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All In With Chris Hayes, Friday, August 21st, 2015

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Date: August 21, 2015
Guest: McKay Coppins, Tara Dowdell, Sam Seder, Tera Dowdell, Mckay
Coppins, Ricardo Aca

CHRIS HAYES, MSNBC HOST: Good evening on this Friday night. I`m
Chris Hayes.

And right now, we are awaiting what is widely expected to be the
biggest event yet of the 2016 campaign. It`s a rally for the current
Republican front runner, a man by the name of Donald J. Trump you may have
heard of. And it is held at 43,000-seat football stadium in Mobile,

People started lining up hours ago in 90-degree heat to get in and to
get a spot. And if the crowd size fulfills Trump campaign`s expectations,
it will make up more than one fifth of the entire population of Mobile.

Joining me now live from Donald Trump`s rally is NBC News
correspondent Katy Tur. She has been following the campaign and there all

Katy, who`s coming to this rally and why?

KATY TUR, NBC NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Well, a lot of people are coming to
this rally. First up, they were hoping that 36,000 would come. They said
they had upwards of 36,000 RSVPs. The stadium holds 40,000 people, but as
you can see, it`s about less than half full at the moment.

So far, though, there are a lot of people are coming to hear his blunt
talk. They are excited to hear what he has to say. They`re excited to
hear what they may not expect to have him to say because he is always a bit
of a loose cannon.

So far, though, the people there, here say they are not necessarily
all decided that they are going to vote for Donald Trump, but they do
believe he has a chance for their vote. They are going to come out and
hopefully, in their words, be convinced by what he is offering the country,
especially, the immigration plan.

Out there, people here are hot on the issue of immigration. Back in
2011, Alabama passed the strictest immigration law in the country. One
where it even made it illegal to give a ride to an undocumented immigrant
in a car be it to school, work or just down the street.

Most of that law was struck down by the courts. It`s no longer in the
books. This is also home to Republican Senator Jeff Sessions who helped
Donald Trump frame his immigration policy.

Also, the state`s governor endorsed John Kasich just a couple of days
ago. So, Donald Trump is no doubt going to come out here and say even
though your governor endorsed somebody else who I can bring out to see me.
Look at the crowds I get. Kasich isn`t getting as much. Look how far down
he is in the polls. I`m leading everyone.

Expect to hear him talk very bombastically about what he can do and
how smart he is and how far ahead he is than his opponents at the moment.

HAYES: Katy, your Trump impression and your predictions of the speech
are getting pretty good the longer that you are riding along with him. I
think all those safe predictions. We will check back with you throughout
the evening.

All right. Joining me now at the table, McKay Coppins, senior
political writer for "BuzzFeed", Democratic strategist Tara Dowdell, Sam
Seder, MSNBC contributor and host of "The Majority Report".

OK. So you, listener, viewer, hi. How are you? Happy Friday night.

Here`s what we are going to do. We`re going to try something tonight.
A special enhanced viewing experience.

Here`s the thing, Donald Trump right now, by any journalistic
standard, is the number one story in the campaign. There`s no way around

I mean, the bump that he`s had in the polls far surpassed the merry-
go-round bumps that we saw in 2012. There`s comparisons with Perry and
Gingrich. He`s outlasting them. He`s led in the last 28 polls.

Recent Rasmussen polls shows among Republican voters, 70 percent
expect him to win the nomination. Here`s why it is an important number.
The best predictor of victory in an election isn`t people saying who they
will vote for but who they expect to win. In fact, that question is one of
the most effective predictors of who wins in general presidential

So, that is important for this polling data -- 28 polls in a row in
which he has led. He is polling 30 to 15 ahead of Bush in the state of
Alabama. He has fairly depthless resources, right? So, this is not
someone who`s going to run out of money, OK?

He has weathered already four or five media storms that people
predicted would be his demise. He has completely untethered from much of
the orthodoxy of the Republican Party, even the conservative movement,
particularly that hoisted by the donor class that ends up being a political
liability. He is a real, genuine phenomenon.

I was among the people who are skeptical in the beginning. McKay
Coppins I believe, you are among the skeptical. Sam, you are a less

SAM SEDER, MSNBC CONTRIBUTOR: I don`t think I was skeptical at all,
frankly. No. I think -- listen, they have been building Donald`s shadow,
Donald Trump for 20 years. It`s just they didn`t expect that real Donald
Trump would show up.

I mean, honestly, I think there was a suit they were creating, the CEO
president, the guy who wasn`t going to take guff, who could talk tough, and
he showed up at one point, and he`s got a lot of money. That`s the big
problem too for the Republicans.

HAYES: He`s got a lot of money and there`s a variety of things
happening here. One is, we heard for so long how strong the Republican
field was. People have been writing this story forever, forever. I read
it 600 times, so strong, deep bench, all these people. Look at all of
these people.

Well, this guy is trouncing all of them. So all the articles about
how deep bench, about how great the candidates -- I`m sorry, Jeb Bush maybe
you think he was a great governor, maybe you think he`s a bad governor,
maybe you think he`s good politics, maybe you think he`s got bad politics,
has not been particularly impressive on the trail so far.

That`s not a substantive judgment, it is a purely performance politics
judgment, not super impressive. OK? Donald Trump will tell you that, by
the way. OK?

But this is -- this is where things now stand. I have -- you know,
the old Keynes line, when the facts change, I change my mind. What do you

I have had to change my mind. Do I think he could be the next
president of the United States? No, I still would bet against that. Do I
think he`s gong to be a nominee? No.

Is he going to be around, is this an actual thing? Is this more than
some like crazy summer flash in the pan, more than a Herman Cain, Michele
Bachmann moment that happens five months out? Yes, 100 percent yes. This
is happening.

SEDER: More than that, he`s not only trouncing them in terms of the
polls, he`s basically every single candidate has had to change whatever
game plan they had two months ago, the day before he jumped in to this
race. Whatever game plan they thought they had has been thrown out the
window. Jeb Bush, in the universe where Donald Trump does not run, never
says the word "anchor babies." He`s never done, there`s not --

HAYES: True, like he was part of a group that wrote a memo saying not
to use it.

SEDER: Exactly.


SEDER: You have the entire party moving to the right, becoming more
and more crazy just to basically get someone to report on them.

HAYES: OK. But, here`s the thing -- yes on immigration moving to the
right, agreed. But to me what is an important thing to understand about
what Donald Trump is doing is that the politics he`s channeling are truer
to the base than the ideologically rigid politics of the conservative
movement. Do you agree, McKay?

MCKAY COPPINS, BUZZFEED: Because he`s not -- because what he is
channeling is not actually an ideologically coherent set of ideas. What
he`s channeling --

HAYES: It`s not like high excess, than when central planning comes in
inevitably, you get risk-taking and cronyism.


What his campaign is built on is an attitude and style and channeling
the id of the conservative base. And at its core, on the right and left,
that is what politics is about. It`s an identity politics that he has
mastered. He is a master performer.

What is interesting, though, I think, is this has been his style for
25 years.

HAYES: Right.

COPPINS: It`s just that now he`s reinvented himself as a right wing
populist provocateur. And it works very well in that setting.

TARA DOWDELL, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: He is the Madonna of politics.
I mean, he has reinvented himself.

HAYES: That`s a good point.

DOWDELL: Because what Trump has over everyone else, particularly the
Michele Bachmanns, the Herman Cains, who are flashes in the pan, what he
has over them is he understands marketing.

So, I worked on campaigns, but I also run a marketing firm. And he
understands that marketing is connecting what matters to people, speaking
to that and connecting with them emotionally and the Republican Party fear
is a primary driver of that.

Donald Trump has tapped into that, tapped into those fear, also some
of those aspirations.


DOWDELL: And that is what he is exploiting.

HAYES: Let me tell you something, I spent most of today listening to
Trump speeches, OK, preparing myself for tonight`s live fact checking,
which we`re going to try to pull off. Don`t go anywhere.

SEDER: You can`t fact -- they are not there.

HAYES: Here`s a few things I learned -- do we have -- can we play the
flag petting? Do we have the flag petting?

I want to show that. Here we go. This is him. That`s him the other
day. Him petting and giving thumbs up to the American flag. OK?

Now, yes, there we go. Cuddling with the flag.

Can we show him talking about the bible? Someone held up a book and
this is him talking about what he thinks about the bible. Take a listen.


DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Hold that book up, please.
OK. One of the great books.

That`s my second favorite book of all time. You know what my first
is? The bible.


Nothing beats the Bible. Nothing beats the Bible. Not even "The Art
of the Deal." Not even close.

I will go so strongly against many things that when they take away the
word Christmas, that offends me -- I go out of my way to use the word with
Christmas. I`d have some people that do this very professionally, they
say, oh, don`t mention the word Christmas. I said, like hell I`m not going
to mention. I`m going to mention, I get up there, I mean Christmas before
I start speaking.

So, there`s a great assault on Christianity in so many ways.


HAYES: Why did I play those three things. That one of the myths that
developed in the two months of the Donald Trump campaign is he is a
straight shooter. That he`s just saying whatever.

The guy is pandering in the most focused way imaginable. He comes
out, he pets the American flag. He tells people the bible is the greatest
book. He says he goes out of his way to say Christmas. He talks about
Christians that are being beheaded by ISIS. He`s in front of New
Hampshire, and he says, people in New York are like, what are they alike,
and I tell them, they are great hard working people, OK?

That is like, oh, he`s not a politician, that is the most lowest
common denominator, obvious pandering a person can do. So, that is one
thing to understand about what a person is doing here.

Not only that -- his shtick has gotten much more on message. So, he
is improvising -- believe me, I listen to five speeches today, back to back
to back.

The themes are always the same. He`s doing the thing that effective
politicians do. He comes back to the same things. He`s not freelancing
all over the place.

SEDER: Right. He`s got macros and I would imagine to a certain
extent that it`s not -- he is not just concocting this. I think he
probably does watch FOX News on a fairly regular basis. I mean, that`s
where his friends are. Even if he`s in --

HAYES: He watches it all the time. He live sweet tweets it.

SEDER: He`s just basically regurgitating what he`s seeing on FOX and
he`s found it to be a very effective and frankly, it makes sense he would
win that battle at FOX. Everyone thought this is FOX versus Trump. FOX is
going to win. No. No, they didn`t.

DOWDELL: To your point, if you watch him when he makes a speech, when
he seems -- he feels he`s losing the audience, he goes to those things that
he knows are going to resonate, he knows will get the applause. He does it
all the time.

But, actually, it is like a break in his chain of thought. You can
tell it is obvious he pivots right to those applause lines.

COPPINS: I can say -- I saw him speak in New Hampshire at the
beginning of 2014 and he was nowhere near as good as he is now. I mean, he
had a very untethered speaking style where he was bobbing from one thing to
the next and he was trying to use -- when he felt like he was in trouble he
would go to his TV catch phrase. He would tell a story about firing
someone, right? That was his way to get the audience back, but he was all
over the place.

And you are absolutely right that he has perfected his performance,
his campaign persona and it is very effective. His press conference this
week was very, very good.

HAYES: Let me just say this, you are seeing right now, that is the
football stadium in Mobile, Alabama. If that looks familiar, you are
right, that`s where the bowl is played every year, if that is
what is ringing in your ears. The capacity there is 40,000 people. Katy
Tur said it was half full when we last checked in.

Trump`s folks say they expect as many as 36,000. It`s a big crowd
either way in the town of Mobile. It`s a big thing happening on Friday

We are going to monitor this and we`re going to take a quick break.
When we come back, we will keep our eye on that screen. We have our fact
checkers, our crack team of producers at the ready. I have subjected the
entire staff to hours of Donald Trump speak in preparation for you.

Trump check live when we come back. Don`t go anywhere.


HAYES: If there`s a core to the message Donald Trump has been giving
and a core to the mess and resonating in what football stadium down there
in Alabama, one of the most restrictive unconstitutional immigration laws
in the country. It is very extreme.

At times, just ugly rhetoric about immigrants and immigration. Well,
it turns out Donald Trump is a sprawling business empire and in some of
those buildings and hotels and construction sites and restaurants in those
hotels there are immigrants and undocumented immigrants working with in
them. One of them has come forward and he`s going to join us here to give
his message to Mr. Trump ahead. Don`t go anywhere.


HAYES: All right. We are -- we are monitoring the crowd in the
stadium in Mobile, Alabama, where Donald Trump will speak in just a bit. I
told you we would be bringing on someone who works in a Trump building, who
is himself an undocumented immigrant. We`re going to do that in just a
little bit.

We think that Trump might be taking stage fairly soon here. Here at
the table, I have McKay Coppins, senior political writer for "BuzzFeed",
Democratic strategist Tara Dowdell, also formerly a contestant on "The
Apprentice", and Sam Seder, MSNBC contributor and host of "The Majority

So, I was giving the bullish case, OK, the bullish case of take this
seriously. This is going to stick around. This is not the sort of flash
in the pan I thought it was or the stunt I thought it was in the beginning.
What`s the bearish case? What`s your case for -- what is the kryptonite

COPPINS: Yes. Well, I think we all -- I was certainly wrong thinking
Trump was going to flame out by the end of the summer. I think it`s clear
he will stick around longer than that. I think that when you look -- you
mentioned a bunch of poll numbers that help him a lot. One thing that
really hurts him and that could prove detrimental to this whole thing is
his unfavorable rating among Republicans. It`s the highest --

HAYES: You think it might hurt in a Republican primary.

COPPINS: Well, who knows he could overcome it. Look, it is highest
among anyone in the field, it`s at 43 percent. They don`t like him. They
have unfavorable opinions of him.

And they haven`t broken it down as much as I would like to see, but my
guess is among the 43 percent are millions of devout conservative
Christians. I mean, there are a lot of people on the Christian right
turned off by Donald Trump. Not just his whole attitude and his
performance, but I mean -- he as a long, illustrious career of alleged
philandering, of having basically violating every value that conservative
Christians have.

HAYES: It is clearly not a devout --

COPPINS: Not a person of faith.

HAYES: He`s not a person of faith. I mean, he`s not devout. I don`t
know his personal views but you were around him a little bit.

DOWDELL: Yes, I was around him on the show.

HAYES: This is not someone who is like quoting a scripture line.

DOWDELL: No, I never saw him quote, reference anything, cross
nothing. So, this is definitely something that is --

HAYES: I`m not saying -- he strikes me as a resolutely secular

SEDER: But, with that said, let me just offer a counter-argument
there. His unfavorability ratings have dropped precipitously since he
entered the race.

HAYES: That is true.

SEDER: He also remains the top choice to the extent that there`s, in
terms of plurality. He remains that top choice of even self identified
Christian conservatives in some polls I have seen.

You know, it seems like -- intuitively you would imagine he would be
rejected but I also thought he would be capped from being from New York,
because there`s some measure of hostility that comes -- that doesn`t seem
to be holding to logic.

COPPINS: But so far he`s -- I mean he`s wall to wall on every TV
channel, right, but still largely controlled his message. There`s not been
a single ad run against him. Not a single -- the rest of the Republican
field for the most part is trying to catch up with him. They are not
viciously, rigorously going after him.

HAYES: Rick Perry did. I mean, Rick Perry did. Lindsey Graham did.
Rand Paul did.


COPPINS: That is the very bottom of the polls, right?

DOWDELL: Four people that Republicans don`t like. John McCain going
after you, Lindsey Graham going after you, Republicans have a problem with

HAYES: By the way, as we watch this crowd file in, we should say this
about the crowds. The record crowd so far in this election is held by
Bernie Sanders, 28,000 in Oregon. Sanders posted numbers around 27,000,
28,000 a few times, 27,000 in L.A.

He has been drawing the largest crowds of the -- you can see there`s a
bunch of empty seats in the back there. Not that Mr. Trump is all for the
game of expectation setting. Folks in Trump t-shirts and mobile for Trump
signs there.

That is something to keep in mind in terms of energy and whether
energy -- the connection between energy in crowds and polling and broad
sort of applicability. What do you think of the idea that I have, which
I`m sort of obsessed with, about the message being unimpinged by the
obsessions of the oligarchs in the Republican Party?

I want to play part of the interview he did in Alabama where he got a
question about the deficit. Take a listen to this.


HOST: What do you do here to attack the deficit? Do you shrink the
size of the federal government? Do you raise taxes? Do you -- how do you
attack this?

TRUMP: No, we`re not raising taxes.

HOST: Will you take a pledge not to raise taxes?


TRUMP: -- nation in the world.

What we`re going to do is shrink government, but we`re also going to
bring back jobs.

Look, China is taken all our jobs. Other countries, not just China.
I`m using them because they are number one abuser, OK? They abuse us
because our politicians are stupid people.


HAYES: See, this is the thing. He doesn`t spend a lot of time on the
deficit. He doesn`t spend a lot of time in shrinking government. He got a
question about the deficit and he went right to his -- right to
nationalism, nationalism first, national second, nationalism third.

What are you going to do about the deficit, we will shrink government
and taxes but it is really about Chinese taking our jobs. What are you
going to do about X? Well, really, we got to get some good negotiators in
so we get this. So, you know, we take oil from Iraq.

Everything comes back to this put me the tough, strong guy in charge,
reclaim American greatness, and I think that`s actually a more appealing
message than telling people you`re going to cut Social Security.

SEDER: Of course, of course. And I would say, the third one is not
nationalism, because he`s also -- that projects on to what a lot of
conservatives perceive is a sort of like attack on their world view by
other Americans, right? By gay people, by Muslim Americans, by feminists.
I mean, it goes on and on.

You can just listen to Limbaugh for two weeks and get the list. You
can probably do it in two hours. And he refuses to take guff from anybody.
That`s like the fantasy version of themselves.

COPPINS: I think it is useful to compare him to Mike Huckabee right
now. Huckabee is the other Republican in the race who has an aversion to
this small government entitlement slashing idea that`s taken hold in the
conservative base -- conservative movement.

HAYES: You can see individual in a blazer and a red hat there. That
is Donald.

COPPINS: The iconic image.

HAYES: The iconic Trump. He seems to be enjoying himself amongst the
denizens of Mobile, Alabama, as he makes his way towards, wherever he is
going to be delivering. It`s in the middle of this crowd.

COPPINS: What I was saying is I think Huckabee has taken a lot of
guff from conservatives commentariat, this kind of Tea Party groups for not
being in line with them. When he talks about it he talks in a conservative
Christian compassion that doesn`t necessarily translate. Whereas Donald
Trump, he has a great line, when he is asked about cutting Social Security,
he said we don`t have to cut Social Security if I`m president. I am going
to make the country so rich.

HAYES: Exactly. Why go around telling people -- here he is. Trump
check live begins now. We are at the ready. Battle stations.

TRUMP: Thank you. That`s so beautiful.


You know, now I know how the great Billy Graham felt because this is
the same feeling. We love Billy Graham. We love Billy Graham.

You know, this all started -- we had a hotel and we were going to have
250, or 300 people and the hotel was great. They called and said something
is happening here. We can`t hold this. This is crazy what`s going on.
And then we went to the convention center and they have 10,000 people and
we are all set and excited and the next day they said too many people. We
can`t put them in.

So, we came here. We came here.


You know, today if you notice, we have a stock market not doing so
well. We have a country not doing so well. We have been saying it for a
long time.

We have politicians other than a few politicians that are with us
tonight, right? We`ll exclude them.

But we have politicians that don`t have a clue. They are all talk.
They are no action. What`s happening to this country is disgraceful.


And you know when I announced I was running for president, I brought
up -- I brought up the subject of illegal immigration.


And I took a lot of heat, that I can tell you. Rush Limbaugh actually
said incoming, he got more incoming than anyone I have ever seen and two
weeks later, everybody was apologizing to me. They saw I was right.
Between what happened in San Francisco to incredible Kate and her family,
such an incredible family and Jamiel and so many people have been so badly

The other day in California, last week, a woman, 66 years old, a
veteran was killed, raped, sodomized, tortured and killed by an illegal

We have to do it. We have to do something. We have to do something.


So we`re going to talk. We`re going to have a lot of fun. The
weather is a little dicey. That`s OK. Who cares if it rains, right?


Right? You know, if it rains, I`ll take off my hat and I`ll prove --
I`ll prove --


I`ll prove once and for all it`s mine. OK?

So, we`re going to talk about a lot of different subjects and, you
know, it`s nice. Friday night, what the heck, right? What`s better?
What`s better?


What people, the people that built this country. That`s what we have
here. I mean, the people that built the country. Great people.

So, we`ll start with a little talk on the illegal immigration, what`s
going on. We have to stop it. We`re going to build a wall. It`s going to
be --


You know, it`s amazing. The politicians 10, 15 years ago, they all
wanted a wall, but it never went. It never happened because somebody
didn`t want a wall, probably a lobbyist.

All of these guys like Bush and like Hillary Clinton, they are all
taking care of -- I don`t know if you know --


No, but when Hillary has $60 million and when Jeb Bush -- when Jeb
Bush who`s totally in favor of Common Core, weak on immigration, right,
very weak on immigration, wants to let people come in, although now he is
using anchor baby.

You know, he put out a memo. You cannot use anchor baby. Now because
I used it, he`s using it.

Politicians -- but when they have in his case $114 million. In
Hillary`s case, she`s got $60 million. I don`t know that she will make it
to the gate. What do you think?

I`m not sure she`s making it to the gate. Some bad things came out
today. You know, those classified. You know the word "classified."

You know, they have destroyed General Petraeus over less. And nothing
seems to be happening here. So, it will be very interesting to see what
happens ultimately.

But we have right now, and I just got these numbers today. I said
what are they? Seven and a half percent of all of the births in this
country are illegal immigrants, OK? Can`t afford it. And they are supposed
to stay.

Now I turned out to be right. The 14th Amendment -- you know I had
these guys who were telling oh, you can`t change the 14th Amendment, it`ll
take so long. On that I agree. But you know what, an act of congress --
the 14th amendment, I was right on it. You can do something with it and
you can do something fast. You can do something fast.



HAYES: Let`s just be clear about the 14th Amendment here, a pet
theory has developed in fringe circles recently that some statutory fix
could happen to the 14th Amendment, but the vast majority of constitutional
scholars I`ve read say that the words in the constitution granting
citizenship at birth to anyone born here are exactly what they are and can
only be repealed with a constitutional amendment.


TRUMP: doesn`t work that way. Mexico doesn`t do it. Other
places don`t do it. Very few places do it. We`re the only place just
about that is stupid enough to do it.


TRUMP: So, I decided to run. I have gotten an amazing reception. We
have to say. Has this been crazy?


TRUMP: Man, I mean, it`s been wild. I`m a nonpolitician. The other
day I served jury duty, right?

I told you, they had occupation. I refused to put down politician.

But I will say this, we have a great politician here. We have a man
here who really helped me. He`s the one person sought his counsel because
he`s been so
spot on. He`s so highly respected. Has anyone ever heard of Senator Jeff
Sessions, huh?

Jeff, come up. Where`s Jeff? Get over here, Jeff. Look at him.
He`s like 20 years old.

HAYES: Senator Jeff Sessions of Alabama, who`s probably one of the
most sternly militantly anti-immigration members of the United States
Senate led the
opposition to that comprehensive immigration reform bill that passed with
about 70 votes also helped -- that looks like Jeff Sessions making an
endorsement I have got to say. And that`s kind of big news. I mean, I
don`t think there is a single prominent elected Republican who has endorsed
Trump yet. That is what this looks like right now.

Let`s take a listen to Senator Sessions.

SEN. JEFF SESSIONS, (R) ALABAMA: The American people -- these people
want somebody in the presidency who stands up for them.


SESSIONS: Defends their interest and the laws and traditions of this
country. We welcome you here. Thank you for the work you have put in to
the immigration issue. I`m really impressed with your plan. I know it
will make a
difference. And this crowd shows a lot of people agree with that.
Congratulations. Welcome and god bless.

TRUMP: Thank you, Jeff.

HAYES: Just a quick correction. Trump said no one in the world
offers birthright citizenship. That`s not true. Actually almost every
country in the
western hemisphere in the world offers birthright citizenship. Very few --
in fact, no countries in Europe do. It is a western hemisphere, eastern
hemisphere vibe, but we are not alone.

TRUMP: ...including Alabama.

We`re leading in Florida. Can you believe it? We`re leading big in
Florida. And you know it`s really amazing. I said, well, I love Florida,
it is a great place, right, great. But Florida -- we have a governor and
we have sitting senator and I`m killing them. Explain that. Obviously
they are not doing a very good job because that shouldn`t be happening.

But we`re winning in Florida, Pennsylvania, Iowa, New Hampshire, South
Carolina, North Carolina, Texas and then nationally, we`re just absolutely
way ahead of everybody else.

In fact, if this were another country, we could maybe call for an
expedited election, right? I`d love one. Can we do that? Can we do that?
I`d like to have the election tomorrow. I don`t want to wait.


TRUMP: So, the reason that I think we see this receptivity is that I
know the game better than anybody. I have been on the other side. You
know, I was totally establishment, hands millions of dollars all the time
to these characters, right. I was like the fair-haired boy. Do I look
fair-haired? But I know the game. I understand it. And so many people
have come up, lobbyists. I said I don`t want money from lobbyists, but
recently last week a man comes up who`s a good
guy. I know him. I said, I don`t want your money. I don`t want your
money. Because -- I don`t know, maybe, I will rethink it. Should I
rethink it? Take it,
take it.

You know what I should do, how about this? How about if I take his
money but
in the end I screw him and not do anything for him, is that OK? Can I do

You know, I built a great business and I feel sort of stupid. I say I
don`t want your money, can I take it, please. I promise I won`t do
anything for him.

I told him, I said, you know I don`t want your money because in two
years when you come to see me about something I`m not doing it unless it is
good and unless it`s going to make America great again, right? Right?

But I`m going to have to rethink it. I think I`m going to rethink
because I think I should take a lot of money -- are we allowed to give it
to charity or something? I don`t know.

Just take it. Just take it.

So what happens is these guys come up and I`m lucky -- you know,
everybody said he`s never going to run. OK. You know that, right? And my
wife actually said, you know if you -- and she knows me pretty well and
also sees the reaction and for a long time whether it is Trump "The Art of
the Deal" which Obama and Kerry
obviously did not read when they did this crazy deal with Iran -- oh, look,
"The Art of the Deal." Come here. Give me that book. I love that book.

You know, I said the other day -- and it sort of played pretty well,
that is my second -- help her over here. Help her over here. give me that
book. I said the other day, it played pretty well.

That is the second -- help her over here. Help her over here. That
is my -- give me that book. Give me that. There`s always "The Art of the
Deal." And that`s the real one. That`s the original. That`s when they
used real paper, right? I said the other day because so many people they
carry around "The Art of the Deal" because they are begging. They are
begging their politicians, please, please read "The Art of the Deal" when
you negotiate with China and with Japan
and with Mexico and with Vietnam and with Saudi Arabia and with everybody.

You know, right now we have a problem where North Korea is getting
frisky, right? Now, recently I ordered 4,000 television sets. I`d like to
order them from here. Like the hats are made in America. Can you believe
I was able to find a guy?

I had to do that because these hats are hot as a pistol, you know
that. and they are made in America. And I`m going to give you your book,
believe me, I haven`t forgotten about you, but they are made in America.

But the other day -- and now I see today it is sort of pretty hot on
the news that our very dear friend from North Korea is acting a little
rambunctious again.

So I ordered 4,000 television sets from South Korea. Whether it is
Samsung, Sharp or LG or any of them. They are all made in South Korea. I
paid a fortune. And they are wonderful, they are wonderful people. They
are making a fortune.

We don`t -- do we have anybody who makes television sets in this
country? I almost like I don`t think so, right?

So they are mostly made, other than Sony, which has lost its way --
prices are too high -- but they are mostly made in South Korea. Now I see
North Korea is acting up. So I see we are sending ships and getting our
troops ready. We have 28,000 troops over there and we`re getting ready
just in case we`re going to fight, we`re going to protect. We get nothing.
We get nothing. What do we get? We get nothing.

Saudi Arabia -- and I get along great with all of them. They buy
apartments from me, they spend 40 million, 50 million. Am I supposed to
dislike them? I like them very much. But you know Saudi Arabia makes $1
billion a day -- a day. In all fairness that`s before the oil went down a
little bit, but that`s okay. These are minor details.

So now they are making a half billion a day. That`s not so bad,
right? We get nothing. And they wouldn`t be there without our protection.

Even Germany, Germany is a power. Who has a Mercedes-Benz? Anybody?
A lot of people. They are a power. They pay us nothing.

We defend the whole world. All you have to do -- and we want to be
nice. Somebody said, oh, that`s like the mafia defense. I said don`t worry
about it, okay. The mafia is not so stupid, all right. They said that is
terrible to ask for money. No, they said it. They said that`s terrible.
How can you possibly ask for money to defend a country.

I mean, the whole world. All you have to do -- we want to be nice.
Somebody said, oh, that`s like the mafia defense. I said don`t worry about
it, okay. The mafia is not so stupid, all right. How can you possibly ask
for money to defend a country? I mean tell me, how crazy are we?

Now we`re sending our ships, we`re sending our everything. I will
tell you those 28,000 troops that we have on the boarder between North and
South Korea, that`s dangerous territory. They are in harm`s way. They are
in harm`s way. And we get nothing. We get nothing other than they are a
good competitor. They compete with us. They take our trade. We lose a
fortune with them. we lose a fortune with China. We defend Japan.

You know, we have an agreement with Japan where if somebody attacks
Japan we have to come to their rescue, but if we get attacked Japan doesn`t
have to help us. Do you think that is a good deal? That is sort of like
Sergeant Bergdahl -- has anyone heard of Sergeant Bergdahl?

The traitor, no, no, the traitor. I call President Obama the five for
one president. Wwe get Sergeant Bergdahl, a traitor who by the six people,
at least, that we know of, six people were killed trying to get this guy
back. Six people, they went after him. They wanted to get him back.

So we get Sergeant Bergdahl and they get five people...

HAYES: All right, just so we`re clear here, Sergeant Bergdahl is not
prosecuted for treason. He is prosecuted for desertion. The army
prosecutor is planning on presenting no evidence that six people died in
looking for Sergeant Bergdahl, and they of course are the people who have
that evidence is a claim that Donald Trump said the other day.

TRUMP: New Hampshire was so incredible, the crowds -- you saw it.
Every time I go on television it has got to be live. It is live. I said,
oh, can I have a rest, please?

Tonight it is live on Fox. Who likes Fox? I like Fox. It`s live on
CNN. Who likes CNN? All right.

And it`s -- and it`s live on MSNBC, right? Well, they are still
with. They are still working. But I said, you know, how come it always
has to be live. Why don`t they cover me like anyone else where they go the
next day and they show a little clip. Every time I speak it has to be
live. It is ridiculous but it`s okay.

We have to suffer with it.

But look, the reason I have this really incredible enthusiasm and I
really appreciate -- especially with this weather and this heat and
everything else but the reason I have it is because I do know what I`m
doing. And I don`t say that in a braggadocious way, you people are looking
for somebody who knows what he is doing, whatever it is.

You know, you know -- thank you, darlings. I`m going to sign her
book. I have to get her the hell out of here.

She`s so beautiful.

I said it the other night, my second favorite book of all time.
What`s my first favorite book?

CROWD: The bible.

TRUMP: The bible.

And as much as I love "The Art of the Deal" it`s not even close. We
take the Bible all the way, right? OK. Thanks.

So, I was saying. So they said I wasn`t going to run. Everybody said
he`s never going to run. Never going to run. He`s just having fun. Just
a good time. His brand, like I care about my brand at this point. At this
point, you know, my brand.

I mean, I lose gutless Macy`s because I said about illegal
immigration. They dropped my brand and I`m supposed to be -- they are
gutless. They are all gutless.

I have to sue Univision. Univision, my poor Miss Universe people,
these beautiful women, some are girls, but beautiful women and I get
dropped by, think of
it -- you have these magnificent women that work all their life to be in
the Miss USA contest and two weeks before the contest NBC and Univision
drop because they thought my tone was a little bit strong.

And it turned out I was right. So here`s the good news, I sued them

And I mean in the case of Univision, I sued them for $500 million. I
want that money. I want that money.

So I actually put it on the other day, Miss USA I put it on because it
was only fair to the people and we had it on a small network and it was
fine but who
would do that all because they want to be so politically correct. They
actually called and said, oh, we will get it back on soon. We will get it
back on soon.

You know, in a case of a couple, they said Trump loses NASCAR. It was
all over the world. A friend of mine called because I opened with a strong
statement, meaning illegal immigration. We have to solve the problem.

So all one day it was NASCAR, Trump loses NASCAR. I said I don`t have
a deal with NASCAR. It turned out that I lost NASCAR. You know what they
did, they
rented a ballroom at Trump Doral. Can you believe it? That was my loss.
They had a ballroom.

And by the way, I kept their deposit and rented it to somebody else.
The next day, I didn`t even know I had a deal with them. It turned out
they had a ballroom in one of my places, Doral.

The next day ESPN severs ties with Trump, it`s all over the world.

I had friend called me from Paris. He`s a great businessman. Oh, it
is too bad about what happened to ESPN. You know what it was? A golf
outing at one of my
courses in Los Angeles. Can you believe this? This is my big deal. And
this was all over the world.

I mean, the press -- I don`t know maybe they didn`t get it. Maybe
they don`t get it. I was very disappointed, though, with Macy`s. You
know, shirts and ties, not a big deal. But they heard there were going to
be three pickets in front of the store.

And they called, oh, we`re going to have pickets. We`re going to have
pickets. I said, look, in two hours they will be gone. Believe me.
They`ll go for lunch. They won`t come back. Don`t worry about it. I`ve
been through it. It`s true.

But they said oh, this is so bad. Can we sever ties? I said I don`t
care, sever ties. I don`t wear ties so much anymore, you know. I didn`t
like their ties that much any way, you know why because they were made in
China. It always drove me nuts but they were good.

HAYES: That is Donald Trump doing the going in on Macy`s part of the
stump speech, it has become standard, of course, in the Republican primary
getting tens of thousands of people there to cheer him suing people that
backed out of deals with him pretty much through the looking glass.

We are going to take a break and come back. More with the Trump check
live. Do not go anywhere.



TRUMP: When Jeb Bush, who`s in favor of Common Core, weak on
immigration, right? Very weak on immigration, wants to let people come in.
Although now he is using anchor baby. He put out a memo, you can not use
anchor baby now because I used it, he`s using it.


HAYES: All right, joining me now McKay Coppin, senior political
writer for Buzzfeed, Democratic strategist Tera Dowdell, Sam Seder MSNBC
contributor and host of the Majority Report.

Everything -- first of all, I just want to -- in terms of how we set
this up, the pandering thing. I mean, I love you guys in Alabama. Bring
the woman up with the book. Like this is all -- you guys like Fox, yeah,
we like Fox. I mean, he starts out. First line is Billy Graham, Billy
Graham, one of the greatest preachers, one of the greatest.

MCKAY COPPIN, BUZZFEED: I mean -- look, everything we said tonight
is, I think he`s bearing out. And even building on, right? I mean, I
think the most impressive thing that he`s doing tonight is showing that
channeling his winnerness, his entire brand which is built on being a tough
guy bully who beats people to a pulp, right?

HAYES: And screws people, that`s the other thing.

COPPIN: In fact you heard him say, this guy, this lobbyist tried to
give me $5 million and I said -- no, I shouldn`t have taken it. Maybe I
should take it and screw him...

HAYES: Crowd goes nuts.

COPPIN: And the crowd loves that, right, because what he`s doing is
saying I am like this. I will do it what I have done my whole life and I
will do it for you. And I`ll do it against all these countries and
everyone who is screwing you right now.

TERA DOWDELL, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Exactly. But the irony is that
everything he has done tonight, to your point earlier, has been exactly
what a politician would do. He is unfettered pandering right now and he`s
taking the Republican message, a very -- we talked about this, a simple,
crisp, easy to understand message and he has taken it to a higher level.

HAYES: Well, or a lower level of lack of...


HAYES: And the thing about politicians, like, that was a big moment.
I`ve got to say. Jeff Sessions comes out, puts on the hat for a second and
takes it off realizing what he has just done.

DOWDELL: He thought about it, right.

HAYES: No. Seriously, because I think that counts -- Jeff Sessions
it appears just endorsed Donald Trump. That`s the first Republican elected
to endorse him as far as I can tell.

SAM SEDER, HOST, MAJORITY REPORT: He`s very excited I think about the
idea of getting rid of birthright citizenship, and I think for Jeff
Sessions. And you know at the very least that`s his like -- that`s his pay

But I think it has to be said that Trump is just delivering the
subtext, all the other stuff that the Republicans say at the end of the day
can be boiled down to are you going to be tough? It doesn`t matter. Are
you going to make those people pay? Are you going to be muscular in some
fashion? So, I think...

HAYES: Toughness sells.

SEDER: This is about looking at who the Republican Party is. It is
about Trump but only to the extent of he is a mirror and that is what he
keeps doing,
he just keeps mirroring.

HAYES: We are going to have a special guest with us coming up in just
a bit to respond to Donald Trump who is still going down there in Mobile,

Mckay Coppins, Tera Dowdell, Sam Seder, thanks so much for time
tonight. Really appreciate it.

Stay with us. Trump Check Live after this break.



TRUMP: When Mexico sends its people, they are not sending their best.
They are sending people that have a lot of problems. They are bringing
drugs. They are bringing crime.

RICARDO ACA: I`m an undocumented immigrant. I was about 14 when I
crossed the border.


HAYES: Joining me now, the man in that video, Ricardo Aca. Ricardo,
you work in Trump`s Soho building, right?

ACA: Yes, I technically don`t work for the Trump hotel but I do work
for the restaurant.

HAYES: That is housed in that...

ACA: That leases space in that building, but and I still have to go
in there and look at his name right up there and have to work under that.

HAYES: You came here, how old were you came?

ACA: I was about 14 when we crossed the border, and I arrived in
Arizona and then we just drove up here.

HAYES: What does it feel like to watch this phenomenon happen? he
says that Mexico is sending rapists and criminals, that people like
yourself, you, literally, who is a beneficiary of DACA, which was signed by
the president, it`s the reason that you have some sort of legal status,
even though you are undocumented. He wants to deport you, probably wants
to deport your family, your friends, round up

ACA: I mean, at first it`s a little of a shock, because he`s a
celebrity, so you kind of like in a way grew up watching Miss Universe
because Mexico always participates. So then at first it`s a shock, but

HAYES: So you had sort of warm feelings.

ACA: No. At first it was shock, but then I got really angry. But
then for me my way of responding is not just by attacking or by offending
someone that I personally don`t know and never met in my life. For me I`m
a photographer and
I wanted to respond doing a photo series in which I had my Mexican
community hold signs saying I`m not a criminal, I`m not a rapist, I`m not
drug dealer many response to that and a friend of mine asked if he could
fill me in on the process and that`s how this video came.

HAYES: What would you say -- people that are his supporters feel very
strongly that people like yourself, you, your friends, your family, some of
your co-workers are taking over. You are coming over with ill intent. You
are here to harm people or you`re here to get welfare. What do you want to
tell them?

ACA: Well, I think with my video, the purpose of it is to show that
my daily life I don`t go around looking for crime or selling drugs or
raping people I
go to my job, from one job to the other, and during my free time, if I can,
I get to do what I love, which for me is photographing.

HAYES: You work two jobs.

ACA: I work two jobs -- well, technically three and one is at a photo
studio, yes.

HAYES: So you are working three jobs.

ACA: Yes, three jobs.

HAYES: And what has it men for you to have the president have an
executive order, which gives you for the first time some kind of semblance
of legal status.

ACA: He definitely gave me more opportunities. And now I don`t have
to get, paid under the table. I can have a Social Security number and get
paid with a

HAYES: So you have come out the shadows. I mean you quite literally.

ACA: Yes, I have finally come out of the shadows. And now I have
more opportunities. I can apply for a job anywhere. But I can only dream
as far as two
years. Like ten years from now, I don`t know if I`m going to be here
because if this guy becomes the president he wants to deport me and 11
million other immigrants.

HAYES: Is that a conversation happening in the kitchen where you are
working, among family members?

ACA: I don`t think that anyone in the kitchen talks about it, just
because they are very shy about it. They don`t really follow politics that
much, but at the same time, I think they will be in fear if they were to
lose their jobs or be deported because what are we going to do? I mean,
how will he send us back.

HAYES: What would it mean for you to have a president -- and Donald
Trump, I should say, is -- everyone in that Republican field as far as I
can tell says
they will repeal the executive order that granted you some semblance of
legal authority. What does it mean for you.

ACA: It would mean that I will be unable to work. I would end up
getting deported and then I will go back to Mexico and my life is not there
anymore, my life is over here. So, it will definitely be completely
different and then I`ll
probably -- I wouldn`t have a good life over there, as good as I have here
because where I went to school, this is where my family and friends are.

HAYES: Ricardo Aca, thank you very much. Takes some real guts to up
here. Thank you.

That is All In for this evening. The Rachel Maddow Show starts now.


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