Up   |  March 24, 2013

What drives people out of New York City

Chris Hayes’ New York City mayoral roundtable debate housing, education, income disparities, and what drives people to and from the city.

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This content comes from Closed Captioning that was broadcast along with this program.

>>> you want to respond to my skepticism of the liberals of the tax and spend .

>> in the end it comes down to what we try to do in new york city . new york city used to be the city where immigrants and those came here to worked in lower pay jobs and moved up the economic ladder. it appears right now as if the rungs of the ladders, some are being pulled out. we are seeing low-paid and low-income workers who aren't moving up the ladder who are being kept down which why you can --

>> is there -- how much is the business environment of the city and how much of the decisions being mid at the margin by whether it is wealthy people or people coming up businesses or somewhere else, how much is that affected? what tipping point is there when things like in positions and mandates like paid sick leave or higher taxes push people over that marginal line and decide not to open --

>> decree eighting opportunity, creating that path to the middle class of new york city , only helps create a stronger city. what you are seeing is new york city being made weaker. as we saw by the grass. the exodus of middle income workers. that's killing the city. middle mcindividuaclass individuals, the backbone of the city. drying up bit by bit. s it is better to be the people of the city of new york .

>> we have policies that make it attractive to come to new york. new york city is always going to be a best nation for people from around the country, around the world. and we have to make it's easier for not only businesses and no only the big companies, but the mom and pops. i have called for the elimination of some of these tax breaks , big corporations get. mom and pop stores never get. not only do they pay their share of taxes, but they get --

>> what are they?

>> given violations. insurance companies in new york city are exempt from general corporation tasks p.m. how many small businesses do you know of who are -- exempt from general corporation tasks. i have to say something about the personal income also. sal, i will be happy to give you a lesson on this it has been 15 years.

>> fact of the matter is a person that makes $30,000 a year in new york city pays something like 3.3% of their income in city income tax . a person that makes $30 million a year pays something like 3.7%. yeah, they are not exactly equal but you go from 3.3% to 3.7%.

>> that's not true.

>> it is over 5%.

>> no, it is absolutely not over 5%.

>> to the tipping point. i think we have to recognize the city is stuck on a lot of levels. this income disparity , lack of opportunity problem, and one of the reasons i say you need to tax the wealthy is because if you don't fix the school system , a lot just can't change if you don't have early childhood education . after school. up can't allow pathway opportunity for young people . the investment oriented strategy, which i say is -- we have extraordinary tools in new york city . when we tax the wealthy -- that will get bus $530 million a year, just for those two needs in our schools, if we use our pension fund investments --

>> pre-k.

>> and after school. pension fund investments on john's watch, up to $135 billion now. pension fund dollars new york city controls. but with the laissez faire policies of bloomberg, we haven't used our pension fund dollars to create affordable housing in the city which other jurisdictions do. new york city , strangely, has become unprogress enough terms of what government can do to effect equity, economic equity, i say there is a keynesian approach that works when you have a local government this big. city with this much wealth. keynesian approach that works today for that.

>> i support the keynesian approach but very careful about local taxes. the local level -- you have to be very careful. people can move to connecticut and new jersey and save literally tens of thousands of dollars in taxes. we don't want to drive those people out of the city. it will create -- the opposite effect what bill wants to do. i'm a big believer -- universal.

>> let me interject. this is an empirical question of higher marginal rates producing exodus. there has been literal tour on this.

>> not much.

>> there has been? in new jersey that suggests the predicted effects of exodus did not materialize. that's not definitive. literature is not that robust. this is an empirical question at what level and will it affect them.

>> we already have -- again, this still comes back to we can debate this and can do this for a couple of hours. it comes back to what are the policies, what comes out of city hall , what's the mayor do? we talk about housing. we talk about education and education system that continues to fail. we talk about a number of different things. what are the policies? mall businesses. city of new york squeezes those small businesses and hits them with fines and penalties. pushes half of them and number of them out of business. what are the policies that come out of city hall ?

>> elasticity for a second. things that drive people, including the wealthy, out of the city, it is not the marginal tax rate . it is going to be the quality of li life, safety in neighborhoods.

>> i want to turn to power in the city. power, particularly in the first election that we have had without a -- candidate that can really seem fund the way bloomberg has in the regime of the current clam campaign finance . hi, i'm amy for