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'Rita Cosby Live & Direct' for June 6

Read the transcript to the Tuesday show

Guests: Jim Souers, Clint Van Zandt, Pat Brown

JOE SCARBOROUGH, HOST, “SCARBOROUGH COUNTRY”:  God bless America and for those men.  It‘s all the time we have tonight.  RITA COSBY LIVE AND DIRECT starts right now—Rita.

RITA COSBY, HOST:  Thank you.  What a great tribute.

And good evening, everybody.

Right now, we have some breaking news in the Clemson bikini murder case.  There is now a suspect in the brutal killing. 


UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  Warrants have been issued for Mr. Jerry “Buck” Inman for the crimes of murder, criminal sexual conduct in the first degree, and kidnapping involving the death of Tiffany Souers. 


COSBY:  And NBC‘s Michelle Hofland is live in South Carolina, where the announcement was just made—Michelle. 

MICHELLE HOFLAND, NBC NEWS CORRESPONDENT:  Big news around here, Rita.  You know, last night we told you that the big news or significant information that so many people around here were hoping here when the county commissioner made his announcement would be the name and the face of the man that they believe is behind that ATM disguise.

Well, the Greenville County commissioner came through for them tonight.  Tonight, this is the face of the man that the Greenville County solicitor believes killed Tiffany Souers 11 day.  They have his name.  They have his face, but they do not have him yet. 

This is Jerry Inman.  He‘s 5 feet 10 inches tall, 35 years old, and he‘s covered with tattoos, some of those on his neck.  There‘s a bat.  On his right hand, there‘s a skull.  On his left hand, there‘s a skull and a pentagram. 

Now take a look at what they say his SUV Looks like.  It is a 1990 Chevy S-10 Blazer, red or silver.  Or he may not be driving that.  He could also be driving a ‘97 green Chevrolet Camaro or 1985 Ford Econoline van.  That one is maroon.

Tonight, the police say Inman could be just about anywhere.  And the Greenville County solicitor says he could strike again. 


BOB ARIAIL, GREENVILLE COUNTY SOLICITOR:  Inman is considered extremely dangerous.  And any sightings of him should be reported to authorities immediately.  He is presently registered as a sex offender on the Tennessee sex offender registry. 


HOFLAND:  And that‘s not all.  We just spent the past few moments trying to get the criminal background of this guy.  You‘ve got to take a look at this.

First of all, when he was 18 years old, Inman was convicted or sent to prison in North Carolina for 10 years after being convicted of second degree sexual offense.  Not only that.  Also prison break and jail break. 

Then once he got out of there, he was out of jail for a year.  Then he went back in in Florida for kidnapping and also sexual battery with a weapon or force.  Now he was sentenced to 30 years in prison.  I just looked at this information that we just received.  And Rita, his date that he was supposed to get out of jail in Florida is today, zero six, six, 2006. 

So the question is when did he get out of jail in Florida?  Because police believe he was here 11 days ago when he killed Tiffany Souers. 

COSBY:  Very disturbing news.  Michelle, please come back to us to us later in the show if you get any more details as the story is definitely breaking.  We appreciate it very much.

And just moments ago, I spoke to Tiffany‘s family.  Here‘s what her father had to say about this major development in the case. 


JIM SOUERS, FATHER OF TIFFANY J. SOUERS:  My initial and still to this point is incredible rage and anger.  I think the guy is an ugly human being and I‘m just—I‘m very emotional about it right now. 

COSBY:  You know, when you see him, and we heard from the solicitor that this guy has a rap sheet that sounds like a mile long in several states, registered as a sex offender in Tennessee.  I‘m sure just outrage as a father. 

J. SOUERS:  I mean, complete—I don‘t know how the guy is allowed to walk around like he is.  I don‘t understand.  And my daughter ends up being the—you know, being the victim.  Very, very sad.  Unbelievably sad right now. 

COSBY:  Is there any sense of relief that at least they have the DNA matches, that at least they know who they‘re looking for now, Jim?

J. SOUERS:  Yes, I mean, obviously, for this to drag on months and then longer than that, years, would be horrible.  So there is great relief to know that they know who the person is.  And I have great hope that everyone will do everything they can to find this person immediately.  He needs to be caught and he needs to be put away. 

COSBY:  You know, one of the things the solicitor touched on is that he works in construction.  Do you believe he was working that construction site right near your daughter‘s apartment?

J. SOUERS:  Yes, I do.  That‘s the only way, at least in my mind that there could have been a coincidence.  Him being there and my daughter being in her apartment.

COSBY:  And she wasn‘t there that long, right?  So the opportunity was not that long?

J. SOUERS:  Yes.  She was there seven days.  She arrived on Thursday, and she was killed basically Friday morning at 1:30.  So you know, she probably was at the pool over the weekend, that kind of thing.  And only he knows and God knows how it all transpired. 

COSBY:  You know, let‘s pray that this man is watching TV and turns himself or someone else, you know, turns this monster in.  What do you want to say to him tonight if he‘s watching?

J. SOUERS:  I want to tell him that his insignificant life, as far as I can tell, he has taken a very significant life, and I don‘t understand the trade.  And I don‘t understand why someone would want to do what he did to my daughter.  It makes no sense to me.  And I can‘t imagine why he would end such a beautiful life as Tiffany.  She had so much to give the world. 

So—and I think, you know, I‘d love to see this guy—this guy needs to be caught immediately.  He‘s just an ugly human being. 

COSBY:  You know, we‘re going to put out the word tonight as much as we can.  Put out that number.  And of course, you know, we are seen nationally all over the country, because they‘re saying that this guy may have certainly crossed state lines.  They don‘t know where he is. 

What do you want to say to anybody tonight who knows this man, as we‘re putting a picture of him up?

J. SOUERS:  I‘m begging, praying and hoping that anyone that sees this person does the right thing immediately and calls the tip line and brings this to an end.  Justice has to be—has to be served somehow some way quickly with this person, because the bottom line is, is there another girl out there?  Right?  Is there another victim possibly.  So let‘s bring this guy in immediately. 


COSBY:  And our prayers are with the Souers family tonight.  Let‘s hope that they get justice soon.

Let‘s now go straight to former FBI profiler Clint Van Zandt and also criminal profiler Pat Brown. 

You know, Clint, this guy‘s rap sheet is so long.  We just heard also from Michelle that apparently he was released from Florida.  It was supposed to be today.  But he‘s got sexual offenses in multiple states.  This guy is extremely dangerous. 

CLINT VAN ZANDT, FORMER FBI PROFILER:  This guy is a true monster, Rita.  I mean, it‘s an affront to me as a human being, as a parent, that this guy is out there and was able to do something like this.  I think it should be an affront to every American, every human, that somebody like this is capable of doing this horrific crime. 

COSBY:  You bet.  And Pat, before I go to you, let me play you a little clip.  This is from an official there in the state law enforcement division in South Carolina.  This is what they just said a few minutes ago. 


UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  We‘re conducting a nationwide search, and we‘re urging the public to be on the lookout for him.  He‘s extremely dangerous.  We need to find him as soon as possible before he can hurt anyone else. 


COSBY:  This seems like the kind of guy who could strike again, too, Pat.  This guy seems like out of control.

VAN ZANDT:  Well, very much so.

COSBY:  Let me go to Pat. 

PAT BROWN, CRIMINAL PROFILER:  Rita is exactly right.  I mean, after all, this guy should have been in prison for the rest of his life, but somebody let him out.  And how quickly did he find a girl?  What, 10 days or whatever, how many days it was?

COSBY:  Yes.  Seven days.  Seven days.

BROWN:  Exactly.  He gets out and immediately he goes and kills.  That‘s his first thing he does.  Now he‘s on the run.  You don‘t think that this guy is going to go on a possible spree?  He‘s nothing to lose anyway.  So he‘s extremely dangerous and everybody better watch out for him, because he may go on that killing spree and God knows how many more girls could get killed at this moment. 

COSBY:  You know, Clint, one of the things that the father talked about and we heard in the press conference a few minutes ago, they talked about this construction site.  You know, we had someone say right away when this case broke, maybe he worked in construction.  We heard from the solicitor that he worked in construction. 

The father surmises there was new construction right next to her apartment.  And he surmises maybe he saw her laying out by the pool.  Do you think that that—is that could be a significant tie now, it sounds like?

VAN ZANDT:  Yes.  They‘ve got to come up some logical reason why these two comets would cross in space.  Why this—why this absolute two-legged monster would have any reason whatsoever to ever see this young woman. 

You know, Rita, I normally, after years and years, don‘t get emotionally involved in these things.  I mean, this is a terrible crime.  This is a terrible person.  The people, you know, who are watching this show right now, look for these tattoos.  Key on the guy‘s lack of hair.  Key on his tattoos.  Look for the vehicles and call the police night or day.  You‘ve got to get this guy off the street. 

COSBY:  Pat?  Pat Brown?

BROWN:  I‘m with Clint—I‘m with Clint there.  I mean, this guy is just so dangerous. 

And I want to say, when you let one of these guys out, he‘s trolling all the time, and he‘s only looking for a window of opportunity.  So it doesn‘t matter where he goes.  He could be working in a store, and he‘ll start looking at the customers and the women walking in the parking lot.  And he could be working in the park.  And he‘ll notice who‘s coming in there.  He‘s going to find somebody somewhere. 

So that‘s why these guys cannot be put out there and not watched.  And just, you know—we‘re just going to assume that they‘re not going to do anything.  That‘s ridiculous.  And of course, this poor girl paid with her life just because she happened to be in the vicinity of this creep. 

COSBY:  Yes, target of opportunity. 

Both of you guys, stick with us.

BROWN:  Absolutely.

COSBY:  About the tattoos.  One of the things we want to talk more about, those bizarre tattoos all over his body.  And when we come back, we‘re also going to talk about what else may help police hunt down this guy as you look at his picture. 

And there‘s also a lot more coming up here on LIVE AND DIRECT. 

Everybody, take a look. 


COSBY (voice-over):  Still ahead, for a year, the world believed that Olivia Newton John‘s ex-boyfriend was dead, so why does a witness think she saw him in this hut?  We‘ve got the stunning new pictures in this international mystery.

Plus, would you believe Oprah Winfrey is crashing weddings?  We‘ve got the pictures to prove it. 

Forget the upcoming movie “Snakes on a Plane”.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  Everybody get down!

COSBY:  You‘re going to meet a pilot who actually had a fight with a snake on his plane. 

Plus straight to hell, we‘re taking you to the source to find out if 666 really is the mark of the devil.  Coming up, LIVE AND DIRECT. 



BRENDA SOUERS, MOTHER OF TIFFANY SOUERS:  We have to get this guy apprehended and taken to justice.  And then we can move on with how we put the pieces together in our life without our little girl. 


COSBY:  The parents, of course, of Tiffany Souers.  More now on the breaking news in the Clemson bikini killer case.  Police have just announced a suspect in the case. 

And we have now back with us former FBI profiler, Clint Van Zandt, and criminal profiler, Pat Brown. 

Clint, I want to put up sort of the list of tattoos.  Because that was the first thing that struck me about this guy.  Supposedly, he‘s got tattoos all over his face. 


COSBY:  So this is the descriptions.  On his stomach, there‘s a picture of a female with a gun.  Left hand, you‘ve got a pentagram.  You‘ve got a dagger.  You‘ve got a tiger on a part of his body.  A bat on his neck.  Very visible.

In fact, if we could put the picture back up of this guy, you can see it‘s pretty visible where these tattoos are.  Is that going to help track him down, at least, Clint?

VAN ZANDT:  Yes.  What your viewers need to consider, Rita, is that this guy is going to be wearing a baseball cap.  He‘s going to be wearing sunglasses, so key in on the—he‘ll wear a long-sleeved shirt. 

So we need to be looking for the tattoos on his neck, the tattoos on his hands that would, in fact, be visible.  And don‘t necessarily be looking for a guy who‘s bald because he‘s going to be wearing a ball cap or something else to try to hide his appearance.  Think of this guy wearing a ball cap, sunglasses and a long-sleeved shirt.  That‘s what he‘s probably going to look like.

COSBY:  Now great points, because he knows everybody‘s looking for him now.

Pat, what does it say about this guy, too, with all these different tattoos and given his sexual history?

BROWN:  Well, he‘s certainly got a take on the dark side of things.  You know, he might have been into things like gaming and satanic stuff and just a mishmash of things that are kind of—I‘d say kind of dark and evil, because that‘s his take on the world. 

He‘s angry at everybody and everything.  And women are just part of it.  He‘s taking out all of his rage on everybody.  He‘s done it for a long time, and he‘s not going to stop.  And that‘s what makes him so dangerous, that that‘s the only way he does know how to live. 

And so he‘s going to be out there.  I‘d worry about him being involved in things like carjacking or kidnapping somebody else to use as—you know, somebody to take along with him so he has a little protection.  Because on the road alone, he may not have anything.  So people are going to really have to be careful for this guy, because he‘s probably got no money right now, and he‘s on the run.  He‘s got to go someplace, so...

COSBY:  And he‘s got a prison escape in his background, too.  So this guy is someone armed and dangerous in his background. 

BROWN:  You bet.  Exactly.

COSBY:  Clint, the other thing that they‘ve got on this guy, what connected him was DNA.  That‘s pretty strong stuff.  They said they had two strong DNA hits.  Is that pretty significant to lock him in?

VAN ZANDT:  Well, it means a lot of things, Rita.  No. 1, of course, there‘s only three million people in the national DNA database. 

COSBY:  And he‘s there because of his offenses?

VAN ZANDT:  He‘s there because he‘s a former sex offender.  You know, this is one more reason why we need a national DNA database of anyone who‘s convicted of any type of crime like this all across the country. 

And No. 2, it screams for the need of one strike legislation concerning sex offenders. 

COSBY:  You bet.  I mean, this outrageous.  This poor father you heard is just heartbroken and, rightly so, furious.  Right, Clint?

VAN ZANDT:  Absolutely.  I mean, I‘m furious as a father right with him.  That, you know, whatever it takes.  Double my taxes, but keep guys like this off the street the first time they offend against another person. 

COSBY:  You bet. 

You know, Pat, how do you see this ending.  Do you see someone turning him in?

BROWN:  Well, I certainly hope so.  I certainly hope that everybody‘s eyes are out and they‘re able to inform the police and they can just go corner him and take him in. 

What I really am dreading is that he‘s going to get a hold of somebody or commit more crimes.  You saw that with a killer named Christopher Wilder.  When he was on a spree, when the police were after him.  And it ended pretty badly because he took more women down on the way.  Because as I say, he‘s got nothing to lose.

So anybody keep your eyes out for this guy.  You know, don‘t get anywhere near him.  See him, run the other way and call the police. 

COSBY:  Absolutely.  And again, everybody, we want to keep that picture up, because this guy is armed and dangerous, as you heard.  And an all-out manhunt tonight across the country.  He may have fled, you know, from South Carolina to other stats.  There‘s a good chance he‘s somewhere else, maybe disguised, as Clint was saying.

But if you have any information, call the tip line, the number that you see right there on the screen.  Everybody, we will stay on this story.  And if we get any more developments, we‘ll bring it to you later on in this hour. 

And now to the new details in the disappearance of Olivia Newton-John‘s former boyfriend.  For a year now, everyone thought that Patrick McDermott was dead.  But get this.  He may have been spotted down in Mexico, of all places.  And if the witnesses saw what they think they saw, he was not alone. 

Brand new tonight, we have just obtained this video where a witness says she saw McDermott with a mystery woman in this small hut.  You can see the inside there.

With me now live is reporter Louise Pennell.  She‘s with Channel 7 in Australia.

Louise, tell us about the hut, the surroundings. 

LOUISE PENNELL, CHANNEL 7 REPORTER:  Well, Rita, this worker at a surf camp Toto Santos (ph) says that she is almost positive that it was Patrick McDermott that checked into the surf camp with a mystery blonde, as you said, a woman believed to be in her 30‘s, of German descent. 

Now this woman apparently checked in three days before and then the man believed to be Patrick McDermott met with her for one night.  Then they left early the next morning in a green camper van. 

And another employee said that he met a man several months before and he was discussing with the man about how he bought a green camper van.  So there seems to be these sightings, Rita, and yet still no confirmation that it actually was Patrick McDermott. 

COSBY:  You know, and the witnesses say they‘re pretty sure from what I was reading.  This place is a pretty cheap place.  Does it seem like he‘s hiding out and is he disguising himself?

PENNELL:  Well, it‘s certainly in line and consistent with his financial situation.  This place was a $33 a night resort, not quite the five-star hotels that I‘m sure he was used to staying in with Olivia Newton-John. 

But there‘s no doubt that he did choose a very densely tourist populated area to hide in, although locals down there say if you‘re escaping from something or someone, then the Baja Peninsula in Mexico is the place to do it. 

COSBY:  A lot of people have tried to go down there before for the same reason.  Louise, thank you.  Please keep us posted very much.

PENNELL:  Will do.

COSBY:  Now to San Quentin.  It is one of America‘s most notorious prisons, housing some of the country‘s worst criminals.  Last night, we got a rare look and gave it to you inside San Quentin.  It‘s thanks to a documentary that will air later this month on the National Geographic Channel. 

Their crew spent 30 long days behind the walls, giving us an extraordinary firsthand look at what life is really like behind bars for these dangerous inmates. 

Joining me now is former San Quentin inmate, Al Featherstone (ph).  Before we start, I want to take a little bit more of a look at this powerful documentary, “San Quentin: Unlocked”. 


UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  You know one of the things that brings prison into reality is the prison bathroom, because there‘s no privacy.  You sit up here and you go to the bathroom.  Everybody is watching you.  The guy up here can watch you.  The guys on the yard can watch you.  And it‘s just—man, I don‘t know how these guys do it.  I really don‘t. 


COSBY:  As you look at it, how tough is life in there?  And a lot of the guys in there look pretty young.  I remember when I was visiting other inmates in there for interviews.  They were young kids almost. 

Al, can you hear me. 


COSBY:  These guys are young.  Why so many young men in prison?

FEATHERSTONE:  Well, now California has, as of 2000, they‘ve passed a law called Prop 221.  Prop 221.  And that gave the strict attorney the discretion and took it out of the hands of the judge who could be tried as an adult.  So therefore, many of the young—young adults are now being sent to prison at an early age. 

COSBY:  Showing something else.  I‘m sorry to interrupt you.  Because there‘s also a lot of violence.  And you were there for two years behind bars.  I want to show another clip of what life is like at San Quentin. 


UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  You all got stab wounds?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  Got mine right here. 

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  Here‘s mine right here.  Here‘s mine right here.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  What kind of weapons do they use?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  Pencils, break them off. 

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  This was a knife. 

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  Was this all in prison?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  Prison.  Yes, prison.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  What was it over?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  Kill whitey.  Kill whites.  Kill the white man. 


COSBY:  Now how intense is the violence, especially between gangs there and how do they get weapons?

FEATHERSTONE:  Weapons are made, you know.  Inmates have a very creative mind, and so they make weapons out of anything.  And many of them being young have something to prove, so they have to make a weapon to try and prove that they‘re tough. 

But once a man had been through prison and then settled down for a little while, he sees that that‘s nonsense and so he begins to settle down, get his mind situated, getting himself together, building skills so that he can get back to society. 

So, yes, violence is there and violence is very prevalent, but, you don‘t have to become a part of it. 

COSBY:  You know, one of the things they make, Al, is of course, Scott Peterson.  I want to show a little clip, because it‘s pretty amazing what some of the other inmates are saying.  This guy is pretty much a marked guy. 


UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  What do you think inmates would do if he was let loose on the yard over there?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  I believe they would hurt and seriously.  They would seriously hurt him. 

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  If we had a shot at him?  Yes, that‘s a trophy. 

That‘s a trophy right there.  What would we do to him?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  Break something off in him.  Break something off in him.  A pencil, No. 2, preferably.  Sharpen it down and when you get it in there, you break it off. 


COSBY:  You know, when you hear that, how much buzz is do you think is there in San Quentin about Scott Peterson, real quick?

FEATHERSTONE:  Well, those are guys that are trying to glorify something.  But with the security there, it‘s highly unlikely that they would be able to even touch Scott Peterson. 

I know many of them feel that he did a heinous crime, and they would like to get a shot at him, if it was possible.  But that‘s highly impossible. 

And those guys that would make a comment such as that really haven‘t really settled down and really begin to think about going home.  They‘re just there doing time and they‘re still involved in a lot of foolishness.  But a real man would be there and trying to get himself together so he can return back to society, trying to make the transition from prison to free society.  The way it should be.

COSBY:  Al, thank you very much.  I know you‘re doing some good work in ministering to those folks inside.  Thank you very much for being with us again.  It was good to see you, Al.

And coming up is 666 the mark of the devil or just a brilliant marketing tool?  We‘ll take you straight to Hell to find out. 

And what happened when a very famous uninvited guest started crashing wedding parties.  Oprah, the wedding crasher, is coming up.  We‘ve got the pictures of Oprah in action. 



VINCE VAUGHN, ACTOR:  It‘s wedding season, kid!

OWEN WILSON, ACTOR:  You sandbagging son-of-a.

VAUGHN:  I got us down for 17 of them already. 

WILSON:  OK.  How many of them are cash bars? 

VAUGHN:  Great question.  Love where your head is at.  And two of them actually are.  But I got us covered.  Purple Hearts.  We won‘t have to pay for a drink all night. 


COSBY:  Well, she is the queen of daytime talk and one of the most influential women around.  But what is Oprah Winfrey doing crashing weddings?  That‘s right, two unsuspecting couples got the surprise of their lives when Oprah showed up unannounced at their receptions.  Not to worry though, she brought a gift with her.  You can see some of the pictures there.  LIVE & DIRECT tonight are Linda Curtis and Martha Francis.  Oprah crashed the wedding of Linda‘s daughter and Martha‘s son.

Linda, what was the reaction when Oprah showed up? 

LINDA CURTIS, OPRAH CRASHED DAUGHTER‘S WEDDING:  Oh, it was just—everyone was completely in shock, because we had absolutely no idea.  We were just circulating around, saying hello to everyone and I saw bright lights go on around my daughter and people around her and large—the big booms from the microphones or whatever, so I rushed over there, and my first thought was that some of Morgan‘s (ph) groomsmen had played a trick on him and brought in impostors in. 

COSBY:  And how did you confirm it, Linda?

CURTIS:  Well, I went over to Oprah and I said, who are you?  And she looked at me and said, I‘m Oprah.  And I said, no, no, really, who are you?  And she said, I‘m Oprah.  And then I guess I must have said, I really need to know who you are.  And she had on a pink hat and she ripped it off of her head and she said, I‘m Oprah Winfrey.  And then everything just broke loose, because.

COSBY:  And I heard your husband also confirmed when he ran the marathon and confirmed the marathon time that she ran, so that was sort of the final clincher? 

CURTIS:  Yes.  He asked her, he said, how—if you‘re Oprah Winfrey, how fast did you run the marathon?  And she looked at him and she said, four hours, 39 minutes.  And he high-fived her and he said, you are Oprah Winfrey. 

COSBY:  Martha, what was your son‘s reaction and his new bride? 

MARTHA FRANCIS, OPRAH CRASHED SON‘S WEDDING:  Well, I think if it had been an athlete or a male of some sort, he would have been a little more excited about it.  But... 

COSBY:  Oh, the women were happier than the guys? 


FRANCIS:  No.  I don‘t think so, just my son.  No, the men were just right in there with them.  But the women acted as though Elvis Presley had arrived and their hearts were pounding and their hands were beating and they were very, very excited. 

COSBY:  And, Martha, I heard that she also brought a gift that she looked up sort of online to see what the registry was.  What did she bring? 

FRANCIS:  Well, she did look, and Bethany (ph), luckily enough, and Morgan had most of their China et cetera already purchased for them.  So she bought them the most lovely set of dishes and cups that were just beautiful.  So, she did a good job. 

COSBY:  Yes, it sounds like she did her homework.  You know, Linda.

FRANCIS:  She did.

COSBY:  Linda, how long did she spend at the reception and what did she do?  Was she mingling?  Was she polite? 

CURTIS:  Oh, she was so gracious.  She and her friend Gail (ph) just kind of mingled with the guests and they posed for pictures and gave everybody hugs and just—they were so gracious and just kind of wondered around.  And you know, that the throng—everybody was kind of coming in on them, but they were just so very nice.  And I know I probably hugged her maybe three or four times, maybe a little more.  But it was really exciting and it‘s just something that Bethany and Morgan will just always have, you know, memories of.  And she just kind of was the icing on just a wonderful, wonderful day for both our children. 

COSBY:  I bet.  What a way to get married.  Martha, real quick, I hear they‘re calling it “Oprah-homa” in Tulsa, that‘s the buzz here.

FRANCIS:  Oh gosh, everywhere you go, like for instance yesterday I went into a little store and somebody called me on my cell and I was talking to them, yes, Oprah was at my son‘s wedding.  And the ladies go, oh my gosh, oh my gosh!  And so everyone was—it‘s “Oprah-homa,” that‘s for sure.  For sure.

COSBY:  All right.  Well, both of you, thank you so much.  Congratulations and also to your son and your daughter.  What a great way to get married. 

FRANCIS:  Thank you.

CURTIS:  Thank you very much.

COSBY:  Thank you very much.

And everybody, coming up tomorrow, Oprah crashed more than one wedding on her surprise trip.  We will have all the details and it will be an emotional wedding video of Oprah surprising another happy couple.  That‘s all tomorrow night.  Make sure you tune in right here on LIVE & DIRECT. 

And there is a lot more coming up here on MSNBC tonight.  Let‘s check in with Tucker Carlson.

Tucker, I bet you have crashed a wedding or party or something in your day, right?

TUCKER CARLSON, HOST, “THE SITUATION”:  Actually, I remember when Oprah crashed my wedding.  She caught the garter, it didn‘t work though, I don‘t know what happened. 


COSBY:  Was it your first wedding or your fifth wedding, which one? 


CARLSON:  It was wife number one. 


CARLSON:  A Pennsylvania high school class president is barred from his own graduation because of gang threats against him.  Why isn‘t the school doing anything to protect him?  We‘ll debate that. 

Then Ann Coulter joins us.  Her book came out today.  She has simultaneously infuriated and delighted millions in the past 12 hours.  She talks to us for two full segments.  It is going to be interesting.

COSBY:  I cannot wait to see you and Ann Coulter together, that should be a good one.  Tucker, thank you.

CARLSON:  Thanks, Rita.

COSBY:  And everybody, in just a few minutes from now make sure you tune in to “THE SITUATION.” Tucker and Ann Coulter, it will be interesting.

And still ahead, everybody, the other big story in the world of celebrity is definitely the “Brangelina” baby pictures.  We told you that they would worth a ton of money.  But Wait ‘til you hear just how much they went for. 

And why is everyone afraid of 666?  You are going to find out where the evil mark comes from in the first place.  We have got a lot more ahead, stay tuned. 


COSBY:  Well, everybody, it is the sixth day of the sixth month of the sixth year of the new millennium, but could this day of 666 really be the mark of the devil?  You can see him working behind me there.  The answer doesn‘t really seem to matter, because people are cashing in.  


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE:  It‘s all for you, Damien.  It‘s all for you. 


COSBY:  Well, from the remake of the 1970s thriller movie “The Omen” being released, to this celebration in Michigan, the devil was in the details today as people there literally went to Hell, that‘s in Hell, Michigan, where they were doing some celebrations. 

And here with us tonight to talk about 666 is Reverend Felix Just, he is a professor of theology and religious studies at the University of San Francisco. 

Father Felix, what is the significance of 666?  Are we being scared way too much?  Is there any significance to it? 

FATHER FELIX JUST, PROFESSOR OF THEOLOGY & RELIGIOUS STUDIES:  Well, there certainly is some significance, but people are making much too much out of it.  And there is absolutely no reason to be scared about it at all.  Because the number 666, which appears in the Book of Revelation in Chapter 13 Verse 18, it mentions that it is the number of a person, the person that is called the beast.  It is a demonic type of figure maybe, somebody who has political or economic control over the world, but it is not a date in any way, shape or form. 

And secondly, Biblical scholars certainly know that it is a reference to Emperor Nero in the First Century and not a prediction of anything that would happen 20 centuries later. 

COSBY:  Yes.  And in fact, the emperor, it‘s an interesting point,

because I want to put up the quote in the Book of Revelations, the Biblical

reference you put up.  It is interesting when you go back and you look at

it.  And there is the line right there.  Why does people why does it instill so much fear in people, though, Father? 

JUST:  Well, because many people are worried about the end of the world and when it will come and if for the type of people who read the Book of Revelation as a set of predictions for the future end of the world, then they will take things, like this line and others from the Book of Revelation or from the other prophetic books of the old testament, and they will try to calculate when the end of the world is coming. 

And they think maybe the anti-Christ must be born before Jesus will return.  But once again, I would say and many other mainline Christians would say that‘s not exactly the right interpretation of the Book of Revelation.  It should not be predicting the future or our own end of the world, rather it is an encouragement to the Christians of the First Century to persevere despite the persecutions they were under based on the Roman Empire. 

COSBY:  And of course, Father, people are now talking so much about it, particularly because of this remake of the film “The Omen.” Let me play a little clip, this is of the remake of the film that is just coming out now. 


JULIA STILES, ACTOR:  Damien.  Please, help me. 


COSBY:  And of course, that‘s the scary thoughts a lot of people go through when they think of today, 666.  But LIVE & DIRECT tonight on the phone with us is John Colone.  He is the unofficial mayor of Hell, Michigan. 

John, I understand there you are having the opposite, you are having a bit of a celebration, right? 

JOHN COLONE, UNOFFICIAL MAYOR OF HELL, MICHIGAN:  Well, I don‘t know if it is really—it‘s a celebration after looking at the sales of the end of the day today. 

COSBY:  What kind of sales?  How many people came to Hell? 

COLONE:  We probably had 15,000 folks come in today, easily. 

COSBY:  Wow.  And that‘s a big change.  You only have how many? 

COLONE:  Well, our population is about 72 folks.  But it‘s just unbelievable, the three businesses that—the amount of business they did today and they all needed that push and that (INAUDIBLE) to—you know, for their year.  We are a true destination.  So we are very slow six months of the year. 

COSBY:  Did you realize that it would create so much buzz?  I understand that you have been getting calls, or at least your group, from where, all over the world, right? 

COLONE:  We have had calls literally from all over the world.  And we are getting orders for products from all over the world. 

COSBY:  And what kind of things?  What kind of products do you have? 

What kind of things.

COLONE:  Well, we have coffee mugs that say “Once in a Lifetime: 666 Hell, Michigan,” and matching T-shirts.  And everybody got a certificate of authenticity that they were actually in Hell today, and things like that.  But people drove an ungodly amount of miles.  I mean, we talked to people that drove from as far away as Phoenix to Michigan.  And you know, nothing to jump in the car for some folks, you know, 10 hours.  So many people from completely out of this state. 

COSBY:  And how did you get the name too, Hell, Michigan? 

COLONE:  We were settled in 1838 by George Reeves and his family.  George had seven daughters, no reason to call it Hell.  But he built a mill on the base of our river and had a general store and he had—he would grind the local farmer‘s grain into flour.  So he also ran a whiskey still.  So a lot of times that first seven, 10 bushels became whiskey or moonshine, and then turn—you know, horses would come home without riders and wagons without drivers and somebody would say to the wife, well, where is your husband?  And she would reply, oh, he has gone to Hell. 

So in 1841, when the state came by and asked George what he was going to name his town, he said, call it Hell for all I care, everybody else does. 

COSBY:  What a great story.

COLONE:  And that‘s how we got our name. 

COSBY:  Let me bring in Father Just. 

Father, you know, as we‘re hearing all these tributes to 666, how do you feel when you see it?  Do you think it‘s OK?  You know, it‘s interesting, there are some Christian groups that were actually upset about what was going on in Hell, Michigan. 

JUST:  Well, I think the approach that the folks take in Hell, Michigan, is absolutely right.  There is a spiritual tradition even that says the best way to get rid of the devil is to make fun at him, to just laugh at him.  And so rather than taking things too seriously and worry about, you know, who is the anti-Christ, is my child going to be born today really the anti-Christ, that is foolishness I‘d say, or superstition at worst. 

Making fun of the devil, making fun of 666, I have a Web site in which there are many jokes about the 666 as well as a little bit of mathematical and biblical explanation as well.  And today, also, I‘ve had maybe 25 to 30 times the number of visitors on my Web site that I normally get on an average day. 

COSBY:  Well, Father, thank you very much for being with us on this interesting day, and for your interesting perspective, thank you. 

JUST:  You‘re very welcome.

COSBY:  And, Mayor, thank you.  Enjoy the celebration there in Hell. 

And still to come, everybody, the $4 million baby, our “Celebrity Dish” tonight on the most sought-after picture in the world. 

And “Snakes on a Plane” may be one of the most buzzed about movies of this summer, but forget the movie, we have the real deal and the pilot who lived to tell about it. 


COSBY:  Well, in tonight‘s “Celebrity Dish,” she is the most sought-after celebrity in Hollywood, and she is not even a month old yet.  Of course, we are talking about the Shiloh Jolie-Pitt, the newborn baby, daughter of actors Angelina Jolie and Brad Pitt.  Well, the world has been eagerly awaiting the first baby pictures of Shiloh and “People” magazine has reportedly secured the photos for an astounding $4.1 million, again, $4.1 million.  And we are joined now by Jonathan Klein, he is the CEO and also co-founder of Getty Images, which brokered this big bucks deal. 

Are you surprised how much they went for? 


COSBY:  You are not, it got heated I understand.  How many folks were in the bidding room and give us a sense of sort of—I understand it was an un-air-conditioned room late at night.  Give us sort of a sense of the climate there. 

KLEIN:  Well, what basically happened is sometime ago we entered into arrangements with Brad Pitt and Angelina Jolie.  The core or the key to these arrangements is that neither them nor Getty Images would earn a dollar out of these pictures, and that all the money would go to charity.  One of our photographers shot the images.  We invited our customers in various countries around the world to view the images and decide whether they wished to publish them. 

And as you said a moment ago, “People” magazine announced earlier today that they would be publishing the pictures in the United States.  So it was a very orderly process.  I really can‘t comment how warm the room was.  I was actually in the sun in Seattle that day.  And it was pretty straightforward and everybody is delighted about the fact that from a couple having a healthy child, there is an opportunity to turn that to great purposes and lots of money will be raised for charity. 

COSBY:  You bet.  And good for you guys too, Jonathan, for playing such a key role too.  It is great stuff.  You know, this is what we know about the baby so far.  We know that she was delivered by C-section, she weighed seven pounds, that Brad cut the umbilical cord.  We haven‘t seen the pictures, I understand you have not either, because it has been really under tight seal.  But what have you heard?  Have you heard, are there a lot of pictures?  Are we seeing the parents with the baby? 

KLEIN:  Unfortunately, you‘re right, Rita, I haven‘t seen the pictures.  And it‘s the first time in the 11 years that I‘ve been doing this job where we have been involved in pictures and I haven‘t seen them.  We wanted to keep them extremely secure.  So I can‘t comment on the pictures not having seen them.  What I can comment.

COSBY:  Are you trying to break into a safe or something, Jonathan—aren‘t you? 

KLEIN:  Am I personally trying to break into a safe? 


KLEIN:  Certainly not now.  I‘m speaking to you now.  But as soon as I get out of the studio, it‘s a possibility.  No, jokes aside, I think that the amount of interest in these pictures meant that magazines and publications around the world would justifiably pay a high price for them.  And therefore it was very important that there wouldn‘t be pictures all over the place prior to that point.  And we have been very successful in that regard, and that‘s why I think everybody is pretty delighted with how it‘s turned out. 

COSBY:  Yes, real quick, the top-selling pictures, we were looking this up.  Britney Spears, about half a million bucks.  You can see what the others received.  Why this one?  Really quick, Jonathan, why is this one just $4.1 million? 

KLEIN:  I think there are a number of reasons.  I think firstly, both of the parents of Baby Shiloh are pretty much at the top of their careers and are very much in the public eye and in the public arena all the time.  The second point about this is that it is seldom that you have celebrities who are globally relevant and important. 

This is not just a story in the United States, the pictures will be sold all over the world.  And certainly I like to believe, and maybe I‘m naive about this, that the very public attitude that both of these people have taken towards very important issues, in New Orleans, in Africa, various diseases, has also made this a more interesting and a more compelling story. 

When you put all of that together, plus I think they are going to be good photos, as I said, I haven‘t seen them, I think you have a very good recipe. 

COSBY:  Well, we can‘t wait to see them.  And again, congratulations on playing such a key role for such a great cause too.  Thank you so much.

KLEIN:  Thank you very much, thank you.

COSBY:  Thank you. 

And still ahead, everybody, landing a plane is hard enough, but imagine having to do it while wrestling a snake.  The pilot with a real life horror story joins me next. 



SAMUEL L. JACKSON, ACTOR:  Everybody buckle up now! 


COSBY:  Well “Snakes on a Plane” is one of the most buzzed about movies of the summer.  You just saw a little clip.  Some say it has gotten so much attention because the storyline of snakes on a plane is just plain ridiculous.  But don‘t tell that to Monty Coles (ph).  He is a pilot who recently found himself face-to-face with, you guessed it, a snake in the cockpit of his own plane.  Monty Coles joins me live. 

Monty, what did you do when you realized you had a plane in the cockpit—you know, a snake, in the cockpit of your plane? 

MONTY COLES, PILOT:  He stuck his head out of the dash and stared me right in the eye.  And when he came out about four inches, I didn‘t realize what type he was, I hit him with the radio and he fell on my feet. 

COSBY:  And then I understand then you had to—what, you actually coiled it around your arm, right? 

COLES:  Yes, I went to open the door on the other side and he ran up the door and I grabbed him by the neck, and he just coiled up.  And black snakes are a constrictor, that‘s the first time I realized what kind of snake.  And then he got a hold of a lever on the floor of the plane and was pulling.  But I had him under control at that point, I felt. 

COSBY:  And how did you land safely?  I understand you told—I love this line, you told ground control, this is the control tower, you had to make an emergency landing, and you said you had “one hand full of snake and the other hand full of plane.” How did you finally bring the plane in safely? 

COLES:  It wasn‘t too awful bad.  He settled down.  But I was able to reach around him and work everything with one hand.  And.

COSBY:  And how did he get there to begin with? 

COLES:  . got on the ground.

COSBY:  How did he get there to begin with, Monty?

COLES:  I had been leaving the door open on it.  It‘s in a small hangar, and let some air ventilate through it so it wouldn‘t be so humid inside.  But the door is closed now. 

COSBY:  You know, I bet it is.  You know, the movie “Snakes on a Plane” is coming out, there has been a lot of hype about it, do you feel like you sort of lived through the real thing and are you going to watch the film? 

COLES:  I probably will watch it.  And, you know, I hope nobody else lives through it.  And I hope that it shows other pilots and people driving, that you—if you maintain control, you can get through about anything. 

COSBY:  You bet.  Well, what a great message.  And, Monty Coles, we are glad you are safe and sound.  Make sure you keep that door closed. 

And everybody, that does it for me.  Let‘s go to Tucker and “THE SITUATION.” He starts right now. 



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