'Up with Steve Kornacki' for Saturday, July 11th, 2015
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Show: UP with STEVE KORNACKI
Date: July 11, 2015
Guest: Elahe Izadi, Nan Hayworth, Ron Insana, Wesley Clark, Michael Kruse,
STEVE KORNACKI, MSNBC HOST: The Donald heads to the border.
All right. Good morning. We`re supposed to have an introduction here, I
guess we don`t today. But good morning and thanks for getting up with us
today on UP. Donald Trump as we say there in that attempted cold open, he
is sticking to his position on immigration, he is set to give a big speech
in Arizona later today. We`re going to have more on that in just a moment.
Also ahead this morning, as the confederate flag falls in South Carolina, a
stunning admission from the FBI that the shooter never should have been
allowed to buy his gun in the first place. We`ll tell you how that
happened and what it means.
Plus, the shocking plot twist about one of the most beloved literary and
movie characters of all time.
And also coming up on the show, how the celebration continued last night
for the U.S. women`s soccer team. Those details and much, much more all to
come in the next two hours on this show.
But we begin this morning with Donald Trump doing what else, stirring
controversy on the topic of immigration. The republican presidential
candidate not backing down from the comments he made when he announced his
run last month and all the comments he`s made since then about undocumented
Mexican immigrants, claiming that Mexico is sending rapists, criminals and
drugs to the United States. And in a news conference in Beverly Hills
yesterday, Trump was flanked by families of people killed by undocumented
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: They`re sending people into our
country that we don`t want but we take and that they don`t want.
People came into the country illegally and killed their children. And it`s
a very, very sad thing what`s happening with our country. With respect to
whether you want to say illegal aliens, illegal immigrants, illegals, and
nobody wants to talk about it. I guess I cause controversy and for no
reason because I was talking about Mexico is sending people that Mexico
doesn`t want. And everybody knows that`s what I was saying, and everybody
knows that I have great relationships with Mexican people.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KORNACKI: That`s Trump`s new comments coming only hours before he`s set to
speak in Phoenix, Arizona, today. These comments were at an event hosted
by the local Republican Party.
Joining me now from Phoenix is MSNBC reporter Amanda Sakuma. So, Amanda,
that event you`re at today, you`re getting ready for out there, that was
moved to a larger venue to accommodate a larger-than-expected crowd. So,
what are we expecting to hear from Donald Trump? What`s the scene going to
be like there when he appears later today?
AMANDA SAKUMA, MSNBC REPORTER: Good morning, Steve. As you mentioned,
organizers were expecting maybe 500 people to join them at a hotel ballroom
across town. But they sold out after a couple of hours. Now they tell me
they`re moving here to a convention center at the heart of Phoenix where
they`re expecting as many as 5,000 people. So, as you mentioned, Trump is
in many ways coasting on this controversy. And so, when he comes and
speaks today, he`ll be standing next to one of the single most divisive
characters on the immigration debate, Sheriff Joe Arpaio.
Now, Arpaio is in the midst of his own controversy. He`s in a long-
standing lawsuit right now and federal case over his discriminatory
policies within his sheriff`s department that were targeting Latino
motorists. Now, just yesterday the judge in that case said he refused to
recuse himself from the case after it came to light that an attorney for
Arpaio had a private investigator spy on the judge`s wife. And they tried
to use that as a reason why the judge should recuse himself in this federal
case. So, in many senses, this, normally Arpaio would be a very toxic
person to be standing on stage with, but in many ways this is in line with
what Trump has been saying. There will be many anti-immigrant protesters
here, and there will be many pro-immigrant protesters here expected to
rally outside of the event later today.
KORNACKI: All right. Amanda Sakuma in Phoenix, thank you for that.
I always forget, we got that three-hour time difference. It`s pitch dark
in Arizona. Still only 5:00 in the morning out there. But Donald Trump
will be out there later. As we say, Arizona`s top Republicans, they are
distancing themselves from Donald Trump. At least most of them are, not
Joe Arpaio certainly as he prepares to deliver his remarks in that state
later today. Senators John McCain and Jeff Flake will not attending, with
Flake saying, quote, "Donald Trump`s views are coarse, ill-informed and
inaccurate and they are not representative of the Republican Party. As an
elected republican official, I`m disappointed the county party would host a
speaker that so damages the party`s image." And protesters are planning to
demonstrate outside as Amanda was saying there, where Trump is going to be
speaking. But there`s a broad base of support for Donald Trump and his
message in Arizona, especially among the ranchers who make their living
along the border.
NBC`s Mark Potter surveyed the scene for us ahead of Trump`s speech.
MARK POTTER, NBC NEWS CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): For several years,
hidden cameras in the Arizona desert had captured scenes like these, of
drug and immigrant smugglers, sometimes armed, hiking through miles of
American ranch land after illegally crossing the U.S.-Mexican border. This
video was shot in May south of Tucson just two months before Donald Trump
complained about border security.
TRUMP: We don`t even have a border. People are just flowing through like
water. There is no border right now.
POTTER: Arizona rancher John Ladd whom we visited several times before
along the Mexican border fence and others have long complained --
JOHN LADD, ARIZONA RANCHER: They just cut everything at ground level.
POTTER: -- about what they say is an insecure border that leaves them
facing security threats on their own land. They applaud Trump for giving
their concerns a national voice.
LADD: I`m really impressed that finally somebody has the courage to talk
about the reality of what`s going on.
POTTER: While ranchers see a dramatic drop this year in immigrant traffic,
drug smuggling they say is still rampant and insists Trump`s message is
FRED DAVIS, ARIZONA RANCHER: He`s talking about securing the border.
That`s the most important thing.
POTTER (on camera): And in your estimation, the border right now is not
DAVIS: Absolutely not.
POTTER (voice-over): But others in Arizona say, Trump`s comments about
Mexicans are offensive and insist he is overplaying the security threat.
Jimmy Pionke lives a half mile from the border.
JIMMY PIONKE, JIMMY`S HOT DOGS: The tone was arrogance at best and
nonsensical at worst. What he said was just not true.
Mr. Trump doesn`t actually know what`s going on. It`s easy to sit back in
New York City in Trump tower and make statements like that.
POTTER: Mark Potter, NBC News.
KORNACKI: All right. Let`s bring in this morning`s panel. Elahe Izadi,
national reporter with "The Washington Post." Former republican
congresswoman from New York Nan Hayworth and MSNBC`s Krystal Ball, co-host
of "THE CYCLE."
All right. Donald Trump, let`s talk about this. So, what do we learn this
week, we found out, first of all, we can put this up on the screen. He is
definitely surging in the polls. This is the latest. This is the national
poll. The economists, they take this one, Donald Trump now at the top
among Republicans nationally. First place. Check that out. We`ve been
talking so much about how you have to be in that top ten to make the
debate. Donald Trump clearly going to be in debate. So, we got that.
We`ve got the Republican National Chairman Reince Priebus making the call,
the Donald Trump this week. This was something your newspaper reporter
Elahe basically telling him. Tried to tone it down a little bit on this
KRYSTAL BALL, MSNBC HOST, "THE CYCLE": Yes.
KORNACKI: So, in the wake of those poll numbers --
BALL: Trump said that he was congratulating him. That`s all that was.
KORNACKI: Two very different versions of that phone call. That Donald
Trump, we played a cut of it right there. I have to say, and now the way
they were setting this event up yesterday, this press event where you`re
planning, he`s got families of people -- crime victims from undocumented
immigrants. So, his tone, though, was -- that was a quieter Donald Trump I
think than we`ve seen. I do wonder, did that message in some way get to
BALL: No, I don`t think so. Why would it, frankly, when he`s looking at
these poll numbers and he`s saying what I`m doing is working great, right?
This has gone better than even he could have possibly imagined in terms of
his person goals. He`s surging, he`s getting all the attention that he
wants. Every show is having to talk about him even if we want might want
to ignore him, when he`s getting that kind of traction in the polls, you
can`t. So, no, I mean, his tone is a bit different because he`s with
family members who have been impacted by violence. So, that`s naturally
going to bring a different tone out. But I don`t see him backing down or
toning it down or doing anything like that.
KORNACKI: So, where does he go from here? I`m kind of curious. I mean,
there was so much, I was always skeptical he`d actually run for president.
And he still has though, we have to say there`s this whole technical thing
where he has got to file, these really, you know, thorough financial
And he says he`s going to do it. So, you know, let`s see, he`s already
taken this farther than I thought he would. But -- is Donald Trump now, if
he does run, if he stays with this, is he running as immigration is the
issue or is there a next act, is there a next issue? Where does he go from
ELAHE IZADI, "THE WASHINGTON POST": Well, I`m not sure, but this
particular issue has hit at that moment in this country where everyone is
talking about the case in San Francisco and all these corporate sponsorship
deals that are pulling out has just catapulted him into the national
spotlight even more and more. But the thing is, this is the very issue and
the tone that the Republican Party, the national Republican Party does not
want to be talking about in this way. This is what`s so concerning to
national republican leaders, that all this work that they`ve been trying to
do over the past four years in trying to woo Latino voters might all go
down the drain in just a few weeks` time. So, that`s what`s really
concerning about him honing in on this issue. But he`s definitely zeroed
in on something, that there`s a segment of republican primary voters who
are upset and want this issue to be talked about.
KORNACKI: Right. And so, Nan, I guess that raises the question, if you`re
the Republican party, if you`re Reince Priebus, if you`re anybody in the
party that`s concerned about the tone from Donald Trump, and you`re looking
at these poll numbers, the response that he`s getting from Republicans, the
fact that he`s tapping into genuine feelings republican voters have on this
issue, on immigration, how do you argue with in public? How do you fight?
How do you counter Donald Trump when he`s basically articulating positions
that the base has?
FMR. REP. NAN HAYWORTH (R), NEW YORK: Well, there`s tone as we`ve talked
about and there`s substance. We want our president to be forceful, to be
forthright, but also to be respectful. Donald Trump is instead being
inflammatory. You know, he doesn`t sound the way I think most Republicans
would want their presidential candidate to sound. But he is going to push
this as far as he can because he`s got the name recognition. That`s why
he`s up so high in these polls. It is an opportunity for Republicans to
reflect on the substance of the issue, and there is genuine frustration not
only among Republicans, but among just about every one affected by this
issue, and that`s the entire American public. We have a government that
has not been effective in protecting our borders, in protecting both our
citizens and those who enter this country under circumstances that are
cruel, from harm. You know, this government isn`t doing anything right now
KORNACKI: Well, and I feel like that`s something that Trump is tapping
into here. And it`s not just literally about the immigration issue.
KORNACKI: It`s about the frustration with in terms of republican voters,
the republican establishment, in terms of voters in general, the political
establishment, the idea that it`s just these politicians up there in suits
who tell you all the things you want to hear.
KORNACKI: And guess what? There`s always fine print, there`s never any
follow through. And, you know, I`m just imagining this Krystal, this
argument playing out in the debate next month. Trump is on the stage, Jeb
Bush is up there, Jeb Bush gives them this sort of nuance take on, what we
need this kind of a pathway, and we need to be reasonable about this. And
Trump will just look at him and be like, Jeb, you`re what`s wrong. You`ve
been talking that way for 30 years. Nothing changes. Nothing gets done.
BALL: He is very certain, right, often wrong but never in doubt. That is
Donald Trump. And people love that sort of black and white certainty.
Right? He doesn`t sugarcoat things. That`s the way that they`re feeling.
And I think you`re right. It`s not just about immigration. It`s about
this broader sense that the country is changing and I`m uncomfortable with
the direction that it`s going in. And also frankly, all of the business
establishment, walking away from him in the way that the media is attacking
him, that just strengthens him. And that`s actually a problem that the
Republican Party has created for itself. They`ve created this narrative
that the establishment is bad and that no authority figure should ever be
trusted. So, to me the idea of Reince Priebus, right, the emissary of the
republican establishment trying to tell Donald Trump to tone it down, that
just serves Donald Trump. I mean, he has absolutely no power. The more
that Trump exacerbates the powers that be, the stronger that he`s going to
be in these polls.
KORNACKI: I just want to play this quickly. Because we`ve seen this video
make the rounds this week. And when Republicans say they have a chance,
the republican establishments sort of talks about where he is vulnerable,
where Trump is vulnerable. Where they can kind of get him. A lot is going
back to 1999, he flirting with running for president back then, a very
different Donald Trump presented himself. We have a clip from that. Let`s
play that for a second.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Would President Trump ban partial at the border?
TRUMP: I`m very pro-choice. I hate the concept of abortion. I hate it.
I hate everything that stands for it. I cringe when I listen to people
debating the subject. But you still, I just believe in choice. Hey, I
lived in New York City, in Manhattan all my life. Okay? So, you know, my
views are a little bit different than if I lived in Iowa perhaps.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KORNACKI: And this was -- I mean, this was Trump back then, he talking
about single payer health care, universal healthcare, this was Donald Trump
who is very liberal on gays, especially in 1999. And he`s managed to
execute this -- he`s playing almost like the Pat Buchanan role in the
Republican Party right now. You know, is that past going to at least trip
him up here do you think Elahe?
IZADI: I mean, maybe it can be used to show him as a hypocrite. But if
you`re going to attack him on his record, you`re just more and more, it`s
just -- it`s further legitimizing the possibility that this candidacy is
going to go somewhere. Now, the poll numbers that we saw, like you say,
its name recognition, there`s a margin of error. You often have these
sorts of candidates doing really well in the polls in such a crowded field
this far out before the election. But yes, I mean, you can definitely look
at his record and say, wow, it`s very different. Now, if you want to look
at Bernie Sanders as the Donald Trump of the Democratic Party, I mean, that
comparison doesn`t hold because Bernie Sanders has held those positions for
IZADI: Donald Trump it appears is putting forward some positions that get
him a lot of attention right now.
KORNACKI: You have set up a very good segue to our next segment which will
be about the man you just mentioned, Bernie Sanders and some of the
positions he`s held over the last few decades.
Still ahead, also, will a last-minute offer help keep Greece`s economy
afloat and will what happens in Greece affect us here in the United States?
But first, most Americans say they are unwilling to vote for a socialist.
We`ll look at what that means for a self-described socialist Bernie
Sanders. Stay with us.
KORNACKI: Progressive, liberal, left winger, those are some of the many
words used to describe Senator Bernie Sanders as his presidential campaign
picks up momentum. But there`s one word we haven`t heard used as much, a
word Sanders uses to describe himself.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LARRY KING, HOST, "POLITICKING WITH LARRY KING": You`ve described yourself
as a small d democrat. So will you tell us Americans what a small d
SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (I-VT), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Well, a democratic
socialist like that.
KING: Right. Democratic socialist.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KORNACKI: Socialist. That is a term that doesn`t sit well with most
Americans. Pew finding in 2011 that just 31 percent, that`s less than a
third of those survey have a positive view of the term socialism, 60
percent have a negative view, the negative view of socialism that Sanders
has been trying for years to disprove, going back to his days as
Burlington, Vermont`s mayor.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SANDERS, NBC "TODAY," APRIL 7, 1981: We believe in democracy. I mean, the
problem with the word socialism is that very often it`s been equated with
what happens in the Soviet Union, which is authoritarianism and
totalitarianism. I believe very strongly in the right of descent, and I
think people with those ideas fight for those things very strongly.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KORNACKI: But Missouri Senator Claire McCaskill who`s already endorsed
Hillary Clinton says, the media hasn`t questioned Sanders enough about his
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. CLAIRE MCCASKILL (D), MISSOURI: I think the media is giving Bernie a
pass right now. I very rarely read in any coverage of Bernie that he`s a
socialist. I think everybody wants a fight and I think they`re not really
giving the same scrutiny to Bernie Sanders that they`re giving to certainly
Hillary Clinton and the other candidates.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KORNACKI: Is Claire McCaskill right? Is the media giving Bernie Sanders a
pass? And could Americans really vote for a socialist? Well, let`s ask
our panel. I love the old Phil Donahue interview there, 34 years ago.
Yes. That`s a fun one to look at. But okay, so, I mean, you look at those
poll numbers, two to one people have a negative view of the term socialism.
There`s Claire McCaskill who`s you know, sort of a Hillary surrogate,
clearly sees an opening there to kind of marginalize Bernie Sanders. Is
socialism the connection that Bernie Sanders has to it, does just that
automatically kill him as a national candidate?
HAYWORTH: Well, it`s a convenient code. You know, nobody is using it in
the strict political theory definition. But it`s very clear that Bernie
Sanders is someone who wants to confer more power on the government to run
more -- evermore aspects of our transactions, of our lives, for Americans
historically that`s been anathema although it`s perhaps becoming less so.
And obviously for Hillary Clinton`s supporters, they`re pulling this word
out because they know that it`s going to be toxic to moderate democrats.
BALL: Republicans used it to great effect.
KORNACKI: Well, I mean, that`s the question. If you -- the Republicans,
how many conservatives on talk radio or blogs or whatever are always
calling Democrats socialists, collectivists, communists. And now, you got
it, actual socialist running for the democratic nomination.
BALL: It`s part of why the word has less power because it has been used so
much. But there`s also a shift that`s happening that is pointed out in
that same article which is that younger Americans who were born post-cold
war, at least came of age post-cold war, they don`t have the same like red
fear that older generations had.
KORNACKI: You know, we can put those numbers up actually, Krystal. Let`s
put these up so you can see. This is people age 18 to 29. And that is
striking. Look at this.
BALL: They`ve used socialism more positively than capitalism.
KORNACKI: That`s an amazing disconnect.
BALL: Yes. And I think because they think of it more in terms of the
Bernie Sanders model, right? Looking at, yes, I believe that we should
support people. I believe that we should have a social safety net. If you
look at most of the positions that Bernie Sanders advocates for, they`re
actually quite popular, including expanding Social Security which is
popular across a broad range of ages. So, I think most folks are not
thinking so much about the label, that they`re looking at the positions.
And look, Bernie Sanders has a ceiling. He`s not going to be the
democratic nominee, he`s not going to be ultimately a national candidate.
But the thing that people are responding to is that he is crystal clear
about where he stands. He`s been in the same place his whole career and
that authenticity is a very rare commodity in politics. I mean, if you
want to compare him to Donald Trump, there`s nothing comparable in Donald
Trump in terms of that sort of genuine authenticity.
KORNACKI: Well, I wonder --
HAYWORTH: It`s a big contrast of Hillary Clinton who is perceived --
BALL: Absolutely right. That`s absolutely right.
KORNACKI: And I`ve heard the argument made -- you talk about all the
strengths Hilary Clinton has, is you know, this is the biggest front-runner
Democrats ever seen, either party has ever seen. That is actually a
contrast. If there`s one candidate who that contrast works for, it`s
Bernie Sanders because she represents so much of the entrenched power, all
the political class lining up for, that it sort of helps define him more to
run against that.
But I wonder, you talk about that generational difference on attitudes
towards socialism, and how much of that has to do with, in the older
generation that remembers that lived through the Soviet Union, soviet
communism and all that, a younger generation to whom that`s not part of
their life. It`s a point that Bernie Sanders tries to make when asked
about this. We have a clip. This is when he was on Seth Meyers show
recently, when he talks about socialism as a governing philosophy, he talks
about Scandinavia. This is what he has to say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SANDERS: We have countries like Denmark, Sweden, Norway, all the European
countries, which have had social democratic governments and labor
governments, and the result of that is, in those countries health care is a
right of all people. I don`t see that as a great problem.
(CHEERS AND APPLAUSE)
At a time when so many of our young people can`t afford to go to college,
tuition is free in many of those countries. Excellent.
(CHEERS AND APPLAUSE)
They have excellent childcare, strong retirement benefits. They`re often
very strongly pro-environment, taking on climate change. So, I think when
people understand that in those countries governments are working for the
middle class rather than the billionaire class. I think we can get a
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KORNACKI: So, there you go, Elahe, all those millennials applauding in the
background. This 73-year-old candidate.
IZADI: Yes. Take them to all the spots, all the millennials -- talk about
free tuition for sure. Yes. I mean, the idea that socialism as this label
is going to bring him down in a democratic primary, I mean, if you look in
the Iowa polls, he is gaining on Hilary Clinton right now. And that, he
could be a foil in that state. If she does not win Iowa, that will not be
good. But the issues he`s articulating, the argument that he makes is that
these are positions that he`s holding that a lot of people, both democrat
and republican also hold. And so whether or not he becomes the candidate,
the nominee, it is another question. Is he going to be pushing Clinton
into these positions? And that doesn`t really maybe bode well for her in a
BALL: He already has pushed her I think.
IZADI: Yes. On gun control, she`s talking more and more about that.
KORNACKI: I`m really excited to see. I mean, we talk about these
republican debates, but I`m really excited to see Hillary Clinton versus
Bernie Sanders. I know there`s three other candidates up there. And I
kind of wish we could just have just that --
BALL: One-on-one debate.
KORNACKI: -- one-on-one debate with Hillary. You know, she is probably
happy the other three are up there.
BALL: I mean, it may actually feel much like a one-on-one debate. Because
he is incredibly outspoken, he`s very smart, he knows what he`s talking
about. He has that certainty and he is willing to say exactly what he
thinks. So, yes, it will be fun to watch. I mean, one thing that I`ve
been thinking about, watching how well that Bernie Sanders -- and by the
way, you get a lot of credit for predicting how well he would do
unexpectedly. You were one of the first people who looked at --
KORNACKI: I`m glad you read your notes --
BALL: And said, this guy is going to do better than people think. I mean,
you`re absolutely right about that. I mean, I look at this and I think,
you know, imagine if Elizabeth Warren would have gotten in this race.
KORNACKI: I wonder if Elizabeth Warren thinks that, too.
BALL: You know, I think she would be in a much different position, she
would have a much broader range of support and really could have given
Hillary Clinton a run for a money.
KORNACKI: And meanwhile, Martin O`Malley is sitting back there in
Baltimore saying, why isn`t it me?
BALL: Why not me?
KORNACKI: This is supposed to be me. All those years of planning.
Anyway, still ahead, why federal authorities now say the gunman in last
month`s Charleston Church shooting shouldn`t have been allowed to buy a bun
in the first place.
And next, a deadly explosion outside the Italian consulate in Egypt. The
latest on that right after this break.
KORNACKI: Developing at this hour, we`re following reports that an Islamic
State Leader Hafiz Saeed Khan has been killed in a U.S. drone strike in
Afghanistan. Khan is the head of ISIS for Afghanistan, Pakistan and some
other adjoining regions. According to Taliban sources, Hafiz Saeed was
also once part of the Afghan Taliban. A small but increasing number of
senior Taliban militants in Afghanistan have switched allegiance to ISIS.
There was also a deadly explosion this morning outside the Italian
consulate in Cairo. That blast coming early this morning in Egypt`s
capital city killed at least one person and injured nine others. The
consulate was closed at the time and no one who worked there was hurt.
Investigators still trying to determine the cause of that explosion. No
one has claimed responsibility for the attack as yet.
Stay with MSNBC and NBC.com throughout the day for updates on these
And still ahead in our show, the shocking revelation in the new Harper Lee
novel about one of the best loved fictional characters of all time.
And next, the loophole that allowed the Charleston Church shooter to buy
his gun. The FBI admits its mistake on the same day that the confederate
flag comes down. That`s next. Stay with us.
KORNACKI: It`s been an emotional 24 hours in South Carolina where
yesterday morning the confederate flag was removed from the front of the
statehouse in Columbia. More than 100 people watched the historic
ceremony, much more than 100, on the national audience and television, too.
The flag is now housed nearby at a confederate relic museum. The flagpole
was also removed yesterday from the statehouse grounds. This came a day
after South Carolina`s republican Governor Nikki Haley signed that bill
into law calling for the removal of the flag. It also came less than a
month after the racist murders of nine members of a black church in
Charleston, South Carolina by a man who embraced the confederate flag.
Not long after that flag came down yesterday, the director of the FBI
revealed that the gun used in the Charleston church shooting never should
have been sold to the gunman in the first place. James Comey revealing
that Dylann Roof`s criminal history didn`t make it into the FBI`s database.
If it had, that would have prohibited his purchase of the gun. Instead
Roof got his gun because federal law allows the gun sale to go ahead if the
FBI hasn`t blocked it. Now, in previous elections, Democrats have often
appeared timid on tackling gun control as part of their campaigns, but ever
since the Charleston shooting, Hillary Clinton has been talking about
toughening the nation`s gun laws, including this week in Iowa.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HILLARY CLINTON (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I think it`s pretty clear
that a majority of Americans and a majority of gun owners agree with
universal background checks to keep guns out of the hands of domestic
abusers and people who are mentally unready and unstable and even
terrorists. Because right now we can`t even stop that in a lot of the
parts of the country. So, let`s get back to having a conversation. Let`s
not be afraid of the gun lobby which does not even really represent the
majority of gun owners in America.
(CHEERS AND APPLAUSE)
KORNACKI: And this is a shift in emphasis that helps the former secretary
of state stake out the more liberal ground of her closest challenger,
Vermont Senator Bernie Sanders. On this issue she could be standing out
there alone. Because when it comes to guns, Sanders isn`t your typical
liberal. He represents a rural pro-gun state. He`s voted in the past for
legislation that protects the gun industry. In Thursday in Virginia,
Sanders argued with a member of the audience over whether gun manufacturers
should be held liable.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SANDERS: If somebody has a gun and somebody steals that gun and they shoot
somebody, do you really think it make sense to blame the manufacturer of
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, and I`ll tell you why.
SANDERS: No, well --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Come on!
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Because there`s smart gun technology that would
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We`d like other people to get a chance.
SANDERS: The pointers that I made, if somebody sells you a baseball bat
and you hit somebody over the head, you`re not going to sue the baseball
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KORNACKI: So interesting. I mean, he is making the guns don`t kill
people, people kill people line that you always hear from the NRA. And
this is Bernie Sanders. And this is the one issue people always look at.
And they say, he`s to the left of Hillary on everything, on taxes, on that.
Not when it comes to guns.
HAYWORTH: Well, it`s going to goes back to Hillary Clinton`s problem as
Bernie Sanders presents her with the challenge of advocating for evermore
government basically, except perhaps in this case on Bernie Sanders` part.
We have an ineffective government apparatus, this was a failure of the
background check system. So the background check was in place and didn`t
work. Why? Because it`s not being administered properly. So --
BALL: Well, if I could, I mean part of the problem here was that there is
this prioritization over the speed of someone being able to get their gun -
HAYWORTH: Right. In three days.
BALL: -- in three days versus the thoroughness of the background check.
BALL: So if the person at the FBI had had more time because she was trying
to find the information, if there had been more time to find that
information, then Dylann Roof wouldn`t have been able to get a gun. So, I
think it speaks to the fact that we prioritized the ability of people to
get a gun and really leaning on the side of anyone being able to get a gun
over having a thorough background check system. And there`s also another
piece here which is a lot of reluctance among the pro-gun community to give
any information about who owns guns and their background and their history
to the federal government that makes it very hard to have an effective
background check system.
IZADI: And this is actually -- shows that this particular tragic incident
is a case study in how something can -- people who are already anti-new gun
laws and people who are already wanting more restrictions and more controls
on who gets a gun, both sides can look at what happened and see that
there`s -- that they have a legitimate concern and their position is
legitimate. And also, this incident I don`t think is going to create any
momentum, real momentum to actually do something, let`s say, in South
Carolina where Nikki Haley, a republican governor was the one who led the
charge to bring down the confederate flag.
IZADI: But on guns she`s very clear. And in the past she`s supported
legislation that would make it easier for people to get guns and you
wouldn`t even have to get a permit or training to get a gun. So this isn`t
really going to change the conversation anymore than any other incident.
KORNACKI: Right. I think what Bernie Sanders is trying to do here and it
reminds me so much, we`re always drawing comparisons to between him and
Howard Dean. And they`re both from Vermont, they`re both sort of landed
KORNACKI: -- but that was the issue also where Howard Dean was sort of at
odds with the democratic base. And Howard Dean`s point when he ran for
president 12 years ago and Bernie Sanders, listen to him is making the same
argument now. He is basically saying the idea of having national policy on
guns doesn`t make sense because a gun means something very different in
Vermont, he`s saying. Where in Vermont, it`s used for hunting, it`s used
for food on the table. He said, in a city like Chicago where you`re seeing
it every weekend, it`s killing people. It`s being used differently. And
he`s saying, we have to have a political discussion that reflects that. I
wonder what you think of that.
BALL: I mean, on the policy, the problem with that view is that then if
you have lenient gun laws in one place and the next-door neighbor doesn`t
has stricter gun laws, then you`ve sort of negated the ability of the state
with the stricter gun laws to be able to really enforce who is bringing
what into their state. I mean, I do think that it`s interesting what
Bernie Sanders that this is the one place where he hasn`t been consistently
on the Left. I wonder if there`s been too much made of this issue though.
Because in a modern context, I`m not sure where he actually would differ
from Hillary Clinton in terms of a policy prescription which will be one of
the things that will be interesting to see come out in the debates.
IZADI: And it`s also a way for her to attack Bernie Sanders and his record
without really directly attacking him and attacking policies that the
liberal base actually supports.
KORNACKI: Right. Any time she can kind of get to his left without much
IZADI: Yes, exactly.
KORNACKI: I think she`s going to be taking it.
Anyway, still ahead, did Scott Walker accidentally let the cat out of the
And next, the latest on the potential deal that could keep Greece in the
Eurozone. That`s next.
KORNACKI: Greece now has just one day to reach a deal with its creditors
and avoid a likely exit from the Eurozone. There`s growing hope this
morning that a deal can be reached though with Greece`s parliament voting
overwhelmingly this morning to approve the Greek prime minister`s latest
proposal, an offer that includes many concessions. It`s the creditors,
except Greece`s proposal, the country could get another three-year loan to
keep its economy afloat.
Joining us now to discuss all of what is happening over there, we have CNBC
contributor Ron Insana. So, Ron, thank you for being here.
RON INSANA, CNBC AND MSNBC CONTRIBUTOR: My pleasure.
KORNACKI: And this is -- it`s such an important issue and it`s one that I
want to understand. And I have to be honest, it`s something that I`ve
struggled to understand in reading about it.
INSANA: Many of us have. Yes.
KORNACKI: So, that`s why we have you here, to try to give us some clarity
on this. So, let`s start with this. Right now this thing has passed
parliament. This new deal has past parliament. It`s going to go in
Greece. Now, it`s going to go to the EU to decide if they`ll going to
accept this. But is it likely they`ll accept it and what will that mean?
INSANA: Well, we`ve heard some cooing noises so far from France and other
members of the European Union that the Greece government has come toward
the creditors to meet their demands, whether it`s reforming their pension
system, their retirement age, getting their fiscal house in order and
balancing their budget, all of those steps have been promise now by Greece
where they were rejected not too long ago. Now, that would come in
exchange for $83 billion in fresh cash which Greece desperately needs. Its
banking system is running out of money, its GDP has collapsed by over 25
percent. So, they need money. What we don`t know is where Germany stands
at the moment on this, whether they feel Greece has come far enough and
will do enough in order to really right their fiscal house. You know how
people complain about our country being, you know, a little bit profligate
when it comes to spending. Greece makes us look like a very tight wads by
KORNACKI: Well, so, a week ago, the story was, you had this referendum in
Greece and they rejected these -- they rejected the terms of Germany, they
rejected the terms of Europe. Now they`re giving in. Are they back to
where they were before the referendum?
INSANA: Yes, I mean, Europe starved them. Right? I mean, what really
happened in the interim is that the European Central Bank which was
providing emergency cash to the Greek banking system capped the amount of
money that they were sending over. That forced the banks to shut down.
So, Greeks could only take out 60 euros a day. And if they were to do that
for an extended period of time, the banking system Steve would simply run
out of money, absolutely, literally run out of cash. They have a deepening
economic crisis, 26 percent unemployment rate. The youth unemployment rate
there is 52 percent. Without any fresh funds they collapse and probably
leave the Eurozone and abandon the Euro as a currency, being forced to go
back to the old currency, the drachma.
KORNACKI: Okay. And so, what does that mean? I mean, the states -- does
Greece stay in the Eurozone? What does that mean?
INSANA: Correct. All right. Well, it`s both political and economic. If
they were to leave the Eurozone without any fresh cash, it`s bad enough
that the Greek economy has already collapsed by 26 percent. It would go
into free fall. That would be horrible for the Greek people. Then if they
exit the Eurozone for which there is no legal mechanism in Europe, it would
call into question the integrity of the single currency, the currency union
in Europe and whether or not peripheral countries also heavily indebted
like Portugal, Italy, Spain and Ireland, would want similar debt relief if
it passes or whether they would be vulnerable to leaving as well which
would just blow up the entire experiment that started in 1999. So, there
are both political and economic dimensions to this that would be, if they
went the wrong way, fairly catastrophic for the European Union.
KORNACKI: There is also a lot of commentary that I`ve read that`s been
very critical of Germany, they says Germany`s role in this has, they`ve
been too hard on Greece basically. The terms have been unreasonable and
they`ve sort of made the situation worse in Greece. Is there anything to
INSANA: Well, some might argue them. Certainly, the International
Monetary Fund wants Germany to approve debt relief reducing the amount of
outstanding debt that Greece owes to the European Union. The U.S. has
supported that position as well. Having said that, what most people don`t
realize is that Greece already doesn`t have to pay interest principle on
its outstanding debt for the next five years. Greece wanted as much as a
20-year moratorium on its debt which Germany finds somewhat unacceptable.
Northern Europe is financing the 45-year-old retirement age in Greece, the
very generous pensions that Greek workers get. And so, what`s at stake
here is a precedent in which, do the rich countries of Europe continue to
subsidize all of the poor countries of Europe at taxpayer expense? And so
that`s where in Germany it comes down particularly hard because it`s the
best performing economy in Europe. They have the most money. They`re also
on the hook for the most Greek debt. So that`s why they`ve drawn such a
hard line in the sand.
KORNACKI: Forty five-year-old retirement age.
INSANA: Well, you know, we should all be so lucky. Right?
INSANA: I mean, by the same token, it`s unsustainable. Right? There`s
$86 billion in taxes that have not been paid by the Greek people.
Literally the same amount of money they`re asking for for the next three
years has gone uncollected in the tax system. So, there are some problems
in Greece that need to be dealt with forthrightly and it hasn`t happened
really in the last several years.
KORNACKI: Okay. Well, it`s a drama that`s playing out this weekend. We
will see what happens tomorrow night when the EU makes that decision.
MSNBC Ron Insana, thank you for joining us.
INSANA: Thank you.
KORNACKI: I appreciate that. We are staying on top of a developing story
as well this morning in Serbia where an angry crowd has thrown rocks, water
bottles and other objects at that country`s prime minister breaking his
glasses. This played out at a cemetery to lay flowers to commemorate the
20th anniversary of genocide in Srebrenica. That`s Europe`s worst massacre
since the holocaust.
Still ahead on the show today, negotiators in Vienna working all weekend
long to meet their new Monday deadline for a nuclear deal with Iran.
But first, the accidental presidential campaign announcement that hit the
internet yesterday that left one campaign hitting delete, delete, delete.
Stay with us.
KORNACKI: All right. There`s a lot going on this morning. Let`s get
caught up with some of the other headlines making news. Our panel is back
Let`s go to "The Washington Post" which tells us, whoops, Scott Walker`s
Twitter account jumps the gun, announces his run for president. So,
yesterday, there it is. Scott Walker`s campaign said, he`s running for
president on Twitter. The tweet was quickly deleted. A Twitter
spokesperson said, they are looking into the issue. And this is
interesting. The Walker team is not at fault.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Really?
KORNACKI: So something went screwy there.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Is anonymous behind that?
KORNACKI: Was there a hack? Did the Donald strike? I don`t know what it
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: But we`ll see what happens.
HAYWORTH: No, they must have left it up to the federal government to do
the tweet and they got him.
BALL: I mean, I think that we`re all shocked that Scott Walker is going to
be running for president. I had no -- I did not see that coming at all
until Twitter told me.
KORNACKI: That`s what I mean? Why delete the thing once it`s up there?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. But if you are going to hack, aren`t you going
to put something a little bit more embarrassing up?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, that`s a good point.
KORNACKI: You know -- he`s not running for president.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There you go.
KORNACKI: I don`t know. Anyway, thinking like a hacker here. Let`s see
what`s in "The New York Times," a book review of Harper Lee`s, "Go set a
watch men." This is incredibly controversial, the book, not the review.
The book is incredibly controversial now because of course, people weren`t
sure that Harper Lee really wanted this released 50 years after "To Kill a
Mockingbird." But the character, Atticus Finch, one of the most beloved
characters in all of the fiction history, becomes -- here is his quote,
according from the review here. "Atticus is a racist who once attended a
clan meeting who says things like that the negroes down here are still in
their childhood as a people. Asks his daughter, do you want negroes by the
carload in our schools, churches and theaters? Do you want them in our
KORNACKI: This is Atticus Finch, the character in this new Harper Lee
book. We say, no, it was written about 50, you know, years ago. But wow.
BALL: Right. It`s wild and it`s wild to think -- I mean, that book was so
influential and so inspirational and really pushed social change forward.
It`s unbelievable to think that, you know, if the first manuscript had been
accepted, what this would have been.
KORNACKI: People walk around to this day with the name Atticus because
their parents were so inspired by his character, by the movie character by
Gregory Peck. So, I guess what the story here though is, this was the
original version. This is what Harper Lee originally wanted the book to
be, about a 25-year-old girl who comes back to Alabama and reckons with her
racist father. And she sent it off to a publisher and the publisher
basically said, you know, try something else. She came up with, okay, now
the father is a hero.
IZADI: Well, maybe there`s a reason why that original manuscript wasn`t
published. So, maybe we`re finding out now. I don`t know.
KORNACKI: It raises the question, did she really want this published.
KORNACKI: Given, you know? Let`s see what else is making news here.
"Variety" tells us that Roger Reese, the actor in "Cheers" and "The West
Wing," in Nicholas Nickleby, he dies at the age of 71. Remember him, I
remember him as Robin Colcord, the billionaire, millionaire, whatever from
London who comes over and marries Rebecca Howe on "Cheers." Very sad news
there. And we also have this from WECT Television station I think in North
Carolina. Look at this. Shark bites dolphin. The dolphin died yesterday
morning after he`s being injured by a shark at Kure Beach in North
Carolina. The dolphin had a deep bite to its tail. North Carolina has
seen a record number of shark attacks obviously in recent weeks. A lot of
this involving people but this is obviously really sad, too.
BALL: We had a shark expert on "THE CYCLE," you know, the other show that
I do, and he was telling us that actually a big part of the problem is
overfishing. And so the sharks just don`t have the food that they are
looking for and they`re getting very desperate.
KORNACKI: And so they come closer and they come closer in. And they
always tell you, you know, it`s still safe, look at the statistics go, in
the water and be careful. How do you be careful if a shark is 20 feet away
HAYWORTH: You can`t possibly. You know, you really do have to follow
common sense. And, you know, that`s why we have swimming pools.
KORNACKI: Thank you.
There are stingrays, there are jellyfish, there are sharks.
BALL: Right. Well, I will point out. Humans kill way more sharks than
sharks kill --
KORNACKI: Wow! Yes. You`re exactly right. Krystal Ball, shame on you
for standing up for the sharks like that.
Another full hour of news and politics still to come, including one
reporter`s attempt to dig into the questions of how well we really no know
Bernie Sanders. He came up with something very interesting. That`s ahead.
Stay with us.
KORNACKI: Making or breaking the Iran deal.
KORNACKI: Thanks for staying with us this Saturday morning.
At this hour in Vienna, talks in Iran over that country`s nuclear program
are officially in over time. The deadline extended. And the rhetoric over
who is at fault for the delay is heating up. We`re going to go live in a
moment to Vienna for reaction and all of the latest.
Also ahead this hour, we`re going to look at the Jeb Bush surge that is
actually happening right now. The question is, how long will it last?
Plus, the White House state dinner with very special attendees, all of them
ages 8 through 12, with something called Barack-omoli (ph) on the menu.
Also, the Girl Scout with a thing or to teach all of us about closing the
deal. She is the world record holder for cookie sales. You won`t believe
how many boxes she sold. She is going to be along later to show us how to
get things done.
But we begin this hour with yet another deadline missed in those historic
nuclear talks with Iran. Negotiators in Vienna yesterday blowing through
their deadline for a final deal for the third time now in 11 days. They
are racing against a clock to meet their new deadline, a deadline just two
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOHN KERRY, SECRETARY OF STATE: We have a couple different lines of
discussion that are going on right now, but I think it`s safe to say that
we have made progress today. The atmosphere is very constructive. We
still have a couple of very difficult issues and we`ll be sitting down to
discuss those in the very near term.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KORNACKI: In the extended quest for a landmark deal with Iran, John Kerry
making some history of his own. He has devoted more time to a single
negotiation than any American official in more than four decades. But
whether Kerry can deliver a nuclear deal with Iran is still very much an
open question. Iranians publicly blaming the U.S. for the delay, while
U.S. officials are saying the Iranians made new demands this week, calling
for an end on an embargo on conventional arms.
President Obama huddled with U.S. negotiators on Wednesday by a video
conference from the Situation Room. The night before, he told Senate
Democrats that he put the odds of a deal at less than 50 percent. By
missing yesterday`s deadline, the Obama administration also missed the
window for expedited congressional review of a final deal. Congress will
now have 60 days, that is twice the amount of time they would have had if a
deal was struck before now to approve any deal negotiators hammer out.
That is yet another obstacle in the path to a final agreement.
Joining us now for the latest from Vienna is NBC News chief foreign affairs
correspondent, Andrea Mitchell.
Andrea, thanks for taking a few moments this morning.
So, tell us, we have this new deadline two days away. What are the
obstacles standing between these folks and a final deal?
ANDREA MITCHELL, NBC NEWS CHIEF FOREIGN AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: There`s a
lot of smaller issues that still have to be finessed or polished or honed,
if you will, in the words of the Russian foreign minister the other day.
But the big thing that emerged this week was Iran really raising the level
of its demand for a lift of the embargo that has been in place. There have
been three U.N. resolutions embargoing arms deliveries to or sales from
Iran from 2006, 2007, 2009, from the U.N. Security Council.
These resolutions would require a lifting of the embargo. The resolutions
would have to be canceled. Iran made that demand. These are non-nuclear
issues. This is conventional weapons, but it includes ballistic missiles.
And it was a real red line to the president apparently in that video
conference call on Wednesday night. So, whereas Iran thought with Russia
and China`s help, Russia, in particular, wants to sell arms to Iran and be
able to get back into a very lucrative business there.
With Russia`s help, Iran was basically dividing the Security Council. The
first time we`ve seen a real division among the negotiating partners here
on what`s called the P5-plus-one, the Security Council permanent members
plus Germany. That created enormous strains. Vladimir Putin exploited
that. In a previously scheduled summit, including Iran`s President Rouhani
on Thursday and Friday in Moscow.
So, there was a lot of tension back and fourth, blame back and forth. I
think part of this was both the U.S. and Iran trying to show its critics,
its hard liners, if you will, and I know they`re not analogous, but the
hard liners in Iran that want to kill any deal, the critics of this who
include some prominent Democrats as well as a lot of Republicans and
presidential candidates, Republican candidates in both capitals, who would
like to kill the deal even though they don`t know the details yet. Their
read on the emerging deal has been very, very negative.
And so, each side, each negotiator, Zarif on one side, the foreign minister
of Iran, Secretary Kerry want to show that they`ve been tough. They`ve
gone past these deadlines. They rang the last bit of concessions out of
Now, the question is, can they come together? The best prognosis is that
they might at the earliest tomorrow -- Steve.
KORNACKI: And, Andrea, as we say, there`s been so many delays in this
whole process. This is another two-day extension.
KORNACKI: If they don`t come together tomorrow, is Monday a hard deadline,
or is just there just another extension after that?
MITCHELL: I`m afraid to say it`s just another extension after that because
if they believe they`re making progress -- they`ve been doing this for 20
months. The feeling by the U.S. officials is that every time the Iranians
go back to Tehran, the U.S. loses ground because things have that been
conceded to at the table are criticized back home. They then have to
revisit a lot of this stuff.
The feeling by the Iranians is that every time John Kerry talks to people
in Washington, they lose ground. So, their accusations of reneging on both
Just a clarification, by the way, on John Kerry`s track record -- this
would be the longest time that a U.S. secretary of state has been overseas
on a single mission, but not compared to George Schultz, Jim Baker or Henry
Kissinger who traveled all the time for 30 days at a time, Henry
Kissinger`s record. But that would be ricocheting around the world on
different projects. This would be sitting in foreign capital for 15 days,
it`s pretty extraordinary and not devoting real attention to the rest of
the world. It`s a big commitment.
KORNACKI: All right. Andrea Mitchell in Vienna, keeping a close eye on
those negotiations. Obviously, that story playing out this weekend. We
will keep a close eye on it as well. Thank you, though, Andrea.
Joining me now is retired four-star U.S. General Wesley Clark. He was a
former NATO supreme allied commander and one-time Democratic presidential
General, first, I`m just curious, Andrea`s report right there, this issue
that emerged in the last few days about weapons sanctions, not nuclear
sanctions, weapons sanctions on a shipment of arms into and out of Iran.
Iran wants those sanctions eased as part of this. They say, hey, those
sanctions are in place because of the nuclear program. If we cut a deal in
the nuclear program, those sanctions should no longer be in place. The
Obama administration saying that`s a red line.
Do you think that`s something that has the potential to and that should
potentially trip up a deal?
GEN. WESLEY CLARK, FORMER NATO SUPREME ALLIED COMMANDER: Well, I think it
certainly has a potential to trip up the deal. But I think it`s also a
crucial mistake by Iran in the negotiations.
I`ll tell you why, Steve, because the big challenge for the United States
is to explain to the people and to the Congress why giving in to Iran`s
demand for nuclear energy and centrifuges and then releasing money back to
them that was held in the sanctions is in the long-term interest of the
United States, given the fact that Iran hasn`t committed to change its
conduct and is pursuing any number of military activities and other
aggressive activity in the region. It`s a terrorist state.
So, by opening up this new avenue of talk on conventional arm transfers,
Iran opens the door for the United States to come back with a new set of
demands, constraining Iran`s behavior. I hope that we`re doing that
because this is a much more constructive avenue of approach than simply a
one-off trade on the nuclear technology.
KORNACKI: I`m curious, though, what you think happens if this weekend
results in no deal. Andrea is saying probably if that happens, then this
Monday deadline becomes a new deadline maybe a couple days down the road.
But if these negotiations eventually fail to produce some kind of an
agreement, what is the way forward then?
CLARK: I think it`s continuing discussions on a new framework for an
agreement. I think we`re into a dialogue that`s going to continue and
continue and continue, because it`s not just about nuclear weapons. It`s
about the future of the region. It`s about terrorism. It`s about
conventional arms transfers.
And behind that conventional arms transfer request by Iran, of course, it`s
very easy to see what`s behind it. They not only want to develop a
deterrent capacity with ballistic missiles that can strike the U.S.
homeland or threaten to, but they also want improved air defenses so the
United States doesn`t have the military option.
So, I think they`ve made, as I say, a tactical mistake in bringing this
into the dialogue, but I think that if there`s a pause, if there`s an
adjournment, if there`s a temporary failure, I think you`re going to
continue to see continuing negotiations with Iran on a variety of issues.
Iran is a nation. It`s powerful. It`s got a young dynamic population. It
wants its place in the region and the United States is constraining that.
We want Iran to behave responsibly in the region. And between those two
sets of demands, that`s the stuff of dialogue and unfortunately maybe
conflict, more open conflict if it`s not resolved.
KORNACKI: Well, if there is a deal, of course, there`s now the aspect of
congressional opinion being offered. They`d have 60 days. Congress has
given themselves 60 days to weigh in on any deal that would be struck at
Given the resistance you`ve seen from so many in Congress already to the
idea of negotiations with Iran, let alone any deal that`s struck, what are
the keys in your mind of President Obama being able to sell a deal to Iran?
What are the key things he absolutely has to have in there to be able to
sell this deal to Congress?
CLARK: Well, I think it`s not only to say to Congress, well, what`s the
alternative if we don`t sign, he`s already rolled out the very heavy
penetrating bombs that would be the alternative conceptually if we didn`t
I think he`s got to be able to address Iran`s behavior in the domain after
there`s a signature. In other words, Iran gets $100 million. What do they
do? Go on an arms buying splurge, build a super highway into Syria so they
can roll columns of tanks in there and continue their conquest of the
Middle East? What`s going to happen?
Congress doesn`t want to endorse that, and neither does the president. So,
the president has got to come to terms with this issue and its explanation.
It really is about Iran itself, not just about the nuclear discussion.
KORNACKI: All right. Thanks as always to retired General Wesley Clark.
Appreciate your thoughts this morning.
CLARK: Thank you, Steve.
And still ahead, my interview with one of the greatest salespeople I`ve
ever met and you will ever meet. She isn`t even old enough to drive a car.
Before that, though, next Jeb Bush`s summer surge as the former Florida
governor finally emerging as the GOP front-runner.
KORNACKI: Some new developments to tell you about in the effort to reach a
deal with Greece that would keep the country in the Eurozone. The head of
the Eurogroup cautioning a deal is not as imminent as some might think.
The finance minister of the Netherlands saying there is, quote, "a major
issue of trust" on whether Greece can push through the reforms that are
needed. We`ll keep an eye on that.
And meanwhile, pivoting to politics -- after weeks of questions about the
direction of his campaign and maybe even his viability adds a candidate,
Jeb Bush is suddenly enjoying a surge. News breaking on Thursday that the
super PAC supporting him raised $103 million in the first half of the year.
That broke the $100 million goal that was widely reported to be that super
PAC`s goal. That is also on top of the $11.4 million that Bush`s actual
campaign raised in the 16 days that followed his formal entry into the
The former Florida government`s poll numbers are climbing as well, along
with its coffers, jumping 5 1/2 points in the Real Clear Politics polling
average, since his June 15th campaign launch and putting him almost six
points ahead of any other candidate.
"Politico`s" Eli Stokol calls this Jeb Bush`s summer surge but asks the
question, will it last?
Back at here the table to talk about this, we have our panel Elahe Izadi
with "The Washington Post", former Republican congresswoman from New York,
Nan Hayworth, and MSNBC`s Krystal Ball, co-host of "The Cycle".
So, let me put an idea out there. We always talk about on this show, we
talk about it, we`ve been -- everybody has been talking about it for the
last week. Donald Trump is doing so much damage to the Republican Party,
doing so much damage to all these Republican candidates, Nan, I think
Donald Trump is helping Jeb Bush.
KORNACKI: All those other candidates, nobody is hearing from them right
now. It`s just Jeb and Donald.
HAYWORTH: Right. Governor Bush is the grownup, he`s the professional. He
looks and sounds presidential. He gave a terrific announcement speech that
was very inspiring. He speaks Spanish at home. His wife is Latina. It`s
a marvelous --
KORNACKI: As Donald Trump pointed out. They`re basically attacking his
HAYWORTH: And for most people, that is what Donald Trump is doing, it`s
going to strike a sour note. And Governor Bush can instead look like the
man who is positive, who has solutions and who is going to be able to lead
us forward. That`s why I think he raised so much money, he`s a
BALL: I agree with your theory in the short-term at least. It is -- it
has been good for him because no one is paying attention -- people aren`t
thinking that much about Scott Walker`s announcement on Monday.
KORNACKI: Maybe that`s why he accidently tweeted it.
BALL: Maybe we figured it out. We haven`t heard much from Marco Rubio. I
think you`re absolutely right about that in the short term.
The question is, how much damage Donald Trump is doing to the Republican
Party brand and if that`s going to be the issue for Jeb Bush ultimately in
a general election? Because I think that`s the bigger problem. I mean,
the Republicans tried so hard to make this nominating process not to be the
clown car it was last time around. Now with Donald Trump in, it`s
officially a clown car again.
KORNACKI: I will say, trump has been good for Jeb Bush. I`m playing
ahead, Elahe, to that debate next month. I mean, there is -- of all the
candidates that Trump is running against, he`s delighting in tweaking Bush
more than the others. He`s on stage, pointing to him, pointing his finger
in his face. Jeb, you`re a loser, just get over the fact, you`re a loser,
you can`t stand up to Russia, can`t stand up to me.
IZADI: I`m really impressed by your --
KORNACKI: Thank you. I`m usually terrible at celebrity --
KORNACKI: I`ll do debate prep. Yes, hire me out for that.
I`m imagining, it becomes a thing, it`s not even a test of Jeb Bush as an
explainer of policies. It becomes this very almost like primal test.
Donald Trump is in your face, calling you names, telling you you`re a weak
person. You`ve got to stand up to him in a meaningful way on that stage.
IZADI: Yes, and if he can kind of come across as the grownup in the room
and as the one who is willing to stand up to Donald Trump even though
Donald Trump might be articulating some views that a segment of the base
really wants. If he can appear to be rising above that, that can
definitely appeal to not just primary voters but in a general.
So, I think he can play it that way. You`re right. It puts you in the --
I hope he`s prepared for that.
KORNACKI: How do you do it? It takes a certain amount of almost acting
skill. If you try to stand up to Donald Trump and you`re a little
hesitant, you`re a little tentative, stumble over your word, he`s going to
BALL: He`s not bound by facts. He will say whatever he feels like saying.
KORNACKI: If you hit him with statistics, he`ll say wrong numbers.
BALL: Wrong numbers. Yes, I mean, look, these debates we all know, as
much as we would love for them to be contest of ideas, people are left with
lasting impression that`s much more about the visuals and the tone and who
was tough and who was weak. I do think that`s going to be tough. And I do
think that Jeb needs to hire you as his debate prep coach --
KORNACKI: The 2000 presidential debate, it was Bush versus Gore. Gore was
coached in that third debate, a physical statement, his like, he`s sort of
alpha male-ness, and it is to walk up to George W. Bush while he was
speaking, it was a town hall meeting that. They could walk around the
It ended up this moment where Gore approaches him. It`s kind of awkward.
It`s kind of hesitant. And Bush just stops, looks at him and gives this
little nod. It was, to the extent the moment mattered, Bush clearly won
HAYWORTH: Well, Jeb -- Governor Jeb Bush needs what I -- I`m thinking of
Ronald Reagan as well. When Ronald Reagan was commanding in that primary
debate, decades ago when he said I paid for this microphone. And I`m going
to -- slightly different situation, but the same point, that he can look --
Jeb Bush can put -- he can put Donald Trump down in a very professional
way, then he will prevail. He`ll have an incredible opportunity.
KORNACKI: Right. It`s a huge opportunity. It`s a huge risk. I`ve got to
imagine, they`re all thinking, right now, what is the line? If Donald
comes after me, what`s the line?
But I just think the thing with Trump that`s different than the other
candidates, is like, you can prepare that line, you can rehearse it, you
can even deliver it well. And there`s a chance Trump is going to turn
right around, not miss a beat and you`re not going to know what to do.
BALL: And you`ve got nothing left.
KORNACKI: And it`s a bust instead of a breakthrough.
HAYWORTH: A test of improvisational skills.
IZADI: He should go to second city or something.
KORNACKI: After he finishes the Steve Kornacki school of debate
preparation. Right. It hasn`t failed anyone yet. It hasn`t worked for
KORNACKI: But anyway, still ahead: new revelations about Bernie Sanders`
life from the years before he became a U.S. senator.
And next, what just happened at Spain`s famous running of the bulls that
hasn`t happened in more than a century.
KORNACKI: All right. Starting now with something you`ll never see me do,
the running of the bulls in Pamplona, Spain. Four people were gored on the
fifth day of the festival. Five others suffered cuts and bruises. One of
the six bulls actually turned back and returned to its holding pen. It
didn`t want to run the race. It`s not really a race. But you know what I
Historians say the last time that happened was during a run in the 19th
century. Thousands of people packed the streets of Pamplona each summer
for the nine-day festival, either daring to run with the bulls themselves
or simply cheering on those who are brave, if brave is the right word,
brave enough to run.
We`re expecting an even larger crowd this September, interesting segue
here, at the Global Citizen Festival, Beyonce, Pearl Jam, Ed Sheeran and
Coldplay will headline the concert in Central Park here in New York on
Beyonce made this special announcement about it this week.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BEYONCE: I`m proud to announce Chime for Change will be joining Global
Citizen with the goal of ending extreme poverty by 2030. Chime for change
will be bringing hundreds of initiatives dedicated to education, health and
justice for girls and women everywhere.
So, please visit globalcitizen.org and choose how you can help. Thank you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KORNACKI: Also being told at this year`s Global Citizen Festival, there
will be no bulls.
For more information on this year`s festival including how to earn tickets,
go to globalcitizen.org. Be sure to join us on MSNBC on Saturday,
September 26th for special live coverage of that event. You`re not going
to want to miss it.
Still ahead, the Girl Scout who sold -- get this -- 22,000 boxes of
cookies, breaking her own world record with lessons for all of us about how
to close the deal. She`ll be along. That`s coming up.
And next: the news about Bernie Sanders that the senator manage to keep to
himself for his entire political career until now.
Stay with us.
KORNACKI: There`s very little we don`t seem to know about the key moments
in the life of Hillary Clinton -- childhood outside Chicago, student
commencement speaker of Wellesley, Yale Law School, marriage to her law
school classmate, partnership at the Rose law firm in Little Rock, as her
husband Bill built a political career, first in the Arkansas governor`s
office and then on the national stage, a daughter named Chelsea, the White
House, the Lewinsky scandal, the Senate, the State Department. Hillary
Clinton`s life in not an open book is at least a heavily scrutinized and
very familiar one.
But not so much for her closest rival for the 2016 Democratic nomination.
Senator Bernie Sanders of Vermont has managed to keep huge swaths of his
personal life off limits, even as he has succeeded in politics. First as
the mayor of Burlington, Vermont, then a congressman, now a U.S. senator
who is now running for president. Sanders is so private that it wasn`t
until yesterday that we learned that his only child, a son, was born out of
wedlock and not during his first marriage. We learned this in a "Politico"
magazine article titled "Bernie Sanders Has a Secret."
There`s absolutely nothing wrong with having a child out of wedlock,
obviously. It`s something that is notable in this context, only to point
out that if Hillary Clinton were the parent of an illegitimate child,
instead of Bernie Sanders, the nation not only would have heard about it
long before now, it would have been dissected over and over and over and
Bernie Sanders proves it is possible to be a United States senator and keep
large sections of your private life off limits. But can the same be said
once you`ve decided to run for president?
Joining us now is Michael Kruse, senior writer in "Politico" and the author
of that article about Senator Sanders. Michael joins us now.
Thank you very for taking a few minutes. Tell us the story of how you
learned this. Part of the story I`m interested in hearing is how you
reported it out, because you`re dealing with a senator who doesn`t ever
want to talk about his private life in any way.
MICHAEL KRUSE, POLITICO: Sure. Thanks for having me on.
So, I went up to Vermont, interested just broadly in Bernie Sanders in the
1970s, this fascinating formative time in which he went from perennial
third party loser to the mayor of Burlington, Vermont, in 1981.
My reporting took me somewhere frankly I didn`t expect to go, which was
making a public records request for the birth certificate of his son which,
of course, showed that the mother of the son is not Bernie Sanders` ex-wife
which had never been reported in 44 years of his public political life.
The story I wrote and the choices I made and how I provided the context was
not about that fact. It was about how that fact managed to not get
reported, managed to not get talked about at least publicly for so long. I
think it says something about Bernie Sanders and his priorities. It says
something about Vermont and the Vermont press corps and their priorities.
KORNACKI: Yes, it`s interesting. I mean, to read your article, there are
so many fascinating details in there. He tried to be a carpenter at one
point in the 1970s. Apparently, he was not a good carpenter.
He was living on unemployment insurance for a while. When he got his first
election as mayor of Burlington, he was 40 years old, about $30,000 a year.
So, it`s more money than he had ever made in his life. Some fascinating
But I guess the thing I took away was, this is a guy from Brooklyn, New
York, who wound up in Vermont after college, and he really found the
perfect place for himself.
KRUSE: He did. It suited him very, very well. It was the kind of place
where he could talk about what he wanted to talk about to a receptive
audience. He was a more racially oriented radical activist in college, but
when he gets to Vermont, he turns his focus to economic justice which he
had been talking about ever since with sort of startling consistency.
Vermont, they knew him or they knew of him and they`ve known of him for a
long, long time and they let him, for better or for worse, talk about what
he wanted to talk about.
KORNACKI: Let me bring the panel into this.
And I`m curious what you guys make of this. We always have debates about
what`s off limits, what`s fair game. Bernie Sanders has tried to draw this
line his whole political career, that basically nothing that isn`t
literally or explicitly about policy, nothing is relevant. He doesn`t want
to talk about anything. And he`s been successful as Michael is saying, in
establishing this zone of privacy.
Now, he`s running for president. The expectations in a national political
campaign, especially when you start to get some traction in the polling, a
BALL: Definitely a little different. To your point, he`s not only avoided
this sort of scrutiny, but he`s actually turned it into one of his core
principles, right? Like this campaign isn`t about me and my personality
and my life and where I lived and those sorts of things. It`s about the
principles, it`s about the policies, it`s about the people.
And so, he does something very effectively that usually Republicans are
much better at which is an attack and critique of the media. He says the
media doesn`t focus on what`s important, they`re trying to focus on my
personal life when people want to hear about how they`re going to get jobs
and how they put food on the table, which frankly I think is an argument
that continues to work in a presidential campaign.
KORNACKI: But it does seem -- how much do people want to know? You`ve
been a candidate before. How much do people want to know about you as a
person versus being what your policy positions are and everything?
HAYWORTH: I think people do like to -- certainly, it`s political trope
that people like to get to know you as a person, they`ll be hard pressed to
dislike someone who has a favorable biography. You know, you want to
present yourself in a favorable light, family, personal, whatever.
Personally, I agree with Bernie Sanders, it is about the policy. That`s
exactly right. But what I do want to know about the person, are you a
hypocrite? You know, if you are -- and he is not. He does not rail
against families who have children out of wedlock or any of those things.
HAYWORTH: So, I don`t see any evidence of hypocrisy in his background.
But what I do see key, the one in his personal life, what I do see that is
interesting is that he is -- that he lived for a long time on the benefits
of the state, if you will, and that`s not at odds with his policy stance,
so I give him that. But I do have a significant problem with choosing that
KORNACKI: I imagine former congresswoman --
HAYWORTH: Right, as a way of living.
KORNACKI: Michael, let me just ask you this. So, have you since this
article came out, have you heard from Senator Sanders, from his staff, from
the people around him? What`s been their reaction to this?
KRUSE: I think their reaction to my reporting even before the story ran,
when I talked to them before the story ran, their reaction was very calm,
very methodical. I thought it was impressive to be honest, answered every
question I had and then when I said, is there anything else that you`d like
to add, Michael Briggs, Bernie Sanders` spokesman, went back to the
policies which I thought was totally fair and reflected his priorities and
reflected his key issues.
The story I think gets at the fact that both of these things are fair game
when you`re running for president. People should focus on the issues. But
there are certain details about your personal life that should not be off
limits anymore, especially when you`re running for president. It all adds
up to the total package that people need to know about if you want people
to vote for you for president.
KORNACKI: Can never accuse Bernie Sanders, Krystal, of not being on
KORNACKI: That`s one takeaway.
My thanks to "Politico`s" Michael Kruse.
Up next, a world record holder joins me right here. We`re putting her
skills to the test with our very own original UP sales challenge. You are
not going to want to miss this.
KORNACKI: It is not every day that we have a world record holder on this
show, but yesterday, 13-year-old world record holder Katie Francis stopped
by UP world headquarters to have fun with us. Katie sold 22,200 boxes of
Girl Scout cookies this year, 22,200. Think of that for a second. That
shattered her own world record which she set last year.
Katie sells cookies so fast that she keeps 10,000 boxes of cookies stashed
in her garage at any given time. Now, Katie is addressing the Oklahoma
professional sales association this month. But yesterday, she was here and
we decided to put her to the test to find out just how good a sales woman
she actually is. We recruited some of my colleagues here at 30 Rock.
Check this out.
KORNACKI: You are a great salesperson obviously to sell that many cookies,
that small amount of time. What happens when somebody says no to you?
KATIE FRANCIS, COOKIE-SELLING CHAMP: Well, I just move on and try to find
the next person, because I found through the sale that about three out of
every five people will say yes. So, I`ve just got to find those three
KORNACKI: Some people say, what is the test of the ultimate salesperson?
It`s selling somebody something they don`t want or don`t need, right?
KORNACKI: Getting them to say, you know, I don`t need it but I want it
anyway. So, we thought we would bring three of my colleagues out, three of
my MSNBC colleagues out and we would have you sell them things that they
We`re going to change right now and go into, look at this, the elevator.
If you recognize this elevator at home, this is from the MSNBC show "YOUR
BUSINESS" that airs on Sunday mornings on this network. And they do
something called the elevator pitch. There`s no better person to welcome
to the elevator than JJ Ramberg, the host of "YOUR BUSINESS."
JJ, how are you?
JJ RAMBERG, YOUR BUSINESS" HOST: Hello, Steve.
FRANCIS: Nice to meet you.
RAMBERG: Nice to meet you, too. It`s fun to see you here.
KORNACKI: JJ is the host of the preeminent business show on all of
television, an expert on all things small business. So, you`re going to
try to sell her the book "Small Business for Dummies."
FRANCIS: Well, I saw online that you`ve done several articles for
"Entrepreneur." I wanted to start out by saying I love that magazine and I
actually subscribe and I`ve once been interviewed. So, my goal is to sell
20,000 of these books by 2020. And 20 percent will go to Make-A-Wish
Foundation and Compassion International.
RAMBERG: So, you did a good job because you went right into something I
care so bad about, which is socially responsible business. If you did
research on me, you know that I`m kind of a sucker for anybody that gives
back. So, I`m going to buy this book.
KORNACKI: Wow, she made a sale.
RAMBERG: I do not need this book, but I`m going to buy it for you.
KORNACKI: She is one for one.
So, JJ, thank you for joining us on the elevator.
RAMBERG: Thank you.
KORNACKI: Nice to see you.
And now, please welcome to the elevator, our MSNBC colleague, Colonel Jack
Jacobs, Medal of Honor recipient, military expert.
COL. JACK JACOBS (RET), MILITARY EXPERT: Hey, Steve.
KORNACKI: Welcome. This is Katie.
JACOBS: Pleased to meet you.
KORNACKI: This is an Army man, this is West Point through and through.
So, you`ve got to sell him something he doesn`t want or need. He doesn`t
want season tickets to the navy football team. Try to sell him that.
FRANCIS: Well --
JACOBS: Good luck.
FRANCIS: I know that you might not want these, but what they would is a
really good gift to someone from the Navy who can`t afford to go.
JACOBS: You`re appealing to my better nature, and you`re assuming I have a
better nature. But I`m Army, you know? I don`t have very much interest in
the Navy except insofar as they can use their planes to attack -- ships to
attack my enemy. No, Navy tickets?
KORNACKI: Can I give you a suggestion? Here is what I would suggest.
Navy has been a little better than Army recently.
KORNACKI: That means the value has gone up considerably. So, if you buy
these at a discount rate for her right now. You could turn around --
JACOBS: I might be interested -- I`m a businessman and I might be
interested in doing that. I -- there is a possibility I might be able to
scalp -- I mean I might be able to send them off to other people. You got
it, 10 percent discount, you got yourself a deal.
KORNACKI: She`s two for two.
Colonel jack, thank you very much.
Welcome to the elevator, Ronan Farrow.
How are you?
RONAN FARROW, MSNBC: Always a pleasure. A real pleasure to meet you. You
are quite the entrepreneur.
I know nothing about selling things. Tell me. Teach me your voodoo.
KORNACKI: What does Ronan Farrow not need?
FARROW: I`m dreading this.
KORNACKI: A copy of his mother`s autobiography, Mia Farrow`s "What Falls
Away", and yet, Katie is going to sell it to you and get you to buy it.
FARROW: I know the story, though. This is the problem. So, you`re in for
KORNACKI: Well, let`s see what she can do.
FARROW: There`s a great plot twist where I`m born. Jury is out how that
FRANCIS: Well, you can never have too many. It can be one for office, one
for home. You can always regift it. Plus I`m making a donation for 20
percent of my sales going to Compassion International and Make-A-Wish
Foundation. I just wanted to say I really admire all your work with that
kind of thing.
FARROW: Thank you, Katie. The flattery really works on me because I`m a
narcissist, Steve, so that works for me.
How much is this fabulous item that you`ve pitched so effectively?
FARROW: I`ll do it for two.
FRANCIS: Awesome, thank you so much.
FARROW: Thank you so much. What a lovely item.
KORNACKI: You can handle the business transaction off the set.
FRANCIS: You are going to do great things young lady. Great to meet you.
KORNACKI: All right, Katie Francis, well, you went three for three right
Katie Francis, it was so fun to meet you. Thank you for playing along.
You`re a very impressive sales woman.
KORNACKI: I had to make a confession to you as well, that book wasn`t
actually Mia Farrow`s. We couldn`t find a copy, so we printed out a cover
of it and taped it onto another book and sold it to Ronan anyway. So, she
really was a good sales girl.
Anyway, thanks to Katie Francis for sharing her sales skills with us here
in MSNBC. You can learn more about the organization and what they do at
girlscouts.org. And thank you to our friends over at "YOUR BUSINESS" for
letting us take a ride in their big industrial size elevator. You can
catch "YOUR BUSINESS" tomorrow and every Sunday morning at 7:30 Eastern. I
watch it every Sunday right before I come up here and do this show.
Only two weeks after the Supreme Court handed down its decision on same-sex
marriage, more history is going to be made this afternoon at the home of
the king of rock and roll. Graceland will be hosting its first same-sex
wedding. The couple which has been together for 15 years will get married
at the chapel at Graceland which has hosted hundreds of weddings over the
years, but not until the state of Tennessee recognized same-sex marriage
could they hold a same-sex ceremony. That`s happening today.
Up next on the show, another group of precocious kids was at the White
House yesterday playing chefs for the first family with some creative
culinary concoctions. A lot of C`s there. We`ll give you a taste after
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I also just wanted to let
you know that although I can`t stay to eat right, but I`ve looked over the
menu, and the food looks outstanding. I`m particularly impressed with the
Barack-omoli. So, I`m expecting people to save me a little sampling of the
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KORNACKI: So, f you were watching the show, I got the word wrong. I said
Barack-omoli. It was Barack-omoli, who knew?
That was President Obama addressing the Fourth Annual Kids State Dinner,
which was held yesterday at the White House. The event brought together 54
8- to 12-year-old chefs. All winners of the healthy lunch time challenge.
They shared original recipes like quinoa-crusted spinach, tofu pie, and
What a great event. I have to be honest --
IZADI: Would you eat any of that?
KORNACKI: What a terrible menu.
IZADI: Not your favorite?
KORNACKI: Come on. Put some chips, put some subs, put some pizza,
lasagna. Barack-aroni, I`ve called it?
BALL: The most sophisticated palate.
In my experience, in my limited experience with you, you don`t maybe have
the most sophisticated palate. You would do well to try some of these
KORNACKI: I have tried them and they`re disgusting. I just try --
KORNACKI: No insult to the kids. I`m sure they made delicious quinoa.
BALL: The real question if there were peas in the Barack-omoli.
IZADI: Yes, would you eat it?
KORNACKI: Yes, I would eat it.
BALL: Inquiring minds want to know.
KORNACKI: Trick question, I wouldn`t eat it either way.
KORNACKI: Let`s see what else. This is the "Catching Up" segment. What
else is in the headlines making news that we can talk about with the panel.
How about this? This is from "The Associated Press", the U.S. women`s
soccer team joins Taylor Swift on stage at a concert. This is fresh off
the ticker tape parade that was held her in New York City yesterday. I
know Krystal Ball was at that parade.
BALL: I did.
KORNACKI: The World Cup winners joined the pop star on stage last night at
MetLife Stadium. That`s the Meadowlands for her hit song "Style." The
team brought their trophy. They let Swift hold it on stage, seeing some of
BALL: Oh, man, that is so cool.
KORNACKI: What was the parade like yesterday?
BALL: Oh, it was unbelievable. So, I was actually at city hall where the
parade ended after they marched through the Canyon of Heroines. And people
got there at 9:00 a.m., the ceremony didn`t start until 1:00 p.m. And the
whole time, hour after hour, the energy was just amazing.
They had a female deejay playing these female empowerment anthems including
Taylor Swift. Everybody was dancing and getting down, all these little
girls decked out in their patriotic garb. It was just an amazing
atmosphere, this very girl power patriotic party, a lot of fun.
KORNACKI: "Politico" tells us Ted Cruz is feuding with "The New York
Times" and loving it. "The New York Times," of course, this is the news
yesterday, refusing to put Cruz`s memoir, "Time for Truth" on its
bestseller list because it says sales were mostly strategic bulk purchases.
Now, Cruz`s publisher, Harper Collins said they found no evidence of bulk
orders. The Cruz spokesman responding, "We call `The Times`, release your
so-called `evidence`. Demonstrate your charge isn`t a naked fabrication
designed to cover up your own partisan agenda."
Well, I predict that even if it wasn`t actually selling that well before,
this book is going to sell like crazy with conservatives now.
IZADI: "The Times" gave Ted Cruz a big present right there.
HAYWORTH: An alignment of incentives.
KORNACKI: So, if it wasn`t on this week`s list, I think we can probably
look for the Ted Cruz book on next week`s. Do we have any time here?
One quick one here. NBC sports, a 108-year-old woman is going to be
throwing out the first pitch at tonight`s Seattle Mariners game. Evelyn
Jones, the oldest person ever to throw out the ceremonial first pitch --
congratulations to you, Evelyn. That is amazing. That`s my favorite story
of the day.
We`ve got to end it on that. My thanks to our panel, Elahe Izadi, Nan
Hayworth, Krystal Ball. Thank you all for being here.
And thank you for getting UP with us today. Join us tomorrow, Sunday
morning, 8:00 a.m. Eastern Time. I`ll have U.S. Senator Chris Murphy from
Connecticut on the very latest on the Iran negotiations, including gun
reform be back on the table after the Charleston massacre.
But before that, you`re going to want to watch Melissa Harris-Perry. She
is coming up next.
Have a great Saturday.
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