedy, and
Johnson. And none of these cases was because the United States was weak.
It was because the Russians were stupid. And in every single one of the
cases we prevailed, we forced the Russians and the soviets to back down.
And none of these cases could redo that with our own military force. We
used exactly the tool of President Obama is using now -- diplomacy,
alliances, and economic pressure. In the end, Putin is going to back down
and I think we can do it without firing a shot.

SCHULTZ: Joe, what do you make of the Russians successfully testing
an intercontinental ballistic missile today?

CIRINCIONE: Well, this was a previously planned test, and you heard
responsible Congressional leaders like Republican Senator Bob Corker on the
Foreign Affairs -- Foreign Relations Committee discount any connection
between these tests ending the crisis in Ukraine. I believe that`s true.

I believe you`re starting to see Putin will start to look for a way
out trying to find a way to deescalate the crisis -- the ICBM test which is
an unfortunate coincidence.

SCHULTZ: Governor, what about this. The conservatives are going all
out of their ways make -- using these events to paint President Obama as
weak. Take a listen to this.


SARAH PALIN, FORMER VP CANDIDATE: Obama`s -- the perception of him
and his potency across the world is one of such weakness. And you know,
look, people are looking at Putin as one who wrestles bears and drills for
oil. They look at our president as one who wears mom jeans and equivocates
and bloviates.


SCHULTZ: Governor, your -- and former ambassador, I want your
response to that.

RICHARDSON: Well, it`s irresponsible. Republicans -- and many
Republicans have been responsible but there are some that are trying to use
this politically. This was not President Putin`s fault. This was Vladimir
Putin trying to reassert the Soviet Empire. And the president is using
every tool available to respond.

So, it`s unfortunate -- this is a national security case. This is
important to U.S. interest. It involves NATO, it involves our allies, it
involves an important country -- Ukraine, strategically located, and we
shouldn`t be playing politics with this to say that the president has been
weak or Putin did this because President Obama`s previous weakness.

Look what happened in Georgia under George Bush.


RICHARDSON: There was an altercation and President Bush did what he
could but he responded almost in similar fashion as President Obama is

SCHULTZ: Well, it`s just not the cable chatter. It`s those in a
position of responsibility. Today, Senator Lindsey Graham twitted, "It
started with Benghazi, when you kill Americans and nobody pays a price, you
invite this type of aggression." Graham hashtag the tweet Ukraine.

Governor, your response to that, and Joe, what`s your take on that? I
mean, this is really a political football with those who really shouldn`t
be going down this road.

CIRINCIONE: Ed, I think the greater threat the Americans.

RICHARDSON: Senator Graham.

CIRINCIONE: . go governor.

RICHARDSON: No, I was just going to say, Senator Graham is a
responsible guy, a good guy, but he`s in a very tough primary in South
Carolina. So the tougher he sounds, the better he is. That`s all I wanted
to say.

SCHULTZ: Joe, your thoughts.

RICHARDSON: Joe, I`m sorry. Go ahead.

CIRINCIONE: No, you`re right. Senator Graham is under a lot of
pressure at his home state. He just -- Department of energy, your former
agency, just announced it`s closing the controversial Max Plant today. A
$30 billion boondoggle. So Graham is under some pressure. He is trying to
act tough, distract attention. But I think these kinds of attacks are not
just politically despicable. They`re historically ignorant.

Truman wasn`t weak, Eisenhower wasn`t weak, nor was Kennedy or
Johnson. It`s not because of our weakness. It`s because of Russian`s
stupidity that they made this move. I think we will prevail on this if we
can stop the attack from our own political opposition. That`s the greater
threat we face today, not attacks by Putin on Ukraine.

SCHULTZ: Well, you got Putin doing a Baghdad Bob imitation today.
That`s what I thought. He was denying the troops who are in Crimea. Thank
you so much gentlemen. Thanks for being on the program tonight. Bill
Richardson and Joe Cirincione.

Coming up, a New York City councilman accused a charter school CEO of
using her students` funds. We`ll talk to that councilman next. Stay with


SCHULTZ: And in Pretenders tonight, appraising Arizona, Steve King.
The congressman from Iowa is mourning Arizona`s dead Anti-Gay Bill.
Entrepreneurs cannot legally discriminate over what King calls a professed


REP. STEVE KING, (R) IOWA: When you`re in the private sector and
you`re an individual entrepreneur with God-given rights that our founding
fathers defined in the Declaration, you should be able to make your own
decisions on what you do in that private business.

There`s nothing mentioned in their on self-professed behavior and
that`s what they`re trying to protect the special rights for self-professed


SCHULTZ: Self-professed behavior, wow. Steve King is all worked up
about these special rights. He`s more worried about all the good
hardworking bigoted business owners of Arizona. King thinks sneaky
homosexuals will trap business owners.


KING: How do you know who to discriminate against? They about have
to tell you, and you know, and are they then setting up a case? And is
this about bringing a grievance or is it actually about a service that
they`d like to have?

I don`t know whether it`s a choice or not. I think that that exists
across continuum in some type of a curve, and I don`t know what that curve
actually looks like.


SCHULTZ: Well, don`t get it started on what you don`t know
congressman. If Steve King believes he can make hatred the new victimhood,
he can keep on pretending.


SCHULTZ: Welcome back to the Ed Show. This is the story for the
folks who take a shower after work.

There`s a national push back on charter schools happening all across
the country. Here in New York is a big battle. The private sector CEO
formula which infiltrates our children`s learning process is being

New York City Mayor Bill De Blasio has been an outspoken advocate for
public schools since before he was elected. De Blasio announced on
Thursday, he was axing three planned charter schools operated by Success
Academy, the city`s largest for-profit school network.

Now today, De Blasio is in New York`s State Capital of Albany to make
a push to Governor Andrew Cuomo about his ideas for pre-kindergarten and
after school programs. De Blasio`s trip was met with some opposition.
Well-financed charter school advocates also showed up in Albany today to
protest these plans.

Eva Moskowitz, Success Academy Charter School`s CEO is protesting
Mayor De Blasio`s education policies. Moskowitz is angry that De Blasio is
refusing to grant three of her school`s space in city school buildings.
She canceled classes at her 22 schools so that hundreds of parents and
students could be bussed to Albany today to protest De Blasio`s move.

Daniel Dromm, a Queens Councilman says Moskowitz is using kids as
pawns in her effort to privatize public schools and get rich.

Daniel Dromm, the Chairman of the City Council`s Education Committee
joins us here on the Ed Show. Mr. Dromm, good to have you with us.


SCHULTZ: All right. This is charter schools for profit looking for
something for nothing.

DROMM: That`s right.

SCHULTZ: Do you believe that?

DROMM: That`s right. They`re looking for free rent in our public
schools where there are already existing public schools in the same
building. And the inequality of having a charter school which is well-
funded with carpeted hallways, with playrooms, with black rooms, situated
in the same hallway as under funded as our public schools are, with broken
tiles and with leaky fillings, shows the inequity of that type of a system,
where they want to come in, they want to have a rent-free building to
occupy, while our public schools students don`t have the exact same.

SCHULTZ: So tax payer dollars would be going to with the form of a
facility going to a for-profit venture in education.

DROMM: That is correct. And so, they`re actually non-profit, some of
them. Some of them are for profit organizations. It depends on what
charter school it is that you`re talking about. In the case of Eva
Moskowitz, it`s a non-profit. However, Eva pays herself half a million
dollars. Her husband also makes a lot of money out of it.

So what we see here happening in New York City is the corporatization
or the privatization of our public school system. And that`s basically
what it is that we`re opposed.

SCHULTZ: What is she doing with these students today in your opinion?

DROMM: She took them to all the announced (ph) in New York City
public school teacher for 25 years. And I got to tell you, in 25 years
that I was a teacher, we hardly ever had a day where we could close a
school. Never mind close school to take a trip up to Albany.

And the question is, is who`s paying for this trip? By what right
does she had just in unilaterally decide to close her schools. Those
children who could not make it to the -- up to Albany, what type of an
education do they get? She claims that she was going to have lessons on
the bus up to Albany. I wonder what that lesson even look like.

SCHULTZ: OK. Are these charter schools outperforming the public
schools? And why that -- is it the only reason why the mayor shut these
schools down is because they were looking for tax-free money?

DROMM: The mayor shut down these preschools because there are
problems with these preschools. What I meant is that the.

SCHULTZ: Not performing?

DROMM: Right. That they`re not performing and that they are also
mixed with high school students in the same school. That`s one of the
issues that the mayor had. But the jury is out in terms of how charter
schools are performing. The scores are flat.

I want to say right off the bat also that I`m not anti-charter. I
happen to have a very good charter school in my district, the Renaissance
Charter School. It happened to also be a unionized charter school. And
that`s a school that I can support. So we`re not a 100 percent against
charter schools. We are against the corporatization and the privatization
of charters like the school that Eva Moskowitz is operating.

SCHULTZ: How is this going to end up, I mean, this is going to really
brew to be a huge battle.

DROMM: Well, I`m going to have an oversight hearing in the New York
City Council in April to find out how she was able to close these schools,
to look at her salaries, and to investigate the charter schools situation
overall in New York City.

SCHULTZ: Is Mayor De Blasio correct in his efforts in you opinion?

DROMM: Absolutely. Mayor De Blasio has been fantastic on this issue.
He`s trip up to Albany today to support pre-K as vitally important to the
future of New York City students.

SCHULTZ: Where is the governor going to come down on this?

DROMM: I`m not sure. We`re going to wait and see what happens there.
I understand that he did attend this rally today, but we will see. We need

SCHULTZ: Mr. Dromm, thanks for joining us tonight. This is a battle
that we will talk more about because it`s happening all over the country.
It`s hot here in New York.

That`s the Ed Show. I`m Ed Schultz.

Politics Nation with Reverend Al Sharpton starts right now. Good
evening, Rev.


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