Meet the Press | June 16, 2013
>> let me ask you two about the other big debate back home over the nsa surveillance and edward snowden. senator chambliss, is he a traitor? should he be tried as a traitor back in this country? and what do you think is next for him? how hard is it going to be to get him back to face justice?
>> well, it depends on exactly what he's charged with and the process as followed by the prosecutorial team. i'm going to leave it to them to decide whether or not he ought to be charged by treason, but as i said earlier this week, if he's not a traitor, then he's pretty darn close to it. and as far as getting him back here, he needs to look an american jury in the eye and explain why he has disclosed sources and methods that are going to put american lives in danger. i mean, there's no question about it. we know now that because of his disclosure that the terrorists, the bad guys around the world are taking some different tactics and they know a little bit more about how we're gathering information on them, and i think it's important that we bring him to justice.
>> are you skeptical, senator udall, of the government's claims, the head of the nsa saying this has done real damage, that it harms national security , and with these programs, that terrorist plots have been foiled?
>> david, if i might take a moment before i answer your question, i did want to say that my thoughts are with all the victims of the wildfires we've had here in colorado, and i want to insure them that i know the federal government will be there for them just like the federal government was there for the victims of hurricane sandy and the recent tornadoes in oklahoma. we stand together as americans , and i hope americans will send their prayers and thoughts out here to colorado. but let me turn to your question. i am skeptical that the 215 business records program of the nsa is effective. we are talking about the p.r.i.s.m. program, that's a second program. it has been effective. it surveils foreigners who are interested in terrorist activity . but i have to tell you that on the 215 business records front, i don't think collecting millions and millions of americans ' phone calls -- now, this is the meta data , this is time, place, to whom you direct the calls -- is making us any safer, and i think it's ultimately, perhaps, a violation of the 4th amendment . i think we should have this debate. i'll introduce a bill this week to narrow the reach to those who have a link to terrorism. a similar amendment passed in 2005 . it had support from people like senator hagel , senator durbin and senator barack obama . i'd like to have that debate. it's important that the american public know what's being done in their name.