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The Ed Show for Monday, July 20th, 2015

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Date: July 20, 2015
Guest: Brad Woodhouse, Ron Christie, Paul Douglas, Mark Pocan, Caroline


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Screen that here (ph), you know.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Wildfires in California. There are sweeping across
highways in forcing camp evacuation.

SCHULTZ: Later, Hecklers and Hashtag.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What is not like we like to shut it (inaudible) down,
but we have to.

getting (inaudible).

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yeah, hold on one second. Hold on, hold on.

SANDERS: And folks (ph) stay with me.

SCHULTZ: And got issues.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Do you think that being gay is a choice?

GOV. SCOTT WALKER, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I don`t know what to answer
to that.


SCHULTZ: Good to have you with us tonight folks. Thanks for watching. We
start tonight with the most popular Republican presidential candidate in
the lives, in the country Donald Trump.

Do you ever ask yourself a question what does Trump bring to the table?
Sometimes you can see the forest because of the trees. He bring everything
to the table, he`s got the money, he`s got the polling, he`s the crowds
wherever he goes, he`s got the media attention, he know how to get it.

Nobody else can match what Trump is doing right now and if this is a game.
Nobody place it better than Trump so far although Trump wasn`t playing
games this weekend. He really cut to the chase and got himself on a snit.
The Donald ignited a media firestorm with these comments about John McCain.


president. I raised a million dollars for him. That`s a lot of money. I
supported him. He lost. He let us down. But, you know, he lost. So I
never liked him as much after that because I don`t like losers.

But Frank (ph) let me get to him. He hit me is war hero. He`s a war hero.
He`s a warrior of as he captured. I like people that weren`t captured OK.
I hate to tell you. Do you agree with that? He`s a war hero because he
was captured, OK. You can have -- and I believe perhaps he`s a war hero.


SCHULTZ: Trump attended to clarify he`s comments a short time later.


TRUMP: If somebody is a prisoner, I consider them a war hero other than
Bergdahl. Bergdahl was a prisoner I don`t consider him a war hero. But if
somebody`s a prisoner I would consider that person a war hero. But we have
a lot of war heroes who weren`t prisoners also and we should give them some
credit too.


SCHULTZ: Trump has not apologized for his remarks about Senator John
McCain. He wrote in USA Today op-ed that the media is distorting he`s

Earlier today McCain spoke about Trumps comments.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Does Donald Trump owe you an apology?

SEN. JOHN MCCAIN, (R) ARIZONA: No, I don`t think so. But I think he may
owe an apology to the families of those who have sacrifice in conflict and
those who have undergone the prison experience.


SCHULTZ: Now not to defend Trump here. But let`s not forget who started
all these back and forth between Senator McCain and Donald Trump. Trump
goes to Arizona gets a huge crowed and McCain accuses him of pulling out
the crazies and the crowd of the Republican Party.

Excuse me Mr. McCain. You brought an inept candidate to the forefront in
2008. Keep in mind Donald Trump is leading the Republican field. Why is
that? Maybe he saying some people like. The latest Fox News poll has
Trump in first place at 18 percent, Scott Walker is in second at 15, and
Jeb Bush is in third with 14 percent. Republicans immediately use Trumps
comments to attack the front runner.


WALKER: At a minimum he needs to apologize in terms of what he needs to do
next, in terms of the race I think that`s up to voters. But he clearly --
he needs to apologize and refrain from comments like that.

Iowa, the good New Hampshire and the good people of South Carolina are
going to figure this out. And here`s what I think there going to say
"Donald Trump you`re fired."

assumption or he`s saying that somehow if you`re captured in battle your
less worthy of honors than someone who isn`t. It not just absurd
defensive, it`s ridiculous. And I do think it is a disqualifiers commander
in chief.

directly to John McCain and also to the veterans of this country. I don`t
think he has the character or the temperament to hold the highest position
in this country.


SCHULTZ: Don`t you think it`s interesting how quick the Republicans are
jumping all over Trump because of this comment. But they sure were slower
on his comments of Mexico weren`t they? It`s open session on Donald Trump
right now. They of course have got all their talking points together.
Republicans are in full attack mode.

Jeb Bush he twitted out "Enough with the Slanderous attacks. Senator
McCain and all of our veterans particularly POW have earned out respect and

New Jersey Governor Chris Christie Twitter "Senator John McCain is an
American hero, period, stop."

Louisiana Governor Bobby Jindal twitted "After Donald Trump spends six
years at POW camp. He can weigh in on John McCain service."

And the RNC release the statement that read in part "There is no place in
our party or our country for comments that disparage those who have served

Now hold that, hold it right there. Is serving in the United States Senate
something honorable? I remember the Republican Party just ripping apart
our current President accusing him of not being American, accusing him of
being other, accusing him of being born somewhere other than the United
States and palling around with terrorist. But I didn`t see statement from
the Republican Party back then but they really have learned their lesson
now haven`t they. Republicans have quickly and collectively condemn the
Donald Trump`s comments on John McCain.

Meanwhile, Republicans as a whole well, they weren`t so quick to condemn
these remarks from Trump as I spoke about.


TRUMP: When Mexico sends its people, they`re not sending their best, their
not sending you, they`re sending you, they`re sending people that have lots
of problem, and they`re bringing those problems with us. They`re bringing
drugs. They`re bringing crime. They`re rapist. And some, I assume, are
good people.


SCHULTZ: Some Republicans did call out for those comments. But the
collective outrage, we have to admit was missing. The criticism of Trump
on these racially charge remarks is no where near what we`re seeing
compared to his comments on John McCain.

Is it possible that Donald Trump could save the Republican Party from
themselves? That he actually is what they`re and somebody is now saying it
out there but that wasn`t suppose to be in the queue card. And so now
they`re collectively trying to write this was it apparent wrong in their

Get your cellphones out. I want to know what you think. Tonight`s
question, "Will Donald Trump`s campaign suffer because of his comments on
John McCain?" Go to to cast your vote. We`ll bring you
the result to the segment of this program.

For more let me bring in Brad Woodhouse President of Correct the Record,
also with us tonight Ron Christie Columnist for the Daily Beast and former
Special Assistant to President George W. Bush, and Michael Eric Dyson
Professor and MSNBC Analyst and of course Professor at Georgetown
University, gentlemen, great to have you with us tonight.

Ron a couple of question for you first, they knew ABC Washington post polls
shows that Trumps lead is jumping. Why is that? Is now -- he`s at 24,
Walkers at 13, Bush at 12, Bush is actually going down, Huckabee, Rubio and
Rand Paul -- the other ball. They can`t get in double figures. What`s
going on here Ron? Why is Donald Trump polling so well if he`s so bad?

RON CHRISTIE, DAILY BEAST COLUMNIST: Well, good evening Ed. It`s nice to
be with you. I think one of the reasons why he`s polling so well is I
think a lot of people are tired of this scary typical Washington politician
where they put their finger up there in the wind and see which way the
winds blowing and they try to say what they think people want to hear. And
I think Trump whether you like him or not there`s a certain level of
authenticity issue.

Now look, make no mistake about this Ed. You and I talk about this for the
last several weeks. I think he`s carnival barker. I think he has no place
being on the stage or the national stage as far the Republican Party
concern. And I think he`s candidacy is a joke. But I think it does send a
shot across the bionanomatrix (ph) Republicans but also to Senator Clinton
and of course to Senator Sanders who`s also running that people are looking
for authenticity and they`re looking the people in Washington saying "You
folks just don`t get it."

SCHULTZ: Well, if he`s candidacy is a joke Ron. What`s wrong with the
Republicans here? He`s double enough everybody in the field right now.
The more outrageous he is the more Republican voters he gets appealed -- he
gets more appealing too. I mean, you got a problem with the party, what`s

CHRISTIE: Oh, do Ed. You know, look I`ve been very consistent with this.
I think the folks at the RNC should have been out much, much earlier about
his racist comments several weeks ago.


CHRISTIE: They should have been out about he`s comments this past weekend.
And I think the way that you frame the story. It`s very well said. People
have been looking and saying "What in the blaze is this, this guy doing
leading the polls, why is out there, why is saying these things and where
the prominent national Republicans who`re out there who should be shaking
this up and saying.


CHRISTIE: This guy needs to go. I mean, he needs to go. But I will you
say this being here in Columbus, Ohio. My former boss a gentleman who I
work for eight years John Kasich the current governor of Ohio will make his
announcement tomorrow...

SCHULTZ: Nice promo.

CHRISTIE: ... and I think once he has. Great, yeah and great promo. I
had to do it Ed. But I think once you have folks up there, who actually
have a record and actually have something to say. I think Trump will fade.
And he needs to face now.

SCHULTZ: Well, you know, what, in modern day politics I guess it`s not
about the Record, it`s about the money and it`s about the media moxie. But
Michael Eric Dyson, is this the Republican Party that we`re finally getting
to know out in public, getting out behind close door. So this is who they
really are and that`s why Trump is polling so well, what do you think?

the part that`s most vocal. As with any group of people those to the
extreme are often the most amplified and they`ve been out there. Donald
Trump is channeling the end of this collective, you know, anxiety and this
collective sense of this ease that so many Republican field in the face of

You pointed out earlier about President Obama being subject to some of the
calls and claims of his otherness. Now only McCain who`s honorable service
has been besmirch now by Donald Trump. Donald Trump is willing to say
anything. But he`s a big bad bully with a bunch of money and as a Result
of that he`s intemperance is accommodated and people feel that somehow they
must allow him to speak as of being rich and quite successful in his
business gives him the right to say the kinds of thing that he does and
they have purchase in the large of political order.

The question is, are they going to continue to reflect what the view points
are of most Republicans as he leads the field or will the kind of comments
since if you will pack within that group of people to take over and Donald


DYSON: ... will be reign in. So far it doesn`t look like he`s being reign
at all.

SCHULTZ: Can we give Donald Trump some credit that this billionaire is not
so disconnected from the American people. I mean, this is a guy who has
experience a lot in life and he knows how to relate. He knows where people
are. Brad Woodhouse.

SCHULTZ: No question.

SCHULTZ: Brad Woodhouse, I don`t think you can enough of this can you? I
mean, you really want him to win this thing.

Ed, is that Donald Trump is the Republican Party, you had it right. They
want -- hey we don`t want people to know Donald that`s who we`re, that`s
what we`re. They don`t swing voter to know it. But they have feed this
very type of rhetoric over the years. Listen, do not forget they made this
same claims about dishonorable service or whatever not a war hero against
John Kerry.

Last fall they were saying that the children that were coming over the
boarder from South America, oh my God they`re carrying Ebola. You know,
they`re criminals and so, the Republican Party had feed this, they`re
language hasn`t been quite strident or direr as Donald Trumps.

But these chickens coming home to roost in terms of the way the Republican
Party has conducted itself. Approaching its base, trying to favor the Tea
Party, and the way it`s treated others like John Kerry.

SCHULTZ: Well, there`s no doubt about the 2004 election. They really
swept voted Kerry who went after his military record they question his
integrity across the board. I mean, it was nasty hardball in 2004 in his
military record. And so, what is sacred ground and what isn`t sacred
ground when it comes to veterans. But now what we`re seeing is this
collective pushback on Trump by other Candidates.

Ron Christie, to disparage Trump, is that going to be a strategy now
because so far it`s not working.

CHRISTIE: Well Ed, I don`t know if so much that we should disparage Trump.
I think the Republican candidates need to go out there and articulate a
very positive message of what therefore, what do they believe. How would
they leave this country poor? I`ve listen Brad`s comments.

SCHULTZ: That`s not provocative enough.

CHRISTIE: Which is absolute nonsense. I mean, Brad says Donald Trump
represents Republican Party. I`m sorry Brad Donald Trump represents Donald
Trump period.

WOODHOUSE: You go back and look at what Republican candidates were saying
last fall about Ebola, about the kids coming over the boarder. People that
you only promoted like sheriff or pile (ph). I mean, this is the
Republican Party. You just don`t want people to know it.

CHRISTIE: Sorry Brad, unlike the Democratic Party which is going to have a
coronation of a very flawed, very dishonest candidate. I think the
Republican leading was leading folks who were not there on the stage.


CHRISTIE: Excuse me Brad I didn`t talk over you. All right, all right you
need to learn some manners here. Look, I think what the Republicans are
going to do is articulate a very positive message about what therefore.
We`re not going to coronate anybody to be our next president. Where going
to have in vigorous debates.

SCHULTZ: You know, what, Ron that`s the problem right there Ron. Nobody
is paying attention to that kind of talk. They`re not, you know, I think
their plans, their policies. I mean, Donald Trump is sucking all the air
right after the room. Every single new cycle, he has a way of doing this.

CHRISTIE: Ed, do you think this drive me crazy. I mean this drives me
absolutely crazy for being a Republican because it gives fuel to the fire
people like Brad who say that represents the Republican Party and that`s
who we`re, absolutely nonsense. I mean, the Republicans would have been
wise, the establishment, the folks out in Washington would have been very
wise who said "This guy`s a joke, he`s a carnival barker, he needs to go."


CHRISTIE: And since they didn`t, look at the board he`s now in there. And
now everyone trying to figure out how to deal with him.

SCHULTZ: Professor Dyson, well these comments about John McCain come back
and hurt Trump in the polls down the road. What do you think?

DYSON: Well, accumulatively maybe. But right now he`s rating high. He`s
saying anything he wants to say he`s a rhetorical gunslinger, that kind of
bravado (ph) is being embraced as the reintroduction of real man into the
process. So I think Donald Trump is getting he`s money worth right now and
we`ll see it`ll speak negative to him in the future.

SCHULTZ: Brad Woodhouse, Ron Christie and Michael Eric Dyson always a
pressure. Good to have you with us on the Ed Show.


SCHULTZ: Thanks so much.

CHRISTIE: Thanks everyone.

SCHULTZ: Remember to answer tonight`s question at
We`ll have the result right after the break. Follow us Facebook. Watch my
Facebook feature "Give me a minute." And you can get my video Podcast at

Coming up, floods and wildfires just raise all kinds of issue for the folks
on West Coast. We`ll look at how climate changes producing more wild

And later, the Black Lives Matter movement makes and impact on Netroots
Nation. Was it positive? Rapid Response panel weights in on how the
movement is shaping the conversation for 2016.


SCHULTZ: And the numbers are coming in on the Ed Show. Here`s where we
stand on tonight`s Bing Pulse poll. Tonight`s question, "Will Donald Trump
campaign suffer because of his comments on John McCain?" 38 percent of you
say "Yes," 62 percent of you "No, that`s just the Donald talking the way he
talks." Keep voting throughout the hour at

We`re coming right back stay with us.



SEN. JIM INHOFE, (R) OKLAHOMA: In case we have forgotten because we keep
hearing that 2014 is been the warmest year on record. I ask the chair, you
know, what this is? It`s a snowball and that just from outside here. So
it`s very, very cold out, very unseasonal. So Mr. President, catch this.


SCHULTZ: We are back on the Ed Show. Thanks for watching tonight. That
of course was Oklahoma Senator Jim Inhofe on the Senate floor back in
February making absurd argument to disproved climate change.

Five months later and we`ve seen the hottest June record. NASA says 2015
is on track to be the hottest year ever. Increases in severe weather have
also been tied to climate change. We are seeing lots of it.

Southern California got a break from its record drought in the form of
record rainfall this weekend. A bridge collapsed on interstate town
between Phoenix and Los Angeles on Sunday. Official say it maybe days
before it is fix.

The area by Joshua Tree National Park received a rare heavy rain storm that
wiped out the bridge. The storm dumped nearly an inch of rain an hour with
60 mile an hour winds. It caused mud slides and flooded roadways and some
motorists where left stranded.

Also in California, a 3,500 acre wildfire has been ranging in San
Bernardino County. On Friday, it jumped on the Interstate 15 in Southern
California torturing 20 cars. Luckily, no one was injured. Officials say
the fire is now 60 percent contained.

Earlier today, Al Roker explained the increase in California severe


AL ROKER, WEATHER FORECASTER: We`ve had these impacts from El Nino
already. This is remnants Dolores and all that moisture streamed up into
Southern California and the Southwest causing big problems. The problem
here is water temperatures, the sea surface temperatures. Three to six
degrees above normal and they`re only getting warmer. This is favorable
for tropical development.


SCHULTZ: And for more conversation on this let me bring in Paul Douglas,
Senior Meteorologist at EROS weather in Minneapolis.

Paul, great to have with us tonight.

What is going on in Southern California, one extreme to the next?

moisture from the flooding over the weekend Ed was the result as Al pointed
out of ex-hurricane Dolores. Some of the moisture streaming up in at the
Southwest and spiking normal monsoonal thunderstorms, which do tended
developed this time a year mid and late summer. You do have sort of a
localized monsoon affect in the Southwest.

But we may be cruising toward a super El Nino as big or even bigger than
what the country experienced back in `97, `98. I`m seeing some numbers in
the Middle Pacific that are just staggering. They call it ACE, Accumulated
Cyclone Energy and it`s 22 times greater than it should be this time a year
in the Central Pacific.

The Pacific has become a playground for cyclones. A record number of
hurricanes and typhoons, these typhoons draw their energy from warm ocean
water but in turn they tend to relax the trade wind which causes even
warmer water to build to the surface which amplifies the El Nino. We could
be looking at two, three, three and a half degrees warmer than average and
what that could mean is a very significant shift in the pattern for

Every El Nino is different Ed, but right now some of the smart money is on
significant rains and a potential break in the drought within about three
to six months.

SCHULTZ: Paul, how rare is that? 22 times greater. I mean, have we seen
that maybe in the last or since records have been -- being kept, what about

DOUGLAS: I`ve never seen a number that high. Again, this accumulated
cyclone energy a measure of how much energy is not only in the atmosphere
but in the oceans and some thing is happening in the Pacific and I kept
telling people it`s very simplistic to look out to your window at the
thermometer and on a cold day or day or it`s snowing dismissed climate

You know it`s harder to keep a global perspective. It`s harder digging
into data in science. Conspiracy theories have always been easier sort of
a mental shortcut to actually doing the work, looking at the science. But
it doesn`t matter which side of the island that you`re on. Thermometers
Ocean buoys or either Republican or Democrat, the data is data, the science
is the science.

And 93 percent of all that extra warming from greenhouse gasses has been
going into the oceans and people think well it`s out of sight, out of mind.
Well, some of that warmth is now coming back to the surface. It`s spawning
these record typhoons especially in the Western Pacific but also hurricanes
in the Eastern Pacific and that may in turn amplify the El Nino which may
have a silver lining helping to ease the drought in California this winter.

Not a sure thing. Not a slam dunk. But it`s freakish how bizarre the
weather swings have been here in recent months here this whiplash going
from flood to drought.

Senator Inhofe home State of Oklahoma went from historic drought to
biblical flood Ed in the meteorological blink of an eye.


DOUGLAS: We`re seeing things we haven`t been seen before.

SCHULTZ: Pretty crazy. Meteorologist Paul Douglas always great to have
you with us. I appreciate your time tonight. Fascinating stuff. Still to

DOUGLAS: Thanks Ed.

SCHULTZ: ... Bernie Sanders and Martin O`Malley faced tough crowds at
Netroots Nation. We`ll have the details in reaction to Hillary Clinton`s
choice to say, "No, I don`t think I`m going to go there this year."

And John McCain and Lindsey Graham kicked off the No Nukes tour. We`ll
look at the congressional pushback on Iran nuclear deal next. Stay with


SCHULTZ: Welcome back to the Ed Show. The Iran nuclear deal sell job is
in full swing. Is that really necessary?

Secretary of State John Kerry went on all five Sunday talk shows to defend
the agreement.


JOHN KERRY, SECRETARY OF STATE: We have a plan in order to deal with
pushback against Iran`s behavior with respect to military interdiction,
stopping the flow of weapons, dealing with counter terrorism, dealing with
Special Forces training and capacity for some of those other countries. So
there will be plenty of pushback, Chuck. But the simple reality is that if
you`re going to push back against Iran, it is better to push back against
an Iran that doesn`t have a nuclear weapon rather than one that does.


SCHULTZ: Earlier today, the deal got the unanimous endorsement from the
U.N. Security Council. The 15 member group also authorized measures to
begin lifting sanctions on Iran.

President Obama says Congress should consider the strong international
support when debating the merits of the agreement.


OBAMA: There is broad international consensus around this issue, not just
among the international community but also among experts in the nuclear
proliferation and my working assumption is that Congress will pay attention
to that broad-based consensus.


SCHULTZ: Lawmakers have 60 days to review the deal. Today was the first
official day in that 60-day count. Many Republicans are strongly against

Just a short time ago, Republican Presidential hopeful Lindsey Graham,
Senator John McCain and former Senator Joe Lieberman held a town hall
meeting in New York City to launch their No Nukes for Iran tour.


GRAHAM: I would say there`s a better than 50-50 chance that we can reject
the deal with the understanding that the next president will have power to
negotiate a better deal because congressional sanction still being in place


SCHULTZ: Joining me tonight by Steve Clemons, MSNBC Contributor and Editor
at Large of The Atlantic. Steve, good to have you with us tonight.


SCHULTZ: Your reaction -- you bet. Your reaction to the U.N. Security
Council endorsement with the backdrop of the Republican saying it`s a bad

CLEMONS: The world sees this as an infliction point and Barrack Obama, in
addition to other world leaders has sown that we can still do things in the
world and not everything is a failure from the start and you`ve basically
successfully applied crippling sanctions to Iran, gotten Iran to move in
one of the best and most thorough arms control negotiations that have been
negotiated right now and the Republicans have to decide whether or not
they`re going to isolate the United States in this effort to put Iran on a
new course and commit the Unites States to something that might look like
more of a military track.

We`re not and to see, you know, what Barrack Obama has done and what this
U.N. vote did is essentially give the Republicans an opportunity to stand
up and to demonstrate that they`re more about politics and they`re about
the substance and core of vital national interest of United States.

SCHULTZ: So are we in for a big political fight now that this tour has
started by these two senators and former Senator Joe Lieberman. I mean,
and Kerry of course Secretary of State doing the media blitz to gather
support. I mean this is what we`re in for in the next 60 days.

CLEMONS: Look I don`t see -- we probably are but I don`t see anything
wrong with Lindsey Graham, John McCain and Joe Lieberman raising
fundamental important questions about any agreement.

I mean that`s what the Congress is therefore. That can create a
responsible discussion. Unfortunately, Senator Corker who is chairman of
the Foreign Relations Committee has demonstrated how to do that more than
Lindsey Graham has and Lindsey Graham is by far better than most other
Republican candidates that are running right now who probably haven`t read
the agreement, don`t know what it stands for and came out against it before
it even been done.


CLEMONS: So we`ve got different gradations of opposition here. But I
think Corker who has kept his powder to dry is setting the right mold.
It`s fine to be skeptical. We were skeptical of Soviet arms control
negotiations. It`s fine to be skeptical of Iran arms negotiations and
nuclear weapons program negotiations but they need to come in and look at
the content and substance of that deal, put on the table what they would do
differently and look at what a 15 to zero vote in the United Nations is

SCHULTZ: Steve Clemons, always great to have you with us. I appreciate
your time tonight.

CLEMONS: Thank you Ed.

SCHULTZ: Thanks. You bet.

Still to come, the Rapid Response Panel on Netroots Nation and the impact
of the Black Lives Matter movement.

And later, Scott Walker says he doesn`t know if being gay is a choice.
Congressman Mark Pocan of Wisconsin joins with the reaction of the
governor`s comments.

Stay tune, we`re right back.

Market Wrap.

Stock managed slight gains. The DOW adds 13 points. The S&P inclines by
one. The NASDAQ is up by 8 points closing at another new high.

Share of IBM are sliding after hours. Big Blue reported earnings that
being estimate but revenue came in light sending shares down about 4
percent in late trading.

And Morgan Stanley strong (ph) trading revenue surge more than 30 percent
over the last year. The company`s results came in better than analysts

That`s it from CNBC, first in business worldwide.


SCHULTZ: Welcome back to the Ed Show. Thanks for watching tonight.
Progressives swarm the Netroots Nation conference in Phoenix over the
weekend. Organizers and activists gathered to hear from the nation`s top
liberal leaders although Hillary Clinton was not there. She decided not to

Ed Show producers were on the ground at Phoenix to get the reaction.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m disappointed. I`m actually a big Hillary
supporter myself personally and I really wanted to see her debating on the
issues that I care most about.

explain her values and how they match with other progressive values.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think it`s actually a mistake. I think she`s
underestimating Bernie.

not here, you know, is kind of overshadowing matter of fact that there are
some really good candidates here.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, I think it`s maybe a bad strategic choice.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Even if she had a good response they would have found
a narrative to hater, so I think in the end she probably made the right
decision for her.


SCHULTZ: During Clinton`s last appearance she received a decidedly mixed
reaction by attendees who were unsatisfied with her record. The focus that
Netroots took a sharp turn away from Clinton`s absence on Saturday night.

Black Lives Matter demonstrators took the driver seat. Chance interrupted
Martin O`Malley`s on stage interview. His response made matters even


MARTIN O`MALLEY: Black lives matter. White lives matter. All lives


SCHULTZ: O`Malley struggled with criticism for policing tactics in the
past. O`Malley apologized in a separate interview saying he did not
understand the depth of feeling attached to the issue.

Demonstrators didn`t spare Bernie Sanders from the same confrontation.


SANDERS: Black lives of course matter and I spent 50 years of my life
fighting for civil rights and for dignity but if you don`t want to be here
that`s OK.


SCHULTZ: Bernie Sanders still hasn`t found footing with African-American
voters. Sanders led set-ins during the 1960`s civil rights movement. He
responded to racial injustice for the conversation on economic inequality.
Sanders introduced legislation to tackle youth unemployment and boast jobs

Sanders hosted a Phoenix rally that night that drew the largest crowd yet
for this campaign season but analyst wonder if he can maintain momentum
without appeal from key liberals.

Joining me tonight on our Rapid Response panel Caroline Heldman, professor
of Politics at Occidental College, also with us again tonight, Michael Eric
Dyson, professor at Georgetown University and MSNBC Political Analyst.

Dr. Dyson, you first. Does Bernie Sanders have a problem with black
voters, black voters have a problem with Bernie Sanders, or is it just an
issue of not knowing who the candidate is?

DYSON: Well, he certainly has a problem with black voters if he exhibits
the kind of tone depth approach that he did at the Netroots conference.
The reality is, of course, that he wants to ride upon his rigorous
commitment to civil rights over a period of 50 years. There`s no question
about that.

And his sneak days when he ways out front. But that, you know, there`s a
Janet Jackson thing, what have you done for me lately here. And he`s got
to show that she understands black lives matter that their structural
inequalities that there are blind spots in the American conscious or at
least in the optic nerve of American race that says that black peoples
lives don`t add the same as white folks lives though.

SCHULTZ: But Dr. Dyson as the black community listening to Bernie Sanders
and I think that`s a fair question because when all the turmoil was
unfolding down in Ferguson.

DYSON: I remember.

SCHULTZ: . Sanders was given numerous interviews saying that the issue is
a jobs program. And we`ve got to focus on black youth unemployment in this
country. He said that. I didn`t hear anybody else say that.

DYSON: Absolutely right. I`m not denying that Bernie Sanders doesn`t have
any good ideals, but let me tell you a couple of things. First of all with
-- especially with the white progressives, subsuming the issue of race
underclass has been a full part (ph) because the point is that you can`t
explain the way racial intolerance by reference to a class inequality.
Because when class inequality is erased, that would suggest that there`s no
persistent racial animus but that`s not the case.

Even people who are upwardly mobile who share space with other white folk
who are doing well face barriers to them. That`s why you got a glass
ceiling or in this case you got ceilings imposed upon black managers. So,
I think that`s number one. But number two.


DYSON: You can`t just talk about what you used to do and good stuff you`ve
done for black people. You got to talk about how you`re struggling with
the specific forms of racial brutality and police brutality.

Now, I think Bernie Sanders actually said some great things about that, but
at the moment that you`re being challenged, you can`t be defensive, you got
to talk about that, build bridges and talk about.


DYSON: . how there are still inequalities that exist that they have to be

SCHULTZ: Caroline Heldman, did Hillary Clinton make the correct move by
skipping the Netroots conference?

because these are not her people. And if what happened at the Netroots
conference is any indication thing -- good news for her she skipped it
because all three of the candidates, Martin O`Malley, Bernie Sanders and
Hilary Clinton do not have a good answer for the black lives no matter at

Martin O`Malley and Hillary Clinton both said, "Black lives matter, white
lives matter, all lives matter," which we already know that white lives
matter. We live in a white supremacy system where we place more value on
white lives. It is empirically proven time and time again.

So, to diminish the campaign goal of trying to put focus on black lives,
it`s a huge stumbling block for these candidates. And I would agree with
Dr. Dyson that you can`t simply reduce systemic racist into an economic
problem as Bernie Sanders has done. So far we have not heard something
from these candidates.

SCHULTZ: Well, when you say that these aren`t her people, I think these
people are going to be supporting Hillary Clinton. Some of the people that
we interviewed said that they were Hillary`s supporters and they were
disappointed that she wasn`t there.

HELDMAN: Well, I think.

SCHULTZ: Go ahead.

HELDMAN: I would say that if Bernie Sanders wasn`t liberal enough for
them, Hillary Clinton certainly wasn`t. And I`m sure that there smattering
Clinton`s supporters there, but she has a broad basis support, she has
higher support amongst African-American than Bernie Sanders does, he`s
around 5 percent.

And I think that does have a lot of to do with his limited appeal and his
response here was indicative of that.

SCHULTZ: I don`t think he`s been really introduced of the black community.
It`s going to take time, but that`s just my perspective. I mean,
progressives erupted on Twitter with the #Berniesoblack. So, why do some
voters believe Bernie Sanders is weak on racial justice Professor Heldman?
I mean, it`s.

HELDMAN: Because he is. He is because he has a kind of old style Marxist
critique that reduces systemic racism down to just an economic issue. And
as Dr. Dyson pointed out.


HELDMAN: African-Americans and also share economic strata face racism.
This is not something that you can simply eradicate just by eradicating
social economic inequality.

SCHULTZ: All right. It is great to have both of you with us tonight.
Michael Eric Dyson and Caroline Heldman, I appreciate your time on this.

Still ahead, Scott Walker takes the lead in Iowa, but his recent record on
gay rights could cause him. Stay tuned.


SCHULTZ: As you saw thousands of progressives traveled to the Netroots
conference in Arizona over the weekend, attendees were divided on who they
like to see as the Democratic nominee. The answer was clear. When it came
to choosing a Republican.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I would really like to see Donald Trump get the

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I would love to see as actually be able to run again is
Donald Trump.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think that the more ridiculous the person the
better. He keep saying stupid thing.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I want Trump to be the representative of the Republican

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think Donald Trump is the Republican Party unmasked.
Trump is really a reflection of the entire party. And so, I think they
should nominate the person that most reflects their entire party`s elements


SCHULTZ: So, at least they agree on something. We`re coming right back on
the Ed Show. Stay with us.


SCHULTZ: And tonight`s Two-Minute Drill, a close call off the coast of
South Africa a top rank surfer narrowly escaped a shark attack during a
championship tournament. And the scary scene played out on live TV.

NBC`s Kelly Cobiella has the details.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Julian Wilson taking on Mick Fanning.

just getting underway. Three time champion Mick Fanning was waiting for
waves then this.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We can see a little splash (inaudible).

COBIELLA: A shark knocks Fanning off his board pulling him under.
Competitor Julian Wilson frantically paddles toward him. But then, Fanning
emerges and swims for his life. Within seconds, both men are safely out of
the water.

MICK FANNING, PROFESSIONAL SURFER: I was waiting for the face to come at
me. I go swimming (inaudible).

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She had a couple of punches in?

FANNING: I punched him in the back.

COBIELLA: Back on shore.

FANNING: I just saw it like taking my board around and started cracking

COBIELLA: Relief and shocked over their narrow escape.

JULIAN WILSON, PROFESSIONAL SURFER: I was like, "Oh he`s gone," like,
"he`s gone or not?" I`m like, "I feel like I can get that quick enough."

FANNING: Yeah. It`s this -- she came in as soon as (inaudible).

COBIELLA: The surfers didn`t get back in the water, instead sharing first
place. Two champions and one very close call.


SCHULTZ: Stick around there`s more coming up on the Ed Show. We`re right
back after this.


SCHULTZ: And finally tonight on the Ed Show, we checked in the campaign
trail again. Scott Walker is trying to sidestep an issue he was already
vocal about. Over the weekend he was asked whether being gay is a choice.


WALKER: My opinion in every single issue out there. I mean to me that`s,
I don`t know, I don`t know the answer to the question. So, I`m saying it
from the opinion -- I don`t know what the answer to that. And again I`m
going to spend my focus on things that I do know what I can work on.


SCHULTZ: Last week Governor Walker said he supports the band which keeps
openly gay leaders out of the Boy Scout`s organization.


WALKER: The protection was not a physical protection. It`s a protection
discussion about the policy protected them from being involved in the very
thing you`re talking about right now, political and media discussion about
it, instead of just focusing on what Scouts are about, which is about
camping an citizenship and things of that nature.


SCHULTZ: The Boy Scouts executive committee recently voted unanimously on
a new directive which would allow gay adults to serve as employees and
troop leaders. Walker later released a statement trying to clarify his
stance saying he supports the previous membership policy because it
protected children and advanced scout values.

Walker, if he wants to win Iowa. The latest Monmouth University poll of
likely Iowa Republican caucus-goers has Walker in first place with 22
percent. And if he wants to stay in the lead, he needs to remember that
Iowa was the third state and first in the nation`s heartland to allow same-
sex couples to get married.

Civil rights organization human rights campaign criticized Walker`s
handling on the question about homosexuality being a choice. The group
posted on its website, "Of course, it isn`t a choice. If it was, Scott
Walker would be able to tell us when he chose to be straight."

I`m joined tonight by Wisconsin Congressman Mark Pocan. Congressman, good
to have you with us tonight. Your reaction to Scott Walker`s handling of
these questions about homosexuality and whether it`s a choice or whether
you`re born gay. I mean, it`s almost ignorant bordering on insulting as I
see. Your thoughts?

REP. MARK POCAN, (D) WISCONSIN: Yeah. It`s pretty basic stuff. So I
mean, clearly he`s either in extreme pondering mode or unfortunate
ignorance mode. But neither is, especially electible in November election.

So, I think, you know, he`s trying to appeal to every extreme person he kin
in Iowa to try to win that primary. If he doesn`t win Iowa, he`s toasted.
And he`s just going to whatever it takes to try to get elected.

So, you know, this is just another one of those situations where again, he
knows better but he`ll do whatever it takes to become president.

SCHULTZ: Well, what about him as a candidate, does this prove that maybe
he`s not very well fought out that he maybe a good presenter but policy
wise, he really doesn`t know.

POCAN: You know, over and over, he`s had these foot and mouth problems,
you know? He said that the single greatest active foreign policy by
President Reagan was firing the air traffic controllers the fact that he
can handle ISIS because he stood up to a 100,000 union protesters.

He was asked what evolution and he told the reporter, "I`m going to pant on
that one." I mean that`s your inside voice not your outside voice. This
is a guy who really, you know, did all right here in Wisconsin. We had a
recall and that actually made him stronger because fundamentally people in
Wisconsin didn`t think that was nice.

And we`re fundamentally nice people in the upper Midwest as you know Ed.
But when it comes to this sort of either pondering or ignorance that`s been
coming out of the Walker campaign, he`s not showing that he`s a very
electible candidate.

SCHULTZ: Well, earlier today, Governor Walker signed a bill banning
abortions after 20-weeks of pregnancy. Is the timing of this just a
political play to win favor from the conservative base? What do you make
of it?

POCAN: You know, I think every decision he makes when he has juice in the
morning, he tells people it`s Florida juice because he needs votes in
Florida not California. If he`s having eggs, he tries to decide if that`s
going to offend anyone because they`re unborn eggs. I mean, this is a guy
who wants to be president so desperately, he will say anything and do
anything to get elected. But people will figure that out. And I think
ultimately that will be his demise.

SCHULTZ: I think it needs to be pointed out again that in the recall that
he won, 70 percent of his commercials were actually running against the
recall convincing the people of Wisconsin that the recall should not have
taken place that they hired him to do a job. He should have the full four
year to finish the job.

And Tom Barritt, of course, was outgunned financially some 10 to 1. And
most of the money came from out of state. I mean, do you think that`s a
story that needs to get on the national level so they put Walker in some

POCAN: Absolutely. In fact, you know on Election Day 70 percent of the
people said they didn`t like the idea of a recall. And yet, I think
President Obama on the exit polls was up 7 points in the exit polls for
people who just voted to keep Scott Walker. I mean clearly it wasn`t about
ideology, it was people in the upper Midwest thought that we have a normal
election process to get rid of a governor and that the recall wasn`t nice.
And that fundamentally just didn`t connect with the public.

And as you said, they expect millions and millions of dollars telling the
public that it wasn`t nice to recall someone. And that was effective.
And, you know, so people look at Scott Walker on paper and he looks like a
good candidate, but those of us who, you know, been with him for a decade
or two can tell you a whole lot more.

SCHULTZ: Yeah. Congressman Mark Pocan of Wisconsin good to have you on
tonight. Thanks so much.

And that is the Ed Show. I`m Ed Schultz.

Politics Nation with Reverend Al Sharpton starts right now.


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