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PoliticsNation, Monday, August 31st, 2015

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Date: August 31, 2015
Guest: Rich Galen; Joan Walsh, John Nichols, Ryan Grim, Victoria
DeFrancesco Soto, James Peterson

launches a new attack on Jeb Bush, some are comparing it to Willy Horton.

Also Dick Cheney is trying to sell some books by bashing President Obama.

The White House wants to know what the Kanye West campaign slogan would be.

And tennis star Serena Williams already making history today.


We begin with the political attack some are comparing to the infamous Willy
Horton ads from the first President Bush, but this time it is Donald Trump
going after Jeb Bush on immigration.


JEB BUSH (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Yes, they broke the law, but it`s
not a felony. It`s kind -- it`s an act of love.


SHARPTON: Donald Trump smearing millions of undocumented immigrants for
the crimes of just a hand full of people. But apparently, this message is
working. Trump is once again at the top of a new poll. Of Iowa
Republicans, he`s tied with Dr. Ben Carson, who we will talk about more
later. But Jeb Bush is down to single digits. Trump wants to make this
election all about immigration, and the other candidates are taking notice
with some trying to out trump Trump. Here`s what Scott Walker`s attempt
looks like.


CHUCK TODD, NBC NEWS HOST, MEET THE PRESS: Why are we always talking about
the southern border and building a fence there? We don`t talk about the
northern border where if this is about securing the border from potentially
terrorists coming over. Do you want to build a wall north?

have asked you about that in New Hampshire. They raised some very
legitimate concerns including some law enforcement folks that brought that
up to me at one of our town hall meetings about a about week and a half
ago. So that`s a legitimate issue for this to look at.


SHARPTON: Yes, talking about building a wall along the largest border in
the world and Chris Christie is now saying immigrants should be tracked
like FedEx packages.


to do as president. I`m going to ask Fred Smith, the founder of FedEx,
come work for the government for three months. We need to have a system
that tracks you from the moment you come in and then when your time is up,
whether it is three months or six months or nine months or 12 months,
however long your visa is, then we get you and tap you on the shoulder and
say excuse me, thanks for coming, time to go.


SHARPTON: I mean, seriously, is this what the immigration debate come to,
tracking people like FedEx packages and building a wall between us and
Canada? This is not a path to the future for the GOP. Many Republicans
know it. But with Trump leading the way, this is where the debate is at.

Joining me now are Maria Teresa Kumar and Rich Galen. Thank you both for
being here.



SHARPTON: Maria, how are Latino voters responding to this new Willy Horton
attack by Trump?

KUMAR: They are basically saying that folks don`t get it. And this is
what is interesting. Normally, Latinos wouldn`t be paying attention to
this except for on the evening news being piped in through Telemundo or
Univision. This morning, I was talking to a friend of mine in L.A. And he
was saying that on his way to work, he was listening to the radio station
in the morning, just a regular radio station and they were replaying the
Trump comments and they are replaying Chris Christie. So this is
definitely on the Latino radar and this is the last thing the GOP wants.

SHARPTON: And, you know, when you talk about on their radar, Rich, a lot
of it, most of it is geared towards Mexicans. But the smear has been to
many Latinos and for that matter blacks who have become part of the
immigrant community. Some not at all. Puerto Ricans are not immigrants.
They are Americans citizens. But the smear seems geared toward any one of
Latino background even on specified around Mexico.

GALEN: Well, sooner or later, I mean, I`ve been saying this since the
middle of the summer. And I`ve been wrong every time, but just have to
think that sooner or later, Trump will get over the line and people will
say OK, that`s enough.

I mean, this, the thing you showed now was a 15-second Instagram
submission. It wasn`t even an ad. So I think the news media has a lot to
do with this. In terms of the Walker idea about a border, almost 50
percent of the U.S. border, which is between nine and 11,000 miles,
depending upon have the perimeter, you know, depending upon how you count
inlets and bays and things. But about almost 50 percent is water, the
pacific, Atlantic and gulf. So at what point do we surround the entire
country with a mote. I mean, it just doesn`t make sense. At some point, I
mean, it makes a lot more sense to --

SHARPTON: If you get down to how we pay for it and all of that it`s even
less sense.

But let me go back to this, Maria. The fact is as nonsensical as it sounds
and impractical as it is, if it were to become policy, the candidates are
buying it. Trump is setting the agenda and they are all out here dealing
with it. Another example of the influence, the debate over birthright
citizen ship. Scott Walker is taking at least three positions on it.
Watch what he said over the weekend.


WALKER: Secure the border, enforce the laws, no amnesty, no forward in a
way that provides for a legal immigration system that puts priority in
American working families and the wages. I`m not talking about changing.
I`m talking about --

TODD: You want to keep that in place?

WALKER: I`m not talking about changing the constitution.


SHARPTON: Now, he doesn`t want to change it, but doesn`t the fact that he
wants to deal with this and that he`s having troubled issue shows Trump`s
influence on the race, Maria?

KUMAR: I think that exact problem. Unfortunately, a lot of the stuff that
Trump start saying as spewed out, folks were saying that it was silly
politics and non-sense. But the fact that the leadership, people that want
the highest office of our land, that they are actually buying into this
rhetoric, that is racist and spiteful is unfortunate, and they will have a
longer problem because sure, the short-term sound bite sounds good to rally
up the extreme base. But there is no way that they are going to be able to
actually get to the White House if that`s their ultimate goal.

And not just the Latino community that finds this offensive. Allies and,
you know, allies find that offensive and just main stream Americans, they
can`t believe that this is coming out of presidential candidates.

SHARPTON: Absolutely. And you know, Rich --

GALEN: It`s not coming out of all the presidential candidates to be fair.

SHARPTON: No. It`s coming out of many and there is not a denouncing by the

And let me say this, Jeb Bush while Trump is surging, Jeb Bush is
struggling. "Politico" reports three top fundraisers have left his
campaign and Trump attacks on Bush have been constant. Here is a sampling.
This is just since Friday, just since Friday.


honestly, you should vote for Jeb. The country will go to hell but we
won`t talk about.

Would you rather have negotiate with Iran, Trump or Jeb?

CROWD: Trump!

TRUMP: I would say Jeb Bush is a frequent target because when this whole
thing started, I thought he was going to be the primary competition. But
he`s drifted very much to the middle of the pact and he is rapidly
disappearing. So we`re going to have to look at somebody else.


SHARPTON: Rich, how much are these attacks hurting Bush?

GALEN: Well, they are hurting in August, but we are in August. And I
think one -- I haven`t talked to them, but I think one of the precepts of
the Bush campaign is to let all this stuff happen. If they have enough
money to keep on going, they never had to win in Iowa. So they are not
nearly as concerned as somebody like the Walker campaign might be.

But it`s certainly, it gets everybody`s attention because the Bush people
are now fighting a two-front war that they didn`t think they were going to
have to be fighting. They thought they are going to be at the top and just
keeping up with the people back.

Before we go, though, I want to say something about Sunday mornings,
Reverend. That you are going to have the ability to drive the conversation
every Sunday morning because every one of those other shows will listen to
what you`re guests say at 8:00 eastern and have them react, have the guests
on other shows react to what you say. So I think you`re really going to be
a big-time influence on Sunday morning talk shows.

SHARPTON: I always said some Republicans make sense, some.


SHARPTON: Thank you for that, Richard. That is exactly our intention,
that`s exactly our intention.

Let me go back to this show, though, while we`re still weekdays, Maria. I
want to ask one more question, John McCain`s, one of his chief strategist
weighed in on this whole debate about the campaign of Donald Trump and Jeb
Bush. I want to play this for you.


STEVE SCHMIDT, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Donald Trump is emasculating Jeb
Bush and Republican primary voters are not going to default to the
establishment candidate who is being weakened by these attacks that go un-
responded to.


SHARPTON: I think Schmidt is not a guy you can discount. He was a major
Republican strategist. How do you think about, what do you think about
what he said?

KUMAR: I think what he is saying is absolutely right. And Steve is every
even kill, he calls the shots as he sees them. And I think this is what
he`s saying is absolutely right. And the person that is waiting in the
wings as we see Jeb Bush falter one time after another is John Kasich. And
I think that every single criteria that Jeb Bush says why he should be
president, Kasich can fill that quite easily. And I think it is one of the
reasons why you hear him very much threatening the needle but not necessary
coming out (INAUDIBLE) because he`s waiting in the wings.

SHARPTON: Is Kasich viable? I saw a piece in a "New York Times" over the
weekend, Rich, that kind of said the same thing. And I`m beginning to see
a gentle push for Kasich going forward, not too aggressive. Is that the
hidden possible candidate that could be the consensus?

GALEN: Sure. And I`ve known Governor Kasich since he was a freshman in
college. He is a very talented guy. But let`s go back to the Bush
situation. Steve Schmidt has been a friend of mine for a long time. But
here is one of the things you have to remember that politics is, you know,
we keep talking about a war and things like that. And any war you don`t
fire off all your ammunition just because you have it. You save it for
when it can make the most impact. And I think that what the Bush people
are waiting for is for the Trump wave to sort of crest over and then race
in with what they have got. But either Bush or Kasich will be a very
informative opponent to whoever Democrats are, Joe Biden.

SHARPTON: All right. Maria Teresa Kumar and Rich Galen, thank you both
for your time tonight.

KUMAR: Thank you, Reverend.

SHARPTON: Still ahead, President Obama makes a big move to respect Native
American heritage in Alaska. And some Republicans are freaking out.

Also, he`s back. Dick Cheney predicts that president Obama`s Iran deal
could lead to a nuclear strike.


impose sanctions to make certain that you only lift them when you achieve
those conditions that were originally hoped for and you need to be repaired
for example to make the threat of military action very credible.


SHARPTON: Will Kanye West run for president? Wait until you hear the
reaction from the White House.

And Serena Williams chases a grand slam making history today before even
taking a swing.



KANYE WEST, SINGER: And yes, as you probably could have guessed by this
moment, I have decided in 2020 to run for president.


SHARPTON: That`s right, Kanye West announced last night`s video music
awards that we wants to run for president in 2020. West says it`s about
ideas, but someone beat him to the Punch in buying out a possible campaign
Web site, is taken and a Republican operative already
filed ready for Kanye paperwork ready for the government.

Now, the White House is weighing in a possible Kanye run. Spokesman Josh
Earnest said he looks forward to seeing what slogan chooses to embroider on
his campaign hat. But maybe he`s already gotten some tips from an expert.
Remember this selfie of him and Kim Kardashian with Hillary Clinton? But
before we can talk about 2020, we have to get through 2016 and it has big
news today on the democratic side. That`s next.


SHARPTON: In the next few hours, more headlines for Hillary Clinton when
the state department releases a new batch of her emails. We expect to get
7,000 pages and about 150 pages contain classified information. But the
state department says that information was not classified at the time she
sent or received it. It`s still not clear what the fallout would be. But
there is one thing you can bet has grabbed the attention of the Clinton
campaign and that is this new poll in Iowa that has Senator Bernie Sanders
hot on her heels. Thirty seven percent of Iowa Democrats say Clinton is
their top pick, but Sanders is now within striking distance with 30
percent, just seven points back. And it comes right after another poll
puts Sanders on top in New Hampshire with 44 percent, Clinton had 37
percent in the same poll.

Today MSNBC`s Andrea Mitchell asked Sanders about Clinton`s campaign and
the email controversy.


running let me reiterate is not against Hillary Clinton or anyone else. It
is for American people who are sick and tired of seeing the middle class
disappear. I`ve known Hillary Clinton for 25 years and I know what a very
hard-working, intelligent person, somebody I worked with in the Senate. So
I`m sorry. I`m not going to get into the media game, Andrea, of attacking,
making personal attacks against Hillary Clinton.


SHARPTON: Joining me now is Joan Walsh of Thanks for being
here tonight.

JOAN WALSH, SALON.COM: Thanks for having me, Rev.

SHARPTON: Joan, the last two days, another batch of emails and an eye-
popping Iowa poll. I mean, should the Clinton campaign be getting a little

You know, I think they are a little concerned. It`s still very early, but
Senator Sanders is running a really great campaign and it`s resonating. He
is really getting across the message of economic fairness, college
affordability, expanding health care, single payer health care, things that
progressive would want to be in the mix for a long time and they are
hearing it and it is resonating. So I think that`s good for the party in
the long run. You know, the Iowa poll on top of New Hampshire, those
things have to be somewhat troubling.

SHARPTON: Let me stop you right there. The Iowa poll, I mean, we would
expect Bernie Sanders to do well in New Hampshire, but Iowa for him to
start surging.

WALSH: Right. Well, you know, we`ll see if he can turn the surge into
organization. I mean, he has a very good ground organization. When people
compare him to senator Obama and say he could do that kind of come from
behind victory, he could. He absolutely could. I`m not going to rule that
out. But Senator Obama had a number of incredible number of people on the
ground. He was running a ground game that no one had seen before. She was
counting on turning out reliable caucus goers. He was counting on bringing
in new folks and he did it. Can Senator Sanders bring in new folks? That
remains to be seen.

We also - we should also say she`s doing much better in more diverse
states, Iowa, New Hampshire are 90-something percent white, in Nevada, in
South Carolina and Pennsylvania, she is much stronger.

SHARPTON: But if she is defeated in Iowa and New Hampshire, she goes into
the state with a serious problem.

WALSH: It could certainly change the perception and momentum, absolutely.

SHARPTON: The Des Moines Register in Iowa, their poll has an interesting
numbers about Clinton. They asked Democratic voters if the email serve
issue was important, 61 percent said no. So if the email issue isn`t
hurting her, why are poll numbers dropping? I mean, does this suggest a
deeper problem?

WALSH: I don`t know if it suggest as deeper problem. I think even if
people say the email doesn`t bother me or they understand it or they don`t
understand it and they think it`s being exaggerated, I think there is a
perception that she is under siege constantly that there are always
questions, there is always an error of scandal that is hyped.

SHARPTON: Even though some of the e-mails were not classified when she --

WALSH: I mean, FOX is going crazy about these 150 emails, again, they were
not classified when she sent or receive them and that`s basically been
true. This is mainly a turf war between the state department and
intelligence agencies over what should be classified and what shouldn`t.

SHARPTON: Well, Donald Trump got really deep in it by this weekend going
after one of her aides with his attacks and let me show you what he said
about Huma.


TRUMP: Who is Huma married to? One of the great sleaze bags of our time,
Anthony Weiner. Did you know that? She`s married to Anthony Weiner, you
know, the little bing, bing, bing. She`s married to Anthony Weiner who is
a perv.


SHARPTON: I mean, do Republicans like Donald Trump risk going too far
going overboard with these kinds of personal attacks when you`re dealing
with Secretary Clinton or her staff.

WALSH: I don`t know. I mean, this is the Trump brand and it is doing well
so far. We haven`t seen anybody go too far for the Republican base at this
point. But the idea that a man on his third marriage and has said all
kinds of reprehensible things about women would be trashing somebody else`s
marriage and calling someone is perv is just outrageous. But again, you
know, Trump gets, this is the kind of thing that Donald Trump gets away
with. I don`t know, I don`t see it hurting Hillary Clinton because anyone
who is likely to vote for her is going to tune it out but it`s kind of

SHARPTON: Let me ask you quickly, Dick Cheney, the former vice president,
he weighed in on the potential Democratic field. Let me show you what he
said about the field specifically what he said about vice president Biden.


CHENEY: I would love to see Joe get in the race.


CHENEY: Go for it, Joe. He has tried twice before. He obviously is
interested. I think there is a lot of support for him in the Democratic
Party. I think it would stir things up. They are short candidates on
their side. So, you know, Joe would have a shot at it.


SHARPTON: What is Cheney up to here, Joan?

WALSH: Nothing good. He`s never up to anything good, so that`s easy to
say, Rev. I mean, look. I wish vice president Biden every all good luck
in making a very tough decision. But as he makes it, he probably has to
put that on the no side because Dick Cheney has been wrong about everything
major in American political and international life. So I think the vice
president was not happy to hear that endorsement.

SHARPTON: All right. Joan Walsh, thank you for your time tonight.

WALSH: Thank you, Rev.

SHARPTON: Still to come, more on Dick Cheney, also lobbying against
president Obama`s Iran deal, warning of a nuclear strike. Will Republicans
let him, that is Cheney, with the agenda?

Plus, President Obama renames a major mountain in Alaska sending some
Republicans right into tonight`s "Got You."


SHARPTON: President Obama began a historic trip to Alaska today to call
for sweeping action on climate change and to help mark the visit, the Obama
administration is renaming America`s tallest mountain, Alaska`s mountain
McKinley was named after the 25th president, William McKinley. But now
goes back to the original Native American name Denali out of respect to the
heritage of native Alaskans.

But some on the right don`t like it especially Republicans from McKinley`s
home state of Ohio.

Speaker John Boehner said quote "he was deeply disappointed."

Senator Rob Portman said it was yet another example of the president going
around Congress.

And Governor John Kasich says the president once again over steps his

But guess what? Most people in Alaska including Republicans have been
calling it Denali for years. Check out this video from Alaska`s Republican
senator, Lisa Murkowski (ph).


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We`re honored to be able to officially recognize the
mountain as Denali. I`d like to thank the president for working with us to
achieve this significant change to show honor, respect and gratitude to the
people of Alaska.


SHARPTON: Did those other right wingers think we wouldn`t notice they are
trying to make a mountain out of a mole hill? Nice try. But we "Got You."


SHARPTON: Former Vice President Dick Cheney is back once again trying to
set the GOP`s foreign policy and it sounds awfully familiar. Cheney is on
a new book tour and this morning slammed President Obama`s Iran deal
complaining it`s not tough enough.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They need to re-impose sanctions. You need to make
certain that you only lift them when you achieve those conditions that
originally hoped for and you need to be prepared, for example, to make the
threat of military action very credible. You got to rebuild America`s
defenses and when you say all options are on the table you got to mean it.
And Barack Obama gave all of that away before he ever got down to the final
package and he believed and operated a based on the proposition that
multiple concessions in areas that had nothing to do with nuclear weapons
but will significantly increase Iran support as the chief sponsor of terror
in the world.


SHARPTON: In his new book, Cheney goes even further writing quote, "The
Obama agreement will lead to a nuclear armed Iran, a nuclear armed race in
the Middle East and more than likely the first use of a nuclear weapon
since Hiroshima and Nagasaki." It`s an alarmist claim. And it`s
strikingly similar to the claims about nuclear threats that Cheney made to
justify the Iraq war.


they are out there looking for ways to develop deadlier weapons to use
against us that they would like to get their hands on our nuclear weapon if
they could.


SHARPTON: Dick Cheney has zero credibility on this issue. Getting the
U.S. into the Iraq war. It led to over 30,000 American soldiers being
killed or injured but then Republicans listened to him. Will they listen

Joining me now is John Nichols of The Nation and author of "The Rise and
Rise of Richard B. Cheney." And The Huffington Post Ryan Grim. Thank you
both for being here.

JOHN NICHOLS, THE NATION: Thanks for having me.


SHARPTON: John, do Dick Cheney`s frantic warnings about a potential
nuclear strike sound familiar to you?

NICHOLS: They sound very familiar. Thirteen years ago in August of 2002,
Dick Cheney was out on the speaking circuit talking about Iraq and he was
using very similar language to this, and it was really the first signal of
how aggressively the Bush administration would go to promote a war in Iraq.
We know how that turned out, we know how wrong Dick Cheney was that time
but I would emphasize to you Reverend that if you look back at Dick
Cheney`s history, you will find that he has been wrong again and again and
again about foreign policy going back to the 1980s on Central America, on
his votes as regard to South Africa and apartheid through the first Gulf
War when he was secretary of defense and yet, many generals were very
concerned about misguided strategies and approaches he proposed through
his time at Halliburton where there were terrible mistakes as regards to
business judgment and as you had pointed out in the run up to the war with


NICHOLS: And so you have this long list of not getting the right.

SHARPTON: Now, Ryan, Cheney is giving a speech on Iran next week. How
much influence does he still have with Republicans on foreign policy?

GRIM: He doesn`t have a ton of influence anymore. You know, the
Republican Party is kind of, you know, kind of split now over how to handle
this kind of bilacous behavior because it backfired so badly. You know,
the only thing that Cheney does really is actually help Democrats, if the
vote on the Iran deal were still at all in doubt in the Senate, Cheney
coming out strongly against it could only help Democrats, it could only
help unify them in support of it but there are a lot of Republicans, I
think, at this point saying okay, I`m going to go forward with this policy
because I know Dick Cheney is behind it.

SHARPTON: Yes. But you`re saying that, Ryan, but John, Cheney was asked
and he says, he`s actually advising some of the republican candidates.
Watch this.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Have any of the candidates asked you for your advice?


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And you`ve given it?

CHENEY: Private conversations, yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You`re not actually formally advising any candidates?

CHENEY: I haven`t put my name to advising any candidate. Occasionally I
get calls and I`m happy to answer those calls but I`m always on the basis
that it`s not something we discuss with the press.


SHARPTON: I mean, John, isn`t it alarming that they would even be calling
asking for counsel from Dick Cheney given the record you cited of how he`s
been mostly wrong over and over again on foreign policy?

NICHOLS: Well, I have to be honest with you, I`m not sure all of these
Republicans necessarily think he was wrong. They live in an echo chamber
where they believe certain things and push certain concepts. I think that
what Ryan said is important. They certainly aren`t going to publicly say,
yes, I`m taking all my counsel from Dick Cheney because his approval rating
still aren`t very good.


NICHOLS: But the truth of the matter is if you look at, for instance,
Scott Walker`s foreign policy, the things he had said they are
exceptionally similar to what Dick Cheney is saying, Lindsey Graham, you`re
not going to find it that much different and as you move up that political
food chain into the republican field, you`re going to find an awfully lot
of echoing of Dick Cheney, far more than you would expect considering his

SHARPTON: Now, let me go back to you, Ryan, because Dick Cheney`s daughter
Liz made a comment about her father that I want to play to you. Watch


LIZ CHENEY, POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I know of no one who has been more
courageous and dedicated and honorable than my dad in terms of being
willing to is absolutely what we have to do. This is the right thing to
do. The gratitude as Americans that we feel is matched only by our loved


SHARPTON: I mean, Liz Cheney might think we all did the gratitude for
being courageous in coats or honorable I think was the other term. But the
American people don`t quite agree. I mean, when you look at the fact that
the month before he left office, 61 percent of Americans had an unfavorable
view of the vice president. Ryan, should Americans feel gratitude to Dick

GRIM: I mean, calling him courageous is border line offensive. You know,
this is somebody who had I think four deferments in the Vietnam War.

SHARPTON: Exactly.

GRIM: And said that he had, I think, quote-unquote, other priorities
unquote at the time and so he didn`t bother to serve and then spent the
rest of his life sending young men into war and, you know, what John says
is also important that, you know, people like Liz and Dick Cheney do have a
remarkable ability to kind of look back and say, we weren`t wrong, if only,
you know, they have listened to us just a little bit more. Sure, okay,
maybe ten years wasn`t enough in Iraq but if you gave us another ten years,
it would have certainly flowered.


GRIM: And that`s the reason why -- they have, you know, for all their talk
about personal responsibility, they have an adaptability to blame others
for their own failures.

SHARPTON: John, let me give you this one, you know, Dick Cheney weighed in
on the e-mail controversy around Hillary Clinton. Listen to what he said.


CHENEY: I found it surprising that somebody as high-ranking secretary of
state dealing with classified and sensitive information all the time, would
think that it was okay to have a private server in your home, it`s sloppy
and unprofessional and lack of understanding how easy it is for many
adversaries to tap into communications, to get involved for example
obviously into reading e-mails as we know now is very extensive.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Do you think this undermines or disqualifies her

CHENEY: I think there`s a very real possibility of that.


SHARPTON: Now, today Valerie Plame weighed in and this is the former CIA
officer whose cover was blown by Cheney`s chief-of -staff. Watch what she
tweeted. She says, "That`s rich coming from a man who goes so far as to
betray covert agents in his quest for political advantage." Isn`t it
little ironic to see Dick Cheney raising questions about confidential
information -- John.

NICHOLS: It is of course ironic, and if you didn`t brought up Valerie
Plame, we would have. But it`s also important to understand that when Dick
Cheney was vice president, the pressure he put on the CIA to come up with
information that might justify the war in Iraq, the pressure he actually
put on Secretary of State Colin Powell to make an over the top case for a
war with Iraq is well-documented. We know that Dick Cheney is somebody who
has really gone across the line and way out of bounds as regards to how you
deal with intelligence information and how you manipulate it, frankly, for
political purposes and for him to try to play this political card, I think
is getting the reaction that it should. It`s blowing up on him because
it`s inappropriate.

SHARPTON: John Nichols and Ryan Grim, thank you both for your time

GRIM: Thank you, Reverend.

NICHOLS: Thank you.

SHARPTON: Ahead, Donald Trump punches a hole in GOP field and political
outsiders like Ben Carson are rushing in. And Serena Williams is a smash
hit at the U.S. open, helping to set a record before even taking a swing.


SHARPTON: Donald Trump is not the only Washington outsider rising in the
GOP race. Dr. Ben Carson is having his moment in the sun, too. He`s tied
with Donald Trump for the lead. In Iowa with 23 points, that`s an increase
of 15 points for Carson since mid-July and he`s not the only one gaining
ground. Businesswoman Carly Fiorina is in third place with 10 percent and
Senator Ted Cruz who rose to fame by attacking GOP elites in Washington is
right behind her at nine percent and it`s a momentum even Donald Trump has


TRUMP: You know, a poll came out today, actually Dr. Carson is second.
He`s a nice guy. I can`t hit him, he`s been so nice to me. It`s true. I
cannot hit him.


And Ted Cruz, Senator Cruz has been so nice to me, I can`t hit him. I may
have to if he starts getting really close, I may have to.

Joining me now are MSNBC contributors Victoria DeFrancesco Soto and James
Peterson. Thank you both for being here.



SHARPTON: James, how surprising is this surge for Ben Carson?

PETERSON: It`s a little bit surprising, Rev. I mean, I think it depends
how we define outsider here too. Right? And so, sure, Trump is sort of
outside the beltway and outside of politics but I think when I look at Ben
Carson and Carly Fiorina for that matter, they are also as figures somewhat
outside of the scope of what we traditionally see from republican
candidates. So, in much the same way that Herman Cain was to propelled to
popular success amongst Republicans, I feel like Dr. Carson has the same
kind of lame that he can play which is essentially the Republican Party
politics says, hey, we`re trying to be a big tent, we`re diverse, we have
women, we have people of color too. And Dr. Carson kind of fits that mold
in a way that makes his attack and critique of President Obama I think
resonate with a lot of republican caucus voters.

SHARPTON: Victoria, the fact is that he comes off, as Trump says, a nice
guy, of course everything with Trump is whether you`re nice to him. But a
nice guy congenial, he spoke at National Action Network Convention, my
civil rights group was better received than I thought he would be. No
support really but cordial but then the stuff he says going to what James
says, is as far right as you can get. So, does that explain his surge,
he`s saying what they want but he`s, he puts it in a more acceptable

SOTO: Well, Reverend, I would say that he`s the anti-Trump solution for
conservative Republicans. So, one of the issues where he`s very
republican, very conservative, rather is on women`s rights, on pro-life
issues and so what he does is, he puts down a stake on these very
conservative issues but he`s not that angry Trump in your face type of
politician and I think for those republican who haven`t gotten onto the
Trump bandwagon, they see Carson as an alternative and again, as James
pointed out, Carson is about as much as an outsider as you can get.

Yes, Trump is never held elected office but he`s always been in the circles
of power. He`s always been in the circles of fundraising. Ben Carson has
never held office. He`s never been a CEO like Carly Fiorina which has a
little bit more experience with politics. He is a surgeon and he is
someone who is a fresh face and that is what people love. And again, I see
some inklings of what some folks like so much about Barack Obama that
freshness but when you dig beneath that, that`s when some problems starts
to arise.

SHARPTON: Well, let`s dig beneath it James, because he has said some
things that are clearly just as extreme as Trump`s views on immigration and
let me let you hear some of the things that he said about the war on women.


CARSON: There are those who are always trying to stir up trouble. They
are always trying to drive wedges between us, and, you know, they tell you
that there is war on women. There is no war on women. There may be a war
won what inside women but there is no war on women.


SHARPTON: I mean, is the GOP primary voters going to reward this kind of

PETERSON: They are, Rev. Because the way that republican politics has
worked in the modern era is, you know, it`s kind of like a game of got you.
So they actually love having someone from the medical field, having a
surgeon sort of retrograde views about reproductive rights gives them a
stronger claim over women`s bodies, which I think is ultimately the sort of
mission of some conservative Republicans when it comes to reproductive
rights. And so, having a surgeon say it, is almost the equivalent of
having Dr. Carson as a black person say he doesn`t like Black Lives Matter
or he doesn`t like the way in which black folks vote in terms of the
Democratic Party. And so, they love having that kind of got you space from
which to articulate their position. And so, him being a surgeon and saying
that rings authentic for republican voters.

SHARPTON: Victoria, you know when you look at GOP fundraising so far, Jeb
Bush and his outside groups have raised nearly $120 million. He`s won of
seven Republicans who`s raised more money than Ben Carson, who`s raised $10
million. For people like Jeb Bush does this suggest that money can`t buy
your love, let`s put it that way in the republican primaries this time?

SOTO: I agree, Reverend. You know, and we`re seeing it right now and I
think what is going to be most troubling for candidates like Jeb Bush and
Scott Walker is this anti-establishment where so we see Trump and Carson
and Fiorina doing so well. In the more establishment folks following
further and further behind it. And there are different types of move-ins
in the Republican Party, Right? You know, in the 1990s we saw a very
strong evangelical push. And in 2010, we saw a very fiscal, conservative
push with the Tea Party movement, and now we`re seeing a full on anti-
establishment movement which is so interesting because it`s an 180 from
what the Republican Party usually does. They always end up nominating that
candidate who is the establishment, whether it`s John McCain or Bob Dole or
George W. Bush, it is the establishment candidate but this may be the
election where they break the mold.

SHARPTON: Victoria de Francesco Soto and James Peterson, thank you both
for your time.

PETERSON: Thanks, Rev.

SOTO: Thank you, Reverend.

SHARPTON: Ahead, Serena Williams swings for the record books at the U.S.


SHARPTON: Serena Williams is on the verge of making history at the U.S.
open. If she wins the tournament, she`ll become the first person to win
all four grand slam titles in a single season in nearly 30 years, already
the hype is paying off. This year the U.S. open women`s final open sold
out before the men`s title match is believed to be the first time that
that`s ever happened. So far Williams looks to be taking it all in stride.
Just days ago, she was having fun singing a song from "The Little Mermaid."





SHARPTON: Williams` quest for the grand slam begins today, I`m serving her
up my best wishes on the match.


SHARPTON: If we close tonight with the weekend`s events marking ten years
since Hurricane Katrina, in New Orleans a wreath was laid to honor the
estimated 1800 lives lost, a parade marched through the Ninth Ward a
section once buried in water, and at the saints` preseason game, Head Coach
Sean Payton wore the Katrina x symbol on his jacket. It was the same
symbol used by rescue teams to record home searches and document whether
people were found inside. The team also released a thank you video ahead
of the game.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thank you, New Orleans.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thank you, New Orleans.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thank you, New Orleans.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: New Orleans, thank you.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: For giving us the greatest home field advantage in the

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: For refusing to give up and always believing in the
city and in us.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: For inspiring our success and supporting each other
like the family we are.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: For being there for us and rocking the dome, supporting
us, win or lose.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: For giving us something greater to play for than


SHARPTON: And today there is new attention on a lesser known story from
the Katrina aftermath. "The Washington Post" revealing new details about
how the Mexican military helped in the recovery effort shortly after the
hurricane, a Mexican army convoy working with U.S. officials crossed the
border and brought drinking water, medical supplies and mobile kitchens
that could feed 7,000 people a day. They helped out for three weeks,
critical aid at a chaotic time.

Ten years later, that story is worthy of being told and keeping in mind as
the nation debates immigration and politicians toss around offensive terms.
It`s a reminder that all people deserve respect, including our neighbors in
Mexico. I still cannot figure out why some in Washington at that time
could see weapons of mass destruction in Iraq that were not there, and
couldn`t see the impact of Hurricane Katrina and the levees breaking that
was live on all of our television sets that was right there.

Thanks for watching. I`m Al Sharpton. "HARDBALL" starts right now.


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