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PoliticsNation, Monday, August 10th, 2015

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Date: August 10, 2015
Guest: Marq Claxton, Joan Walsh, Austan Goolsbee, Jamal Simmons, Eric


I`m Michael Eric Dyson. "Politics Nation" with the Reverend Al Sharpton
starts right now.

REV. AL SHARPTON, MSNBC HOST: Tonight on "Politics Nation," Hillary
Clinton slams Donald Trump`s outrageous comments about women and calls out
the rest of the GOP field, too.

Also, the FBI will help investigate the police shooting of an unarmed
teenager in Texas.

And Rand Paul blames inequality on some people working harder than others.

Welcome to "Politics Nation." We begin tonight with Hillary Clinton
weighing in on the latest Donald Trump controversy. His comments that many
believe suggested FOX anchor Megyn Kelly asked him questions, tough
questions at that because she was hormonal.


about Megyn Kelly is outrageous. What the rest of the Republicans are
saying about all women is also outrageous. They brag about slashing
women`s health care funding. They say they would force women who`ve been
raped to carry their rapist child and we don`t hear any of them supporting
raising the minimum wage, paid leave for new parents, access to quality
child care, equal pay for women or anything else to, you know, give women a
chance to get ahead.


SHARPTON: Clinton making the point the GOP`s problems go beyond just
Trump. But today, he claimed his comments were misinterpreted and said he
deserved an apology.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Let me just ask you just to clarify, if someone made
such a comment about a female journalist, suggesting that they were on
their menstrual cycle.

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: That would be inappropriate.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It would be classless and juvenile and over the line.

TRUMP: It would be inappropriate, but I didn`t do that. She asked me very
inappropriate question. She should really be apologizing to me, you want
to know the truth.


SHARPTON: But nearly, every other Republican running for president has
said Trump is wrong.


JEB BUSH (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Give me a break. I mean, are we --
do we want to win? Do we want to insult 53 percent of all voters? What
Donald Trump said is wrong.

BEN CARSON (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: In no way do I advocate, you know,
saying mean things about people. That has nothing to do about political

GOV. BOBBY JINDAL (R), LOUISIANA: I think it`s cowardly to share those
kinds of demeaning and insulting comments.

using is absolutely inappropriate.

CARLY FIORINA (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Women understood that comment
and yes, it is offensive.


SHARPTON: Republicans can`t afford to keep alienating women. In 2012,
President Obama beat Mitt Romney among women voters by 11 points. But
along single women, the president won by more than 35 points. It wasn`t
even close. The GOP has a serious problem with female voters and I`ll go
out on a limb here and I`ll say that Donald Trump is not helping.

Joining me now is MSNBC political correspondent Kasie Hunt and Joan Walsh
of Thank you both for being here.



SHARPTON: Kasie, let me go to you first. Clinton is tying Trump to the
rest of the GOP candidates. Isn`t that exactly what they were afraid of

HUNT: Well, Reverend, I think that at this point secretary Clinton is in
some ways having as much trouble breaking through the noise as any of those
other Republicans candidates. And the reality is that, you know, the
Clinton campaign still expects that they are going to be facing one of the
other people in this field and not Donald Trump and so in some ways, it`s
actually muted their message and their attempts to hold those other
candidates accountable for what they say are anti-women views. But it
really tough to even break past that.

And I will also point out that also on "Morning Joe" it wasn`t part of the
clip that you were just discussing but (INAUDIBLE) they put questions,
policy questions on women`s issues to Donald Trump and he refused to answer
them. He said, you know, we are going to have to wait for the next debate.
But he couldn`t talk about the policy of equal pay.

SHARPTON: And I think, Joan, that that is selling. He would not deal with
the policies even on women`s policies when he`s in the middle of this kind
of controversy, and whether people believe that he was being hormonal as
most people that I`ve talked to believe or whether he believes him that he
was referring to her nose, which also by the way, wouldn`t be appropriate.
I mean, it`s not like he -- that`s appropriate. It may not be as blatantly
sexist but it is certainly still inappropriate. But whatever your belief,
it clearly says he has no real policies around women or concerns. I mean,
has he become the candidate the GOP deserves?

WALSH: I think he is the candidate that they deserve because he really
does share so many views. And honestly, Reverend Al, you and I have talked
about this before. We have seen such an outbreak of misogyny racism in the
wake of the election of president Obama. This is not new.

I mean, I`ve had conservative politicians say disgusting things to me with
no backlash. It`s just happens to one of their own. It shouldn`t happen
to Megyn Kelly. But, you know, now it`s a big deal. But, you know, Kasie
makes a great point. He`s complained about Megyn Kelly not asking him
policy questions and then Mika asked policy questions and he said I can`t
get into that.

SHARPTON: Wait until the next debate.

WALSH: Wait until the next debate.

SHARPTON: You know, Kasie, the blood comment wasn`t the only offensive
thing Trump said about Megyn Kelly. Listen to this from "the Today Show."


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You reposted to your followers on twitter a message
from someone else but this message called Megyn Kelly a bimbo. So in
effect, you publicized that message to 3.6 million people. Do you think
she`s a bimbo? Do you agree with that? Is that why you posted it?

TRUMP: I thought the questions she was asking me were inappropriate and
they were that questions that somebody you could make the case.


SHARPTON: You could make the case. I mean, help me out there, Kasie. You
could make the case if she is a bimbo? And he had a chance to say any
number of things, no I don`t agree with it. Somebody on my staff retweeted
it. I didn`t. I deny knowledge. He not only doubled down not denying the
bimbo retweet that he did to over three million people, he said you can
make a case for calling her a bimbo.

HUNT: Well, these attacks, Reverend, obviously attack that can only be
leveled at women. There are definitely gendered. And we haven`t seen
Donald Trump back away from anything that Donald Trump has said over the
course of his presidential campaign. I mean, we can use cliche phrases
like double down, triple down. I mean, I`ve lost count of the number of
times that Donald Trump has doubled down on statements he`s made that have
been deemed controversial or that, you know, people in the media have said
would definitely kill his campaign, and they just haven`t and this seems
like the latest it ration of that.

SHARPTON: You know, Joan, you got to give the Donald credit. He`s also
been helpful because he reminded us this morning he`s not the only
candidate with a troubling record on women`s issues. Let me play this for


TRUMP: So the women`s health issue, which Jeb Bush so amazingly blew about
four or five days ago when he said no money going to women`s health issues
or essentially that and with me, Mika, I would be the best for women, the
best for women`s health issues.


SHARPTON: You know, nothing like bringing somebody down with you. I mean,
very helpful of him, but how big will women`s issues be in 2016?

WALSH: They are going to be enormous. I mean, I think that the Clinton
campaign, assuming that she is the nominee, really has a strategy for
mobilizing women. They see the numbers that you played earlier, Reverend

But I do. You know, I kind of worried in the wake of the debate that
people would not pay attention to the ridiculous and the hideous things
that the candidates said about abortion. That the Jeb`s comment about half
a million, half a billion dollars is just too much money, might be too much
money for women`s health, that these things were being obscured by the
circus atmosphere.

So it was very nice of Donald Trump to bring us all back to the fact there
were some men on that stage who said some pretty awful things and that will
have a very hard time going after the women`s vote, if they get the

SHARPTON: You know, Hillary Clinton, Kasie, today also called out Marco
Rubio for his position on abortion rights. Listen to this.


CLINTON: When one of their major candidates, a much younger man, the
senator from Florida says there should be no exceptions for rape and
incest, that is as offensive and as troubling a comment as you can hear
from a major candidate running for the presidency.


SHARPTON: Now, she`s in effect saying, Kasie, that what Rubio is saying is
just as offensive as what Trump said. Will that resonate?

HUNT: Well, Reverend, to a certain extent this is the difficulty of
dealing with Donald Trump, right? I mean, it is the flip side of the fact
that he can command headlines whenever he wants to by saying this
outrageous bombastic things. And if you`re the Clinton campaign, it makes
it hard to, you know, give your voters a sense that they should be just as
alarmed about Rubio as much calmer seeming, but in their view extreme
policy positions. That`s the challenge that they face and that`s again, we
were talking a little bit about this earlier. You know, that`s the
challenge for them.

I mean, Scott Walker had a similar moment in the debate where he was asked
about protections for the life of the mother and abortion-related
legislation. And, you know, we`re not sure where this Trump phenomenon is
going to end up. I think if you didn`t have Trump there, both that Scott
Walker moment and also Rubio`s position here, would be things that could
potentially, we would be talking about them as things that will potentially
last into the general election and they still could. But I think at this
point, with what`s happening with Trump it`s so unpredictable. I`m not
sure that we can go so far as to start having that conversation at this

SHARPTON: Do you think, Joan, that we`re seeing the beginning of the end
as we`ve seen it predicted wrongly before? I mean, the new poll out, Trump
is still up at 19 percent, Carson at 12, Walker at 12, 11 to Bush, 10 to
Carly and Cruz at nine. It doesn`t look like it hurt and he is standing
right now.

WALSH: No. I mean, at every juncture, people have said, he can`t say that
about Mexican immigrant. He can`t say that about John McCain. He can`t
say that about Megyn Kelly and FOX. He pick add fight with FOX and he won.
Roger Ailes called him to beg him to come on the shows. There is a great -

SHARPTON: Well, we are going to talk a lot about that later in the show.

I have the question, Kasie, though, for all of you to ask Donald Trump that
will really bring a lot of followers to thinking if he won for president,
would he put a big T on his emblem on the White House. Everybody should
think about that.

Kasie Hunt, Joan Walsh, thank you both for your time tonight.

WALSH: Thanks, Rev.

HUNT: Thanks, Reverend.

SHARPTON: Ahead, new questions about the deadly police shooting of an
unarmed college football player. Now, the FBI is investigating.

Also, GOP`s poor logic, you won`t believe the newest Republican solution to
income inequality.

And what Bernie Sanders` record-setting crowd say about the appeal of a
progressive agenda.

Plus, Trump TV, the new twist in his suddenly strange relationship with FOX

It`s a big show tonight, stay with us.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I read that ad during a recent conversation are the
Republican donor, Jeb Bush referred to Donald Trump as a buffoon, a clown,
and a-hole. Then Trump was like that`s right, I`m a total triple threat.



SHARPTON: New questions tonight in the deadly police shooting of unarmed
man in Texas. Could it have been avoided? Tonight we are getting new
evidence including the dispatch audio with the FBI joining the



LORETTA LYNCH, U.S. ATTORNEY GENERAL: I strongly condemn the violence that
was perpetrated against the community including the police officers in
Ferguson last evening. Not only does violence obscure any message of
peaceful protest, it places the community, as well as the officers who are
seeking to protect it in harm`s way.


SHARPTON: Attorney general Loretta Lynch condemning violence breaking out
in Ferguson, Missouri overnight. Today authorities declared a state of
emergency in the town. That`s after gunfire erupted scattering crowds that
gathered to mark one year since the death of Michael Brown.


SHARPTON: Police said the shooting was an exchange of gunfire between two
rival groups and had nothing to do with the peaceful protest protests.


CHIEF JOHN BELMAR, ST. LOUIS COUNTY POLICE: No, they were criminals. They
were not protesters. Protesters are people that are out there. They are
talking about a way on how to affect change. There is a small group of
people out there that are intent on making sure that we don`t have peace
that prevails. I don`t know how else to say that.


SHARPTON: Today an 18-year-old is in critical condition related to the
violence. Police say he opened fire on plain clothes officers in an
unmarked car. Early this morning, he faces charges of assault. Those
officers have been placed on administrative leave.

MSNBC`s Trymaine Lee is live in Ferguson.

And I`m going to Trymaine. What is the mood like there now, Termaine? I
was there Friday with members of the family and into Saturday morning. And
then I hear this when I get back to New York Sunday. And I know it`s
unrelated to the protests. What`s the mood now on the street?

TRYMAINE LEE, MSNBC CORRESPONDENT: Folks are at once saddened and
frustrated that while they are commemorating, you know, a movement that was
sparked by bloodshed and violence that again bloodshed and violence
revisited this community. And that it just -- have taken so many steps
forward and in some ways is tainting all these they have been trying to

On the same token for a number of other people talk to, protesters who say
that, you know, what? This is another example of these guys state sanction
violence. And they point to the fact that the police were in plain clothes
and that there were unmarked police car. And while Chief Belmar of the St.
Louis county police say that they turned on the lights on the inside, they
just don`t trust anything the police have to say.

And so, even while, you know, folks who were out there heard this kind of
valley of gunfire and clearly, there were folks in the crowd that were
firing and police say this young man was a part of that initial skirmish,
they simply still don`t believe the police and say again, it illustrates,
you know, why they have been protesting in the first place.

SHARPTON: I understand that and again, I had left on Saturday, but I
understand yesterday there was gunfire while the peaceful protest was going
on totally unrelated. And the incident that caused the injury was later
last night two. So there was two shootings, both unrelated to the
protesters, is that correct?

LEE: That is correct. And I mean, that`s when we talk about this
language, so many times people gather in street but are they legitimate
protesters. Last night at St. Mark`s church there, most of the organizers
and Dr. Cornell west and bunch of other folks who were at St. Marks. After
that, there was a free concert with a (INAUDIBLE) and a bunch of other
activists` MCs.

So, most of the organizers and I don`t want to say legitimate protesters,
but they weren`t on Ferguson. What you saw on Ferguson last night was
reminisce of what we saw the night of the indictment. A bunch of really
young kids out there. You are talking about 14, 15, 16 mixed in with
families and some other folks, but the mood was a little different. Even
today`s civil disobedience. It was very organized. It was ordinarily.
Now, it was in passion and angry and spirited.

SHARPTON: That was the Moral Monday movement that had already been
scheduled. Reverend Barbour has initiated that movement all over the

LEE: That`s right.

SHARPTON: MSNBC`s Trymaine Lee, thank you for your reporting this evening.

LEE: Thanks, Rev.

SHARPTON: Now we turn to the police shooting death of an unarmed college
student in Texas.

The Arlington police chief is asking the FBI to help with the investigation
in to the death of 19-year-old college student named Christian Taylor. He
was killed by a police trainee inside a car dealership. Security video
shows Taylor vandalizing cars at the scene. The video also shows him
crashing a jeep into the showroom. But it does not show the fatal


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Suspect is still inside on the property. He broke
into possibly a gray colored ford mustang.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We got shorts fired.


SHARPTON: Police say Taylor tried to flee the scene and was shot during a
struggle by officer brad Miller who has been put on paid leave. He has not
yet provided a statement to investigators, which is standard practice for
police in the area. The police chief promises that there will be a
transparent thorough and fair investigation.

Joining me now is Marq Claxton, former New York police officer and director
of Black Law Enforcement Alliance. Thanks for being here.

SHARPTON: Marq, what will be the initial focus of an FBI investigation in
a matter like this?

CLAXTON: It`s a typical investigation. You want to gather as much
evidence out there as possible. That evidence could be video evidence
which some of it, of course, has been forth coming and been released. Some
additional video evidence supposedly has not been released but I`m sure
they will examine that. You want to go over ballistics and forensic
evidence that you may have. You want to basically established, you know,
forensically what could have occurred, what did occur and you want to back
that up by good science. So you have investigators on the scene here that
will be trying to kind of recreate if you will exactly what happened where
everyone was, the positioning, what evidence is and what that evidence will
tell you about what actually occurred.

SHARPTON: Now, there were two officers involved in this confrontation with
Christian Taylor. Officer Miller is a rookie. He fired his gun four
times. The other officer is a 19-year veteran of the force. He used his
taser. Could experience have played a role in the decision about the use
of police and should this trainee should he even have been there on the
scene when a call like this was made?

CLAXTON: Experience, absolutely is very relevant and especially these use
of deadly physical force cases there, especially when you have a more
experienced officer who does not use deadly physical force. You have an
officer with limited amount of time and really, a tremendous limited amount
of time on the job itself who does use this firearm and uses it four times
as opposed to the more experienced officer who used non-lethal means, at
least attempted to use non-lethal means in the interaction there.

So definitely is relevant and it speaks also in addition to time on the job
or experience, it also speaks to the current level of professional
standards across the nation in policing and whether or not there needs to
be a further examination of that, as well.

SHARPTON: Now, Christian`s father spoke about his son`s death. Listen to
this, Marq.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What he`s done in no way is right, you know. But shoot
an unarmed man and you`re trained to take down, as a police officer you`re
trained to take down men with your hands. You have your tasers, you have
your clubs, whatever there is. Unarmed 19-year-old and you shoot the kid?


SHARPTON: Won`t that be a key part of the investigation whether or not it
was justified to use deadly force?

CLAXTON: Absolutely. I mean, they are going to examine that continual
force as its referred to in law enforcement circles. You know, at what
point can you use? What type of force? Is it justifiable from a legal
standpoint, et cetera. And what the father expressed is what other
communities, other individuals expressed as well and that`s he really
displays an erosion in the confidence of law enforcement. You know,
because we`re at the stage right now where everything has to be questioned
rightfully because we`ve seen some cases where there weren`t enough
questions asked or the right answers weren`t given to the questions. So,
you know, he`s really expressing not only grief of a family member, but
really the, he really displayed what is happening across the nation and
that`s an erosion in confidence and trust unfortunately in law enforcement.

SHARPTON: Marq Claxton, thank you for your time tonight.

CLAXTON: Thank you, Rev.

SHARPTON: Coming up, Rand Paul says we can solve income inequality if
people work harder. It`s like the 47 percent comments all over again.

And after their big fight, are Donald Trump and FOX News getting back
together? What that means for 2016.


SHARPTON: Americans want fresh ideas and by golly (ph), that`s what
Republicans are going to give them. Just listen to the ground breaking new
policies the GOP candidates presented at the first debate.


SEN. MARCO RUBIO (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We need to repeal or replace

BUSH: You get rid of Obamacare.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Repeal Obamacare.

TRUMP: We have to end Obamacare.


SHARPTON: Well, wait a second. I think we rolled the wrong clip. That
sounds like the old rhetoric, control room, do we have the right soundbite?


RUBIO: We need to repeal and replace ObamaCare.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You get rid of ObamaCare.


TRUMP: We have to end ObamaCare.


SHARPTON: Yep, it turns out that was the right clip. Republicans are
still talking about repealing ObamaCare, despite the mounting evidence
that`s working. A new study shows in states that expanded Medicaid and set
up health care exchanges, the uninsured rate dropped by 44 percent while
states that didn`t take both of those steps only saw 28 percent drop. So,
here is a fresh idea. Republicans could get on board with Medicaid
expansion, nearly half the adults that remain uninsured would be eligible,
but until then, Republicans should come back to planet reality where
ObamaCare isn`t failing. The sky isn`t falling and the talking points from
2010 are not working. Nice try but we got you.


SHARPTON: It`s the new 2016 republican answer to income inequality and
it`s a doozy. Here is GOP Senator Rand Paul saying Americans must, they
just need to work harder.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Question, doesn`t your plan massively increase income

SEN. RAND PAUL (R-KY), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Well, the thing is income
inequality is due to some people working harder and selling more things.
So, if people voluntarily buy more of your stuff, you have more money.


SHARPTON: He said that, that`s right, he`s claiming inequality as due to
some people working harder. It`s startling. Implying that the poor just
don`t work harder enough. It`s also strikingly similar to Jeb Bush last
month when he said Americans need to work longer hours. And for party
trying to move forward, it`s a painful flash back to Mitt Romney`s 47
percent comments. But for Democrats, it`s an opening, a chance to put
forward serious solutions. Today Hillary Clinton unveiled her college
affordability plan and she took aim at Republicans who refused to make it a


HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I want them to have to answer
to the American people why they don`t want to make college more affordable
and why they don`t want to refinance college debt. This has to be a choice
and so what we`re doing is setting up our side of the choice. We`re
setting up, you know, the proposal that I`m making and then I`m going to be
looking to see what their response is and then let`s have an election about


SHARPTON: Bernie Sanders is also drawing the contrast with Republicans on
income inequality and he`s drawing huge crowds, a record-setting 28,000
showed up in Portland, Oregon for his rally last night. If Republicans
want to gain ground on this issue, they better take Rand Paul`s advice and
work harder.

Joining me now is Austan Goolsbee, former chairman of President Obama`s
Council of Economic Advisors and democratic strategist Jamal Simmons.
Thank you both for being here.



SHARPTON: Austan, what is your take on Rand Paul`s comments that income
inequality is due to some people working harder?

GOOLSBEE: Well, look, you kind of nailed this. The thing that`s
interesting is that data shows that the biggest increase in income
inequality has come from the big returns to capital income. The earning of
interest on your inheritances --


GOOLSBEE: On big stock holdings on things like that. Obviously, how many
hours you`re working at your job is not going to allow you to catch up to
the amount that Donald Trump`s kids are getting when the stock market is
going up 15 percent a year. So I think he really missed the boat and
Hillary Clinton was on both with the focus on college education today. And
in her last speech, she highlighted let`s have programs to have businesses
share more of their profits with their employees. I think those are both
things that would address inequality.

SHARPTON: Jamal, were Rand Paul`s comments just a slip of the tongue or do
they reveal something about the right wing philosophy?

SIMMONS: No, it`s clearly not a slip of the tongue, Rev. They have an
entire plan about how to cut taxes so that it benefits the wealthy more.
The problem for the Republicans on this is that most Americans think they
are working pretty darn hard. Most Americans get up every day and they go
out and they work and they don`t see the returns. And what Austan has been
talking about and others, is when you see productivity going up but yet
wages staying flat, you got to find some way to get the system fixed so
that people can see the benefit of their work. That`s the challenge. And
you know, we have to explain that in big mass macro-economic terms that
Americans don`t get. They already know it. They feel it in their bones
and they`re looking for somebody who is going to help fix it. I think
Hillary Clinton did a great job today offering a plan that is really going
to disrupt opportunity to let more people participate in our economy, not
less like Rand Paul.

SHARPTON: You know, Austan, I mentioned that this was reminiscing -- I`m
talking about Rand Paul`s working hard statement, it sounded similar to Jeb
Bush saying something last month. Listen to this.


PAUL: Work force participation has to rise from its all-time modern lows.
It means that people need to work longer hours and through their
productivity gain more income for their families. That`s the only way
we`re going to get out of this rut that we`re in.


SHARPTON: So, Jeb Bush is saying people need to work longer hours. Rand
Paul saying they need to work harder. I mean, has the GOP learned anything
since Mitt Romney`s 47 percent comments?

GOOLSBEE: Not from -- you don`t see it in those statements, certainly. I
mean, there is a little bit of a distinction between the two of them, Bush
and Rand Paul but I can`t tell which one I find more disturbing. On one
hand, Jeb Bush seems to have a totally pessimistic view that he says the
only way we`re going to get out of it is if people are going to go work
even harder than they do now, which Americans that are working already work
more hours than virtually any other country in the entire OECD of advanced
economies. Rand Paul took it one further appearing to say that the
inequality was good, that it kind of reflected what was accurate, that the
reason people don`t make as much is they are not working hard enough and
they don`t sell things that people want to buy. Now, that`s a different
idea but it`s an equally offensive idea to people who are doing their jobs.

SHARPTON: Yes. I mean, what I guess I`m trying to get Jamal is don`t they
just seem out of touch? I mean, don`t they seem disconnected from
Americans in everyday life?

SIMMONS: They do seem disconnected, Rev. And as Austan was saying, this
is economic and social Darwinism that you`re successful because you meant
to be successful. Because you`re better than the other people. That`s the
part of libertarianism that I think most people don`t really buy. Because
they know they work hard, they watch their neighbors work hard and they see
what happens. I can remember very vividly being on the campaign trail with
candidates in years past and having people walk up to them and say, it`s
not just fair for people like me. The wealthy get everything. The elites
in my community are getting off but we are getting stuck with the bill and
it`s not working. People want somebody who will help, just regular every
day average Americans have a shot at being successful.

SHARPTON: Austan, you mentioned Hillary Clinton`s affordability program in
terms of college tuition. Let`s look at what the democratic candidates are
proposing to make college more affordable. Hillary Clinton`s plan would
put $350 billion toward college affordability and student loan reform.
Bernie Sanders has introduced a bill to eliminate tuition at four-year
public colleges. How much will issues like this help Democrats draw a
contrast with Republicans in 2016?

GOOLSBEE: Oh, I think that`s going to be a pretty big contrast. You know,
you already saw the Republicans when Hillary Clinton outlined her plan.
Knocking themselves over trying to criticize and say it`s terrible. It`s
going to be the worst thing in the world. So I think that will be a point
of contrast, but Bernie Sanders, as you say, also coming in with a college
plan. The Democrats are firmly putting themselves on the side of we got to
get more educational opportunities for young people and the cost of college
is a critical component of that. Anybody whose against that, I think is
going to suffer with the American electorate because they know you got to
give that.

SHARPTON: Well, that`s my point, Jamal. And I`m out of time but the fact
is, even if you don`t have a commitment to this or if you`re not one that
really actively has fought for these kinds of things like I have, the
politics of it, 63 percent of Americans say, income inequality is a major
issue. How do you win going against almost two-thirds of the country
saying this is important to us?

SIMMONS: It`s just good politics. I know you got to run, Rev. As a
political person here, I also have to say, this is good for Hillary Clinton
to be out changing the subject and talking about what she wants to do for
America, not talking about these other controversies.

SHARPTON: Austan Goolsbee, Jamal Simmons, thank you both for your time

SIMMONS: Thank you.

GOOLSBEE: Thank you.

SHARPTON: Ahead, Donald Trump versus Fox News. Trump talks on the air but
what is going on behind the scenes?

Plus, President Obama opens up about Ferguson and the urgent need for
criminal justice reform.


SHARPTON: Donald Trump is a big talker all across the country and on our
Facebook page, too. Linda wrote, keep it up Trump, you are the gift that
keeps on giving to the democratic candidates. Robin posted, let`s keep
Trump in the game as he makes this race comical.

And Idelia said, "Fox made Donald. Ha, ha. Karma." Idelia, you may have
hit the nail on the head.

Coming up, we`ll going to dive deeper into the Trump Fox relationship and
what`s happening behind the scenes.



UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you think the Fox moderators were fair to you last

TRUMP: No, I don`t think so. I`m not sure that Fox is fair necessarily,
but maybe I should just keep it going because it seems to be whatever it
is, it seems to be going.


SHARPTON: For days republican frontrunner Donald Trump bashed the Fox News
debate. He called out the moderators and their questions, but then today,
a sudden change. When Trump revealed the President of Fox called him, he
tweeted, "Roger Ailes just called me. He is a great guy and assures me
that Trump will be treated fairly on Fox News. His word is always good."

And for the record, yes, he did put quotes around his own name but I
degrees. The tweet came right after MSNBC`s Joe Scarborough was after he
was grilled about whether he had talked to Fox and Trump played it coy.


JOE SCARBOROUGH, MSNBC ANCHOR: Obviously, it`s not in Fox News` interest
to be in a war with you, it`s not in your best interest to be at war with
Fox News. Have you talked to Roger over the weekend? Have you talked to
anybody in Fox News over the weekend about trying to find common ground
with the network?

TRUMP: Well, I don`t want to say that but I will tell you that I don`t Fox
treats me well.

SCARBOROUGH: Well, hold on a second. You`re a straight talker, baby.
Come on --

TRUMP: I don`t want to say. Why should I say? I`m not going to embarrass

SCARBOROUGH: Have to talked to Fox News?

TRUMP: I lead my leap -- my whole life has been led on the theory that I
do not want to embarrass people.


SHARPTON: He doesn`t want to embarrass people? He gave out Lindsey
Graham`s phone number. But apparently, he`s now making amends with Fox.
Trump has a long history with the network. Before running for president,
he was a regular but once he stepped off that set and on to their debate
stage, he thought the host singled him out.


MEGYN KELLY, Fox NEWS HOST: You called women you don`t like fat pigs,
dogs, slobs, and disgusting animals.

TRUMP: Only Rosie O`Donnell.


BRET BAIER, Fox NEWS HOST: You`ve also supported a host of other liberal
policies. You`ve also donated to several democratic candidates Hillary
Clinton included Nancy Pelosi.

CHRIS WALLACE, Fox NEWS HOST: Trump corporations, casinos and hotels have
declared bankruptcy four times over the last quarter century.


SHARPTON: But after demanding an apology, Trump is coming home. A Fox
News host just posted that Trump would appear tomorrow morning on Fox News
to talk about his relationship with Fox News.

Joining me now is Eric Boehlert, he`s from of course Media Matters for
America. Thank you for being here again, Eric.


SHARPTON: Now, listen to Donald Trump talk about this drama on "The Today
Show" this morning. Listen to this.



TRUMP: They had 24 million people watching. It was the largest in the
history of Fox and the largest in all of cable television history. Twenty
four million people. If I wasn`t on the show, they would have had two
million people watching and they probably wouldn`t have had that many. So,
you know, the other candidates are very lucky because at least people are
watching what they are saying as opposed to nobody caring.


SHARPTON: Now, Eric, is that the calculations here for Fox, Trump brings
viewers, high ratings, for Trump they give him exposure?

BOEHLERT: It`s kind of a win, win lose. It`s a win for Fox. They had
record-breaking ratings for the debate, it`s a win for Trump. It`s a loss
for the Republican Party and Democrats are also winning, too. Democrats
were thrilled that the debate had record ratings. It was funny that tweet,
so Trump is this Fox creation.


BOEHLERT: He`s going to appear on Fox to talk about his relationship with
Fox News.


BOEHLERT: I mean, we`re in the house of mirrors at this point and it`s
impossible to separate Fox News from Trump from the Republican Party. It`s
all one big stoop. There is Joe Scarborough. Did you talk to Roger? He
doesn`t even have to tell him who Roger is.


BOEHLERT: He`s supposed to be the head of the news organization. Why
would the candidate be calling the head of a news organization over the
weekend? But this is where we`re at in terms of the convoluted

SHARPTON: Now, what happens after this big feud?

BOEHLERT: Well, nobody really knows. Is Ailes just playing this for
ratings? Was he building up Trump? You know, Media Matters documented
Trump got the most air time last two months in a row of all candidates.
So, is he just building Trump up and hopes for big ratings for the debate?
And now Fox is going to turn? We don`t know. There is lots of people that
still love him. His interviews tomorrow, my guess are going to be phoning
interviews on Fox News.

SHARPTON: Well, we also read about how the owner of News Corp, which owns
Fox --


SHARPTON: Rupert Murdoch was vehemently against Donald Trump but that
Ailes was in a different place. Are they playing good guy, bad guy with
the public here and that they end up with big ratings and advertisers while
they act like there is some internal difference while everybody over there
is laughing at these kind of ratings they are getting?

BOEHLERT: Yes. Right. Early on, Rupert Murdoch very critical with his
twitter account and going after Trump but he`s on silent on that front,
there is always been this turf battle Roger Ailes dominates Fox News. He
has the ratings and the revenues so he can keep, you know, Rupert at a
distance. Again, Rupert has sort of quietly backed off his opposition of
Trump. But all of this leaves the Republican Party in turmoil because
they`ve handed over their branding to a cable channel.

SHARPTON: Would though -- on the Fox part of this, would they sacrifice
their star news anchor in the evening in prime time, Megyn Kelly? I mean,
would they throw her in front of the quote bus as we would say to keep
Donald Trump because of the ratings? I mean, don`t they have some
obligation to dealing with her? She`s their major evening host.

BOEHLERT: Right, in terms of defending her, he went after her strong after
the debate.

SHARPTON: Absolutely. Retweeted a bimbo --

BOEHLERT: Right. We haven`t hear Roger Ailes defend her. I don`t think
they`re going to throw her under the bus. I think it`s almost every man
for them self. The morning show might like Trump. The evening show might
not like Trump. Again, this is what happens when you hand over the
branding of a primary to a cable channel. It`s crazy. We`ve never seen
anything like it.

SHARPTON: Eric Boehlert, thank you for your time tonight.

BOEHLERT: Thank you.

SHARPTON: Ahead, President Obama`s new comments about policing, civil
rights and race in America.


SHARPTON: One year after the shooting death of Michael Brown, it`s clear
we need to continue talking about policing and civil rights in America.
President Obama talked about the urgency of these issues in an interview
with NPR.


PRES. BARACK OBAMA (D), UNITED STATES: If in my first term Ferguson had
flared up as President of the United States, I would have been commenting
on what was happening in Ferguson. I feel a great urgency to get as much
done as possible. And there is no doubt that after over six and a half
years on this job, I probably have an easier time juggling a lot of
different issues, and it may be that my passions show a little bit more.


SHARPTON: He is showing his passions but we`re not seeing that same
passion on the right. At last week`s debate, there were few questions on
policing, voting or civil rights but the debate`s own co-sponsor Facebook
released its poll showing the top five most talked about topics. Number
one is racial issues ahead of Mexico, the economy, LGBT issues and
immigration. It`s top of mine in an urgent time but some on the right say
focusing on racial discord only creates more.


GOV. SCOTT WALKER (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: If anyone focuses on racial
discord, we`ll going to get more. You see that across the country and in
this administration. If we focus on unity, then we`ll going to get more of


SHARPTON: We need more dialogue on race, not less. When you have
structural inequality, when you have unfairness, it is not divisive to talk
about it, it`s divisive not to talk about it. If there is a racial divide
in the criminal justice system, in the economy, to leave it divided is
divisive. To bring it together, is where you solve problems.

Thanks for watching. I`m Al Sharpton. "HARDBALL" starts right now.


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