The Ed Show for Monday, June 22nd, 2015
Read the transcript to the Monday show
Show: THE ED SHOW
Date: June 22, 2015
Guest: Lanny Davis, Philip Rucker, Matt Schlapp, Dan Kildee, Mike
Papantonio, Dan Holler
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Bernie.
SEN. BERNIE SANDERS, (I-VT) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I would tell everyone
to sit down, but there aren`t enough seats.
ALEX WAGNER, THE ALEX WAGNER SHOW HOST: Plus, flag flap.
GOV. NIKKI HALEY, (R) SOUTH CAROLINA: It is time to move the flag from the
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In third flag should be taken down and placed in a
museum where it belongs.
MAYOR JOE RILEY, (D) CHARLESTON S.C.: The time has come.
SCHULTZ: Later, day 17.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Fresh lead in the manhunt for the two men who escape
from a maximum security prison.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: For a break in was reported in a remote cabin.
MAJOR CHARLES GUESS, NEW YORK STATE POLICE: It`s a confirm lead for us.
We`re going to run this to ground
SCHULTZ: And on the Fast-Track.
REP. JOHN BOEHNER, (R-OH) HOUSE SPEAKER: We`re going to have trade
promotion authority. We`re going to have this vote petty soon and I`m
confident we`re in pretty good place.
PRES. BARACK OBAMA, UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: I`m optimistic we`ll get
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCHULTZ: Good to have you with us tonight folks. Thanks for watching.
You can question polls but can`t deny numbers. Bernie Sanders the senator
from Vermont his presidential campaign is on a role, this was the scene in
Denver Colorado Saturday night. Sanders held a rally and spoke to a
massive over capacity crowd at the University of Denver. The University
estimated roughly 5,500 people attended the event. The gymnasium was so
packed. And overflow crowds watched Sanders from the Lacrosse Stadium
where the speech was played on the scoreboard. It appears Saturday`s
political event was the largest of this 2016 election cycle season.
Hillary`s campaign estimated her kick-off rally in New York, the crowd of
about 5,000 the Sanders huge turnout should have the Clinton campaigns
somewhat worried. The Ed Show is on the ground in Denver on Saturday
night. To say the crowd was excited would be an understatement.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SCHULTZ: Don`t underestimate this man, Bernie Sanders. The Vermont
senator is electrifying Democrats around the country.
SANDERS: That nation and our government belong to all of us and not just a
handful of billionaires.
SCHULTZ: After packing Minnesota rallies and surging in Wisconsin`s straw
polls, one organizer sent a warning to the Hillary Clinton camp. Objects
in your rear view mirror are closer than they appear.
NANCY HEINZMANN, COLORADO RESIDENT: There`s more than just Hillary. There
is something else that`s out there. There an excitement. There is
something that is a little more I don`t know fulfilling.
ALLYSON DRAYTON, COLORADO RESIDENT: I love Hillary. But I don`t agree
with a lot of things that she talks about. Especially with, you know,
getting big corporations out of politics.
CHARLES JOHNSON, COLORADO RESIDENT: We are losing our democracy to the
highest bidder and that is not a good thing.
DRAYTON: Build what we need because it`s turning into more of oligarchy.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m worried that Hillary is going to be for that trade
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He`s willing going to stayed unpopular, did unpopular
thing that needs to be said.
SCHULTZ: On Saturday Sanders hosted one of the largest rallies of the
SANDERS: And I said to my staff, look we`re going L.A. Why don`t we see
if we can get a room in Denver? And let`s see if we can, you know, bring a
couple of hundred people together.
SCHULTZ: Over 5,000 people RSVP to the Colorado rally.
SANDERS: About 10 minutes after the e-mail went out we knew we had to
change the venue.
SCHULTZ: People traveled from across Colorado to hear what they call a
true candidate for the people.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No, I think he`s honest. And we don`t have that.
ALISON PORTA, COLORADO RESIDENT: A president shouldn`t be a fancy
celebrity that rides escalators and flies on these magical vacations and
motorcycle trips to Iowa. But he`s the person is here to do a job and it`s
not about him as celebrate. It`s about what he can do for the people that
he wants to represent.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think he really had the talent for a concisely
explaining what everyone is thinking.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Bernie Sanders is the first politician in my life that
represents the people.
JANET SCHOONOPER, COLORADO RESIDENT: I`m not into politics at all. And
they`re intimidated me I guess in the past. I didn`t feel like had a place
with it. I understand what Bernie is talking about.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I really appreciate how he promotes accessibility for
the common citizen.
SCHULTZ: This is no celebrity tour. It is apparent. People showing up
are astute on the issues and stand with Bernie. They stand with him on
trade and fighting inequality.
CHRIS CALLANAN, COLORADO RESIDENT: He draws intersectionalities between
campaign financing and wealth inequality and just a state of democracy in
the United States.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And I like the idea that he wants to change the amount
of pay for workers.
LEVY MORROW, COLORADO RESIDENT: When people like us are working 60 hours a
week and can still barely afford to survive but people like the Waltons are
getting tax breaks of more money than I`ll ever see in my lifetime there is
STEVE GUTIERREZ, COLORADO RESIDENT: It`s actually having a candidate that
backs labor and backs unions and I think it`s our nation`s path to recovery
to rebuilding the middle class. And it`s absolutely exciting to see a
candidate step out and recognize it and support it and endorse it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m born and raised in Detroit. So I grew up the son
of a factory worker who worked hard to get workers rights and labor unions,
the UAW. So I`m always sensitive to what any agreement may do or what it
may mean for workers.
SCHULTZ: Colorado says they`re ready for Bernie Sanders to go all the way.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Speaks a different voice that we`re not used to
RICK HEINZMANN, COLORADO RESIDENT: This is the opportunity to broaden our
political spectrum and not an opportunity that should be missed or over
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: With the crowd that you guys see here and the crowds
he`s generating or drawing across the nations you can bet that Bernie is
being heard and we`ll hear his voice reflected in whoever the nominee is
for the Democratic Party.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCHULTZ: Can we say that no one expected this? People are actually
excited about Bernie Sanders? The guy who`s all over the cable shows and
has been for years? Just a regular guy from Vermont? The political
calendar tells us he`s drawing early record crowds.
Meanwhile it is not just the crowds. The media seems to be giving Sanders
the attention he deserves. There are positive head lines. Painting a
picture of an underdog climbing in the polls and connecting with voters.
The media is finally admitting Bernie is causing real headaches for the
Hillary Clinton campaign. Sanders is forcing Clinton to talk about issues
they didn`t anticipate. Like trade. Bernie Sanders has a well-defined
message on income inequality. He`s been saying the same thing since is
1980s and seems to be paying off now or should we say resonating.
A recent poll out of New Hampshire shows that Clinton is at 41 percent,
Sanders at 31 percent. 15 percent undecided. And in Iowa Sanders has some
work do. A recent Des Moines register poll has Clinton at 16 percent
compared to Clinton`s 57 percent. Although Sanders is up 5 percent since
A Wisconsin straw poll has Clinton in first place at 49 percent. And
Bernie is a close second at 41 percent. At this point there is no doubt
Hillary Clinton is clearly the frontrunner. But the momentum seems to be
with Bernie Sanders early on. What do you call these crowds? A movement?
Just general excitement about politics? I thought people were political
exhausted in this country. And with the primary still roughly 8 months
away can we say anything the possible?
Here is where it stands as I see it early on. Bernie Sanders is making
this a race for the nomination, something that really no one expected. You
can make the argument that Sanders is driving the conversation and the
issues. Citizens United, Wall Street reform and trade is where you are
going to find Bernie Sanders distinctively clear. I think early on that is
the attraction. The question is, can he keep it going?
Get your cellphones out. I want to know what you tonight. Tonight`s
question, "Is Bernie Sanders being underestimated?"
Go to polls.msnbc.com/ed to cash your vote. We`ll bring you the result
later on the show.
For more let me bring in Jonathan Alter MSNBC Political Analyst. Lanny
Davis with us tonight from the White House Special Counsel and Vice
President of Levick, and also with us Philip Rucker who`s a National
Political Correspondent for the Washington Post, gentlemen great to have
you with us tonight.
Jonathan, your reaction to what you heard in that piece. I mean, these are
folks on the ground and it`s just one day into summer in 2015. What`s
JONATHAN ALTER, MSNBC POLITICAL ANALYST: Bernie Sanders is for real. And,
you know, he`s getting these huge crowds everywhere. We haven`t seen them
since Barack Obama`s 2008 campaign, that kind of excitement. The
Democratic Party is a history of liking insurgents, liking underdogs. The
chances I think are good that he will win somewhere. They are not good
that he is going to win the nomination. But he is going to make this a
race and give Hillary Clinton some real competition for the next year. And
he will go to that convention with some delegates. And so this is going to
make the Democratic contest more interesting. I think it is going to be
good for Hillary Clinton ultimately. It will hold her a little more
They are actually not that far apart on most issues these days but she is
going to have to sharpen her arguments and she`s going to get some really
good spring training at the minimum before the general election campaign
SCHULTZ: Lanny Davis, is this unexpected competition for the Clinton camp?
LANNY DAVIS, VICE PRESIDENT OF LEVICK. No. In fact your whole premise
which you and I haven`t always disagreed so we`re going to respectfully
disagree as if Bernie Sanders is unexpectedly or driving Hillary Clinton as
if Hillary Clinton has been taking these issue before, during and after
Bernie Sanders. So, the fact is we`re talking about progressive Democrats
with a long history on exactly same issues. Not one voter named a single
issue there is any significant difference. But you haven`t done that kind
of a piece about a Hillary Clinton crowd with the enthusiasm that I see all
over the country. But I agree with Jonathan. This is good more Hillary.
This is good for the Democratic Party. I was insurgent most of life
Democratic Party primaries, and this is good for the Democrats.
SCHULTZ: Well, Lanny, let me just say this about that coverage. First of
all, Bernie Sanders is far more accessible to the media than Hillary
Clinton. Now, I don`t know whether that`s just a matter of style or
because she doesn`t feel like doing events where there are going to be
5,000 people. I don`t have that answer. I would love to interview Hillary
Clinton and I certainly will cover the campaign when they get 5,000 people
So that being the case -- and I do think that there is a difference. I
have not heard Hillary Clinton say that she wants to break up the banks on
Wall Street. I hear that from Bernie Sanders. So I respectfully disagree
with you in that regard. Mr. Rucker, what is going on here? Do we call
this a movement? These crowds clearly parallel that of what Barack Obama
PHILIP RUCKER NATIONAL POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT FOR THE WASHINGTON POST:
Well, it`s close. There`s a lot of energy out there. I`ve been at a
couple of Bernie Sanders rallies in the last week or so. And he`s very
authentic. He`s genuine. He gets up there and talks for about 45 minutes
really without any notes, there`s no script or TelePrompTer. He just kind
of says what`s on his mind and people seem to believe him. And I think
that message is very powerful with the base of the Democratic Party. That
the trouble for him is that it is a long campaign and we`ve not yet seen
We`ve not yet seen him face the kind of scrutiny that Clinton has phased
both in the press but also from his opponents. And I think that`s going to
be a real challenge for him in these debates and going forward as the media
start to take him more seriously and investigate his past as well.
SCHULTZ: And that was the first question I posed before, I went to you
three gentlemen tonight as can he keep it going? I mean, this is a
marathon. It is not a sprint and there is no doubt.
SCHULTZ: That 5,000 people in Denver doesn`t make a campaign, but it seems
to be pattern that`s unfolding here. Lanny, a lot of people think that
Clinton needs do this kind of campaigning. Is that coming? Or is it still
going to be these listening tours taking place in these smaller events.
DAVIS: Just say, you know, what, it feels like to be a Hillary Clinton
supporter. So when she does the big rallies, and she certainly had 5,000
people and your camera crew wasn`t at that rally, she`s criticized for
doing only big speeches. When she starts had in low key manner on the
listening tour the way she did in New York State when she ran for the
Senate, then you say she`s not doing big rallies. You will find enthusiasm
among women, men, young people, old for Hillary Clinton. If you send you
crews out and do those kind of interviews Ed. And she`s not driven by
anyone. This is her lifelong record.
Did you read on her speech on mass incarceration? Did you read her speech
on race and guns just two nights ago? So you`re not about to judge Hillary
Clinton for being a new progressive when all her life which I`ve know her
since law school, she`s been a fighting progress, on labor issues, on every
issue you can think of.
SCHULTZ: Well, then why doesn`t she stand to it.
DAVIS: I love Bernie Sander but I take exception to your slanted view of
SCHULTZ: There`s no slanted view here because the Ed Show camera crew was
at Hillary Clinton`s event.
DAVIS: Use that he...
SCHULTZ: He`s driving New York at Roosevelt Iowa. I want to drive -- I
want to set the record straight here. The Ed Show crew was at Hillary
Clinton`s big event on Roosevelt Island and we did cover that. There`s no
question about that. Now the point is, I don`t get.
DAVIS: You by driving.
SCHULTZ: And I`m not questioning whether Hillary is a true life long
progressive. That`s not it.
SCHULTZ: But I do question her position and I can`t get a straight answer
on Fast-Track when every single union in this country doesn`t want them to
DAVIS: Then you are not listening. She`s given a straight answer. She
has said she will not support it as long as theirs.
SCHULTZ: So long as. It is not about TAA Lanny. It is about the deal.
DAVIS: She will not support as long as there isn`t worker assistance as
long as there is ability for people like China to mess around with the
money rates and with exchange rate.
DAVIS: And she is opposed to it as of now. This is not the 1990s NAFTA.
This is a different.
SCHULTZ: This segment is not about whether Hillary is on trial about being
a progressive. This segment is about why is Bernie Sanders getting all of
these crowds so early on when he`s saying things that Hillary isn`t saying
DAVIS: As a matter of fact she is saying exactly the same thing
DAVIS: But Jonathan is right. We love insurgencies. I`ve been in them
more than I`ve been on the other side and this is a great contest for the
DAVIS: And she will benefit from Bernie Sanders.
SCHULTZ: I hope so.
ALTER: There is an authenticity to Bernie Sanders that people who are
tired of all the artifice of politics, all of the masks that everybody
wears in politics that they respond to. Because they can tell this is the
real Bernie Sanders. It`s unvarnished and there`s a longing in this
country for that kind of thing. I think that resonates. But people don`t
know that much about him. For instance, he`s to the right of Hillary
Clinton on guns. And when certain Democratic voters find out that Hillary
is more in favor of the common sense gun control than Bernie Sanders is,
they might take a second look at Hillary on that position. So we have a
long way to go, Ed, in parsing.
SCHULTZ: No doubt.
ALTER: All of these issues, where they stand on these issues. But
Hillary, unfortunately for here, even though her numbers are still very,
very strong, there is a little bit of distrust that is creeping into
somebody`s polling numbers and a little bit of a sense they`re not always
getting the direct answer. I think that is what you`re driving at.
SCHULTZ: Well, and they have.
ALTER: And Bernie Sanders is giving very crisp, direct, unambiguous
answers to straightforward questions. And she needs to be a little more
direct, play the angles a little less if she is going to, you know, really
resonate and really mobilize the Democratic party the way she needs to.
SCHULTZ: And finally Mr. Rucker, if you were to characterize the folks
that are going to see Bernie Sanders from your reporting, how would it
RUCKER: Well, they`re enthusiastic. They`re, you know, these are
progressive, liberal activists who have been hungry to hear a message like
this. Whether from Elizabeth Warren or Hillary Clinton or Joe Biden or
Bernie Sanders. Bernie Sanders happens to be the person right now who`s
articulating that message and who`s starting he`s rally saying, you know,
this is a revolution against the billionaire class. There is a segment of
the Democratic Party that really wants to hear that and is energized by
SCHULTZ: All right. Lanny Davis, I`m going show you a story on Hillary in
the coming days as soon as she has ones of these events and you`re going to
do come back on here and talk it over.
DAVIS: Thanks you so much.
SCHULTZ: All right, Lanny Davis, Jonathan Alter and Philip Ruckers, good
to have you gentlemen with us tonight. Thanks so much.
Remember to answer tonight`s question at polls.msnbc.com/ed. We`ll have
the results after the break. Follow us on Facebook. Watch my Facebook
feature "Give me a minute. And of course you can get my video Podcast at
Coming up, the calls to remove the confederate flag from South Carolina`s
state house grow louder and they have been heard. Reaction today.
And later, Fast-Track moves forward in Congress. A Rapid Response Panel
weighs in on the bill`s chances in the Senate. Stay with us. We`ll be
SCHULTZ: Numbers are coming in. Here where we stand on tonight`s Bing
Pulse Poll. Tonight`s question, "Is Bernie Sanders being underestimated?"
82 percent of you say "Yes". 18 percent of you say "No". Keep the voting
throughout the hour coming at polls.msnbc.com/ed.
We`ll be right back. Stay with us.
SCHULTZ: Welcome back to the Ed Show. Debate has reached a fever pitch in
South Carolina over the confederate flag and why it still flies on state
capitol grounds. New calls for removal come after nine people were killed
last week at the historic black church in South Carolina. Governor Nikki
Haley addressed the media a short time ago in this issue.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HALEY: We respect freedom of expression and for those who wish to show
their respect for the flag on their private property no one will stand in
But the state house is different and the events of this past week call upon
us to look at this in a different way.
15 years ago, after much contentious debate, South Carolina came together
in a bipartisan way to move the flag from atop the Capitol dome. Today, we
are here in a moment of unity in our state, without ill will, to say it`s
time to move the flag from the Capitol grounds.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCHULTZ: Immediately after Haley`s announcement, South Carolina Senator
Lindsey Graham issued a statement saying in part saying I`m urging that the
confederate battle flag be removed from State House grounds to an
appropriate location. This is a moral issue nearly all those Republican
presidential hopeful who typically run on morality are voicing their
Wisconsin Governor Scott Walker waited until Governor Haley called for the
flag to be removed this afternoon before he tweeted I`m glad Nikki Haley is
calling for the confederate flag to come down. I support her decision.
GOP frontrunner Jeb Bush tweeted a few days saying "In Florida we acted
moving the flag from state grounds to a museum where it belonged". Senator
Marco Rubio said "This is an issue that they should debate and work through
and not have a bunch of outsider going in and telling them what to do".
There is a long history use of the flag in the state. Charleston Mayor
Joseph Riley led a 110 mile march to Columbia to get the flag off the dome
of the state capitol. Here is what he had to say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RILEY: Put it in a museum without artifacts of history and that`s need to
be done. I think if this one guy, bad guy with consider (ph) about the
flag on his cap. And now was wanted his symbols that help reinforce his
racism, then he can see that symbol in front of the state capitol that
gives a message that we shouldn`t be giving.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCHULTZ: Joining me tonight Michael Eric Dyson MSNBC Political Analyst and
Professor of Georgetown University, also with us Matt Schlapp Republican
Strategies and former White House Political Director for George W. Bush,
gentlemen good to have you with us.
Professor, you first, what is this? Is this a reaction to nine people
being killed by a madman? Or is this a change of heart all of a sudden? I
mean, if those nine people were still alive today would we be hearing from
Governor Nikki Haley on this?
MICHAEL ERIC DYSON, MSNBC CONTRIBUTOR: To answer your latter question, no.
I don`t think we would at all. And so yes it has been I think encouraged
by, forced by, the issue has been introduced as a result of the death of
those nine souls, those martyrs down in Charleston South Carolina. But it
does highlight a bigger issue. The degree to which the folklore of racism
survives in flags like this. In the insignia of that state flag, that
confederate flag is a history of bigotry and violence and terror towards
The ownership of one race of another, the ability to dictate the terms by
which they existed. All of that is symbolized in that flag. I understand
that some say it`s part of heritage and pride but that heritage and pride
rests upon a strict denial of history in the bloody battles that were
engaged in this country over who should be free and who should not be free.
So, I think it was a greet move and a step in the right direction.
SCHULTZ: Matt Schlapp, states in the South have dealt with this. Why is
South Carolina for lack of better term been behind the curve of
conventional thinking here and modern day thinking?
MATT SCHLAPP, AMERICAN CONSERVATIVE UNION: Well, you know, Ed, at the end
of the day politics is about episodes. And what happened in South Carolina
really shifted the politics around this issue. And I think this is a great
moment where leaders, Democrat leaders, Republican leaders stood together
and said, you know, our can move forward.
Yeah, there`s a lot wrapped up in the confederate flag. In the professor`s
right, there`s a lot of evil and terrible past that`s wrapped up in it.
But the real question for South Carolina is about its future. And I think
they realized by the way they have an African American senator in Tim
Scott. He took a leadership role in this. And I think people listen this
is why diversity can be real strength for both parties. I think recently
Clarence Thomas, being the deciding vote in that confederate flag issue in
Texas was important moment. And think this is one of those moments that
the country has watched and changed over.
SCHULTZ: Well, I totally agree with you events change history. There`s no
question about that. But it`s the attitudes that need to change. And this
of course was addressed by the President, President Obama making headlines
for his comments about racism on his first ever Podcast. Here it is.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MARC MARON, COMEDIAN: Racism.
OBAMA: Racism. We are not cured of.
OABAM: And it`s not just a matter of it not being polite to say
(inaudible) in public. That is not the measure of whether racism still
exists or not.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCHULTZ: Michael Eric Dyson, why the President go down this road? Is it
DYSON: Quite necessary. We`re having the conversation. Had he not made
the statement and the way he made it I don`t think we would have been
talking about it as readily. It would have been an interesting Podcast.
But the fact that he said that word reinforces to us a couple of things.
First of all, it`s afoot in the culture and therefore we have to be honest
about it. Secondly, black people when they were murdered by white racists
who deployed that term against them were not called the "N" word. They
were actually called the word itself. And so the President is refusing to
allow us to escape into kind of historical amnesia and as therefore forcing
us to come to grips with the Haines character of the behavior associated
with the term. So, yes I think the term was provocative but also a
brilliant tactic to try to force us to come to grips with that term.
SCHULTZ: Matt, on the flag issue. There seems who had been a mood of
reluctantsy on the part of Republicans and Republican national candidates
to condemn the confederate flag. Is this a deep-rooted problem for
SCHLAPP: Look, I think you can look at it that way, Ed. But actually I
look at this moment when Republicans stood up and led. There`s always this
question about who governs a flag and when you have people outside of a
state telling the state what it should do with its flag, those voices are
less credible. Let`s face it the people that moved in this issue were
South Carolinians. People of all races and both parties decided to say hey
this is a moment when our state should change. That is when it is the most
credible. But I don`t think your characterization is right. I think Mitt
Romney was out there in front. Jeb Bush talked about his record in Florida
when he had the flag removed from the state capitol, when he was governor.
And I think this is an example where.
SCHULTZ: What about Huckabee, what about Rubio and Walker? I mean, there
are more Republican candidates out there that have struggle with this that
SCHLAPP: Sure, guess what. Yeah, but here`s the thing we have the big
crowd of candidates running for president and guess what, voters are going
to reward action. And they`re going to punish action. And this is an
example where some candidates step forward and some didn`t. Now let`s see
what the voters say. And I think the fact is the voters are going to be
appreciative of those that came forward and said this is a moment when we
DYSON: I think that Martin Luther King, Jr. And the civil rights leaders
of his era wanted to tell people said you`re interlopers you were
outsiders. Why you`re coming in middling in our own business. So while I
acknowledge what Matt is said is true. On the other hand without external
pressure, without the nation come dog grips with this heinous crime, this
act of terror. The people inside of South Carolina may not have responded
the way they did. So it`s a both end, it`s an inside outside game.
SCHLAPP: Professor why did -- but why -- look. Here take some credit for
some success here. Tim Scott, an African-American Republican is elected to
Senate and he comes forward and starts talking to Republicans and said look
this is a moment when we need to act we got to move this flag.
SCHLAPP: It was the right thing.
SCHULTZ: Not before the shooting. We have to be clear on that.
DYSON: Wait a minute that right. Not before the shooting and I`m saying
to you that the events of the past week have forced people to take a look
at this. So, I`m not denying your point but I`m broadening it up by saying
external pressure has to be applied and then those inside and begin to
SCHULTZ: OK. Gentlemen we go to leave it there. Michael.
SCHLAPP: It is a terrible thing that it takes.
SCHULTZ: Go ahead Matt. I`ll give you the last word. Go ahead.
SCHLAPP: It`s a terrible thing that it takes a tragedy to get people to
move but when it occurs let`s applaud it. Let just not...
SCHLAPP: ... for not having occurred (inaudible).
SCHULTZ: Michael Eric Dyson, Matt Schlapp, gentlemen thanks for being here
Still to come, Fast-Track moves one step closer to the president`s desk.
We`ll see if the Senate Democrats will back the new version of the bill.
And authorities in Upstate New York could be one step closer to the two
escaped prisoners they`ve been searching for 17 days.
That`s all coming up. Stay with us.
SCHULTZ: And we`re back on the Ed Show. The search for two escaped
prisoners is now centered around always Owls Head New York. Authorities
are searching the rugged and mountainous area just over 20 miles from the
Clinton Correctional Facility where Richard Matt and David Sweat escaped 14
days ago. New York State police saying their investigating this confirmed
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GUESS: We developed evidence that the suspects may have spent time in a
cabin in this area. We cannot get into the specifics of the evidence that
we`ve recovered while investigating this particular lead.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCHULTZ: Sources tell NBC News DNA from at least one of the men was found
at the cabin on Saturday. Over 300 miles away law enforcement officials in
Friendship, New York are ending their search for the men. Authorities in
Allegheny say that the area is clear after more than 300 officers searched
this town over the weekend. Police received a call on Saturday from a
witness who said that they spotted two men near railroad tracks.
Meanwhile another employee at the Clinton Correctional Facility is being
questioned by police. Corrections Officer Gene Palmer was placed on
administrative leave Friday as part of the investigation into the escape.
Palmer was said to have extensive contact with Matt and Sweat along with
Joyce Mitchell, a prisoner worker. Mitchell was arrested on June 12 and
has pled not guilty to charges of promoting contraband and criminal
facilitation for allegedly aiding the prisoners. Palmer`s attorney says he
had no prior knowledge of the escape plan and is cooperating with
authorities. Palmer has not been charged with any offense.
Stick around. More coming up on the Ed Show with the Response Panel next.
JANE WELLS, CNBC CORRESPONDENT: I`m Jane Wells with your CNBC Market Wrap.
Stocks start the week with the rally. The DOW climbs over 103 points, the
S&P adds over 12, the NASDAQ gains almost 37.
Home sales jump to a 5.5 year high last month rising 5.1 percent and prices
have nearly returned to the peaks in 2006. It only took nine years. First
time buyers accounted for 32 percent of sales, first time buyers. That is
the most since 2012. And listen about your health insurance. Cigna shares
rose more than 4 percent over the weekend. Cigna rejected another take
over offer from rival Anthem even though today Anthem call the offer
compelling. Stay tuned.
That`s it from CNBC, first in business worldwide.
SCHULTZ: Welcome back to the Ed Show. Fast-Track trade promotion
authority for the President is now headed to the Senate. Last week the
House passed TPA for the President without assistance for displaced
workers. The Senate had originally sent the House Fast-Track with the
assistance program. Now it could begin. In the Senate the only reason
some Senate Democrats supported the bill in the first place was because
assistance for displaced workers was guaranteed in the deal.
Last week Mitch McConnell said the Senate would be voting on assistance and
Fast-Track in two separate bills. The problem is House Republicans could
advance Fast-Track without assistance. Last month Fast-Track past the
Senate with 14 Democratic votes. If President Obama loses support from
only four Democrats, the deal is going to be off. So far Washington
senator Maria Cantwell is the only Democrat to flip. The senator supported
last month`s deal but recently said "I`m a no because I want to get a
certainty that we`re going to take care of workers who are laid off.
Once again the President`s trade agenda lies in the hands of only a few
Democrats who he has been lobbying hard.
For more, let me bring in Jonathan Alter again MSNBC Political Analyst and
Congressman Dan Kildee of Michigan.
Congressman, it`s a waiting game now for you folks over in the House. How
do you think it`s going to play in the Senate?
REP. DAN KILDEE, (D) MICHIGAN: It`s hard to say. I mean so much of the
focus has been on process rather than substance. What I worry about is
that we`ll lose track or the fact that are some real deficiencies in this
TPA. The failure to deal with currency. The fact that the Malaysia
language looks like it`s going to allow for a lesser standard when it comes
to human trafficking. And I have real questions about Vietnam and whether
this should be some pretty conditions to Vietnam`s entry. The substance
really does matter and we`re really focuses now on whether or not the
Senate will take a clean TPA bill. And if they do, then TPA -- if it`s the
same legislation that passed the House it will go to the president`s desk
without TAA and of course that is going to be a big problem.
SCHULTZ: So the President is willing to accept Boehner in the House and
McConnell in the Senate saying I`m going to trust you. You`re going to get
me this authority to do trade deals and you`re going to come back later on
and do adjustment assistance for workers. Do you believe that is going to
unfold like that?
KILDEE: Well, it is hard to say. And we -- I can speak for myself voted
against TAA because they were connected and we wanted to stop TPA. We
wanted to get it right.
KILDEE: So the real question is whether the Senate will take up some of
the decencies the in this TPA.
SCHULTZ: Is it true that there are some Republicans in the House that will
never go along with TAA Trade Adjustment Assistance for workers?
KILDEE: For sure and in fact the TAA was attached to trade promotion
authority to get our votes, to force Democrats to vote.
KILDEE: For this trade promotion authority. Even though we don`t like the
SCHULTZ: Some called it a bribe.
KILDEE: You could call it a lot of things. It was not something I was
willing to go along with.
SCHULTZ: Jonathan Alter, where does Mitch McConnell play in all of this?
This might be a tough road for him to get the Republican senators to go
along with TAA. What do you think?
ALTER: Well, I think he`ll be able to do it and the combination of
Republican senators that he can corral and the Democrats of course strongly
support Trade Adjustment Assistance should get it over the hump. So, I
think they can kind of put Humpty Dumpty back together again. After it
looked like it was coming apart. Probably will be a bill. Possibly as
soon two bills as soon as the end of this week. So that you would have
Fast-Track authority as well as Trade Adjustment Assistance for workers and
then next year the treaty itself the trade deal itself would come before
But the big thing for me and I think the Congressman and I agree strongly
on this, is that the administration and the Congress has to do something
else entirely for working Americans. A huge infrastructure bill. Rebuild
this country with commitments for half a trillion, a trillion dollars in
spending to repair our bridges, our roads, our sewer systems.
SCHULTZ: So do you think that usually Pelosi would bring the Democrats
along -- do you think that Pelosi would bring the Democrats along and he`d
maybe even Harry Reid would go along with something like that in the Senate
if big infrastructure goes connected to it.
ALTER: Well, it`s not going to get -- it should have been linked.
ALTER: All along. And I think the President made a mistake in not linking
a huge infrastructure bill.
SCHULTZ: Well, I don`t think he anticipated this much push back.
ALTER: But it can still be done after this. It`s a question of holding
Barack Obama`s feet to the fire so that after this trade deal basically
goes through he spends a lot of the rest of 2015, you know, with people
like Paul Ryan who runs the tax writing committee in the House. With John
Boehner, with Mitch McConnell and see if they can do what the Republican
Party a hundred years ago originally stood for which is infrastructure.
SCHULTZ: No doubt.
ALTER: We need this.
SCHULTZ: But that`s a huge carat (ph) that has him played yet. You`re
saying it should have been played that way. I get that. So is that -- let
say the TAA, adjustment assistance for workers and trade (inaudible)
authority get through the Senate on separate bills and it comes back to
your side over in the House. What happens? That is really the question at
KILDEE: Well, unless we correct the deficiencies and trade promotional
authority. I think you`re going to find a lot of Democrats still unwilling
to accept it. But it`s been demonstrated even this week TPA has the votes
in the House. I mean there enough Democrats...
KILDEE: ... that have gone alone with it. But I think Jonathan hit
something very important. If the TPA -- if TPP is really as much about
pivoting to Asia and trying to offset China`s emergence.
KILDEE: We ought to be dealing with why China really is emerging. And
it`s the fact they`re spending 10 times of what we are on infrastructure as
percentage of our GDP. They`re funding the Asia infracture investment bank
which is bringing in lots of countries. We need to fight fire with fire
and not just operate on the assumption that if we do a trade deal with them
we can somehow offset China`s emergence. We need to rebuild our country.
That will off set China`s emergence in Asia.
SCHULTZ: All right, gentlemen great to have you with us tonight, Jonathan
Alter and Congressman Dan Kildee of Michigan.
Still ahead, we`re awaiting for decision day for big Supreme Court cases.
We`ll look ahead at what at stake in healthcare and also civil rights.
Stay with us. We`ll be right back.
SCHULTZ: Here in Tonight`s results of the Bing Pulse Poll. Question, "Is
Bernie Sanders being underestimated?"
76 percent of you say "Yes", 24 percent of you say "No". Keep voting until
the end of the hour at polls.msnbc.com/ed. And thanks for doing it. And
we`re be right back at you.
SCHULTZ: Tonight`s Two-Minute Drill. Putt, putt and drama. Jordan Spieth
is halfway to winning golf`s grand slam with Sunday`s win at the U.S. Open
golf tournament, chambers bay in Washington. Spieth shot a five under
around through four rounds, but came down to the wire, folks. Spieth
double-bogeyed on number 17, thinking about the title but a birdie on 18
give him a one shot lead. And here comes Dustin Johnson almost spoiled
On the par five 18, Johnson was on the green in two shots. Johnson missed
a 12-footer for eagle for the win, then he missed a four-foot putt that
would have send him to 18 hole play of round was Spieth. Johnson hit his
third putt for the par on the 18th leaving him in a tie for second place.
Jordan Spieth is just the sixth golfer to win the masters in the U.S. Open
in the same year joining the likes of Jack Nicklaus and Arnold Palmer at
21-years-old. He`s the youngest golfer to win two majors since Gene
Sarazen in 1922. That`s a long time ago. This guy is special.
Stay tuned. Lots more coming up on the Ed Show. We`ll be right back.
SCHULTZ: And we are back on the Ed Show. Finally the next decision date
for the Supreme Court will be Thursday. Anticipation is mulling (ph) for
the rulings on two huge issues, gay marriage and of course health care.
The high court is deciding whether state bans on gay marriage violate the
14th amendment. On the health care front, if the Supreme Court strikes
down Obamacare, it would cut health care funding for up to 6.4 million
people and up to 37 states across the country. Some economists say
billions of dollars will be lost going to hospitals, drugstores, and drug
makers. Still, some Republicans don`t seem to care.
2016 GOP presidential hopeful Rick Perry`s home state of Texas has an
extremely high uninsured rate. During Perry`s time he`s governor more than
one in five Texans didn`t have health care coverage. He was grilled on Fox
News Sunday about it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHRIS WALLACE, FOX NEWS SUNDAY: You refused to set up a state exchange
under Obamacare, you refused to expand Medicaid. I mean, is that looking
out for the little guy, when 21 percent of Texans didn`t have health
FRM. REP RICK PERRY, (R) TEXAS: Well, If how you keep score is how many
people you force to buy insurance, well, then I would say that that`s how
you keep score. That`s now how we.
WALLACE: But, how about the flip side, how many people don`t have health
PERRY: Let me explain what we do in Texas and this is a state by state
decision. We make access to health care the real issue.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SCHULTZ: Let me bring in Mike Papantonio Ring of Fire Radio host with us
tonight, also Dan Holler Communications Director for the Heritage Action
for Americans, gentlemen good to have you with us.
Dan, I want to ask you. Doesn`t this seem to be the perfect opportunity
for all of the Republican candidates, the individually, to step forward and
talk about health care, about okay, this is where we need to go? I just
don`t seem to be hearing that, Dan.
DAN HOLLER, HERITAGE ACTION FOR AMERICA: Yeah, it`s a great opportunity
and hopefully the Supreme Court will do the right thing later this week.
And what the Republican candidate should be talking about, is how do we
drive down the cost of care? One of things that you saw with Obamacare is
that had rules and mandates and regulations that all piled up dramatically
increased the cost of care for tens of millions of people. That`s not
addressed with the Supreme Court ruling but that`s what we need to look
forward on as Republican candidates get into the race.
SCHULTZ: OK. But I don`t hear any Republican candidates saying I have a
better system and this is what we should do and it would seem to me this is
the perfect opportunity no matter what the Supreme Court decides to do.
Mike, what`s the call on the Supreme Court here? Is it going to come down
to justice John Roberts again on Obamacare?
MIKE PAPANTONIO, HOST "RING OF FIRE RADIO": They`re going to do whatever
corporate America tells them to do Ed. They`re simply extension of the
U.S. Chamber of Commerce at this point. It used to be we could analyze
what a Supreme Court was going to do, we could look at stereo the sizes
(ph). We could look at President. We can say "This is what they should
do". Now it`s very, very easy. We decide what is going to put more money
in corporate America`s pocket and this majority is going to rule that way.
They`re going to -- they`re willing to eliminate tax subsides as you
pointed out. They`re helping millions of Americans afford insurance plans
but corporate America, the U.S. Chamber of Commerce wants that to happen,
so that`s what going to happen.
SCHULTZ: So does it mean that the laws going to get not touched in? I
mean, insurance companies are making double digit profits again which is
good. I`m a profit guy. I want to see more people covered. But will
money drive this?
HOLLER: Well, this should be driven by the law but I do find it funny that
you and everybody else seem to say this is good for the businesses here.
These businesses lobbied on behalf of Obamacare, they lobbied to pass it
because they knew it was good for their bottom line. They didn`t care that
it was going to raise rates for everybody and people have to take
SCHULTZ: Well, it hasn`t raised rates for everybody. It simply has. It`s
not -- at some rates have gone up. Most of the rates have not. I mean, if
you want to look at the past 10 years before Obama got in, we were looking
at double digit increases. We`re not seeing that anymore. So Mike.
PAPANTONIO: If I can address.
SCHULTZ: Go ahead, Mike.
PAPANTONIO: The heritage foundation in front of this because the Koch
brothers, I mean let`s take it down and follow the money here. The Koch
brothers put $4.8 million in heritage foundation to be the voice against
this. Now, he says corporate America is for this. There is a big swath of
corporate America and it is not for this, the U.S. Chamber of Commerce, you
know, this court will do what they are told to do but this majority will do
what they`re told to do by the people who put in there.
HOLLER: They didn`t uphold it or break down last time.
PAPANTONIO: They are politicians with black robes. That`s what the
heritage foundation is counting on and that`s what this court more than
likely will do to some degree. They`re going to make it tough, mostly for
GOP Republican states, that`s the irony here.
SCHULTZ: All right, Dan, your response to that.
HOLLER: I mean, it`s sort of funny to say the court is beholding to folks.
I mean, they had a prime opportunity in 2012 to strike down the law before
it occurred (ph) and they were refused to do it. And I think anybody who
knows what the court is going to do is fooling themselves but there is an
opportunity to finally get this policy right if the court does the right
thing this time.
SCHULTZ: Well, what is the right thing? I mean, if the law -- I mean,
where is it breaking the law? I mean, is it unconstitutional to have any
kind of subsides in our society? I mean, is that where it is, Mike? I
mean, they have to answer that question?
PAPANTONIO: Look, they have to do metaphysical gymnastics. I don`t know
how they get there. They get there for pure political reasons. If you
look at this logically, legally, stare decisis precedent, they don`t get
SCHULTZ: All right, gentlemen.
PAPANTONIO: That they`ll find a way to get there.
SCHULTZ: We`re out of time. We`ll talk again about it when the decision
is made. Mike Papantonio, Dan Holler. Good to have you with us tonight on
the Ed Show.
PAPANTONIO: Thank you.
SCHULTZ: And that`s the Ed Show. I`m Ed Schultz.
PoliticsNation with Reverend Al Sharpton starts right now.
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