Skip navigation

All In With Chris Hayes, Monday, July 13th, 2015

Read the transcript from the Monday show

  Most Popular
Most viewed

Date: July 13, 2015
Guest: Jess McIntosh, Al Franken, Julio Vaqueiro, Antonio Villaraigosa


CHRIS HAYES, MSNBC HOST (voice-over): Tonight on ALL IN --

for president to fight and win for the American people.

HAYES: Scott Walker makes it 15 major Republican presidential
candidates. But is there any oxygen left in the GOP field?

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: And we`re going to take the
country back.

HAYES: Then, Senator Al Franken joins me on a bill to protect LGBT

Plus, the drug lord of the century escapes a Mexican prison again.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A daring, highly sophisticated scheme involving a
mile-long tunnel beneath the prison wall.

HAYES: And "ALL IN America: Water Wars". We`re here in California,
and tonight, the California drought like you`ve never quite seen it before.

ALL IN starts right now.


HAYES: Good evening from Orange County, California. I`m Chris Hayes.

I`m standing in front of Peters Canyon reservoir. And that dusty
patch of white behind me is where the water should be. Instead, this is
what an historic water shortage looks like. A shortage so historic, it`s
the worst in the history of the state.

In fact, it`s so dry out here, when our crew pulled up to set up this
very live shot, this is what they saw -- huge brush fire, which reportedly
spread across about 150 acres. Air tankers were called in, a road was shut
down and some people at a nearby lake had to be evacuated.

The risk of fire is, of course, an all-too common reality in southern
California, exacerbated even more now during this drought. And it`s part
of why we`re here. California, this week of "ALL IN America: Water Wars".

We`ll have much more on what the water shortage is doing in this state
ahead, but we begin tonight with the Republican presidential race which
continues to get more and more crowded. After months in campaigning in
everything but name, Wisconsin Governor Scott Walker officially declared
his candidacy today, becoming the 15th major candidate to vie for the
Republican nomination, that puts another 100 points on the board for Sam
Seder, who managed to poach Governor Walker from Josh Barro in our 2016
fantasy candidate draft.


JOSH BARRO, NEW YORK TIMES: Well, I think people have been
overthinking this. I want the number one candidate, right?


BARRO: I will take number one.

HAYES: Genius. Genius. Josh Barro, a genius. Number one is Scott


ANNOUNCER: Scott Walker. They call him Mr. Unrecallable. Winner of
three elections in four years, never mind how many staffers went to jail.

He`s Wisconsin Governor Scott Walker.


HAYES: That is big. That is big.


HAYES: Scott Walker right now. I`d like to say, we`re having a Scott
Walker moment in this country, I think, after his performance in Iowa.
There`s lots of buzz. Lots of people very excited. He kind of did his
father -- his father was a Baptist preacher. He did his Baptist preacher
routine at the lectern.

BARRO: He`s sort of having a moment, but, you know, I wouldn`t
overstate it too much. I would say, for example, Jeb Bush looks like a
really formidable candidate.


BARRO: For the Republican nomination, so if I were deciding between
Scott Walker and Jeb Bush --

HAYES: I see what you`re doing there, Josh.

BARRO: I would probably go with Jeb Bush.

HAYES: I see what you`re doing there.

All right, whammy pick. We`ve got to do the whammy pick. Sam?


HAYES: Who are you taking?


SEDER: Josh wants me to take Jeb Bush. I`m going with Scott Walker.

HAYES: He got Scott Walker. You got Sarah Palin. Strong whammy


HAYES: Walker got off to a strong start, politically courting GOP
base voters with some impressive appearances in Iowa, but a series of
gaffes on foreign policy and other issues helped raise doubts about his
preparedness. And now, he`s looking to regain his lost momentum.

Unfortunately for Walker, most of the oxygen in the race is still
being sucked up by Donald J. Trump, who spent the weekend campaigning out
West, including at a rally in Arizona, with the famously anti-immigrant
Sheriff Joe Arpaio. Trump`s inflammatory statements about Mexican
immigrants continue to be a major topic of conversation on the Sunday talk
shows yesterday, with some of his 2016 rivals divided about his impact on
the race.


into an anger that I hear every day. People are angry that a common sense
thing like securing the border or ending sanctuary cities is somehow
considered extreme. It`s not extreme. It`s common sense. We need to
secure the border.

doing is being a demagogue. I think he`s uninformed about the situation
regarding the illegal immigrant population.

What happened in San Francisco is appalling. But it does not
represent the 11 million. I think he`s hijacked the debate. I think he`s
a wrecking ball for the future of the Republican Party with the Hispanic
community, and we need to push back.


HAYES: Today, yet another national poll shows Trump in the top two
among the GOP candidates. He`s right behind Jeb Bush with 13 percent in
new Monmouth University poll of Republican voters, up from just 2 percent a
month ago.

Why Trump`s had the highest negatives in the field, a sign his support
could only grow so far, that appears to have completely turned around in
this latest poll. As "Washington Post`s" Fix Blog points out Trump`s
favorability, this is among Republican voters, went from 35 points under
water last month, 20 percent favorable, versus 55 percent unfavorable, to
breaking more or less even today.

Joining me now, MSNBC political analyst and former RNC chair, Michael

Michael, let`s start with Trump and then talk about Walker.


HAYES: The issue here to me is this -- when I think about how these
15 people are going to distinguish each other substantively and
rhetorically, the -- most of them agree on most things, right? They`re
going to be against regulation --

STEELE: Yes, for the most part.

HAYES: -- cut taxes, smaller government, et cetera. There`s a few
places, some stuff on foreign policy, Syria and Iraq, and immigration is
going to be one of the biggest sites of biggest contention, which means
it`s going to dominate as an issue in the campaign, don`t you think?

STEELE: I do. I would not have said that three weeks ago or four
weeks ago, but I believe now, given the way Donald Trump has played this
particular card, it will be -- even if the issue subsides, Chris, even if
something else takes over the storyline for a few days, weeks or even a
month, this is still now going to be a subtext for a lot of the individuals
standing on that stage, because Donald Trump has now put it squarely in
front of folks. I was out in Vegas this past weekend for -- and it was
hysterical. In one sense, listening to people describe Donald Trump, with
excitement and energy and verve.

And then you have the story that broke with, you know, the Mexican
drug lord escaping the prison and folks were like, yes, Donald Trump was
right, told you so.

So, you know, that attitude starts to take hold and finds some deep
roots within the party, it`s going to be -- it could potentially have a
stranglehold on the conversation, to Lindsey Graham`s point.

HAYES: And when you look at Scott Walker, who got in the race today,
one of the issues that he has quite explicitly change his position on is on
the path to citizenship. He supported it, he now has rejected his previous
support, he rejects a path to citizenship. And I think he`s probably
making a smart play, tactically, about what the lay of the land is in the
Republican primary, but that`s precisely the problem.

STEELE: Well, yes. Barack Obama`s proved that we can all evolve
politically on these issues. But barring that, if that`s not what`s here,
but there is something to what you`re saying, a strategic political
calculation, he`s calculating correctly. And I think that in terms of how
this thing plays out for others, they now have to figure out, where do we
cut him off at the pass?

You know, I suggested last week, I think the RNC is a good place to
begin to do that, with the chairman sort of creating the off-ramp, if you
will, by helping Donald dial this back a little bit. But knowing Donald
the way we all do, that`s not going to happen.

So, these folks are still left with having to decide where they cut
him off in order to have the kind of conversation on immigration, since
that`s going to be, as you noted, a dominant sub-story now, that they want
to have. It`s going to be a real problem for him. I don`t see -- I don`t
see the clearing between now and the first debate. Maybe after that,
depending on what happens there, but between now and then, this is going to
be a driver.

HAYES: Walker`s argument today in his announcement speech and one of
the arguments he`s going to make, is basically, I`m the right wing of the
possible, right? I mean, I am the most conservative person in this race
who also has proven that I can implement this vision, I can go after
unions, I can go after voter ID and get that done, I can slash the budget,
I can cut funding at universities, I can take on all the left`s sacred cows
and I can live to tell about it. I can actually implement.

And I got to say, if I were a conservative Republican primary voter,
that would be a very attractive message that he`s essentially the right
wing of the possible.

STEELE: I think that is exactly the way he`s dialed it up. And you
hit it right on the head. He laid out today a very workman-like speech.
It was more of a stump speech than a presidential announcement speech. It
was -- it was folksy, it was personal talking about, you know, shopping at
Kohl`s and getting the bargain deals and relating his experiences to every
other person in the country.

And I think that from the perspective of the question, you know, we
want to nominate the most conservative who can win, Scott Walker today
tried to fill in that question mark with his answer, being him.

HAYES: Now, that electability question is interesting to see one of
Jeb Bush`s people retweeting analysis, says, look, this guy won three
elections when turnout in the most Democratically heavy areas of Wisconsin
are much lower, including in Milwaukee County, where he used to be county

Michael Steele is going to stick around with us.

As Donald Trump keeps pulling his party`s discourse on immigration,
particularly to the right, Hillary Clinton continues to stake out
rhetorical ground on economics to the left. In an economic speech this
morning in New York, she blamed decades of Republican policy for helping to
foster income inequality in this country, calling out some of her GOP
opponents by name.


Governor Bush say last week that Americans just need to work longer hours.
Well, he must not have met very many American workers.


Take a good look at their plans. Senator Rubio`s would cut taxes for
households making around $3 million a year by almost $240,000, which is way
more than three times the earnings of a typical family.

Republican governors like Scott Walker have made their names stomping
on worker`s rights. And practically all the Republican candidates hope to
do the same as president.


HAYES: While "Politico" reports that Jeb Bush is planning to take an
Uber on Thursday during a visit to San Francisco, highlighting the company
as an emblem of the disruptive innovation he says is key to economic
growth, Clinton sounded an alarm or at least a cautious note about its
potential impact on worker protections.


CLINTON: This on-demand or so-called gig economy is creating exciting
opportunities and unleashing innovation. But it`s also raising hard
questions about workplace protections and what a good job will look like in
the future.


HAYES: Former RNC chair, Michael Steele, is still here with us.

We`re joined by Jess McIntosh, deputy communications director for
Emily`s List.

And, Jess, it appears to me out of the gate that, on economic
messaging and indeed from the entire campaign perspective messaging from
Hillary Clinton, it`s going to be focused primarily on middle class wages.
Wages, wages, wages, they`re not growing fast enough. People aren`t seeing
the gains of the economy in their pocket.

Here`s my question for you: How do you make that case after six,
seven, eight years of Barack Obama as the president, how do you make the
case that this is a problem and not blame the president that you are not
going to want to distance yourself from when trying to assemble his

JESS MCINTOSH, EMILY`S LIST: Right. And I think she did a really
good job of that at the very start of her speech, where she praised the
president for getting us out of an incredibly large hole that Americans,
frankly, have a memory long enough to remember that Republicans dug for us,
by spending like crazy in foreign wars and tax cuts to millionaires.

And all of the Republicans on the other side of the aisle seem to want
to go straight back to those policies that got us in that hole in the first
place and we know that the economy, while Americans are starting to feel
pulling out of the recession, it`s just starting to become a reality for
them, we know that we have a long way to go, and we know that we certainly
don`t want to go backwards.

So, I think she`s doing a very smart thing and it`s -- it`s capturing
what Americans are thinking right now, which is, I`m aware that the economy
is getting better, I`m starting to see the signs of that, it`s my own
pocketbook that I feel is not -- is not quite where it ought to be. And
they know which party to blame that on.

HAYES: Michael, I thought the Jeb Bush comment a few days ago about
working longer hours was interesting. Because I think in some sense it`s
divorced from what the data how many hours Americans work, but it also
surfaced to me, this core issue which is what is the Republican solution
going to be to this central question of middle class incomes and middle
wages? It`s not -- it can`t -- it`s not going to be tax cuts, I don`t
think. Maybe it`s tax cuts and deregulation, but trying to explain to
people how you get from A to B, that seems to me the nut that Republicans
have to crack.

STEELE: Well, I think -- let`s start with the Jeb Bush comment and I
think we have to put it in the context as I heard it, at least, that he was
talking about those workers out there who had once full-time jobs, who now
have part-time jobs. You have to address those employers who are not
hiring people but for 35 or 37 hours, not a full 40-hour week. So, that`s
the context in which he was talking about, giving the workers more hours to
work, so that they can go back to full employment, if you will, to full-
time employment. So, I think that`s one piece.

The other piece I think here, you hit a very interesting potentially
sore spot for the GOP as the numbers begin to move in and continue to move
in a progressive way towards economy growing and all of that. How do they
begin to talk about this economy, how do they begin to talk about tax
policy, regulatory policy in a way that brings the voters into their orbit
so they understand what long-term growth looks like, so they understand
what secure job opportunities are.

And quite honestly, the first lady referred to -- Hillary Clinton
referred to this gig economy. Well, yes, that`s a new dynamic, and there`s
some things to be concerned about. But going after an Uber in this type of
economy is not necessarily the way to do it, which is why Jeb Bush wants to
lift up those businesses opposed to trying to figure out how to control

MCINTOSH: I do think --

HAYES: I love this, I --


MCINTOSH: Sorry. Go ahead.

HAYES: Go ahead, Jess.

MCINTOSH: I think it`s really interesting that she was the one that
was talking about a 21st century economy. They keep trying to tag her with
the politics of yesterday or whatever line that they have. But she was
that was talking about our economic realities as it is in the 21st century.
She was the one who brought up Uber and Airbnb and the gig economy, which I
think we`re all aware of and feeling, and just haven`t named.

The other really important thing that she did was say that women`s
issues weren`t women`s issues anymore, they were economic issues. And that
is so true.

She`s the only one recognizing that the economy is going to improve,
when we start valuing and paying for 51 percent of our workforce. She`s
the only one talking about ending gender discrimination in pay.
Republicans can`t even figure out whether that`s a real thing or not.
She`s talking about paid sick leave, she`s talking about fair scheduling,
she`s talking about issues that have frankly never been part of the "how do
we grow the economy?" conversation.

HAYES: Right.

MCINTOSH: She`s making it a front and center part of the
conversation, and that`s the only way that we can have a 21st century
economy that reflects the realities of its workers.

STEELE: But you`re still left with the question, who pays?

HAYES: Well, I`ve always thought, Michael, that the biggest problem
that Mitt Romney had in 2012 was that the best critique of the Obama
economy was essentially a critique from the left on distributional grounds.
It was basically, look, rich people are doing well. The stock market has
come roaring back.


HAYES: The banks have been made whole, how are you doing? But the
problem is, it was impossible for a Republican to, for a million reasons,
both credibly make or even make that case. And we`re going to see another
iteration of it in this campaign. That`s going to be the thing
rhetorically they`re going to have to figure out.

Michael Steele and Jess McIintosh, always a pleasure. Thank you both.

STEELE: Good to see you, Chris.


HAYES: Still ahead, news today in the slow and steady march towards
LGBT equality. We`re going to talk to Senator Al Franken about his
initiative to help the cause.

Then, the almost unbelievable escape of a notorious Mexican drug

And later, we`ll break down the California drought in our first story
for "ALL IN America: Water Wars."

Stick around.


HAYES: When news circulated yesterday about an infamous feared
Mexican drug lord escaping from prison, many things sprung to mind -- for
instance, oh, that`s terrible. Where could this highly dangerous person be
at this moment? Or, who helped, who`s in on it. Or, if you`re Donald
Trump, I told you so.

And in fact, with regard to El Chapo, the Mexican drug kingpin who
escaped a maximum security prison via a tunnel, Trump tweeted, "Mexico`s
biggest drug lord escapes from jail, unbelievable corruption and the U.S.
is paying the price. I told you so."

One thing about which everyone can agree, Joaquin "El Chapo" Guzman is
a hugely wealthy, highly dangerous criminal, and now, once again, he`s on
the loose. That`s ahead.


HAYES: A little more than two weeks after the U.S. Supreme Court made
marriage equality the law of the land, and every day, it seems, we`re
seeing more steps on the march towards progress. Today, the Pentagon
announced it is putting the finishing touches on a plan that will allow
transgender people to openly serve in the military, beginning early next

In a statement, Defense Secretary Ash Carter acknowledged that similar
to the "don`t ask, don`t tell" policy, which was lifted in 2011, there are
already plenty of transgender people serving in uniform. He said, quote,
"We have transgender soldiers, sailors, airmen and marines who I know are
being hurt by an outdated, confusing, inconsistent approach that`s contrary
to our value of service and individual merit."

Also today, the Boy Scouts of America moved to accept gay troop
leaders, saying in a statement, quote, "This resolution will allow charter
organizations to select adult leaders without regard to sexual

These are important steps towards progress, but the LBGT community
arguably faces the most discrimination and harassment as kids and

A survey last year by the Gay, Lesbian and Straight Education Network
found that 70 percent of LBGT students were harassed due to their sexual
orientation, while 55 percent of students said they were harassed because
of their gender expression. Still, there is no federal law that explicitly
prohibits the bullying of kids based on real or perceived sexual
orientation or gender identity. Senator Al Franken is trying to do
something to change that.

And joining me now is Senator Al Franken, Democrat from Minnesota.

Senator, it`s great to have you here.


HAYES: I don`t think anyone would look at the situation that so many
LGBT kids face in school and think -- well, that`s fine, that these kids
are getting harassed. Some are being so horribly hurt by bullying. They
are killing themselves.

The question seems to me, whether this is something the federal
government is in the best position to address. Why do you want to see
federal law on this?

FRANKEN: Well, this has become sort of epidemic. Today, I gave a
speech on this on the floor and showed the pictures of three boys, a 15-
year-old, 13-year-old, and 11-year-old who committed suicide because they
were being bullied, harassed at school.

Thirty percent of LGBT students reported that they`ve missed a day of
school in the last 30 days because they were afraid. And it`s hard to
learn when you`re -- when you dread going to school.

We`re now taking up an education bill on the floor of the Senate. I
have a bill, the Student Nondiscrimination Act, which would give LGBT kids
certain rights that are already extended to kids on -- to students on the
basis of their race, their gender, their country of national origin, if
they have disabilities. And all this would do is simply give LGBT kids who
are the target of so much of this bullying, that it would give them some

And in so many cases, these kids who just can`t take it anymore kill
themselves, and their parents have been telling the school and asking the
school to do something. And this law would say the school has to do

That -- and, look, I`m a United States senator. We`re all adults in
the Senate. Our job should be to protect children. We had 64 votes near
the end of 2013 for the ENDA, the Employment Nondiscrimination Act, which
protects -- it didn`t get passed in the House and didn`t become law, but
lots of states have this, Minnesota has it. And it protects adults around

This is about children. This is about protecting children, and it`s -
- we should do this. And I -- I -- it`s going to come up for a vote this
week, and I want everybody`s help, if they can, if they have a senator whom
they know or whose office you can call, especially Republicans, I have the
support of virtually every Democrat and some Republicans. It`s bipartisan.
But this is something that really needs to be done.

HAYES: You`ve been working on this since 2010, if I`m not mistaken.
I`m curious how the politics -- I mean, 2010 in some ways in this issue
might as well be 1910 in terms of how quickly things have changed. Not
just around gay kids, but also transgender kids.

Describe for me why you think you can get this passed now and what the
politics look like now.

FRANKEN: Well, take ENDA. In 2009, I`m on the health committee,
health, education, labor and pension. This new education bill is something
that we passed out of the Health Committee. We had a Health Committee
hearing on ENDA in 2009, and actually not one Republican showed up for the

Then, just a few years later, in November of 2013, we passed it with
10 Republican votes. We had 60 -- it passed 64-32.

And this is simply extending the same rights that these other students
have -- I want LGBT students to have the same rights, not some of the same
rights. So, this is -- this is to make sure that our kids aren`t afraid to
go to school and a tremendous percentage of LGBT kids, as your statistics
show, say that they are harassed. Many of them assaulted because of --
they are either perceived to be LGBT or identify as LGBT.

HAYES: There`s been -- there`s been a lot of discussion about the
campaign, obviously, as it ramps up, presidential campaign. And something
I wanted to ask you for a very long time is this: you got elected in 2008
and you got elected in a year that was this high water mark in terms of
Democratic turnout. It was a very narrow margin of victory. It was very
contested by your opponent, eventually you got seated.

Six years later, it was just a blood bath for Democrats across the
country, get knocked out left and right, a very different electorate. And
somehow, you cruised through pretty easy re-election.

I always wonder like, what is -- what is the secret? What did you
figure out in those six years that got you from point A to point B?

FRANKEN: Well, I don`t think it`s just one thing. I think the people
of Minnesota had some skepticism about someone who had a career in comedy,
and in that campaign, the other side did everything they could to take
advantage of that skepticism.

So, I think that Minnesotans saw over the last six years that I`ve
worked very hard on their behalf, and on behalf of middle class people and
people aspiring to be in the middle class. And I think that message
prevailed in my race, certainly, and I think that -- I think our party as a
whole has learned that and has moved in that direction.

I think that`s what the American people really care about. That, you
know, Paul Wellstone, who held this seat, said once -- or maybe several
times, that we all do better when we all do better. And I think that`s
true. And it`s true that when there`s a strong middle class, and there`s a
path from those aspiring to be in the middle class, from being poor or in
working class, to get to the middle class, that`s when the country does

And we all do better when we all do better, including people at the
top. That was -- that happened in the Clinton administration, to some

So, I think that is -- that`s the thinking that has prevailed. And
I`ve staked out, you know, leadership on certain issues and certainly one
of them has been LGBT rights.

HAYES: Senator Al Franken of Minnesota, always a pleasure. Wonderful
having you on. Thanks a lot.

FRANKEN: Thanks a lot, Chris.

HAYES: Still to come, a massive manhunt is under way in Mexico after
one of the world`s most notorious drug kingpins staged an elaborate escape
from a high security prison for the second time. Details ahead.


HAYES: High stakes drama happening in Vienna as the Iran nuclear
talks continue. There are indications we could be on the verge of what
would be an absolutely historic deal with an announcement possible within
the next day. The latest meeting between the U.S. and five other world
powers negotiating with Iran just wrapped up within the last hour and if a
deal is reached, it would represent a major breakthrough for U.S.-Iranian
relations and geopolitics in the region and worldwide.

It would also represent the culmination of talks that began secretly
between the U.S. and Iranian officials three years ago and have since
greatly intensified.

We`ll will keep you posted on any announcement of a deal if and when
it arrives.


HAYES: A massive man hunt continues in Mexico tonight after the
escape from prison of a man who was once the world`s richest and most
powerful drug trafficker and who is now once again perhaps the most wanted
fugitive on the planet. Sinaloa cartel leader Joaquin Guzman, best known
by his nickname El Chapo.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Guzman was last seen on a security camera Saturday
night entering a shower area. There, out of camera range, he slipped into
a 20 by 20 inch hole, down a ladder, into an elaborate ventilated tunnel
made of wood and PVC pipe with a small motorized rail car.

The tunnel stretched for about a mile under the prison from a half-
built house in a farm field.


HAYES: This was Guzman`s second escape from a maximum security prison
in Mexico. He was on the lam for 13 years before being rearrested last
year. And his escape is a huge embarrassment for Mexican authorities who
had refused to extradite Guzman to the U.S. for prosecution and insisted he
could not escape again.

Guzman`s Sinaloa cartel is estimated to control at least 25 percent of
illegal drugs entering the U.S. It is known for bribery, deep connections
to Mexican authorities and horrific, horrific violence.

Guzman pioneered the use of tunnels to smuggle drugs across the border
and had relied on networks of tunnels to evade capture, including one
hidden under a bathtub.

An intense search for Guzman is now underway with stepped up security
at airports and border crossings and masked commandos halting vehicles on
nearby roadways.

These photos, reportedly released by one of Guzman`s sons, purport to
Guzman after his escape Saturday night. Though NBC news could not confirm,
they are indeed Guzman. And a former DEA official says tells NBC News that
while they do appear to show El Chapo, the official finds it difficult to
believe that Guzman`s son would give authorities any clues as to his
current whereabouts.

Joining me now is Telemundo`s Los Angeles anchor Julio Vaqueiro who
has long covered the Guzman saga.

Julio, the first thought I think everyone -- if anyone had read about
that first prison break is I cannot believe this happened again, and that
maybe the second thought is of course it happened again, because it`s the
same conditions, the same guy with the same kind of pull and power and
corruption in the Mexican state that allowed it to happen the first time.

JULIO VAQUEIRO, TELEMUNDO ANCHOR: It is -- Chris, thank you for
having me. It is extremely embarrassing for the Mexican government,
unbelievable. And no one can explain this without thinking on corruption.

Definitely, Joaquin "El Chapo" Guzman received help from inside the
prison, in order to build this sophisticated tunnel, 1.5 kilometers tunnel,
in order to build it and escape without being noticed.

So yes, corruption definitely takes place in this saga. And the
question now is, how far up corruption reaches the Mexican government.

HAYES: And this has been a question, when the students went missing
and their bodies are still being searched for, huge protests in Mexico City
all about the nexus of official state violence and the cartels and the
violence that has sort of immolated Mexico.

How much of a political problem, how much political pushback and
unrest are we going to see as a result of this?

VAQUERIO: Well, it`s a huge political problem for Mexican government
for Enrique Pena Nieto`s government. He has been really weak for the last
year after, as you said, 43 students went missing in Guerrero, and now
scandal after scandal has been affecting this government.

And Joaquin "El Chapo" Guzman is probably the worse nightmare that the
Mexican government could have, and it`s an extremely high price that they
are paying, because they have refused to extradite "El Chapo" to the U.S.
This -- his capture was a sort of a proud medal for the Mexican government
and now you have the results of that.

HAYES: Well, I guess the question now is, when you hear the news of -
- you know, they`re searching for him and then you are thinking well,
clearly there`s some portion of authorities that must have collaborated in
this escape. What are the odds of him actually being captured?

VAQUEIRO: Yes, a lot of people doubt he`s going to be recaptured. If
he managed to build this tunnel, to achieve this sophisticated escape, he
might be able to go free for good.

So we`ll wait and see. Definitely U.S. authorities are working hard
to capture him. And also Mexican authorities, according to the Mexican
officials. But we`ll have to wait. It is difficult to really think he will
be recaptured.

HAYES: You can imagine if he is recaptured, that extradition fight is
going to be even more heated this time around. Julio Vaqueiro, thank you
very much. Appreciate it.

VAQUEIRO: Thank you very much, Chris.

HAYES: Coming up, we`ll bring you our first story from the road in
the latest addition of All In America. You`re definitely going to want to
see that. Stay tuned.


HAYES: As I mentioned at the top of the hour, there`s a reason I`m
standing here in front of Peters Canyon Reservoir in Orange County,

Here is what this reservoir looked like in 1966. Here`s what it
looked like just four years ago, and here`s what it looks like now. Bone

This is what it looks like where the water supply is historically low
in a state where everyone is fighting for every last drop. We`ll have much
more on what`s happening in California when we come back.


HAYES: We`re here in California, a state in the grip of a devastating
drought more than a century in the making. That dusty patch of land behind
me is meant to be a reservoir. And all this week, we`ll be bringing you
stories from all over the state from the central valley to San Diego
looking at all the different ways this historic water shortage will impact
not just the state of California, but the entire country and what that
means for a future era of climate crisis.


UNIDENTIFEID MALE: California is dealing with its growing drought

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The state of California is resorting to drastic

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: California is in the midst of a drought of
unprecedented scale.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It is being called the drought of our lives.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And the worst could be yet to come.

HAYES: As long as there have been people in California, there have
been people obsessed with California`s water. And in the 120 years of
official recordkeeping, the driest years ever recorded have been the last

Things are getting desperate.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The problem has gotten so bad in the Central
Valley that the Madera County sheriff`s department says thieves are
stealing people`s water.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: An East Bay drought hotline has been inundated
with calls from people complaining about neighbors who waste water.

HAYES: As any Californian will tell you, the drought is not just
their problem, it`s everyone`s problem.

biggest economy. California is our biggest agricultural producer. So what
happens here matters to every working American.

HAYES: California`s nearly $50 billion farming industry producing
everything from dairy and beef to fruit and vegetables. The state`s
agricultural heartland is the Central Valley, and it produces a quarter of
the nations food.

And all that food requires a lot of water.

80 percent of California`s water is used for agriculture. And that
means that you, the average American, are consuming more than more than 300
of California water each week by eating the food produced here.

Some foods are more water intensive than others. One slice of
avocado, over four gallons, one bunch of grapes 24 gallons, three mandarin
oranges, over 42 gallons.

So where does the water come from to produce all that food? Much of
it comes from here, the Sierra Nevada mountains where every spring the
melting snow pack replenishes the state`s crucial reservoirs. Right now
that snow pack is at
historic lows. And that means the state`s reservoirs are in trouble,
leading experts to make a dire prediction.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: After the driest January on record, California`s
reservoirs may hold just one year`s water supply.

HAYES: With reservoirs running dry, farmers are turning to ground
water. Over time, ground water accumulates in vast underground aquifers,
but now, over the past few years, groundwater levels have dropped 50 feet
or more as farmers drill deeper and deeper to access it.

framework that has been resisted for a long, long time. Since before my
father was even governor.

HAYES: 10 months ago, California became the last state in the entire
west to regulate groundwater usage. The state`s first ever mandatory water
restriction soon followed.

BROWN: We`re in an historic drought and that demands unprecedented

HAYES: A 25 percent reduction in water usage statewide has forced
residents and businesses to cut back. But that mandatory reduction doesn`t
include farmers, which has led to a backlash.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Critics say the farming industry uses the most
water statewide. Brown says he will reexamine the issue if the drought

HAYES: Cities and water agencies have implemented their own
conservation measures, but no one knows if it will be enough, and no one
knows when this drought will come to an end. What we do know is that the
era of climate change is upon us. And the extraordinary in California
today will very likely become the ordinary of tomorrow.


HAYES: Up next, we`ll talk to the former mayor of Los Angeles about
what he tried to do to handle the drought.


HAYES: Joining me now, the former mayor of Los Angeles Antonio
Villaraigosa. It`s great to have you here. Thanks for coming down to
Orange County.

You know, as I was flying out here, I was rereading this classic back
about water in the west called Cadillac Desert. And it`s an amazing book,

It`s all about the fact that this is an impossible dream that all of
this exists because of the way that people figured how to use the water out
here. And he`s got this line -- it`s written in 1986 -- he says, "who
knows about California? If we can keep it all going if California gets

And then he says in parenthesis with climate change, this is 1986, and
carbon emissions, it`s expected to get drier.

So, it`s not like people couldn`t have seen this coming.

you know, in 2008, we put a water supply plan together that addressed the
issue of increasing recycling six fold by 2019.

HAYES: And just to be clear, that is before the drought.

VILLARAIGOSA: Before the drought.

We knew this was coming. We did an adaptability study, the first of
its kind of that magnitude anywhere in the world in 2013, that essentially
said we`re going to increase the number of hot days by four times by 2050.
So we knew this was coming, and it`s here and we`re going to have to
address it.

HAYES: People watching this right now all over the country, thinking
to themselves, well, you know, those Californians, like this is the price
they pay. They like their sun and they like the good weather and maybe no
one should be living down in this desert in Southern California anyway.
Like, why should those people care about what`s happening?

VILLARAIGOSA: Well, because they eat our fruits and vegetables, our
almonds, our pistachios, they eat our cereal products, and I`m talking
about Post cereal, I`m talking about all of the food products that come
from that.

And the fact of the matter is, we`re one of the breadbaskets of the
nation. 50 percent or so of all the fruit consumed in the United States
are consumed because of our agriculture.

So we`re connected.

And this whole idea of water wars, you know, the cities versus the
rural areas just isn`t true. We have to eat their food.

HAYES: I disagree with that. I mean, I was -- look, this is one of
the things here, right, is it`s like you start to talk about this with
people and they get angry real fast about who is to blame. You talk to
farmers, and they`re like -- I mean, people are saying like -- cursing
Nancy Pelosi and those big city San Francisco liberals and folks in the
city. I was talking to them, having dinner with, and they`re like, ah,
those farmers. They`re full of it.

I mean, that is a real thing here.

VILLARAIGOSA: I`m not suggesting that there aren`t angry people in
the world. We see them every day all over the world, isn`t that what you
guys kind of shed a light on?

HAYES: That`s our bread and butter, yeah.

VILLARAIGOSA: But the fact of the matter is, there`s a symbiotic
relationship between the Central Valley as an example and Southern
and Northern California. They feed us. They feed the nation. And so
we`re going to have to work together.

And when I say that I`m not for the water wars, I`m not for the finger
pointing. We`ve got to work together. We`ve got to reach out and recycle
together, use technology. We have some of the greatest universities, the
high tech, Silicon Valley here in California. We need to marshal our
resources to develop the same kind of technologies that we have done for
renewables as an examples.

HAYES: This is interesting, because there`s two ways to look at this.
One way to look at it is, the check is due, right? The civilization that
has been created, this amazing place that`s been created in the desert, the
check is coming due.

And the other way to say is, no, we just need to figure -- we need to
innovate our way out of it.

VILLARAIGOSA: As we always have. Yeah, that`s exactly what we need
to do.

As an example, you and I were talking before the show about
desalinization. It`s been criticized by many as too costly and uses too
much energy. Yet technology is driving that cost down, the cost of water
is making it not as costly.

So the fact is, we`ve got to do more water trading, we`ve got to do
more desal, but importantly we`ve got to develop the technologies to make
sure that we`re conserving our water better, recycling our water better and
reusing it.

HAYES: But there are political obstacles to that.

I mean, you were talking to me just about telling people before the
drought, okay, you can only water your lawn three days a week and what did
people do?

VILLARAIGOSA: They screamed.

HAYES: Yes, right, exactly.

VILLARAIGOSA: They called me names. And then somebody turned on the
water in our backyard because the pipes were outside of the property, and
then they took
pictures of that even though the lawn was brown, they kind of...

HAYES: But magnify that by a scale. I mean, that`s the thing. Is it
like there`s a bunch of entrenched interests, there`s a finite resource and
people are going to -- they want to get theirs.

And someone politically is going to have to navigate that.

VILLARAIGOSA: What we`re going to need is is problem solvers. And
people who don`t want to finger point and fix the problem. The fact is
that climate change is here here. It`s only going to get worse.

Yes, we`re in a drought that`s exacerbating it, but the planet is
getting hotter. We`re going to have to deal with that.

There`s a lot more that we can all do. In fact, it`s great that
you`re here in Orange County. What a backdrop. I mean, because this is --
don`t think that this is the only example of a reservoir that`s depleted,
dams that are depleted. It`s all over the state. And there is a way out.
We know that here in Orange
County as an example, they recycle more than any other part of the state.
We need to replicate that.

Conservation is critical.

Most of our water usage in you are an areas, 40 percent is on our
lawns. Now, we can`t eat lawns or swimming pools.

HAYES: That`s going to come down, that and a lot of things are going
to change. Former Mayor Antonio Villaraigosa, 41st mayor of Los Angeles,
if I`m not mistaken.

VILLARAIGOSA: That`s right.

HAYES: all right. We`ve been crisscrossing the state all weekend,
finding out what`s happened during this historic water shortage, including
in the agriculture power house that the mayor was just talking about,
California`s central

There I met with a farmer Joe Del Bosque who is currently trying to
harvest his prized cantaloupes in the middle of the drought.


HAYES: So, how serious is this drought?

JOE DEL BOSQUE, FARMER: This drought is extremely serious for all of
us here in the central valley. We have had water reductions for many years
now. And we have adapted. We have gone to drip irrigation, high tech
irrigation methods to be very efficient. We have learned how to hedge our
water supply, saving in wet years, carry it to the dry years, buying from
other farmers. We`ve done all these things to try to get through these

But our luck is running out and we`ve run out of aces.

We don`t have any water to carry into next year and if we don`t have
any water next year, if we have another zero water allocation, all of this
will be gone. It`ll be all fallow fields, and our almonds will be drying
and dead.


HAYES: This farm, everything that`s being grown here, everything
that`s lush and green and getting packed on these trucks and sent to
supermarkets all of it next year, another year like this, next year it`s
all -- it`s done.

DEL BOSQUE: Yes. And all these people will not be here. We will
have a silent spring in the Central Valley, because there will be no
workers working and chatting in the fields.


HAYES: I`m going to bring you that story and much, much more tomorrow
as we continue on our special week of All In America


<Copy: Content and programming copyright 2015 NBC. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED.
Copyright 2015 CQ-Roll Call, Inc. All materials herein are protected by
United States copyright law and may not be reproduced, distributed,
transmitted, displayed, published or broadcast without the prior written
permission of CQ-Roll Call. You may not alter or remove any trademark,
copyright or other notice from copies of the content.>

Sponsored links

Resource guide