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'Scarborough Country' for Oct. 18

Read the transcript to the Wednesday show

Guests: Phil Bronstein, Joan Walsh

JOE SCARBOROUGH, HOST:  Bill Clinton is back, and Democrats are cheering “Happy Days Are Here Again.”  Six years after retirement, 10 years after late night pizza parties with Monica, Bill Clinton once again the hero of FDR‘s party, pushing hard to sink George Bush‘s GOP.  But that ship‘s already in danger of sinking as a new NBC/”Wall Street Journal” poll that‘s just out tonight is pointing to a Democratic landslide in less than three weeks.  Say hello, Speaker Nancy Pelosi.

The GOP Congress approval rating is down to a dismal, almost unheard of 16 percent.  That‘s lower (ph) than Republicans like me swept into power in 1994 and just one point off from their all-time low.  And George Bush‘s approval rating stuck in the 30s, at 38 percent.  That is 10 percentage points lower than Bill Clinton‘s approval rating before the 1994 historic landslide.  Republicans, it would seem, are going down with Mr. Bush‘s ship.

Here now, Phil Bronstein—he‘s executive vice president and editor of “The San Francisco Chronicle”—Joan Walsh, editor-in-chief of, and MSNBC political analyst Pat Buchanan.

Phil, let me start with you.  I know you‘re just bursting with pride and joy.  San Francisco‘s own Nancy Pelosi—she sure looks destined to be the next Speaker of House, doesn‘t she.

PHIL BRONSTEIN, “SAN FRANCISCO CHRONICLE”:  Well, certainly, everything that you said leading up to this question suggests that she is.  I mean, I—you know, George Bush, with those numbers, doesn‘t have coattails, he doesn‘t even have a vest.  It‘s—you know, it‘s different out here, I have to tell you, because we just endorsed Arnold Schwarzenegger for governor.  So we‘re going with a Republican here, at least at “The San Francisco Chronicle.”  I don‘t know about San Francisco.  So it‘s not dismal all over for Republicans.  It‘s going to be high times here, though, with Nancy Pelosi as Speaker, if that‘s what happens.

SCARBOROUGH:  Pat Buchanan, the most fascinating story out today, I think, is the reemergence of Bill Clinton.  You know, Democrats look at this guy like a rock star.  They‘ve always treated Bill Clinton like a rock star because he, unlike any other Democrat in modern times, knows how to beat Republicans.  But he is a very divisive figure, as he proved in 2000, 2002, 2004.  Bill Clinton coming to your district in the past has not meant victories or votes.  What about now?

PAT BUCHANAN, MSNBC POLITICAL ANALYST:  Well, look, I think what Clinton is doing, he sees this earthslide coming, and he‘s the guy that can get out in front of the parade and lead it, Joe.  He‘s putting himself out front, so he‘s going to get credit for it.  He‘s going to areas where he can help, urban areas with African-Americans and others.

And I think he‘s also been de-demonized by that “Duke of Hazzards”—

“Dukes of Hazzards” thing with 41.  So I think he‘s been de-demonized.  I think he can help in a lot of areas.  He‘s getting out front.  He‘s not being deeply partisan.  That would be a mistake.  And I think he can help the Democratic Party in certain areas.  But the president, he‘s at 37.  Reagan was at 70 percent when we lost the Senate in 1986.

SCARBOROUGH:  And that‘s the most devastating thing for Republicans!  Joan, you know, there‘s always this six-year itch.  We‘ve all been talking about it now for a long time.  You look at Bill Clinton‘s approval ratings six years into it.  You look at Ronald Reagan‘s approval ratings six years into it.  They don‘t do well at all six years into the presidency.  But George Bush‘s numbers—absolutely dismal.  It‘s very bad news for Republicans.

And now you‘ve got Bill Clinton going out there saying things like this.  And let‘s take a listen to what he said.  It‘s classic Bill Clinton.


BILL CLINTON, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES:  I had an 8th grade science teacher who was one of the most physically unattractive people I ever met in my life.


CLINTON:  He had thick Coke-bottle glasses, and he smoked cheap cigars in a cigar holder that caused his mouth to pinch.  And he had been a football coach before he became a science teacher, and he gained a little weight after he turned to science and he still wore the same clothes.


CLINTON:  And I‘m telling—let me tell you why I said this.  One day in class, he said to us—I was 13 at the time, 47 years ago.  He said, You won‘t remember anything about science in a few years, so if you don‘t remember anything else in class that I teach you, remember this.  Every day, I get up and I go to my bathroom and I wash my face, throw water in my eyes.  I shave.  I wipe the shaving cream off.  I look in the mirror and say, Vernon, you‘re beautiful.


CLINTON:  And by the end of the year, he was beautiful to me.  I say that to remind you it is very hard to succeed in politics when you‘re telling people they‘re ugly all the time.


SCARBOROUGH:  Joan, not exactly the kind of speech we‘d hear from the current commander-in-chief, is it.

JOAN WALSH, SALON.COM:  No, not at all.  I was hanging in there with him until the end.  I guess there was a punchline, Joe.  No, I mean...

SCARBOROUGH:  Well, I think it is that you were beautiful.  I expected him to start singing.  A little too touchy-feely for us conservatives.

WALSH:  Yes, but we liberals love that stuff, Joe.


WALSH:  I think the most telling thing today is that the president is in North Carolina, going to schools, and he‘s not appearing with the two vulnerable Republicans, Charles Taylor and Robin Hayes.  I mean, that to me, it tells the whole story.  He‘s going to be raising money tonight at a private fundraiser, no media.  But you know, the man is spirited in under the cover of darkness now.


SCARBOROUGH:  And—but you got Bill Clinton...

WALSH:  No one wants to see him.

SCARBOROUGH:  ... out here campaigning...

WALSH:  Right.  Absolutely.

SCARBOROUGH:  ... basically, doing whatever he can do to get Republicans—Democrats elected.

WALSH:  He‘s the party leader.  He really is.  Let‘s be honest.  People—you know, there were people who didn‘t like him, but the year that he had the low approval ratings, those last mid-terms, Joe, he picked up seats.  He campaigned hard.  He fought back on impeachment and he wound up picking up seats and defying history.

SCARBOROUGH:  And again...


BUCHANAN:  Joe, that‘s right, that...


SCARBOROUGH:  That‘s the point.

BUCHANAN:  Bush is traveling like Nicodemus, by night, you know?


BUCHANAN:  I mean, he‘s going into these districts and he‘s not going in with the candidate.  He‘s going in the evening.  They‘re closed sessions.  They‘re fund-raising sessions.

WALSH:  Exactly.

BUCHANAN:  But I will credit the president with this.  I‘ve never met someone who‘s devoted more time and effort and labor in off-year elections to his party than this president.  He did far more than Nixon did, far more than Reagan did.

BRONSTEIN:  But the question is, Phil Bronstein, whether that helps or not.  Certainly, if George Bush ever tried to tell a Republican in California that he was coming, they‘d put anti-aircraft weapons up at the borders...


WALSH:  They have.

SCARBOROUGH:  ... and stay—you know, like, Stay the hell out!


SCARBOROUGH:  Seriously, George W. Bush right now is not somebody that you‘d want standing next to you in a lot of districts out there, right?

BRONSTEIN:  Well, he certainly hasn‘t been out here much.  But you know, let‘s not—this stealth candidate—you know, Abraham Lincoln came to Washington in a disguise.


BRONSTEIN:  But yes, I just—I just want to go back to the issue of conservatives not being touchy-feely.  I think part of the problem—you know, Clinton may be almost unnecessary because there‘s such a line of political corpses in the Republican Party because of scandal.  You know, conservatives in the Republican Party are touching and feeling.  They‘re touching the wrong people and they‘re feeling a lot of money.


BRONSTEIN:  So I think that—you know, and you pull that—you pull the scandal curtain back, and then you‘ve got Iraq.  I mean, there‘s not a whole lot going on for the Republicans right now.

SCARBOROUGH:  It‘s unprecedented bad news, Phil, for Republicans.  I can‘t remember another year like this.  And the NBC/”Wall Street Journal” poll is saying only 37 percent want a Republican-controlled Congress, 52 percent want a Democratically-controlled Congress.

Pat Buchanan, I‘ve never seen numbers like that.  When I was in Congress -- ‘94, ‘96, ‘98, 2000 -- all those years, there was a two or three vote swing between the two parties.

BUCHANAN:  I think...

SCARBOROUGH:  Now it‘s blown wide open.

BUCHANAN:  You know, I saw those numbers, Joe, in 1964, when I was with Goldwater!


SCARBOROUGH:  Yes.  But everything went down.  We lost everything.  We were down to 140 seats.  But you‘re right.  I‘ve never seen in an off-year election, even a second-term election, which are almost always bad, numbers like this.  Dick Morris says the Foley thing is just hammering Republicans with the Christian conservatives and the evangelical right.  They‘re just disgusted.

SCARBOROUGH:  And Joan, why is it that we‘re hearing from the White House and other Republican operatives that this Mark Foley scandal is not gaining traction, when that‘s all a lot of people out there are talking about?  Not what Mark Foley did, but what Denny Hastert and the Republican leadership...

WALSH:  Exactly.

SCARBOROUGH:  ... did by allegedly covering up this very, very unfortunate practice of Mr. Foley?

WALSH:  I don‘t know what they‘re talking about, Joe.  I mean, they really are trying to project this positive image.  They‘re really looking away from what the damage is.  The only thing I can say is in their behalf, it‘ll be closer than we think because they have such a superior 72-hour effort, get-out-the-vote effort.  It will—I just can‘t imagine it‘ll be as bad as what we‘re talking about now because...


WALSH:  ... those are assets that we can‘t see on the ground.

BUCHANAN:  And the gerrymandered...

WALSH:  So I think they‘re seeing that.

BUCHANAN:  ... districts...

WALSH:  And the...


WALSH:  The gerrymandered districts do protect incumbents even in a bad year like this.  But I don‘t know what—I think they‘re trying to put a positive spin on it and focus attention away from the leadership failures that are really what the scandal is about, not one bad congressman.

SCARBOROUGH:  Not what one guy did.  But Phil...

BRONSTEIN:  Here‘s the—here‘s the 3:00 AM question, you know, when you‘re up at 3:00 AM, for Democrats.  Are Democrats going to win because they‘re putting up great candidates and because they‘ve captured the imagination of the voters, or are they going to win because the Republicans have messed it up so badly?

BUCHANAN:  They‘re going to win because...

BRONSTEIN:  That‘s a question that I think...

BUCHANAN:  They‘re going to win because...

SCARBOROUGH:  ... resonates.

BUCHANAN:  ... they‘re Brand X.

SCARBOROUGH:  Yes, and...

BUCHANAN:  Folks don‘t want what we got.


SCARBOROUGH:  And Phil, I mean, what do you think the answer to that question is?  I mean, and let‘s talk about Nancy Pelosi‘s Democratic Party.  I can tell you, I think, what Nancy Pelosi‘s position on the war is.  I can tell you what Joe Biden‘s position on the war is.  I can tell you what Ned Lamont‘s position on the war is.  But they‘re all different.  I can‘t tell you what the Democratic Party‘s position is...

WALSH:  But I don‘t think that‘s a problem.

SCARBOROUGH:  ... on the Iraq war.

WALSH:  I don‘t think that‘s a problem.  I actually...


BRONSTEIN:  It‘s not a problem now.

SCARBOROUGH:  No, it‘s not...

BRONSTEIN:  Not a problem now.

SCARBOROUGH:  Yes, it‘s not a problem...

WALSH:  I think...

SCARBOROUGH:  ... when you‘re running against this Republican Party.

BUCHANAN:  But Joe—Joe...

SCARBOROUGH:  But again, I can‘t believe—and I—Thomas Mann at the Brookings Institute said earlier that he didn‘t think that Democrats should be suckered into taking a position...

BUCHANAN:  He‘s right.

SCARBOROUGH:  ... a unified position on Iraq.

BUCHANAN:  He‘s right!~

SCARBOROUGH:  That‘s outrageous!

BUCHANAN:  It is not!  What...

SCARBOROUGH:  It is outrageous!

BUCHANAN:  Look...


BUCHANAN:  Come on, Joe!  Look, Bush took us in here.  We‘ve been in here three or four years.  It‘s a bad situation.  I would say, look, he‘s had an opportunity to do it.  I didn‘t agree with going on.  He did.  And give us a chance.  We got to get out of there.

SCARBOROUGH:  But Phil Bronstein...


SCARBOROUGH:  Hold on a second!  Phil, let me bring you in because when we got elected in 1994, everybody knew where we stood on every issue.  They knew how to judge us.  And that‘s why we got re-elected in ‘95, ‘98, 2000, because the Republican Party of 1994, love them or hate them, told you where they stood.  What does Nancy Pelosi‘s Democratic Party stand for?  What is their mandate when they win, that they‘re not Republicans?


BRONSTEIN:  Well, yes.  Actually, I agree with Pat Buchanan that they‘re Brand X.  I mean, I think the advantage to them is they have so many feet in so many places, it‘s a nice stable structure.

BUCHANAN:  Joe, people think...

WALSH:  And they have diversity.

BUCHANAN:  ... the Republicans should be thrown out.  And if Democrats are wise, they will agree with that and say, We‘ll give you a different alternative.  We‘ll give you something new, a different...

SCARBOROUGH:  A different alternative?  What‘s the alternative, Throw the bums out?

BUCHANAN:  Joe, here‘s the thing.  Throw the bums out.  Exactly! 


SCARBOROUGH:  Joan Walsh, is that what it comes down to?

BUCHANAN:  That‘s what ‘94 was, Joe!

WALSH:  It‘s going to come down to, Throw the bums out and change the course on Iraq.  And there‘s no one position on Iraq.  It‘s going to be sorted out.  It‘s going to be a matter of debate within the party and between the parties, and I think that‘s just fine for the Democrats.  I think that‘s a winning position.

SCARBOROUGH:  What‘s the old Yogi Berra line?  When you come to a fork in the road...

BUCHANAN:  Take it.

SCARBOROUGH:  ... take it.

WALSH:  Take it.


SCARBOROUGH:  Well, that‘s what the Democratic Party promises you in Iraq!  Phil Bronstein, Joan Walsh, Pat Buchanan, thanks a lot for being with us.

And coming up next: A Web site warns of a major terror attack against NFL stadiums this weekend.  The latest live.  Plus, we‘re going to be asking our terror expert about this threat and if al Qaeda‘s really targeting NFL stadiums.

And it‘s Rosie versus O‘Reilly live on national TV, and we‘ll show you the highlights from the fierce “View” face-off.

And later, dramatic footage as cops do battle with a high-speed RV, stupid crooks, angry prostitutes and much, much more.  Court TV shares some of the most shocking videos you‘ve ever seen.


SCARBOROUGH:  Michael, you a football fan?


SCARBOROUGH:  Are you really?


SCARBOROUGH:  You go see—who do you go see?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  Giants, when I can.

SCARBOROUGH:  I wouldn‘t go this weekend.


SCARBOROUGH:  Tonight—this is serious business!


SCARBOROUGH:  They‘re in Dallas.  I‘m glad I like college football because tonight, seven NFL stadiums are on—nobody would blow up Alabama, as bad as they are this year (INAUDIBLE) leave them alone.  Nobody‘s paying attention.  (INAUDIBLE)


SCARBOROUGH:  Anyway, seven NFL stadiums are on alert after a chilling warning from Homeland Security.  A Web site threatens a dirty bomb attack on NFL games this weekend in New York, Miami, Atlanta, Seattle, Houston, Oakland and Cleveland.  The threats are part of an ongoing Internet conversation titled “New attack on America, be afraid.”  Tonight, DHS officials are trying to downplay the threat, and the games are still on as of today in the seven cities.  But should fans be concerned?

For the very latest, let‘s go live to Daniel Garza from KNTV, our NBC station in the San Francisco Bay area.  Danny, how are the folks responding out there?

DANIEL GARZA, KNTV OAKLAND:  Well, Joe, as you might expect, with the rumors of terrorist threats and news of terrorist threats, people are pretty used to this stuff by now, so they‘re being sort of—you know, a little cautious, a little concerned, but sort of taking it in stride.  As a matter of fact, here at McAfee Coliseum (ph) in Oakland, we don‘t see a lot of heightened security.  As a matter of fact, if you take a look over here at the adjacent Oakland Arena, you can see folks lining up to go to “Disney on Ice,” which gets under way in just about an hour or so.

Now, the Raiders say because that dirty bomb threat is not credible, fans shouldn‘t have any concerns about coming to the game on Sunday, that game against the Cardinals.  Still, Raiders say fan safety is important, so they‘ll have all their safety measures in place, all the ones that have been in place since 9/11, including pat-downs and bag searches and metal detectors.  And they say they‘ll probably have some additional security measures in place, but they‘re additional security measures that most folks won‘t see and team officials won‘t talk about for obvious reasons.

SCARBOROUGH:  And Danny, of course...


SCARBOROUGH:  ... that‘s the issue here.  If there is heightened security as we move closer to the games on Sunday, most fans aren‘t going to know about it anyway, right?

GARZA:  No, you know, and the team‘s not going to talk about it.  Obviously, they don‘t want to tip off anybody who might want to do some harm.  So the Raiders are really kind of rushing forward to assure people that things are going to be OK.  Right now, they‘re deciding whether or not to give refunds to fans who might be too frightened to come out to the game on Sunday.  But everybody‘s sort of keeping their fingers crossed, at this point.

SCARBOROUGH:  All right.  Hey, thank you so much, Danny Garza.

GARZA:  Sure.

SCARBOROUGH:  Greatly appreciate the update from Oakland.  And we‘ll be getting back to you, I‘m sure, later on this week.

Here now, let‘s bring in NBC terror analyst Evan Kohlmann.  Evan, credible or not on this specific incidence, we‘ve seen several movies, a Tom Clancy novel sort of set-ups, talking about how a packed football stadium is a very tempting target for terrorists.  What‘s your take on that?

EVAN KOHLMANN, NBC TERRORISM ANALYST:  Well, aside from the threat of organized terrorism, I think what the feds are really concerned about here is the idea that individual lone wolves, people that may not be directly associated with al Qaeda or another terrorist organization, might read these plans and might be inspired to come up with their own ideas.

And this is something that we‘ve seen already happen in Europe, where we‘ve seen sympathists, people that are sympathetic to al Qaeda, come up with plots such as attempting to get a job as a concession salesman at a stadium and then selling poisoned beer to fans at soccer matches.  So I think this is the kind of threat that they‘re worried about.  Suicide bombers, potential weapons of mass destruction, chem-bio weapons being used either by organized terrorist groups or by lone wolves, people that are just reading this and are inspired by it.

But either way, I mean, the threat in general is real.  I think this specifically, I think the feds are right to downplay it.  It doesn‘t make much sense.

SCARBOROUGH:  What about, though, again, we—I was talking about I think the Tom Clancy novel, “Debt of Honor,” where you had somebody flying a commercial aircraft into Congress, and then we‘ve been showing you clips of “Sum of All Fears”—even back in the 1970s—what was that movie?

KOHLMANN:  “Black Sunday.”

SCARBOROUGH:  “Black Sunday” with Bruce Dern.  I remember watching that one Sunday night on NBC after a football game.  But it seems that Hollywood screenwriters have always recognized these huge open arenas, whether you‘re talking about a soccer match in Europe or a football game here in the United States, as being a very tempting terror target.  What could feds do if somebody targeted the stadiums, other than just shut a game down?

KOHLMANN:  Well, other than going after specific intelligence clues, there‘s very little you can do.  You can search fans coming in the stadium.  You can set up sensors to detect possible chem-bio weapons.  You can—you know, you can put up the same kind of offense that we have at an airport.  But the same way that airport security is far from foolproof, neither is stadium security.  And the issue is especially as we‘re moving into winter months now—we‘re talking about people wearing heavy jackets, carrying bags with them.  There—it‘s becoming more and more difficult to try to find bombs hidden on someone.

And if we look at the way that these groups, these terrorist groups,

are developing explosives in order to escape those kind of precautions that

we‘re putting up—metal detectors with, you know, the use of liquid bombs

you know, there is a possibility of someone carrying out a suicide attack.

And obviously, there‘s tremendous symbolic value.  Football is the U.S. national sport...


KOHLMANN:  ... in the eyes of many.  It‘s a lot of people.  It‘s nationally televised.  Americans specifically are watching this.  There‘s a lot of reasons to make this an attractive target.  It is one of the soft targets that I think the feds are most concerned about at the moment.

SCARBOROUGH:  All right, Evan Kohlmann, thank you so much.  And I think you‘re right.  In the end, it seems to be a very tempting target.  Thanks, Evan.

Now, coming up, it‘s “Must See S.C.” when Larry King tries to keep a straight face during his interview with John Mark Karr.  And later: Heather Mills accuses my hero, Paul McCartney, of beating her and taking illegal drugs.  A Beatle doing drugs?  Don‘t say so!  Their divorce is getting even messier.  If you thought the Beatles break-up was ugly, you ain‘t seen nothing yet.


SCARBOROUGH:  Is it time?  You know, nobody can—you know, you‘re going to beat somebody, Heather Mills has one leg, right?


SCARBOROUGH:  No, I‘m serious!  She does!  I‘m not being—you just kind of push her.  You don‘t have to hit her!


SCARBOROUGH:  Anyway, it‘s time for tonight‘s—I‘m sorry.  It‘s time for tonight‘s “Must See S.C.”—I‘m not, actually.  It‘s time for tonight‘s “Must See S.C.,” some video you got to see.  First up, John Mark Karr, believe it or not, is making the media rounds.  He turned up on “Larry King Live” this week, but it seems old Larry might be starting to lose it.


JIMMY KIMMEL, “JIMMY KIMMEL LIVE”:  It‘s a tricky thing to interview somebody like this, but I think Larry handled it very, very well.

LARRY KING, “LARRY KING LIVE”:  We have an e-mail question from Jessie (ph) in Coralville (ph), Iowa.  “John, are the reports you seeked (SIC) a sex change in Thailand true?”

JOHN MARK KARR, FORMER JONBENET RAMSEY MURDER SUSPECT:  Well, you know what?  If it was true, it‘s my choice.  And that‘s what‘s another great thing about being an American is that you‘re free.  And anyone who would undergo a surgery like that, I have nothing but respect for those people.

KING:  All right.

KARR:  If I—I‘d made a choice like that or considered a choice like that, I‘d be proud of it.

KING:  You didn‘t bring the kids with you, did you?


SCARBOROUGH:  And finally, comedians who parody President Bush often take aim at this classic W. chuckle.


GEORGE WALKER BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES:  I haven‘t really thought of it that way.


BUSH:  It‘s—it‘s...



SCARBOROUGH:  Well, Jon Stewart‘s got the finest chuckle impression of them all, and last night, he showed off some of his best work.  Enjoy.


SCARBOROUGH:  And coming up, the story behind one of the wildest “Caught on Tape” videos ever filmed.  We‘re going to show you the crazy things that cops face on a daily basis.

And next: It‘s the fighting Irish.  Bill O‘Reilly takes on Rosie O‘Donnell live on “The View.”  We got the highlights from the culture war grudge match coming up.



SCARBOROUGH:  Coming up, it‘s a hard day‘s fight for Paul McCartney and Heather Mills, as their divorce gets even nastier.  New allegations that the former Beatle hit his wife—whatever—and took drugs.  No way!  He‘s a Beatle!  This is getting ugly. 

Plus, ever wonder just how dangerous it is to be a cop?  Court TV shows us some of the most shocking police video ever filmed.  That‘s me in that car, by the way.

Welcome back to SCARBOROUGH COUNTRY.  Those stories in just minutes. 

But first, it‘s a long-time rivalry that‘s showing no signs of letting up.  Bill O‘Reilly appeared on the chick chat-fest, “The View,” this morning to talk about his new book, “Culture Warrior.”  And big surprise.  Before long, things heated up between Mr. O‘Reilly and Rosie O‘Donnell.  Take a look.


ROSIE O‘DONNELL, HOST, “THE VIEW”:  So do you know how your show has more traditionalists than secular progressives?

BILL O‘REILLY, FOX NEWS HOST:  No, it‘s 50-50.

O‘DONNELL:  No, it is not.

O‘REILLY:  It is so.  It absolutely—where‘s your sign?  Wrong. 

Wrong.  You‘re wrong.

O‘DONNELL:  Listen.  Wait.  Wait. 

O‘REILLY:  I can‘t document this.


O‘DONNELL:  As Phil Donahue said to you, Bill, just because you‘re louder doesn‘t mean you‘re right. 


SCARBOROUGH:  And speaking of yelling, listen to what Bill O‘Reilly said during an interview with the “Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel” on Monday. 


O‘REILLY:  Once in a while, somebody comes on a program like Jeremy Glick or somebody like this who has to be schooled because they‘re so offensive and so outrageous or dishonest, whatever adjective applies to the person, that I have to.  I have to.  But that‘s rare.  Most of the time it‘s back and forth, and then, “Thanks for coming on.  We‘ll see you next time.”


SCARBOROUGH:  Here‘s Matthew Felling.  He‘s the media director for the Center for Media and Public Affairs.  We also have Tom O‘Neil.  He‘s the senior editor at “InTouch Weekly.”

So tell me, Tom, you know, the fighting Irish got together today on “The View.”  Who won? 

TOM O‘NEIL, “INTOUCH WEEKLY”:  I think that Rosie actually handled herself with real class and dignity for Rosie.  I think it was interesting that she kept saying things to Bill like, “I find you interesting.  I‘m going to read your books.”


SCARBOROUGH:  But that‘s garbage.  What happened?  Come on.  What happened?  Because you had said that she looked like a dog that had like one of those electric collars around her neck, and she couldn‘t go out in the street and chase after O‘Reilly because—what, you think Barbara Walters took her to the side beforehand and said, “Don‘t embarrass us today”? 

O‘NEIL:  Oh, yes, I think that was what was happening there is that Barbara had reined in Rosie so much she kept wanting to jump off that sofa.  But what‘s fascinating about watching these two go at it is, you know, Rosie asks Bill a question.  They‘re two attack dogs who don‘t answer each other.  Rosie asks Bill, you know, “Are you for or against the war in Iraq?”  And Bill responds to her by saying, “Are you for or against us winning in Iraq?”  And her response to that is, “If you had a son, would you let him fight in Iraq?”   And they‘re both on the offensive so much...

SCARBOROUGH:  They‘re like politicians.  They don‘t answer the questions.  And that was one of the more fascinating clips.  Let‘s show it for our audience right now. 


O‘REILLY:  Do you want America to win in Iraq? 

O‘DONNELL:  I want America to be what the founding fathers wanted it to be, a democracy...


O‘REILLY:  OK, so you don‘t want America to win in Iraq.

BARBARA WALTERS, HOST, “THE VIEW”:  Don‘t put words in her mouth. 

O‘DONNELL:  OK, don‘t put words...

O‘REILLY:  She won‘t answer the question.  Do you want America to win there?


O‘DONNELL:  Bill, listen to me.  It‘s like saying, “Do you believe in God or the devil?  If you‘re not with us, you‘re against it.”  It‘s antiquated thinking, Bill.  Peace and harmony can...


O‘REILLY:  Sign.  Sign.

ELISABETH HASSELBECK, “VIEW” CO-HOST:  We need to win the war in Iraq for the people in Iraq at this point. 

O‘REILLY:  Let‘s calm down.  Let‘s calm down.

O‘DONNELL:  Look who‘s talking about calm, him.


SCARBOROUGH:  I think it‘s fascinating—just this is me talking—it‘s fascinating that Rosie O‘Donnell can‘t answer that with a yes.  “I want America to win the war in Iraq.” 

But that being said, Matthew Felling, I find it fascinating.  I have little use for the “The View” or “Oprah” or shows like that.  They‘re for chicks!  I‘m a real man, OK?  By that time, you know, I‘ll have my wife-beater, drinking, you know, a beer, you know, probably getting ready for my bowling match at night before I come on the show here.  But that‘s pretty fascinating TV.  I mean, they‘re actually debating Iraq on “The View,” and millions of people are watching.  What‘s going on there?

MATTHEW FELLING, THE CENTER FOR MEDIA AND PUBLIC AFFAIRS:  Yes, I thought it was—I very rarely get to watch these shows either.  Normally I‘ll just tune in to see if maybe Jessica Simpson is there, Jessica Biel is there, and even then I‘ll watch it on mute, if you know what I‘m saying.  But this show this morning, it was full of so many uncomfortable moments. 

SCARBOROUGH:  Oh, it was ugly. 

FELLING:  It was like meeting your college girlfriend‘s parents for dinner.  It was just on edge constantly.  And, you know, I agree about the electric fence analogy with regards to Rosie O‘Donnell, but they completely muzzled her, too. 

Let‘s remember:  Barbara Walters runs this show.  Star Jones will tell you that.  But they muzzled her by giving her these two little cutesy signs saying, “I disagree,” and “You‘re wrong.”  I mean, it was almost insulting to Rosie. 

And I‘m going to have to disagree with the other guest.  I think O‘Reilly came out ahead because he had the charm offensive on.  And he was like, “Hey, ladies, how are you doing?” 

And Elisabeth Hasselbeck, I mean, she‘s just a waste of space.  I felt like I was watching “Take Your Daughter To Work” day. 

SCARBOROUGH:  Well, actually I like watching Elisabeth Hasselbeck, whether she talks or not.  That‘s one of the reasons I like watching “The View” before I put on my t-shirt and go bowling.

So tell me, Tom O‘Neil, why were these people playing nice at times?  I mean, we understand why Rosie was playing nice, because Barbara Walters told her, “You‘re going to play nice.”  But why did O‘Reilly—I mean, take a look at how O‘Reilly and the ladies of “The View” said good-bye at the end of the segment. 


WALTERS:  Let‘s end on a secular progressive note. 

O‘REILLY:  No, no, let‘s end on a “Buy the ‘Culture Warrior‘ Book‘ note.

O‘DONNELL:  Listen, I buy all your books.  I‘m going to buy it.

O‘REILLY:  Will you really?

O‘DONNELL:  Yes, I will read it.  I think you‘re interesting, but I don‘t agree with you on a lot of things. 

O‘REILLY:  And I don‘t want you to.

O‘DONNELL:  I know, and it‘s OK.  Peace, my friend. 


SCARBOROUGH:  I‘m going to throw up.  What‘s going on here, Tom O‘Neil?  They hate each other.  I could show you clips of these two people ripping each other‘s larynx out, and here they‘re saying they like each other?  What‘s going on?

O‘NEIL:  Two things are going on here.  On one hand, Rosie has been so humbled that she just has to cave in when Bill goes on the charm offensive because she can‘t, you know, engage him in a fight that‘s going to take up time on that show. 

SCARBOROUGH:  Why has she been humbled?  Why has she been humbled?

O‘NEIL:  Because she‘s been dominating this show so much lately that Barbara has been saying behind the scenes, “Shut up.”  But yet the other clips that you could show about Rosie and Bill in the past are fascinating.  This is when they‘ve become friends.

Remember, it was on his show that he told Rosie that he was for gay adoption in the state of Florida.  They bonded at peculiar times when she appeared on his show and almost became friends before they went back to being enemies. 

SCARBOROUGH:  Well, and that‘s easy for him to say.  He doesn‘t live in the state of Florida.  I do. 

So, Matthew Felling, what do you think?  And I‘m fascinated by Barbara Walters, and she‘s sitting there—somebody said she looked like the grandmother—it was Michael over here, the cameraman—said Barbara Walters looked like the grandmother at Thanksgiving.  I wish we could freeze that clip where she‘s sitting uncomfortably in the middle.  All she needs is like an old, tiny purse on her lap just kind of looking left and right at the uncle and aunt who are fighting each other. 

What do you think about a trailblazer like Barbara Walters putting herself in this position, degrading to her, or just great entertainment? 

FELLING:  Well, I think she was just maintaining the peace.  She might as well have had a police badge saying, “To protect and to serve.”  I think, with regards to the charm offensive, I really think that Rosie was muzzled, and the reason Bill was being so charming, he‘s selling a book.  He knows that most of the women across America, they either are grandmotherly who look like Barbara Walters, and think like Barbara Walters, and love her, or they‘re watching for the new Rosie O‘Donnell factor.  And Bill doesn‘t want to irritate those people. 

Bill is all about the commerce, and Bill is certainly walking his way to success.  He‘s number one on the list right now.  And the real test, the interesting thing—I‘m sorry to plug a show that‘s some place else next week—is when Bill O‘Reilly goes on “Oprah.”  That might be must-see TV.

SCARBOROUGH:  Oh, I‘m sure it will be.  I‘m sure it will be. 

Hopefully, Elisabeth Hasselbeck will be invited to that show, too. 

Thank you, Matthew Felling.  Thank you, Tom O‘Neil.

Now, it‘s been a hard day‘s fight for former Beatle Paul McCartney.  I‘ve got to say, Paul McCartney, he‘s like the hero, my hero.  I love McCartney, everything about him.  But in divorce papers, Heather Mills McCartney has accused her estranged husband of being a vindictive man—yes, a vindictive man who‘s offered her $100 million for being married to him for four years—but says that he‘s been physically and emotionally abusing her. 

But McCartney, of course, is furiously denying the claims and, by one account, he even called her an “ungrateful bitch.”  Tom Ewart, from our British broadcasting partner ITN, has the dirty story. 


TIM EWART, ITV NEWS CORRESPONDENT (voice-over):  This is the latest round in an increasingly acrimonious divorce, a separation that has been marred by angry allegations and lurid headlines.  Now, court papers reportedly filed by Heather Mills McCartney, who lost a leg in a car crash, make a series of allegations against Sir Paul. 

Among them are these:  that he pushed her while she was four weeks pregnant; that he ignored her disability needs, forcing her to crawl up the steps of an aircraft because it was too narrow for her wheelchair; and that, just three days later, after an argument, he lunged at her with the broken stem of a wine glass, cutting her arm. 

Friends insist she didn‘t leak the papers, which were faxed anonymously and printed in the “Daily Mail.”  They were married seven years ago.  At stake now is Lady McCartney‘s slice of Sir Paul‘s 800 million pound fortune.  Lawyers say big headlines don‘t sway judges. 

PAUL AITCHISON, DIVORCE LAWYER:  This case will go before a specialist family judge in the high courts of the family division.  And I think it‘s highly unlikely that the judge will want to go off on a tangent about behavior when the real issues to be decided by the judge are going to be the very naughty issues about property and finances.

EWART:  Tim Ewart, ITV News.


SCARBOROUGH:  Thank you.  For $100 million, would you let me kick you around the studio for a while, Michael? 

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  For $100 million?

SCARBOROUGH:  $100 million, kick your ass.

Coming up next, those crazy car chases and hookers gone wild.  It‘s some of the most shocking video ever seen on TV, and we‘ve got it for you coming up. 

And later, Scarlett Johansson signs a record deal.  But can the sexiest woman alive carry a tune?  You bet your life.  We‘re heading to “Hollyweird.”


SCARBOROUGH:  Welcome back.  Welcome back.  You like that laugh.  It‘s irresistible video you can‘t pass up when you‘re flipping through channels.  Car chases caught on tape or convenient store robberies that, well, didn‘t go right. 

Court TV‘s put together the best caught on tape moments in a show they call “Most Shocking.”  It airs Wednesday night, and I talked to the show‘s producer, Debra Weeks, who brought some of her most outrageous clips. 


SCARBOROUGH:  Debra, tell me about this show.  Why is it different?

DEBRA WEEKS, COURT TV, “MOST SHOCKING”:  It‘s different because the footage is absolutely shocking.  You know, you see a clip of it on the news, but rarely do you ever get to see it in its entirety.  It‘s raw; it‘s real; it‘s riveting.  And what makes this show unique from other caught on tape shows are the interviews, from the officers and everyday citizens involved.  Their stories are just incredible. 

SCARBOROUGH:  Let‘s show everybody a clip of a shocking RV chase and then get your thoughts. 

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  Shredded tires fly into the path of police cruisers.  Then, a shower of sparks and flames.  Without warning, the streaking comet dives off the road.  The two-ton fireball roars down a boat ramp and plunges into a river. 

SCARBOROUGH:  Debra, it‘s a scene out of “Lethal Weapon 5:  The RV‘s Revenge.”  Talk about that.

WEEKS:  I know.  Have you ever seen a family RV in a chase?  No. 

That‘s whey we picked this story. 

SCARBOROUGH:  And especially not one that resembled a comet.  You‘ve also got some video of people who were lucky to survive some of these shocking moments that you all get on tape.  Let‘s take a look at these moments. 

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  Tom Massey (ph) is cashing in a winning lottery ticket.  Today‘s his lucky day; he just doesn‘t know how lucky.  A truck smashes right through the store and plows straight for Tom. 

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  All I heard was a great big crash, boom.  I have nowhere to go.  Glass is hitting me.  And then all of a sudden there‘s this truck behind me. 

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  Tom escapes certain death or serious injury by less than a foot. 

SCARBOROUGH:  It‘s fascinating stuff.  And where do you get these clips from?  How do you round them all up?

WEEKS:  Well, we‘ve got a crack team of researchers and producers who contact all the law enforcement agencies across the country, sometimes going and visiting them in person, sometimes sorting through hundreds of hours of footage looking for that amazing story, that shocking piece of footage.  And we get overwhelming response from the law enforcement community.  They want to cooperate.  They want to showcase these stories. 

SCARBOROUGH:  Let‘s play a clip from your ride episode that shows just how much trouble one person can cause. 

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  Taipei, Taiwan.  A prostitution sting at a local hotel has turned up a motley collection of ladies, ladies who just happen to be a bit camera-shy.  It only takes one fiery redhead to spark an uprising.  A cameraman gets blindsided by red and her friend who knock his gear away. 

SCARBOROUGH:  Oh, it‘s absolute bedlam.  It looks like scenes from my old high school, really extreme video.  But, again, video that paints a very vivid portrait of what law enforcement officers have to go through every day and, more importantly, every night.  And like you‘ve said before, it‘s something that they want out there, right?  They want people to see just how dangerous their job is. 

WEEKS:  Yes, they do.  And they relive the moments for us.  You know, they take us back in time and really describe what they were feeling, their fears.  And what they reveal is amazing.  They reveal that they‘re human beings like the rest of us.  They get scared.  They don‘t know if they‘re going to come home that night and see their families, but they make split-second decisions that save lives and get the bad guys and protect ours. 

SCARBOROUGH:  All right.  Hey, thanks a lot, Debra Weeks.  The show is “Most Shocking,” and it reveals outrageous and shocking crimes caught on tape.  And we greatly appreciate you being here to tell us all about it. 

WEEKS:  Thank you for having me.


SCARBOROUGH:  I know a couple of those girls.  Hey, coming up next, Brad and Gwyneth reunited, and it feels so good.  We‘ll explain when we take a trip to “Hollyweird.”


SCARBOROUGH:  Hey, tell your publicist to deny, deny, deny, because if the paparazzi didn‘t see it, it never happened, baby.  It‘s time for “Hollyweird.”

First up, Lindsay Lohan, the 20-year-old actress, tells “InStyle” magazine she wants to get married and win an Oscar in the next decade.  Yes, and I want to walk on the moon.  Here now, from “Reality Remix,” Kennedy, and “OK” magazine‘s Courtney Hazlett.

Kennedy, it warms my heart.  She wants to be a serious actress and a married mom.  What‘s your take?

KENNEDY, “REALITY REMIX”:  Aw, isn‘t that just wonderful?  She wants to be a little Angelina Jolie.  She‘s going to go get a plane and a baby from Malawi, and she‘s really on her way. 

SCARBOROUGH:  What about the Oscar? 

KENNEDY:  Well, I think that‘s a bit of a stretch, but a girl‘s got to dream, right?  Don‘t we want young women in this country to be ambitious?  You go Lindsay. 

SCARBOROUGH:  I suppose so.  Courtney Hazlett, what do you think?  What‘s in Lindsay Lohan‘s mind?  Is she tired of being pegged as this party girl? 

COURTNEY HAZLETT, “OK” MAGAZINE:  You know what?  It‘s so easy to mock.  It‘s so easy.  We‘ve been telling Lindsay for so long, “You need to get your act together.  You can‘t keep this up.”  And here she is, she‘s making a list of goals.  It‘s what they tell you to do.  And so you know what?  Lindsay, I‘m happy for you. 

SCARBOROUGH:  All right.  Look at that.  Wonder pals unite. 

HAZLETT:  Show support.

SCARBOROUGH:  Yes, way to show support and not be snarky. 

And as if being “Esquire” magazine‘s sexiest woman alive isn‘t enough

and she is, other than my wife, of course—actress Scarlett Johansson signed a record deal and here‘s a preview of what to expect courtesy of her film, “Lost in Translation.”


SCARLETT JOHANSSON, ACTRESS (singing):  Going to use my arms, going to use my legs...


SCARBOROUGH:  Kennedy, you used to work—weren‘t you like some MTV, like, hotshot?  I mean, come on.  Does she have a future in music? 

KENNEDY:  There are cats all over the country right now throwing themselves off of bridges into stagnant bodies of water. 

SCARBOROUGH:  Lake Eerie is polluted again.  So you‘re not going to go out and buy her CD, huh?

KENNEDY:  Well, you know, oddly enough, I didn‘t download Paris Hilton‘s tracks, and I‘m probably not going to be too interested in Scarlett Johansson, but I think Scarlett Johansson does have a better chance of winning an Oscar than Lindsay Lohan.

SCARBOROUGH:  Oh, no doubt about it.  And, Courtney Hazlett, I‘ve actually heard some of Scarlett Johansson songs, and I think they‘re actually very good.  What do you think?

HAZLETT:  You know what?  I was going to say, I hate to be labeled the unsnarky one here tonight on some degree, but I heard it, too, today. 

SCARBOROUGH:  Have you been going to church lately, Courtney?  Why are you being so nice? 

HAZLETT:  My mom has been begging.  No, seriously, though, I heard part of the song today.  It‘s actually pretty good.  She‘s got some pipes.  And you know what?  There have been worst mistakes made by actors-turned-singers. 

SCARBOROUGH:  Well, you know, me and the guys were just talking before the segment.  We all agree:  She‘s got pipes. 

Now, Paris Hilton and Nicole Richie may be friends again, but Richie‘s friends are reportedly concerned that Hilton is partying way too much for her simple co-life star.  So what‘s happening here, Courtney? 

HAZLETT:  Well, you know what?  Famously these two had a huge falling out.  They became un-best friends, yet they still had to tape “The Simple Life.”   They danced around that.  Now suddenly they‘ve become friends again right before the taping, and everyone‘s worried. 

You know, we‘re messing around with someone who really loves to party, another person who‘s a recovering heroin addict.  So I kind of have to side here with the camp that says, “You know what?  Maybe this isn‘t so good for you.” 

SCARBOROUGH:  I‘m siding with the recovering heroin addict, as I always do.  Let‘s skip straight ahead, Kennedy, to the Hoff.  We have a new clip from the Hoff.  Let‘s play it real—what, you don‘t have the Hoff clip?  You‘re loading it?  Well, that does us no good. 

Kennedy, this is the Hoff‘s next great Internet hit.  Take a look. 

You know what, Mike?  You can do that all...


What is this, cable access?  He‘s got it.  Talking about recovering heroin addicts, T.J. has it.  Let‘s play it. 


DAVID HASSELHOFF, ACTOR (singing):  ... crack in these dirty sidewalks of Broadway.  The hustle‘s the name of the game...


SCARBOROUGH:  ... the name of the game.  You know, Kennedy, you know he‘s singing it two octaves low, but that‘s OK, right? 

KENNEDY:  Wow.  You sound better than the Hoff, Joe, and that‘s saying something. 

SCARBOROUGH:  Yes, but will it sell in Germany?

KENNEDY:  Man, I smell a hit in Dusseldorf.

HAZLETT:  I think you‘ll be huge in Germany.

SCARBOROUGH:  All right.  Very good.  The Munich cowboy strikes again.  Thank you so much, Kennedy.  Thank you, Courtney.  That‘s all the time we have for tonight in SCARBOROUGH COUNTRY.  “Like a rhinestone cowboy”...




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