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The Ed Show for Monday, July 6th, 2015

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Date: July 6, 2015
Guest: Jim Keady, Bob Shrum, Jess McIntosh, David Cay Johnston, Lizz
Winstead, Christine Bullen, Catie Lazarus

ARI MELBER, MSNBC HOST: Good evening Americans welcome to the Ed Show live
from New York.

I`m Ari Melber in for Ed Schultz. And as Ed would say "`Let`s get to


MELBER: Tonight, getting it straight.

GOV. CHRIS CHRISTIE, (R) NEW JERSEY: So what keeps shown on the TV all the
time is, you know, sit down and shut up.

CHRISTIE: Sit down and shut up. People want to cure straight (ph). Sit
down and shut up is exactly what you needed to here.

MELBER: Later, Greece vote no.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We had a real Greek crisis on our hands.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Global markets reaction to this news.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Greeks banks went close today. The ATMs are running
out of money.

MELBER: And leading ladies.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I just comment how we ignited the issue of sexes in

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The comment about beauty and humor.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Raise your hands please if you think that any humor is
not hot enough to be on television. One.


MELBER: New Jersey Governor and presidential candidate Chris Christie
widely known for his tough talks some called it strong and decisive, other
see it as brash and overbearing. There is plenty of confrontation of
course to choose from.


CHRISTIE: And, you know, what, let me tell you this. You know, what, it`s
people who raise their voices and yell and scream like you who are dividing
this country.

If what you want to do is put on a show and giggle every time I talk, well
then I have no interest in answering your question.

Let me tell you something, I can go back and forth with you as much as you
want. And let me tell you something, if after you graduate from law school
you conduct yourself like that in a courtroom, your rear end`s going to be
thrown in jail, idiot.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Christie kills jobs.

CHRISTIE: Really? You know, some may go down to tonight but ain`t going
to jobs sweetheart.


MELBER: There it is that kind of attitude may become a campaign issue and
Christie tackles it today in an interview on MSNBC.


CHRISTIE: People want to cure it straight. They don`t want to hear it,
you know, in this kind of sugar coated focus group tested way. And that
way I`m going to be. And I think it will translate.

Plus, you know, what get shown on TV all the time is, you know, sit down
and shut up. Well, you know, that was, you know, one minute and one pay.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You regret on saying that?



CHRISTIE: No, it`s a Democratic candidate for office who`s standing up and
disrupting the three year anniversary, you know, the anniversary a
Hurricane Sandy, the three year anniversary of Hurricane Sandy. And I said
to him "Can I meet with you later?" You know, they don`t show the lead up
to it, right? I said "Can I meet with you later? Happy to discuss this
with you later. Would you please let us move on with the event?" And he
just kept going. Well, you know, once go through all of those options then
sit down and shut up is exactly what he needed to here.

And I will tell you that most people around the country who I see. I get
that mention to be more anything else on the positive way. So, you know, I
understand that get some of the folks in the media all up and huckles (ph)
them. You know, I`ll be OK.


MELBER: Now Christie was citing his exchange with Jim Keady the candidate
for the New Jersey assembly back in 2014.


CHRISTIE: You all know me. So if we`re going to get into debate here
today, it`s going to get very interesting and very fun, so yeah. I
understand. So, I`ll be more than happy to have a debate with you anytime
you like, guy, because somebody like you doesn`t know a damn thing about
what you`re talking about except to stand up and show off when the cameras
are here. I`ve been here when the cameras aren`t here, buddy, and done the
work. I`ve been here when the cameras weren`t here and did the work.

So listen you want to conversation later. I`m happy to have it buddy. But
until that time sit down and shut up.


MELBER: As Christie was saying his kind of confrontation due get a lot of
attention but even when there`s a dispute people usually hear more of the
candidate side of the story. Christie quick to rehash his battle and put
them in context and he`s off in the one with the microphone to begin with
and the one getting interviewed afterward. So story is often tilt more
toward his narrative.

Tonight for you we have something a little different of prospective from
the other side of the microphone. Jim Keady himself is here Founder of
Educating for Justice and also as we mentioned he`s running for state
assembly in New Jersey.

Thanks for joining us.

JIM KEADY, EDUCATING FOR JUSTICE: My pleasure to be here.

MELBER: Let me get your response. You heard Governor Christie there at
this morning on MSNBC describing what he says was wrong with your approach.
Your response.

KEADY: Yeah, so one of things the governor said was that people want to
hear it straight. And since Governor Christie is incapable of doing that.
I`d like to do for him with regards to this situation.

First he said I was Democratic candidate for state of assembly. At the
time that I engage with the Governor back on October of 2014. I was not.
I was just an everyday citizen. I was working with the group called the
New Jersey Organizing Project and we were trying to get accountability on
the phase Sandy recovery. And the last time I held office was in 2008. I
was city councilman at Asbury Park and I was an independent.

You know, the governor said he claims that he said on that day on October,
you know, can I meet with you later, can we please move on with the even
and none of these things happened. I stood silently with the poster that
said "Stay in New Jersey and finish the job". I did not say a word until
the governor engaged me and the first -- so on that point though he says
here today that he offered to met with you. You`re saying that did not

Well, he said -- the first thing he said was I got the picture, I read it.
And then he starts to get into it and I was challenging him asking, you
know, where is the $800 million to help rebuild these families home that`s
currently accounted for. And I asked about the phase of Sandy recovery.
He said I`ll be more than happy to debate with you. I said, "Let`s do it
right now. Where, can you tell me?" Then he goes on to say, "You should
roll up your sleeves and do the work" and that`s when I took my case to the
mayor of Belmar who is standing next to him and I said, "Matt, you tell
him. Tell him what I did the month after the storm. Tell him how I
dropped everything and I spent almost a month from sun up to sun down
helping my neighbors, the people in the town that I grew up in get cleaned
up and cleared out going into basements and crawl spaces.


KEADY: Covered in Sandy swap trying to help people get stabilized," and I
took the governor in his word when he said that the next due to drop was
going to be getting those Sandy families back home and he has been an
object failure with regard to that.

MELBER: And you hear him there say that he doesn`t regret this interaction
although he`s gotten some heat for it. Did that surprise you?

KEADY: No, Governor Christie, I have never seen other than possibly George
W. Bush, I have never seen a public official whose rhetoric is more
detached from reality. You know, the governor may believe that he said,
"Hey, you know, can we talk about this later. You know, can we just move
on with the event." But all he have to do is watch the video and see that
that did not happen, you know.

And the reason that the governor doesn`t want to have this debate, the
reason I invited him that night and that afternoon, he said in all debate
any time, any place, he said, "Come to my family`s restaurant. You can
meet some of my customers who aren`t back home yet from Sandy. I`ll buy
you the burger and the beer and let`s talk about it." And then he says,
"You know I got a thousand things to do today and that wouldn`t be a
thousand and one. But which is it? Will you debate me any place any time
in this issue or won`t you?"

And the reason that he doesn`t want to debate is because this Sandy
recovery is an absolute mess. We still have 9,000 families that are not
back home. There`s more than a half a billion dollars that is not gone out
the door where two and a half years out in the six months after I engaged
the governor back in October, more money went out the door to help those
families in six months.

MELBER: Right.

KEADY: ... that had gone out in previous two years.

MELBER: Well, I trust it`s an open invitation so you let us know if he
does take you up on it. Jim Keady, thank you very much for jointing us.

KEADY: Absolutely.

MELBER: For that other side of the story, we also want to turn to a big
dilemma for Republicans in 2016, another part of the campaign right now,
how to address the Supreme Court`s ruling for national same-sex marriage?
Any serious candidate for the presidency must be serious about the rule of
law which means honoring Supreme Court decisions. But most Republican
candidates staunchly opposed to same-sex marriage as a choice even if it is
now officially a constitutional right.

Well, just over the past weekend, a clear split is emerging here between
candidates who can live with the new reality and those who can`t. Mike
Huckabee is in the ladder category.


MIKE HUCKABEE, PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: One of the mistakes we`ve even
heard over the course of the same-sex marriage debate is that marriage is
all about just love and feeling is sentimentality and regardless,
heterosexual marriage is largely in trouble today because people see it as
a selfish means of pleasing self rather than a committed relationship in
which the focus is upon meeting the needs of the partner.

And that sense of selfishness and the redefinition of love as to something
that is purely sentimental and emotional have been destructive. And I
think it will prove to be destructive in every definition of marriage be it
heterosexual or homosexual.


MELBER: Also in that same camp, Senator Ted Cruz who said I`ll meet the
press and marriages strictly a states rights issue.


TED CRUZ, TEXAS SENATOR: From the beginning of our country, literally,
from the first days of our country, marriage has always been a question for
the states. You know, on the question of gay marriage, on the policy
issue, reasonable minds can disagree. I am a strong supporting of
traditional marriage, of the union of one man and one woman. You and I may
disagree on that. But under the Constitution, there was a mechanism for us
to resolve our disagreements, which is if you want to change the marriage
law of your state. The Constitutional mechanism is to convince your fellow
citizens to change the marriage laws.


MELBER: The problem for Cruz, well, that same logic obviously could apply
to bans on interracial marriage. They were defined by the state and the
court struck those down 48 years ago. Some Republicans though we want to
note are on the other side of this split saying the split saying that even
if they personally do oppose gay marriage, they can live with it. Marco
Rubio, Jeb Bush, and John Kasich have said they`d be open to attending a
gay wedding. And this weekend, one of them actually followed through. It
was Ohio Governor John Kasich who went to a gay wedding this week and he`s
now the first major candidate to do so since the Supreme Court ruling. It
was for a friend of his in Columbus and Ohio is one of the states which ban
gay marriage.

So putting state`s rights aside, Kasich attendance was more than an
acknowledgment of the Supreme Court`s final word on this issue. It was I
think a consolatory note from a politician who`s long oppose same-sex

All right, get your cellphones out we always we want to know what you
think. Tonight`s question, "Will the same-sex marriage ruling have a big
impact on the 2016 race?" You can go to to cast your
vote. We`re going to bring you the results later in the show.

And for more now we go right to Bob Shrum, a Democratic strategist and
Warschaw professor of politics the USC and Jess McIntosh from EMILY`s List,
hello to both of you, Jess what do you think of this split...

JESS MCINTOSH, EMILY`S LIST: Great to be here.
MELBER: ... and who has the, the better side of it.

MCINTOSH: I mean, I think it`s obvious who has the better side of it, but
when you can trust it with what`s happening on Democratic side of the
equation, the split is just that much bigger, I feel like a lot of -- of
republican messaging in this cycle is going to be how firmly do we stand
against this particular progress. I mean, even in the immigration debate
do you want to build an electrify offense or you just want to deny
citizenship. There is a direction that our country is moving in on
marriage equality, on social justice in a lot of racial politics and gender
politics, and a politics in sexuality, and Republicans are just firmly
stuck on the wrong side of that movement.

So we see the split there not between people who are for it and people who
are against it or people who are really, really against it, and people who
are only kind of little bit against of would probably won`t do anything
about it and I just don`t see that being a winning argument for either side
of that debate.

MELBER: Well, it may not be a very winning argument for people who are
voting on that issue first and foremost Bob, but some of this stuff
politics comes full circle. I mean, you were working for John Kerry who
narrowly lost Ohio when Karl Rove put that very been (ph) on same-sex
marriage on, on a state wide referendum. And here we are this many years
later and it takes the Supreme Court to undo it but you have Republican
governor there, I think striking the best know he can given his long record
if he wants to say something at all.

BOB SHRUM, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Look, I think what Kasich did testifies
to a really powerful truth. This issue was settled, the country is not
prepared to move back on it, that doesn`t mean you won`t have Cruz and
Huckabee and Santorum, and that whole crowd out there trying to reverse. I
mean, Jess is right they have the bad side of the argument they may have
the right side of a lot of Republican primary voters especially in states
like Iowa and in some of those deep southern states that will be the first
super Tuesday.

So what your going to see is Cruz out there, Huckabee out there pushing
very hard, Cruz will do anything say anything I think to become the last
right-wing guy standing, one of the two finalist for the nomination and
whether he gets it or not, in the process his going to do a lot of damage
to the Republican brand because his going to push this whole thing to the

It`s going to be very tough to compete from millennial votes with this kind
of position. I mean, Jess is absolutely right, it`s the same thing they`re
doing on immigration, and you have the same folks pushing the same kind of
hard line and you`re going to end up. You know, Romney got 27 percent of
Latino`s, you can`t win with that. I think the Republicans are headed the
way they`re talking in a way Donald Trump by the way has dominated the
dialogue the last two weeks, they`re heading for like 15 or 20 percent of
the Latino vote.

MELBER: And Jess, you look at Ted Cruz, you watch that meet press
interview, he seems to think that he, is in this that he can be a top tier
candidate that made be confidence or maybe a correct reading of where the

MCINTOSH: Yeah, I mean think that Bob`s right there are going to be two
spots of the end and Ted is buying for the one that will be the most
radical right-wing. In sort of what is he do to the party in order to make
sure that he`s the one that comes out in that. But just like last cycle
when we have Mitt Romney and his establishment favorite and then sort of
out of nowhere, there was Rick Santorum right behind him with all of the
Christian right even Evangelical support, there will be room for somebody
like that this year again. And I think Ted Cruz very much want it to be

I just think its absolute poison for a general election...


MCINTOSH: ... in a presidential year more voters pay attention than people
who are normal political junk using (ph), get all excited about midterms.
When those people tune in to see what messages both parties have to offer,
and one of them is saying tone it down with the love, I just don`t see that
as a resonant, let`s get to the polls and vote against love.

MELBER: And Bob, flipping that over to Democratic side. Does it
ultimately help Hillary Clinton whose running a sort of a quasi-incumbent
campaign that this issues are coming up in a way that is ultimately going
as a forward march for progressives. This isn`t a moment right now where
everyone`s talking about occupying Wall Street or some of the finance
issues that separate her and Bernie Sanders right, this is -- a lot of
these issues are ones where she can legitimately claim there is in a big
deviance between her and her would be liberal challenge.

SHRUM: Yeah, I think that`s true and I think she`s clearly on the right
side of the social issues, the right side of immigration, the right side of
women`s rights. I think it`s very powerful, very appealing I think all of
that`s on about in 2016 and that`s why that your going to have a vigorous
contest more vigorous than some people expected between Bernie Sanders and
Hillary Clinton, but at the end of the day Democrats are going to be a
united because there`s too much on the line in 2016 including the Supreme
Court, including questions like immigration, including questions like
respect for gay people and respect for the rights of women.

So I think that, yeah, that Hillary Clinton`s going to go out the next
several weeks and she`s going to give several major speeches on this
economic issues, she may surprise us with some of what she says, but in the
end I think the Democratic Party will be united.

MELBER: All right Bob Shrum and Jess McIntosh, thank you...

SHRUM: Thanks.

MELBER: ... for your time tonight, and if your watching at home tonight,
never remember to answer tonight`s question at, we`re
going to have the results for you as always after the break.

Coming up, another big international story, Greek voters rejecting
austerities sending leaders back to the drawing board. We`re going to look
at the Greek financial crisis and what it means to the global economy and a
former Disney head says women can`t have it all you`re going to want to
hear this, that`s later in the hours as well.

Stay tuned.


MELBER: Here is where we stand on tonight`s Bing Polls Poll. Tonight`s
question, "Will the same-sex marriage ruling have a big major impact on the
2016 race?" You can see there 67 percent saying "Yes" that is tricking
around, still 33 percent of you say "No" it`s not over, you can keep voting
throughout the hour at

And we, we`ll be right back.


MELBER: Greece is edging closer to national bankruptcy which is what is
made last night`s joyous street celebrations an odd side for many observers
watching around the world. Greek voters overwhelmingly rejecting terms for
a potential bailout with the prime minister pledging a no vote might
increase his leverage to get them a better deal.

Today the governments departing finance minister cast to no voted as a
victory of a small underdog over international bankers saying, "The no vote
will live in history as a unique moment when a small European nation rose
up against debt-bondage, and he called for a new deal with debt
restructure, and less austerity, redistribution in favor of the needy, and
real reforms."

Now, there may be an alternative deal that does save Greece, but the
country`s financial system could also fall apart literally before any
agreement is reached. Greece has defaulted on its national debts to
foreign creditors. Its banking system is basically temporarily crumbling
right now. Because of the meltdown, people have been trying to withdraw
their money from the banks. You could see everybody in line.

But with everyone withdrawing and no one really depositing, there just
isn`t enough cash. Emergency rules now cap withdraws with just $60. An
analyst at the German bank, Deutsche Bank, are forecasting empty ATMs by
the end of this week.

Now, this cash shortage has to be cleared many years in the making. The
nation grappling with 25 percent unemployment there in Greece, and Greeks
who do have cash has spent the past few years pulling it from their
domestic banks, fearing the dooms day scenario were banks can`t honor the
cash they received which is, of course, the core purpose of any consumer

Now, that`s the impact on the ground. Up at the policy level, the question
here is whether Greece can reach a deal to turn the tide and whether it
ultimately break with Europe`s common currency and drop the Euro entirely.

Joining us now with the latest in Greece is CNBC Reporter Sara Eisen. What
do you think is going to happen here?

SARA EISEN, CNBC REPORTER: Well, Ari, it looks like Greece has a very
narrow window, and what appears to be one final shot at bringing a
proposal, a plan to other European leaders in order to secure a bailout

What happened today, the leaders of the two most powerful countries in
Europe got together, that would be German Chancellor Angela Merkel and
French President Francois Hollande. They talked about the results of the
referendum, the defiant no vote by the Greeks.

Importantly, Merkel emerged and said the door is still open, but it wasn`t
exactly welcoming Greece back to the negotiating table with open arms.
Obviously, attitudes have changed. A lot of European leaders saw this vote
in Greece over the weekend as a rejection of the Greek to Europe and to the

Meantime, you mentioned the pressure in the banking system. Certainly,
that was turned up a notch when the European Central Bank actually
tightened the screws on the Greek banking system, which is already on the
brink of collapse. There were lines again at the ATM machines which are
only allowed to disperse 60 Euros per day. And Greece -- Greek are
obviously still concerned about the safety and the value of their deposits
at their banks in Euros.

Greece did appoint a new finance minister today. That was a development.
And the hope there, obviously, is that it can be a more pragmatic finance
minister when it comes to going to the negotiating table and passing some
kind of reforms for Greece in exchange for the bailout money. But there is
still a lot so skepticism and time is running out.

The odds of a Grexit or Greece actually exiting the Euro has gone up. So
how did Wall Street react to the latest bout of Greek drama? Well,
actually better than you might think. The DOW only closed down 40 points.

MELBER: Right.

EISEN: . and the S&P 500, lost less than 0.5 percent. Some resilience
there in the face of what many have warned for a long time could be
Europe`s Lehman moment if Greece does increasingly have to leave.

The important meeting will be tomorrow night in Brussels. That is the
shot, and I hate to say it, another make or break meeting for the European.

MELBER: Right.

EISEN: In keeping Greece in the Euro.

MELBER: And a lot of Americans here (ph), they`re not actually holding the
bag on all of these, so there may be some resilience in the market. Sara
Eisen, thank you for your reporting.

EISEN: Thank you.

MELBER: I want to go right to David Cay Johnston, Professor Syracuse
University, Pulitzer Prize winning writer. Walk us through this for people
who haven`t been following for a long time, but look up and see, I think,
the dooms day that would scare anyone no matter where you live, which is
you put your money into a bank, then you go to get it and it`s not there.

Ari, this is going to be a terrible crisis till they get through it.
There`s no question about that. It`s going to have virtually no affect in
the United States. Our trade with Greece is 1/3 of 1 percent of our trade
with Europe. We do more trade everyday with Canada than we do with Greece
a year.

MELBER: Right. So David, so that`s a nice way to start, so we`re not
scaring people at home if there`s.


MELBER: . if you`re sitting in the U.S..


MELBER: There isn`t contingent. But at the level of a just Economics 101
course, how does it happen? As someone who`s such an expert in this, how
does it happen that one day the bank is fluid, giving you your money back
and forth, and the next day, you have a $60 cap?

JOHNSTON: Well, all the liquidity has been taken out of that economy. The
Greeks cannot ever repay the debts they have. They have been given loans
that were imprudent by the bankers, and the bankers are trying not to
accept the fact that they made bad loans that will not be repaid.

Now, the Greeks dealt with this 2500 years ago when Solon, the great
lawgiver came in and wiped out all debts. The Icelanders did that seven
years ago, they just wiped out all debts. And at the core of this problem
for the Greeks, and the reason they can`t pay these debts is that tax
evasion in Greece is about 6 percent of their economy.

Now, in the U.S. Ari, the U.S. Federal Income Tax about 8 percent of our
economy evasion in Greece is 6 percent of their economy. They have a
terrible problem with ineffective tax system that is crucial to their
inability to pay their bills unlike do they borrowing all this money rather
than taxing themselves. The bankers who made those loans are going to loss
a lot of money. They will get through this. They may want to live and if
they do and (inaudible) drop where they can adjust prices so that they can
be in control of their currency. They can`t do that as long as their part
of the European Union and the Euro.

MELBER: And it`s always to a history the bankers that hold the line on
this because you can find people anywhere in big or small organizations
they want money that they`ll pay back later call a loan and sometimes they
sometimes they don`t pay it back, right. What is going on in the -- what
do we learn about the at least European financial system if it did extend
so many loans that are no good or not realistic?

JOHNSTON: Right. Well, the Germans are the most important force in Europe
and the Germans benefit from their export economy and having a cheap Euro
and we have a very high dollar benefits the export of manufacturing economy
of the Germans, that doesn`t help in anyway the people who live in Greece
or Spain or Italy.

And so the Germans have been willing to in effect subsidize with loans
these countries so that they can cheap the Euro cheap and support their own
economy where the pressure point is where they`re not going to do this
anymore. We haven`t seen but we`re getting close.

MELBER: David Cay Johnston, thank you for unpacking some of what is
complex important story. I appreciate it.

JOHNSTON: Thank you.

MELBER: Now still to come, inside Amy Schumer`s comedy, we`re going to
look at our Schumer`s impacting t he debate over some very big topics,
political and beyond.

And up next, an update on that violent weekend in Chicago. We have the
latest. Stay tuned.


MELBER: We want to bring you a report on the violent holiday weekend that
occurred in Chicago. At least nine people killed. 46 injured shootings
that were across the city. The youngest victim was a 7-year-old boy on his
way home from 4th of July party. Police say they believe the boy was a
victim of a bullet meant for his father where official say is a member of a
street gang.

Mayor Rahm Emanuel addressing the incident just the short time ago.


RAHM EMANUEL, (D) CHICAGO MAYOR: I am both saddened and sickened by what
happened. You have too many guns on the streets. You have a criminal
justice system that lets out too many people repeatedly who use guns


MELBER: Forth of July weekend last year, there were four deaths and 26
injuries. Chicago police superintendent says some thing is systematically
wrong here.


our power to fight this but this fight we need help with. In doing so, we
need to repair our broken system. Criminals simply do not feel the
repercussions of the criminal justice system.


MELBER: The Chicago Tribune for its part have been tracking shootings in
the city there since 2012. They use data from police reporting and street
reports. 2015 is the earliest in the year that 1,000 people have been shot
in terms of the rate. More Americans have been murdered in Chicago in last
15 years and have died in Iraq and Afghanistan combined. Filmmaker Spike
Lee working on a movie centering on Chicago`s violence looking at through
that prism, the movie is literally entitled "Chiraq" and as conversation
started for a lot of residents even though the movie is in production


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Spike Lee didn`t start this problem and he is not going
to fix it. Is that City of Chicago issue and until everybody becomes a
part of this solution. The problem is not going to go away.


MELBER: We have a lot more coming up on the Ed Show after this so please
stay with us.

Market Wrap.

Stocks ended down but off session lows. The DOW falls by 46 points. The
S&P sheds eight. The NASDAQ slams by 17 points.

Oil prices have dropped nearly 8 percent today, the second worst decline of
the year.

Uncertainty about Greece and Europe economic health sent crude sliding.

And Starbuck is raising drink prices starting tomorrow. The company says
the increase will cover the rising cuts of labor, rent, and equipment but
not coffee beans. Those prices have actually been falling.

That`s it from CNBC, first in business worldwide.


MELBER: Welcome back to The Ed Show. You know, it is a common cliche to
think of Hollywood as liberal, could imagine a playground of freethinking
artists and hedonistic executives, pushing the rest of America on a
cultured march into the future. But when it comes to women, Hollywood
looks like it`s often frozen in another era.

In all the top grossing films last year, women made up just 12 percent of
leading roles. The academy that decides on all of those coveted Oscars is
76 percent men with an average of 63. Then you point out these facts and
the usual retort is that pop culture is just a market democracy. If the
people wanted to see different roles, Hollywood would be happy to sell them
something different.

But then something like this happens. Former Disney CEO Michael Eisner,
kicking up a storm over the weekend by offering his take on the shortage of
comedic roles for women, saying, "From my position, the artist to find is a
beautiful, funny woman. By far, they usually, "boy am I going to get in
trouble, I know this goes online", but usually, "he says, "Unbelievably
beautiful women are not funny." That is the view of the man who ran the
second largest broadcast media company in the nation and has people asking,
"What kind of tone is being set here from the top?"

The sexist fixation on a tension between beauty and humor for women alone
isn`t new of course. It`s exactly the kind of (inaudible) you`ll see spoof
by Amy Schumer, one of the funniest people in comedy today. Here`s her
send up of 12 Angry Men, except the tense jury is debating whether she, as
a comedy central star, is attractive enough to be on TV.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Gentlemen, raise your hands please if you think that
Amy Schumer is not hot enough to be on television. One, two, three, four,
five, six, seven, eight, nine, 10, 11. That`s 11 votes for Amy Schumer not
hot enough for television. And anybody voting the other way?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are you kidding me?


MELBER: That sketch basically anticipated the double standard you hear
from people like Michael Eisner.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Now, this Amy Schumer`s going to be the movie? I mean,
we got to stop this.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A movie? That`s too much. She`s starring in it?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I definitely don`t think she`s protagonist hot.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But Kevin James is?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don`t need to think about (inaudible) him.


MELBER: And when Amy Schumer talks, people do listen. Clips from her
third season have topped 35 million views online.

Joining me now to discuss to this firestorm three experts in this area,
funny women Lizz Winstead, Co-creator of The Daily Show and Founder of Lady
Parts Justice, actress Christine Bullen who performs with the Upright
Citizens Brigade, and Catie Lazarus who was named Best Comedy Writer by
Emerging Comics of New York, and host the Employee of the Month Podcast.
Hi, you guys.






MELBER: Your thoughts.

WINSTEAD: It`s so insane to think that humor does not mean sexy for both


WINSTEAD: And that`s really the bottom line is that it`s for men, if you
are funny, you are desirable, sexy, smart. If you`re a woman and funny,
you are making up for some lack of good looking norm that you are supposed
to live up to in life.

MELBER: Catie, I have a stupid question for you.


MELBER: Did it surprise you that a man who runs such a big entertainment
company would think like this?

LAZARUS: No. But your question was stupid.

MELBER: Go on.

LAZARUS: No. I didn`t feel -- I felt -- I`m glad that he`s retired.
That`s all I felt afterward. I mean, it seems like an irrelevant
discussion to have him. I`m glad that he finds Goldie Hawn funny and I`m
glad that he has let everyone know that he is attracted to her. But there
are so many funny women right now who are taking over the box office
including, from Disney, "Inside Out" right now, it stars Amy Poehler.

MELBER: I love "Inside Out".

BULLEN: Very good.

MELBER: It`s a great movie.

LAZARUS: Thank you for sharing. And so I feel like, you know, the
important issues are, you know, how many women was Michael Eisner employing
and was he ensuring that they were at the top of the field. And when
Goldie Hawn was in movies, you know, was he paying are equally to her male

MELBER: Well, when I think part of the point why it`s relevant, I mean why
we consider a new story is what are the current CEO`s think and how often
is this a latent or unstated view that is caviling (ph) and discriminating
the rules that are available to women.

BULLEN: Well, look I see his point because I think it`s really difficult
to find funny pretty women. You have to look in, you know, network
television shows now. Any comedy theater .


BULLEN: So, I do see his point of view. I think, you know.

WINSTEAD: Well, it`s also good where this thing about the whole thing to
me was when he brought up the Miss Arkansas pageant and he was like well,
you know, this people in Miss Arkansas pageant, you don`t need to be funny
that`s like well if they`re on a hunt for hilarious people, on pageant
circuit. Maybe that`s problematic. Last thing you know when I was leaving
through to the (inaudible) pitch, hell like and it wasn`t any funny guys in
there all.

LAZARUS: Or people in color.

WINSTEAD: Yeah, as for that matter, yeah. So, what is beauty, what is
funny? It`s so different to everybody that for him to -- and when you look
at the `90s and when you look at when he was in charge and you look at that
time period, women weren`t driving anything comically (ph).

MELBER: Well that I think that.

LAZARUS: I think, you know, he said a lot about, you know, where Hollywood
is today. I will say that. I mean, when he look at this, this is
something Oscar voters that you were bringing up, I thought like Michael
Eisner was at least honest about how he feels and perhaps people who are
currently in charge can`t say those things even though they may feel that
way. So, I do appreciate that he was honest -- how he feels and you might
completely disagree with it.

BULLEN: Well, I think they feel that way and they don`t even know that
it`s affecting their decisions as, you know, heads of networks and things.

MELBER: Well, that goes as anywhere and we`re talking comedy culture but
that goes to something about identity politics as well which is, you don`t
have to be on death row to oppose the death penalty.


MELBER: You don`t have to be other group to be involved in his advocacy
and yet we do know that who you bring at the table matters. I mean I want
to play another Amy Schumer bit because she`s been such a leader on this.
She took a huge issue that we`ve been debating in politics which is the
military command structure for overseeing sexual assault claims in the
military and turn into a joke about video games. I`m not sure that a
writer from full of guys gets to that joke. Let`s play that.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Just I call a duty except the game plays a way more
realistic so.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh cool, I can be a girl.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You were just assaulted by a fellow soldier. Do you
wish to report?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (Inaudible). A-ha. Who`s this?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You know what, let me go and check the message for it?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, I wish to report it.



MELBER: And it goes on like that. She ends up in like a paper work.

LAZARUS: And I`ve seen it hilarious.

MELBER: Right. So, Catie.

LAZARUS: I will take issue with -- what you said, I mean there are men and
women who work on that show and make that show hilarious together like the
idea that when you said there aren`t men who can possibly have, you know,
being value women as equal.

MELBER: Well, that`s not what I said.

WINSTEAD: That isn`t what he said and I but I also.

MELBER: But what I said was just to be clear, writers from full of men
only. I`m not sure it gets to the rape sexual assault joke. Maybe it
does. I`m not saying .

LAZARUS: No, I think that (inaudible).


LAZARUS: They wouldn`t -- won`t -- wouldn`t go in there the way that`s
nuance and up it to actually look at the full picture of what it`s like as
a woman.

WINSTEAD: Well, I think yeah and I also think that...

LAZARUS: Never mind, I`m going to have a reasonable discussion on MSNBC
and I agree with you.

WINSTEAD: Yeah, I just think that yeah.

LAZARUS: Take quite a feedback.

WINSTEAD: Yeah. I just think that you don`t get there because people
write about their own experience which is why you see 150 sitcoms about
but, you know, the average guy who`s going to smoke and have wife and he
gets to blow the mortgage money at the track and then she becomes the
buzzkill who looks like, you know, she should be a center fold then she`s
scold and he sleeps on the couch and next week.

MELBER: Right.

WINSTEAD: He spends his money in a different way that he wasn`t suppose
to, you know and like he felt...


WINSTEAD: ... the rules are, you don`t have been that way historically
until now when we see women driving show, women had writers, women --
putting women in the center and also women seemed perspectives that people


WINSTEAD: And also you have -- you like John (inaudible) saying "Yeah, I
have no problem anybody comedy was it women and so what.

LAZARUS: Oh absolutely.

MELBER: Do you guys feel in that this is...

LAZARUS: In nurturing female`s careers.

MELBER: This is on its way out of the natural progression at this point.

LAZARUS: I think it`s long overdue but what I`m excited about is so many
women and men and people are deciding that this is antiquated and we don`t
need it anymore. And I hope that, you know feminism. I hope that we all
take a note from the LGBT community and say, OK this is a really great time
for all of us to work together to move towards a little bit more progress.
I mean at Disney there could be a little bit more progress and there is
with Pixar.

MELBER: On that note, Lizz Winstead, Christine Bullen and Catie Lazarus,
thank you for joining.

BULLEN: Thank you.

MELBER: Still to come, the Confederate flag debate continues Joy Reid
joining us from South Carolina with an update.

Stay tuned.

(Commercial Break)

MELBER: Numbers are in. We have the result on tonight`s Bing Pulse Polls.
Tonight`s question was, "Will the same-sex marriage ruling have a major
impact on the 2016 race?" Tightening over time as you guys have been
voting 53, 47 there. You can keep voting of course until the end of the
hour at

And we, we`ll be right back.

(Commercial Break)

MELBER: In tonight, Two-Minute Drill, a fire finished in Daytona. This is
Dale Earnhardt Jr. cross the finish line at the Coke Zero 400. A
spectacular crash happened in his rear view mirror. Austin Dillon`s car
went air borne after being hit by another car. It spun out after flying
over two cars. Dillon`s car hit the catch fence before loading on its roof
on the side of the track. Dillon`s car was then hit by another car then it
lost control on that track.

Even after all that Austin Dillon was able to walk away from the crash
reportedly suffering a bruise tailbone and forearm. Several fans at the
spot of the accident were also injured, one briefly hospitalized.

Now, after this accident, Dillon told reporters he thinks speed on the
track are just too high NASCAR should look into ways of reducing speeds.

Stick around. We`ve got a lot more coming up on the Ed Show after this.


MELBER: Welcome back to the Ed Show. There has been a lot of talk about
removing the Confederate flag from the South Carolina State Capitol of
course and high profile leaders like Governor Nikki Haley and Senator
Lindsey Graham finally came out reversing their position and calling for
the flag to come down. So you might think, it`s a done deal, but it is

At this point, right now, the flag is still flying? It will also take
essentially a 2/3 majority from the South Carolina State House to
officially remove it.

Now, here is the news. Today, the South Carolina State Legislature did
begin debate on removing a Confederate flag from the capitol grounds. The
State Senate also held a vote to advance the bill in two procedural votes.


STATE SEN. LARRY MARTIN, (R) SOUTH CAROLINA: It is a part of our history.
It needs to be respected in whatever way are honored in whatever way folks
use to be. But as far as this day on this State House grounds, it isn`t
part of our future. It is part of our past. And I think we need to leave
it there...


MELBER: Now, this bill needs one more vote in the State Senate before it
heads the House, the final vote could come on Thursday in support for the
flag does remain. Pro-Confederate flag protesters demonstrated outside the
South Carolina Capitol today. They are saying the flag is part of history
and honors fall on civil war of veterans.

The flag also unfold display of Florida Daytona speedway for this weekend`s
Coke Zero 400. Some fans unapologetic in their support for the flag.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is our heritage and our southern way of life and
it makes us happy when we`re able show something that represents us.


MELBER: So it`s not limited to just the South either in Minnesota,
volunteer firefighter was suspended for flying Confederate flag from a fire
truck during an independence day parade over the weekend. Brian Nielsen
there has apologized to the Fire Department and the city of Albert de Lea
(ph). He says he is not a racist and explained the local NBC affiliate why
he flew that flag.


BRIAN NIELSEN, SUSPENDED FIREFIGHTER: Me raising that flag and putting
that flag had nothing to do with slavery. It had nothing to do with this
respect towards our vets or anything like that. It was more of the
statement against the PC.


MELBER: Nielsen saying is he is upset of what he calls a sort of
politically correct movement to remove the flag from history entirely.

For that more now, we go right to MSNBC National Correspondent Joy Reid,
what can you tell us about the latest in this series of votes?

JOY REID, MSNBC NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Ari, Senate have adjourned
for the day. They are expected to come back into session at 10 a.m.
tomorrow morning at which point, they will take up the third reading of the
bill to remove the Confederate flag from the monument behind me and move it
to what it`s called the relic room, it`s a couple of blocks away.

Now, after that, the House can begin to debate on the bill but they have to
wait for the following day. The House is currently considering some budget
items which is a reason essentially for the special session this week.

After that, they are expected to take up what have to then be three
separate readings of the bill in the House after they do those three
readings at which they take essentially three votes on the bill then it can
come back to the Senate.

We`re looking at Thursday before the bill can actually go to Nikki Haley`s
desk. Law maker that we`ve spoken with today seems confident that the
House has the votes. So we could see the flag actually coming down
assuming all goes as people here believe it well by Friday, Ari.

MELBER: Thanks Joy. Did you get a sense of the mood there? I mean, is
this something people being dragged to do politically or is there any kind
of breakthrough to the extent that there have been obviously some
tremendous events, leadership since these tragic mass murders.

REID: Well, you know, it`s very interesting. There have been a lot of
passionate debates going on including between African-American residents
and non-African-American opponent of the flag and people who work here who
brought Confederate flag to make the argument that they believe the flag is
not a symbol of hatred or racism and that debate have been literally taking
place on these grounds.

Now, inside of the Senate, the debate has been playing out in a slightly
different way. Senator Shaheen, who was the senator of the Democrat, who
introduced this bill so that he tried to do this years ago but was actually
blocked by the Governor, by Governor Nikki Haley.


REID: Some of the pro-Confederate flag protests were accusing her of going
back on her work to defend the flag. So you have a lot of people feeling
that perhaps the Governor has abandoned her former position and still
passions are running very high on both side of the issue.

MELBER: Joy Reid, thank you for your reporting on this story. We greatly
appreciate it.

For more, I want to go Lizz Winstead, we`ve been talking to. One of the
points has come up about this? Is that we often hear in the context of
certain controversies that Black America needs to step up. People point to
the President speech at Morehouse as an example, about responsibility and
yet in many of these states, whether it is out of the parade in an informal
way or at the state capitol, and in Minnesota where you have a link. This
is really a big conversation about what everyone call it white American or
white people and how we relate to this history?

WINSTEAD: Yeah. It`s Albert Lea by the way, you said Albert de Lea (ph).
I just wanted to point that out.

MELBER: I appreciate that.

WINSTEAD: That`s OK. I think that why the flag needs to come down was
never more pointed out than by the remarks of that firefighter. It`s the
argument of the culture history of South Carolina which I don`t buy, but it
is part of culture history for sure and I think it should be in a museum
and I think we should talk about why the flag existed and put that in the
context of our past and how moving forward.

But like that firefighter said, this wasn`t about kind to offend veteran,
this was about -- this is about him wanting to call out PC as he said.
This guy is a firefighter. You know, this guy outs out fires and saves
people`s lives. It is not his job to take something that he believes is a
bailiwick for the PC and putting it on his fire truck. When he`s the guy,
you got to call no matter how you feel to save you from a fire. You know,
it`s that sort of taking up the hump of the context of it by white
Americans who sort of stop to really think what it means to people and have
this major (ph) set of talking points about it`s my freedom to do that that
somebody else heritage, it`s like.


WINSTEAD: The bottom line is, it`s the flag of bad news bearers and let`s
talk about it in the context with it should be which is the best.

MELBER: Right and let`s be real about reality. Lizz Winstead, thank you
for joining on a couple of stories tonight.


MELBER: We are out of time at the Ed Show.

I`m Ari Melber filling for Ed Schultz.

PoliticsNation with Reverend Sharpton starts right now.


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