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PoliticsNation, Tuesday, August 25th, 2015

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Date: August 25, 2015
Guest: Tara Dowdell; Patricia Bynes, Cornell Belcher, Jonathan Alter

REV. AL SHARPTON, MSNBC HOST: Right now on "Politics Nation," Donald Trump
versus the right. New fights with Jeb Bush, the GOP establishment and FOX
News. Has Trump met his match?

Also a new bid in Ferguson to restore confidence in the legal system.

And will President Obama have to choose between endorsing Joe Biden or
Hillary Clinton?

And fighting for justice ten years after Katrina. I`ll talk to a man who
lost his brother in the infamous Danziger Bridge shooting.

Welcome to "Politics Nation."

We begin with the latest mess for the GOP. Donald Trump against the world.
His first opponent -- Jeb Bush, who hit Trump today in Colorado.


JEB BUSH (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I`m not a talker, I`m a doer.
There`s a lot of really good talkers running for president. And there`s
one in particular I`m thinking of.

Mr. Trump believes that you can just round people up and that it`s just an
easy thing to do because he`s a successful guy and he`ll just have
successful people do it and it will all work out. Well, the cost of this
will be extraordinary, it will disrupt community life. It doesn`t embrace
American values that I think should be respected. It`s not a practical


SHARPTON: But Trump slamming Bush on twitter for his immigration gaffes.
Amid -- he`s even slamming him for using -- by using his mother to attack


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Would you like to see him run?

BARBARA BUSH, JEB BUSH`S MOTHER: No. I really don`t. I think it`s a
great country. There are a lot of great families. There are other people
out there that are very qualified. And we`ve had Bushes.


SHARPTON: Trump`s also taunting Senator Lindsey Graham over a new poll.
And the numbers that Graham scored. Tweeting, congrats, Lindsey Graham,
you just got four points in your home state of South Carolina. Far better
than zero nationally. You`re only 26 points behind me.

Later, Graham fired back.


and I`ll beat his brains out. I know my state. This is a silly season in
politics. Donald Trump is not going to be the nominee of the Republican
Party. If he is, that`s the end of the Republican Party. He says the
worst things possible about immigrants and women, and he`s a complete idiot
when it comes to Mideast policy.


SHARPTON: But Trump`s biggest feud is with FOX News and specifically
anchor Megyn Kelly. Last night Trump retweeted someone who called Kelly a
bimbo. FOX News chairman Roger Ailes then blasted Trump in a statement
saying, in part, quote, "Donald Trump surprise and unprovoked attack on
Megyn Kelly during her show last night is as unacceptable as it is
disturbing. Donald Trump rarely apologizes, although in this case he

Trump responded in a statement saying he disagreed with FOX. He is leading
in the polls. And he will speak again tonight in Iowa. And I`ve got a
feeling he won`t apologize then either.

We`ll be covering this from all angles, but we start with NBC`s Katy Tur
who is in Iowa for Trump`s rally tonight.

Katy, you covered a lot of Trump events. Will he talk about all of these
feuds tonight?

KATY TUR, NBC NEWS CORRESPONDENT: I think we can expect that he will
address those feuds, and if he doesn`t address them, he`s certainly going
to get asked about it by reporters in the news conference he`ll be holding
right beforehand. My question isn`t necessarily why he`s doing it. I
think he is doing it in order to get attention. Donald Trump thrives on

But whether he`s worried that people will get bored of all of this
fighting, will they start to change the channel because they`ve just seen
this before, heard this story before, heard these words before. But as of
now, Donald Trump is trying to get all the attention. He is trying to be
the lead of the newscast on a day when he wouldn`t otherwise be the lead.
And by bringing up his Megyn Kelly feud again, it`s good timing for him.
He is able to get on the front of all the newscasts, on this front of this
newscast right now, to be on all of the cable shows, and to be on the
network news shows. So this is a calculated effort for him. But I wonder
at what point the people are going to start getting bored of all of this
back and forth swiping - Al.

SHARPTON: What kind of response do you think Trump will get tonight?

TUR: Well, he is supposed to get more than a thousand people here in Iowa.
You can see the crowds are already filling up here. These are people that
want to come out and hear what he has to say. There are people that don`t
necessarily think that his words are too tough. They like that he`s anti-
establishment. I will say though I have spoken to a few people who say
they wish he would stop with the fighting and talk more about policy and

Now, he does have quite an impressive ground game out here in Iowa for a
man that is doing a very nontraditional campaign in a lot of ways. He has
a more traditional ground games to get out the vote apparatus here and
volunteers trying to collect signatures and email addresses and all that
stuff. He`s also supposed to be meeting with some VIPs here tonight
including some GOP county chairs to try to convince them that he should be
the nominee for the Republican Party -- Al.

SHARPTON: NBC`s Katy Tur, thank you for your reporting.

Now let me go to Richard Wolffe and Tara Dowdell that are in studio with

Richard, it seems like Trump and FOX had buried the hatchet. Is this fight
good for him?

RICHARD WOLFFE, MSNBC EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR: I think it is good for him, yes.
Any oxygen is good for him. It looks like he`s taking on the
establishment. And what`s not so good for FOX is that he`s painting them
as the establishment, which is what they are. They are number one news
channel and they are the number one conservative media outlet out there.

So any attempt that FOX makes to push back -- look, it gets attention for
FOX News, but they don`t need the attention. They`re already got sky-high
ratings. He brings this audience with him. He brings a giant amount of
need for the oxygen that these fights entertain. And honestly, he always
wins in these mud fights because they`re played at his level and he`s
expert at it.

SHARPTON: But Tara, he wins in these mud fights, as Richard calls them,
but is he bringing the GOP down? I mean, he`s staying up and going up, but
is he bringing the party down?

TARA DOWDELL, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: I think he`s creating a real
opportunity for Democrats right now. And I think, though, it`s important
that Democrats actually capitalize on the opportunities he`s creating
because, for the Democratic Party right now, one of the most important
things, whether you`re Hillary Clinton, whether you`re Bernie Sanders,
Martin O`Malley, but particularly Hillary and Bernie, is they need to be
energizing the Democratic base. And we`ve seen Bernie do it with portions
of the progressive base and we`ve seen Hillary some trouble with

So I think what this does, it gives Democrats the opportunity to say, oh,
my God, you may have some issues, we may have issues over here but look at
what`s happening over there.

SHARPTON: You know, I noticed something interesting today, Richard.
"Politico" reported that South Carolina Republicans are looking to push
back at Trump. Here`s the quote. "The state GOP party announced on
Tuesday that for presidential candidates to qualify for the South Carolina
primary, they must pledge to support the Republican presidential nominee
and not run as a third party candidate in the general election. " Other
states are considering this as well. What would this do to Trump who has
refused to do that thus far?

WOLFFE: He has, but he`s also proved that he will bend whichever way he
needs to bend. So I don`t think consistency is any part of his premise.
If the state party apparatus is against him, more power to him at least in
his own sales pitch. And that sales pitch has gone really well right now.
By the way, everything I`m saying right now is what an endorsement of his

SHARPTON: But if it is not on the ballot, though, he can`t make the point
on this temper.

WOLFFE: He`ll get on the ballot. I`ll pledge allegiance to the party
until I decide not to. So what? I`m going to play this game because this
whole game is fake and rigged. And I know it because I faked it and rigged
it with everyone else. That`s the circular logic he`s playing right now.
And for people who hate politics as it stands and there are plenty of
people on the left and the right who are in that camp, this is working a
treat for him.

SHARPTON: I think though that his biggest threat, Tara, is I think what
she said at the opening, when do people get tired of it? I mean, you know,
I like great records, but I don`t want to hear them all night. At some
point, does a lot of this fighting and back and forth, people just get
bored and tired and want to go on to the next show? Because that`s what
he`s doing.

DOWDELL: Well I think one of the things that Trump does is I said he is
the Madonna of politics. He reinvents himself.

SHARPTON: But Madonna knew to go and come back.

DOWDELL: Right. Exactly. But she reinvents herself and she has this
longevity. So I think that when you look at Donald Trump I think in the
short term, I don`t think people are going to get tired of it at all.

SHARPTON: But how short is the short term is going to be the question?

DOWDELL: But one of the things he does is he escalates. So when you think
he can`t do anything more outrageous, say anything more offensive, he goes
and takes it to another level, another level of offensiveness. And I think
that so far he`s been very successful at it. And I think we can`t
underestimate the anger. And I think Richard started to speak to this, the
anger in the base of the Republican Party. And Trump has tapped into that
particular vein and he`s saying all those things that, remember, the stuff
he`s saying, calling people idiots, people have been calling politicians
idiots for year, right? No one has gotten tired of saying politicians are

So I think that he is tap in to that. And he is saying those things that
everyone else can say amongst their friends but he`s able to say it to
people`s faces.

SHARPTON: Richard, Jeb Bush is in hot water today after he tried to defend
himself for using the phrase "anchor babies." Let me play what he said.


BUSH: This is ludicrous for the Clinton campaign and others to suggest
that somehow -- I`m using a derogatory term. What I was talking about is
the specific case of fraud being committed where there`s organized efforts
and, frankly, it`s more related to Asian people coming into our country,
having children in that organized efforts, taking advantage of a noble
concept with birth right citizenship.


SHARPTON: So he was trying to defend himself, and he made it worse by
referring to Asian people and by saying that`s what he was referring to.
Now Donald Trump is piling on tweeting Asians are very offended that Jeb
said that anchor babies applies to them as a way to be more politically
correct to Hispanics, a mess.

Trump made this an issue. Jeb Bush screwed it up. And then Trump twists
the knife. I mean, how bad was this for Jeb?

WOLFFE: Terrible. You cannot win at the Donald Trump game by beating
Donald Trump. Only one person wins at that game and that`s Donald Trump.
So what did Donald Trump do? He played Jeb Bush at his game saying you`re
not being politically correct enough, right? You just failed at your own

The way to beat Donald Trump is to use Donald Trump`s rules against him
which is to say you`re tough on immigration, show me your record of hiring
laborers who are actually registered as legal, having paperwork. That`s
how Donald Trump is going to fail. But he`s not going to out-trump Trump
when it comes to being harsh about immigrants. Not going to work, not from
Jeb Bush or anyone else in that field.

SHARPTON: Well, Tara, talking about immigrants and Latinos, Hispanics,
because that`s who Trump`s remarks were about, he may be leading in the
poll, but check this out. Gallup asked Hispanic voters how they view
Republican candidates. Donald Trump has a 51 percent negative rating, way
worse than the rest of the GOP.

Now, he may be winning short term, but does it mean -- doesn`t this really
mean he`s in big trouble in the long run because he`s going to need Latino
votes. He says I`m going to win the Latino votes. And this poll over 50
percent negative rating, far higher than any other Republican candidate.

DOWDELL: It`s far higher than any other Republican candidate, yes, but the
problem is it should actually be higher than that given the nature of the
things that he`s saying. And that`s why I think it`s important. There`s
an opportunity being created here. He is being offensive to Hispanics and
the comments that Jeb Bush makes creates opportunities for the Democratic
Party as well.

But I do think, though, it`s important. People have got to really bring
these points home. It`s not enough to expect Trump to implode, as Richard
said, it`s not enough to expect that. People have to really, as far as the
Democrats in particular are concerned, they need to back up this pointing
out Trump`s craziness with outreach to these communities. With early
outreach to the Asian American community, early outreach to Hispanic
community, early outreach to the black community, early outreach to these
communities that are part of our base, that are an important part of our
base that are being alienated by the Republican party.

SHARPTON: Well, I think they`ve got to get past the Trump show in order to
even break through and say that. And I think that too many of them have
been intimidated. I think now that Jeb is trying to show he`s not, you
can`t do it by playing Trump`s game. You cannot.

DOWDELL: He`s arguing within Trump`s frame.

SHARPTON: You got to fight your fight. You can`t fight his fight and win
because if you fight his fight, he wins every time.

Richard Wolffe, Tara Dowdell, thank you both for your time tonight.

And we`ll bring Donald Trump`s remarks to you. He`s expected to talk to
the media coming up.

Up next, a clean start in Ferguson. Arrest warrants wiped away. How much
will it improve the relationship between police and the community?

Also Scott Walker proves it may be impossible to out-trump Donald Trump.

Plus, will Joe Biden run? It may come down to who is better suited to
fight for the middle class and uphold the Obama legacy.

It`s a big show ahead. So stay with us.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In a speech in Texas Donald Trump called Hillary easily
the worst secretary of state in the history of our country. When asked
what he based that on, Trump said I heard me say it just now.



SHARPTON: Still ahead on "Politics Nation," a fresh start in Ferguson as a
judge overhauls the entire city court system. Will it help heal the

And playing the Trump card. Yet another Republican is trying to mimic
Donald Trump, but it`s not working.


SHARPTON: Big news out of Ferguson. A municipal court judge has ordered
sweeping changes to the city`s court system. It includes withdrawing every
arrest warrant issued in Ferguson before December 31st of 2014. That`s
10,000 warrants. Of course, the charges behind those warrants aren`t going
away. When defendants come to court, they will be given the new option of
either taking a payment plan or community service with the case. The judge
himself says it`s a much-needed step forward for the community.


opportunity for them to make a fresh start. They won`t have a warrant.
The cases will still be on the books and they still will be given a notice
to come to court, but they don`t have to do it under fear of arrest.


SHARPTON: This announcement comes one year after unrest in the city
sparked after officer Darren Wilson fatally shot unarmed 18-year-old
Michael Brown. The department of justice did not file civil rights charges
against Wilson, and the grand jury chose not to indict him. In a city that
still needs to address other injustices in the community, this is a step in
the right direction.

Joining me now is Patricia Bynes, a Democratic committeewoman for Ferguson

Committeewoman Bynes, first of all, thank you for being here.


SHARPTON: How important is this judge`s decision in moving Ferguson

BYNES: Well, considering the status quo in Ferguson and in the St. Louis
region, this is major. This is a huge step. We have 10,000 warrants that
are being dropped. The cases aren`t being dropped, which a lot of people
are hoping it would be, but this is a huge step considering where we`ve
started from.

SHARPTON: Now part of the problem for residents is even getting to court
in first place. The DOJ report points out that people may not be able to
take time off to go to court. They may not be able to afford child care
and they can`t get transportation to the court. This is how something as
simple as routine traffic stops can turn into years of repeated
imprisonments because of missed court dates and mounting fines. And you
don`t have like what we would call in some larger cities mass transit. As
you know, I`ve been around Ferguson a lot. This is real.

BYNES: Yes, it`s very real. We don`t have the best mass transit system,
and oftentimes with these minor infractions your license is also taken
away, but through the actions that the judge is taking, they`re asking that
people`s license also be reinstated so that way they can get to court and
come work out these issues.

SHARPTON: What`s interesting is earlier this month, the attorney general
Loretta Lynch, discussed what changes have taken place since the DOJ`s
report in Ferguson. Listen to this.


LORETTA LYNCH, U.S. ATTORNEY GENERAL: I think actually a lot of things
have changed since Ferguson. I think that the importance of that report
was that it showed the world what people in Ferguson and similar situations
had been saying for years but they just weren`t believed. It opened the
eyes of America and frankly the world to what many minorities are saying
when they talk about feeling a level of disrespect and a lack of inclusion
in their own government.


SHARPTON: Do you agree with the attorney general? Do you think Ferguson
helped open America`s eyes?

BYNES: Absolutely. I think that if you have not wanted to be awakened to
these issues, it`s something that you have refused to see. We`ve watched
legislation being passed all over this country based on things that have
come out of the issues discussed in Ferguson. People looking at their
courts, body cameras, independent officers looking at officer-related
shootings. So this has been a wake-up moment for this entire country and
it started here in Ferguson.

SHARPTON: Discrimination is still a problem, though, in Ferguson. The
city is 67 percent black, but last year in Ferguson blacks made up 86
percent of the traffic stops, 92 percent of the searches, 93 percent of the
arrests. This new rule might help in the short term, but it doesn`t
resolve issues of racial profiling or poverty.

BYNES: Absolutely. It doesn`t really tackle the structural issues dealing
with the municipal court as well. So I see it as an olive branch. I see
it as somewhere we can start to build on more reforms, but there`s no
reason why we shouldn`t let up on demanding more because there`s a lot more
that can be done.

SHARPTON: So as we move on, this has to be real structural change, Ms.
Bynes, because clearly this judge won`t be there forever and clearly these
procedures can be reversed. Unless there`s structural change, we can see
this only temporarily.

BYNES: Absolutely.

SHARPTON: Good, but not really a structural change.

BYNES: Absolutely, I agree. We need the structural change so that way the
changes have a longer lasting effect and we can really start getting to the
root of the issues that are driving a lot of the symptoms that we`re trying
to put a band aid on.

SHARPTON: All right, Committeewoman Patricia Bynes, thank you again for
your time.

BYNES: Thank you.

SHARPTON: Ahead, will President Obama have to choose between endorsing Joe
Biden or Hillary Clinton?

Plus, Scott Walker tries to play the Trump card and winds up in tonight`s
got you.

But first, we`re tracking developing news. Donald Trump`s plane just
landed in Iowa where he`ll hold a rally tonight. He`s expected to talk to
reporters in about half an hour. We`ll bring you what he has to say.


SHARPTON: The race for the Republican presidential nomination has centered
around Donald Trump. The GOP front-runner is grabbing all the headlines
and drawing some big crowds. So what do you do if you`re another candidate
trying to win the Republican nomination? You try to out-trump Trump. "The
Washington Post" reported last week that Wisconsin governor Scott Walker
has set out to tap into some of Donald Trump`s strategy. Monday, he used
the news of the Chinese president`s visit to the White House as an
opportunity to flex his Trump muscle.


of our highest things a president can do, that is a state dinner, for Xi
Jinping, the head of China at a time when all these problems are pending
out there?


SHARPTON: Walker called on the president to cancel the visit entirely
saying quote "we need to see some backbone from President Obama."
Canceling a state visit is displaying backbone? That certainly is a new
way to conduct diplomacy. So what does Donald Trump think about the state


TRUMP: I would not be throwing him a dinner. We`ve had this conversation.
I`d get him a McDonald`s hamburger and say, we`ve got to get down to works
because you can`t continue to devalue.

BILL O`REILLY, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: Here`s a big mac, really? That`s what you
would do?

TRUMP: But I`d give him probably a double-sized big mac.


SHARPTON: You can`t out-Trump Donald Trump. Unlike Governor Walker, he
wants to meet with China`s president over a McDonald`s hamburger.

Did Scott Walker think we wouldn`t notice his latest deep into foreign
policy is a little too undercooked. Nice try but we got you.


SHARPTON: Developing now, new video just in. Donald Trump`s getting off
his plane in Iowa ahead of his rally tonight. He`s now at the center of
the GOP`s 2016 fight and occupying more space by the day. He`s expected to
talk to reporters in about 30 minutes. We`ll bring you what he has to say.

Meantime, on the democratic side, it is now all about who can carry on
Barack Obama`s agenda. Today, reports that the President gave Vice
President Biden his blessing are fueling talk about a Biden run. Now the
Huffington Post reports, Biden might decide to get in because he believes
Hillary Clinton may not be the best messenger on a key issue -- income
inequality. Biden likes to say that people call him middle-class joke and
he`s long positioned himself as the middle-class fighter.


VICE PRES. JOE BIDEN (D), UNITED STATES: We want to make possible for
everyone who aspires to the middle class to have a fighting chance to get
in it and those who are in the middle class have a fighting chance to stay
there. When the middle class does well, the wealthy do very well and the
poor have a chance. They have a ladder up. They have a vehicle. I think
this is all about giving ordinary hardworking American people a chance.
Something remotely approaching a level playing field.


SHARPTON: We`ve also heard Hillary Clinton push a progressive agenda


face is income inequality combined with wage stagnation. They really go
hand in hand. The deck is still stacked in favor of those already at the
top. And there`s something wrong with that. There`s something wrong when
CEOs make 300 times more than the typical worker. I`m running for
president because I think that Americans and their families need a
champion, and I want to be that champion.


SHARPTON: Who will be that champion? After Biden`s meeting with Elizabeth
Warren, Politico is reporting that Warren`s backers are lukewarm on Joe
Biden and are ready to back Bernie Sanders. Bottom-line, who can build on
the President`s legacy? And will that determine who wins the nomination?

Joining me now are democratic pollster Cornell Belcher and MSNBC political
analyst Jonathan Alter. Thank you both for being here.



SHARPTON: Jonathan, what do you make of this report that Biden thinks he`s
a better messenger on income inequality than Hillary Clinton?

ALTER: Well, you know, he has never been a wealthy man. In fact, when he
was in the United States Senate, he was one of the least wealthiest members
of that body. He was raised very middle class. He`s very proud of his
middle-class roots in Scranton, Pennsylvania. And I think he believes
privately that even though he likes Hillary Clinton and they`ve basically
gotten along over the years, that she has gone, you know, a little Wall
Street. She took a lot of money from Goldman Sachs for speeches after she
stepped down as secretary of state.

There were some deals for contributions to the Clinton Foundation that,
even though it went for charity, you know, raised some questions. I don`t
think he thinks the e-mails are a very big deal but some of these other
things could potentially be. But Rev, if he runs, this will be, as my
Daily Beast colleague Michael Tomasky put it, a nasty, nasty race. Because
essentially he`ll have to be saying that she`s too corrupt to be the
standard bearer of the Democratic Party. And that`s a heavy charge. And
Hillary`s people, will say, wait a minute, another old white guy is going
to take away our chance to have the first woman president. So, this --

SHARPTON: I`ll come back to that. But let me put some more stuff in the
soup here before we get to the nasty. Cornell, what do you read into this
report that President Obama gave Joe Biden his blessing? Because if it
gets nasty and that`s true that the President gave him his blessing, that
kind of warms the temperature of the pot.

BELCHER: Well, two things, Rev. One is for the communications students at
home, pay close attention to what just happened. Because that story that
was planted by the Biden folks, that`s how you plant a negative without
taking full -- taking the full responsibility for planting a negative and
putting it out there. That`s a brilliant piece of work on their
communications department. His communications people. And it also tells
me more and more that I think Biden is really, really thinking about
jumping in and I think he`s probably more likely to jump in than not
because he`s already strategizing about how in fact you take down Secretary
Clinton. On the ideal that the President would endorse, let me tell you,
Rev, I`m going to go out on a limb here and say that there`s no way in heck
the President of the United States is going to get involved in a democratic
primary between Secretary Clinton and Joe Biden. The upside would not be -
- there`s no upside in it for him.

SHARPTON: He could just wait and endorse the winner at the convention.

BELCHER: That makes all the sense in the world and it`s still
presidential, and it is the leader of the party. It would make no sense
for him to get involved in a democratic primary especially one that could
get nasty.

SHARPTON: Now, let`s get back to getting nasty since you raised it,
Jonathan. Tomasky, who you mentioned one of your colleagues who I know
well, Michael Tomasky of Daily Beast writes that if Biden does decide to
run the fight with Hillary Clinton will get ugly. Quote, "Biden would have
no choice but to build a run around the idea that she`s too risky, and if
he goes for the jugular, the Clinton team will surely respond in kind."
Would a drag-out fight between Clinton and Biden hurt the Democrats chance
of winning in 2016, Jonathan?

ALTER: Well, it depends how far it goes. I think Cornell is absolutely
right that a blessing by Obama just means that he said to Biden, look, if
you want to run, I`m not going to stop you. It`s not the same as endorsing
Biden. But what will happen is you`ll have a very messy food fight in the
Democratic Party that might have the effect of toughening up Hillary
Clinton and giving her some real batting practice before she faces the
Republicans. So it could be a help to Hillary if Biden runs as long as he
doesn`t stay in too long or if she were to lose early primaries to Biden,
as long as she didn`t stay in too long. So where these things get really
damaging for a political party is when they extend deep into the spring of
an election year, the way they did with Ted Kennedy and Jimmy Carter in


ALTER: So if they have an intense fight in late 2015, early 2016, and by
February it`s all over, that would be okay.

SHARPTON: And I think that, Cornell, that makes sense from a political
strategist and political commentators part. But when you`re looking at
them both -- and I`ve run for president, and I`ve been out as a public
figure. When you look at them both, if he runs, Biden, and has to pull out
third time, he doesn`t want to go out like that. If she runs and loses a
second time, she doesn`t want to go out like that. At some point won`t
human instinct kick in and they`ll get nasty because neither one of them
can afford to go out a loser?

BELCHER: Well, here`s the calculus of politics, and voters always talk
about they don`t like negative campaigns, they don`t like negative
advertising, but there`s a reason why we continue to use it is because it
works. And the math of politics says this, whether you`re republican or
democrat, the guy or in this case the woman who is in front of you, you
can`t get in front of that person unless you attack them, unless you give
voters a reason to doubt them. So, there`s no way that any of the
Democrats are going to get in front of Hillary Clinton unless she makes a
major slip-up, which I doubt she`s going to do because she`s a veteran.
They`ll going to get in front of Hillary Clinton in the polls without being
able to go after her in some way. It`s just inevitable.

SHARPTON: And Bernie Sanders comes right down the middle if they do.

ALTER: Yes. And he`s trying to run a movement campaign.


ALTER: It doesn`t get personal.

SHARPTON: He`s drawing the biggest crowds. Bigger than Donald Trump.

ALTER: As Cornell says if you`re really battling for the nomination in a
serious way, it will eventually going to get kind of ugly. But one thing
to keep in mind is Jill Biden, Joe Biden`s wife. There are reports that
she is very lukewarm on the idea of her husband running. And if she`s not
brought on board, this thing won`t happen. And the other thing --

SHARPTON: Lukewarm is not good but it`s better than cold. Cornell,
Jonathan, stay with us. Because we`re watching Donald Trump. A crowd is
gathering in Iowa ahead of Donald Trump`s rally. Before it starts, he`s
expected to talk to reporters. We`ll bring that to you when it happens.
We`ll be right back.


SHARPTON: Donald Trump is speaking to the media. Let`s listen in.

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: -- Very important. And that was
a total landslide. So we`re very happy with that. Sam Clovis -- in fact,
I think he`s probably somewhere in the room. Where is Sam? Why don`t you
answer that question yourself, Sam? Would that better call? I think so.
Right? Come on up, Sam. Maybe you come up to the mic. Thank you. And a
terrific guy.

again, Carl?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What was the purpose of your meeting with Mr. Trump
today? What is you`re trying to campaign (INAUDIBLE)

CLOVIS: Well, I think it`s to finalize the arrangements that we have, and
I`m here as the new national co-chair and senior policy advisor for Mr.
Trump in this campaign, and I`m excited about the opportunity and the
chance to change the status quo in America. And I think he`s the man that
can do it. That`s why I`m here.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You`ve been the chair in Iowa.



CLOVIS: Yes. Well, I think that you have to talk to the Perry folks about
what`s going on with their campaign. I think for a lot of us the situation
was that more than two weeks ago we were asked to -- if we would continue
without pay in those circumstances. And I think they were having to go
back and restructure the campaign. And I felt it was the honorable thing
to do for Governor Perry -- I think the world of him -- is to step aside so
I wouldn`t have to be part of the calculus on figuring out how to get me
back on board in those kinds of things. And as such, I had an opportunity
to look at other situations, and this is a situation that presented itself,
and I`m very happy and very proud to be here.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) A question about immigration --

TRUMP: Okay. Who is next? Yes, please.


TRUMP: Excuse me, sit down. You weren`t called. Sit down. Sit down. Go


Go ahead.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I have the mic --

TRUMP: No, you don`t. You haven`t been called. Go back to Univision. Go

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You cannot deport 11 million people -- (INAUDIBLE).

TRUMP: Go ahead. Go ahead.

Sit down, please. You weren`t called.



UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I have the mic.


TRUMP: Yes, go ahead. Hi, Jim. Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Roger Ailes is seeking a public apology for Megyn
Kelly. Will you do that?

TRUMP: No, I will not do that. She actually should be apologizing to me
but I would not do that. No.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why she should apologize to you?

TRUMP: Because I thought her questioning and her attitude was totally
inappropriate. So, it`s just -- well, all you have to do is look at the
internet today and you see who people favor in that one. But I wouldn`t --
it`s a very small element in my life. Megyn Kelly. I don`t care about
Megyn Kelly. But no, I would not apologize. She should probably apologize
to me, but I just don`t care. Yes, go ahead.




Right. Well, I just heard about it today. And we`re looking at it. We
certainly have plenty of time because that doesn`t come due for a long
period of time. But we certainly have September 30th. Yes. We certainly
have a long period of time to think about it. So, we`re thinking about it.
And look, and I say it to everybody, we`re leading every poll, we`re
leading every state from Iowa to New Hampshire to South Carolina to North
Carolina. Polls have come in from virtually every place and we`re leading
every place. We`re doing incredibly nationally. The one poll came out
today at 40 percent. It was over 40 percent.

So my whole desire is just fairness, and I want to run as the republican
nominee. I want to win. I think we will win. We have tremendous spirit
in this party. I`ve been contacted by so many people that haven`t voted
for years. They haven`t voted for years. They love the Republican Party,
but they haven`t wanted to vote. And they`re going to be out there and
they`re energized. We`re going to win. And so, I don`t think it`s going
to matter because I think I`m going to get the nomination. And I think
we`re going to go on to win and we`re going to make America great again.
So that`s all that matters to me.


Well, I didn`t say that, but I will certainly consider it. And we have a
lot of time to worry about it. Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You`re running for president and one of our country`s
top journalists, an anchor of Univision was just escorted out of your news
conference. Do you think you handled that situation correctly?

TRUMP: I don`t know, I mean, I don`t know really much about him. I don`t
believe I`ve ever met him except he started screaming. And I didn`t escort
him out. You have to talk to security, whoever security is escorted him
out. But he certainly he was not chosen. I chose you, I chose other
people. You`re asking me questions. He just stands up and starts
screaming. So you know, maybe he`s at fault also. But I don`t consider
that. I mean, somebody walked him out. I don`t even know where he is. I
don`t mind if he comes back, frankly. Yes, yes.


No, I`m not. I`ve done some meet and greets. But I don`t care if anybody
-- you know, we have a small group of people, I guess over here where
people can send in. One woman sent in $7.30 some cents and wrote a
beautiful letter and people sending in $10 and $20. And I like that kind
it`s not a lot of money ultimately. But I`m not doing anything about
raising money. I don`t care about raising money. I mean, part of my thing
is that, frankly, I`m not controlled by anybody. These other people are
raising hundreds of millions. I could do that very easily. I don`t want
to do that. It`s not necessary for me to do that. The one up in New
Hampshire is just a very small ticket item. And by the way, they can come
in free, they can do whatever they want.

And for me, it`s just a meet and greet. It`s going to take place in New
Hampshire and I think in Massachusetts and it`s just a very small
situation. And I don`t consider it a fund-raiser. In fact, people don`t
have to even pay. They`re just people that have been supporting me from
the beginning. They`re terrific people. They want to see good things
happen for our country. So, I could do fundraisers, raise millions and
millions of dollars. And as you know I haven`t done that nor do I want to
do that. Okay? But I do meet and greets. I mean, I have to meet people.
And that`s part of what I`m doing. And I`ll be in New Hampshire, I`ll be
in Massachusetts, I`ll be in South Carolina, I`ll be in Dallas in a couple
of weeks. We`ll going to be all over. Yes.


Because he was out of order. I would take his question in two seconds but
he stood up and started screaming.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Would you let him back in --

TRUMP: I told you already, if he wanted to come back in, I`d love to have
him. But you can`t just stand up and scream. I was saying to somebody
else -- is that correct? I was saying yes, and this guy stands up and
starts screaming. He`s obviously a very emotional person. Okay? So I
have no problem with it. I don`t know him. I have no idea. But I would
certainly love to have questions from him. Yes, yes, sir, go ahead.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Secretary Clinton was here two weeks ago (inaudible) --

TRUMP: Her college what? Yes.


We`re coming out with a plan in about four weeks, and I think it`s going to
make people very, very happy. We have so many people and going all over
the country I`ve been asked so many times by students what are we going to
do. And, you know, the ultimate answer is create jobs because the biggest
problem is they have college debt, they have debt all over the place right
up to their neck, and they come out and they can`t get a job in this
country. Whether it`s China or Japan or Mexico, they`re all taking our
jobs. Now, we need jobs in our country. Enough with what we`re doing with
foreign trade.

So, I think that`s one of the reasons we`re leading by so much in the
polls. Because people know that I`m going to make good trade deals. It`s
not going to be this horrible situation where we get nothing. You know, if
you think about China, they took our jobs, they took our money, they took
our base, they took our manufacturing and we owe them $1.4 trillion. How
would you figure that? It`s like a magic act. We owe them $1.4 trillion
right now. We owe Japan $1.4 trillion. Same amount. Two countries. And
they sell cars to us by the millions. And we owe them money. How do you
figure that? So, we`re going to turn that around. Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) You have a lot of money but ultimately

TRUMP: Well, you saw my income is almost $500 million a year. If I want
to, I can do that. At some point the Republican Party once you get the
nomination is going to kick in. And a lot of money will come into the
campaign. I would say.


I don`t think so. I can tell you right now. In fact, I`ve told people. I
turned down and I sort of made that. I think I told you this. Last week
the week before last, a lobbyist, a person, very good person came to me,
offered $5 million. "Please, I want to give you $5 million for the
campaign." I said, "I have no interest in taking it." In fact it`s the
first time I think he`s ever been turned down. He told me, I think it`s
the first time he`s ever been turned down. Because I know this person.
Good person, smart, tough. He`ll be coming to me and he`ll be saying in
two years, in one year, in four years he`ll be representing a country,
maybe a company or maybe a person.

I`m not doing anything for him. So I said I don`t want to embarrass you by
taking your money and then saying, I`m not going to see you. I`m working
for one thing, for the people. And we`re going to make the country strong,
and rich and great. And I hate to say rich, but we`re a poor nation. We
owe now $19 trillion. It`s actually much more than that. But it`s $19
trillion. We`re going to get things back in shape. This country`s going
to be so strong and so great and you`ll be so proud of it. So, when he
offered $5 million, I know that he`s going to be coming and it`s going to
be adverse to the interests of the people of this country. So I didn`t
take his money. Yes, sir.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) Yesterday he was down at the border at
Texas. He said that border immigration in this country -- (INAUDIBLE)

TRUMP: All right. I watched him, by the way. And he had a very small
crowd. He had very little enthusiasm. He`s a very low energy person. You
need a lot of energy to get this country turned around including
immigration. And the word immigration and illegal immigration, you
wouldn`t even be asking this question if it weren`t for me. Because when I
came out and when I announced, I`m the one that started this whole thing.
And I took a lot of flak the first two weeks, and now all of a sudden
everyone is apologizing to me. I mean, people in this room are apologizing
to me because I brought something up that`s very, very serious.

I brought up the crime. I brought up all of the things that have happened
since including Kate who is this wonderful person from San Francisco with
an incredible family who I got to know a little bit. And Jamil who was
gunned down by an illegal immigrant and so many others. The other day in
California, 66-year-old veteran, okay? Sixty six-year-old veteran was
raped, sodomized, beaten and killed by the illegal immigrant. And that`s a
few of the many. That`s a big problem. So you asked the question, Jeb
Bush doesn`t have a clue, doesn`t even have a clue. And if I weren`t in
this campaign, Jeb Bush would not be talking about illegal immigration.

If you remember he said they come as an act of love. Okay? Tell that to
the families -- and there are many, many, many families who lost a loved
one. Act of love. Okay? There`s no act of love. It`s tough stuff. It`s
mean stuff. And it`s going to be taken care of. You know, a lot of the
gangs that you see in Baltimore and in St. Louis and Ferguson and Chicago,
you know they`re illegal immigrants. They`re here illegally. And they`re
rough dudes. Rough people. They`re going to be gone so fast if I win that
your head will spin. They`ll be gone so fast. Okay? Yes, ma`am, go

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Health care question.

TRUMP: Right.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Where do you stand on funding (INAUDIBLE)

TRUMP: Right. Sure. I`m very strong toward funding for Alzheimer`s and
helping -- it`s a terrible situation. And they haven`t made much progress,
unfortunately, but I`m very, very strong in trying to find an answer for
Alzheimer`s. Big problem. Yes, sir.


TRUMP: No, no, I didn`t say -- I said TV, I said newspaper, I read "The
Wall Street Journal," I read "The New York Times," I read many, many
newspapers, I`ve read many magazines. I even read especially "Time"
magazine this particular week. You know why? Because I`m on the cover.
That`s why I read it. But I read a lot about that. I read -- and I have
people that I like and people that I respect. And it`s a great -- you get
a cross-section of everybody. Because you see people that you really never
have the opportunity to see or meet and then from there you go and decide
what you want to do. But go ahead.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are you assembling, do you have a group --

TRUMP: I do. It will be announced over the next two or three weeks.


That would be possible. But to be honest with you, you know, this country
is in such trouble. Our infrastructure is crumbling, roads, our bridges,
our airports. We`re in such trouble that I`m going to spend a lot of time
here. We`re going to fix our country. Our bridges, 59 percent of our
bridges are in trouble. Think of who ever heard of that? I mean, in
trouble, serious trouble. We`re going to fix our country. I`m going to
spend a lot of time right here in the United States. Yes, sir.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) I talked to a few people downstairs that
said, they worked for him until (INAUDIBLE)


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