ALL IN with CHRIS HAYES
July 23, 2013
Guests: Rebecca Traister, Ryan Grim, Marin Cogan, Todd Gloria, Sen. Sherrod Brown, Letitia James, Prof. Bryan Stevenson
CHRIS HAYES, HOST: Good evening, from New York. I`m Chris Hayes.
Tonight on ALL IN:
Our national conversation on race, another county is heard from. Bill
O`Reilly delivers the angry white man position, and it is a rant that
requires a response. That is coming up.
Also tonight, I`ll tell you how every time you buy a can of soda,
you`re helping make the big banks even bigger. Senator Sherrod Brown is my
guest on this absolutely crazy story.
But we begin tonight -- and, perhaps, you predicted this, dear viewer
-- with Carlos Danger. That is not a superhero cartoon on Telemundo. It
is, in fact, a secret online identity used by one Anthony Weiner, the
former U.S. congressman, current candidate for mayor of this great city of
New York, which he used, as he allegedly engaged in explicit sexual
messages with a 22-year-old woman on the Internet.
This was reported today by a Web site called "The Dirty", which I
didn`t think I`d be speaking about tonight, which treated us all to more
uncomfortably creepy selfies taken by Anthony Weiner and more explicit
conversations full of language we could not repeat here.
The breaking revelations in the Carlos Danger story was not that there
was more creepy Anthony Weiner behavior on the Internet, but that these new
conversations had apparently taken place after, yes, after Weiner resigned
from Congress in 2011, meaning that after the fire storm, after the awful
press conferences with Andrew Breitbart and Howard Stern`s folks heckling
him, after he resigned from his job, Anthony Weiner continued this behavior
After a brief statement this morning which he admitted that some of
the new allegations were true, the mayoral candidate called a 5:00 p.m.
press conference and he did not drop out of the race.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANTHONY WEINER, NYC MAYORAL CANDIDATE: Good afternoon. My name is
Anthony Weiner, Democratic candidate for mayor of the city of New York.
I have said that other texts and photos were likely to come out, and
today they have. As I`ve said in the past, these things that I did were
wrong and hurtful to my wife and caused us to go through many challenges in
our marriage that extended past my resignation from Congress.
While some of the things that have been posted today are true and some
are not, there is no question that what I did was wrong. This behavior is
behind me. I`ve apologized to my wife, Huma, and I`m grateful that she has
worked through these issues with me and that I had her forgiveness.
I want to, again, say how very sorry I am to anyone who was at the
receiving end of these messages and the disruption that this has caused.
And my wife, as I have said, my wife and I, as I have said, are moving
forward together. To some degree, with 49 days left until primary day,
perhaps I`m surprised that more things didn`t come out sooner. I`m
responsible for this behavior that led us to be in this place, but in many
ways things are not that much different than they were yesterday.
This behavior that I did was problematic, to say the least,
destructive, to say the most, caused many stresses and strains in my
marriage. But I`m pleased and blessed that she has given me a second
Now, some have asked the question, where does this fit in? Some
timeline? Some timeline of the continuum of the resignation. Look, the
resignation was not a point in time that was nearly as important to my wife
and me as the challenges in our marriage and the challenges of the things
that I had done and working through them. Some of these things happened
before my resignation. Some of them happened after, but the fact is that
that was also the time that my wife and I were working through some things
in our marriage.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HAYES: The food news for Weiner was there were no Howard Stern
hecklers this time. The assembled press was quite reasonably, I`d say,
focused on the idea that, wow, man, I mean, losing your job as a
congressman and possibly your entire political career wasn`t enough to
break you of this really self-destructive habit. But it became clear, as
Weiner took questions that, no, no, it wasn`t.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WEINER: I said there we more things out there. There were -- this is
-- you have as a fixed time the resignation as the important moment in the
public discussion. That was when the public got a glimpse into something
that we had been working on before, during and since, and this behavior of
mine was part of that. I think I`ve said in my statement, one of the
things I`m not going to do, and I said it to your newspaper, is I`m not
going to get into a back and forth with people who are releasing things,
whether they be true or not. People have a right to say whatever they
want, and I brought that upon myself. I`m prepared now to dispute anything
that`s out there, but suffice it to say that people are out there saying
things that are -- that are not true.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HAYES: Most of this strange exhibition was beginning to look like the
kind of press conference we have all seen before -- the contrite male
politician, so sorry for his sins, with the support of wife awkwardly
standing silently behind her man.
But then something truly amazing happened, as Huma Abedin, the very
accomplished former aide to Hillary Clinton, and supportive wife of Anthony
Weiner, took to the microphone, herself.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HUMA ABEDIN, WIFE OF ANTHONY WEINER: As many of you who have followed
this campaign now, I`ve spent a good deal out on the campaign trail, at
churches and street fairs, parades. But this is the first time I`ve spoken
at a press conference, and you`ll have to bear with me because I`m very
nervous and I wrote down what I wanted to say.
When we faced this in publicly two years ago, it was the beginning of
a time in our marriage that was very difficult and it took us a very long
time to get through it. Our marriage, like many others, has had its ups
and its downs. It took a lot of work and a whole lot of therapy to get to
a place where I could forgive Anthony.
It was not an easy choice in any way, but I made the decision that it
was worth staying in this marriage. That was a decision I made for me, for
our son, and for our family. I didn`t know how it would work out, but I
did know that I wanted to give it a try.
Anthony`s made some horrible mistakes, both before he resigned from
congress and after, but I do very strongly believe that that is between us
and our marriage. We discussed all of this before Anthony decided he would
run for mayor.
So really what I want to say is I loved him, I have forgiven him, I
believe in him, and as we have said from the beginning, we are moving
forward. Thank you very much.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HAYES: And somehow, Huma Abedin convinced me that this was not the
spectacle I thought it was. Revolutionize the way I had understood this
entire thing unfolding before my eyes.
Joining me now is journalist Rebecca Traister, author of "Big Girls
Don`t Cry: The Election that Changed Everything for American Women"; Ryan
Grim, Washington bureau chief of "The Huffington Post", and Marin Cogan for
"The New Republic" and "GQ."
And, Rebecca, I`ll begin with you. Huma is a current aide to Hillary
Clinton I misspoke before. I -- OK, she basically said, look, if anyone
has cause to have beef with this, it is me, above you all, and I have
forgiven him, so back up.
And I found that surprisingly a persuasive argument.
REBECCA TRAISTER, JOURNALIST: I thought she was very persuasive. I
was none too pleased to see her standing there when I tuned into the press
conference, like oh, God, no, I do not need to have the wife walk.
But her statement was persuasive, she`s immensely likable, she`s so
smart, she`s terrific. I do think, though, it was persuasive. I believe
her. She loves this guy. They are going to move forward together.
HAYES: I like the way she hit lots of therapy. She really hit the
TRAISTER: Lots of therapy. Lots of recent therapy apparently.
HAYES: Right now, our therapist is off stage.
TRAISTER: He`s right there, he`s the guy behind us.
HAYES: He`s watching us.
TRAISTER: He`s watching us.
But, so all of that, I agree with you. I was very persuaded about the
-- you know, that they have a deal, they have a situation. They have an
understanding. They have a connection. She persuaded me of all that.
I was not persuaded that I want to be listening to press conferences
like this every six months through mayoralty, you know?
TRAISTER: That`s the separate. All the justification of moving
forward together is on thing. Moving forward into Gracie Mansion is
HAYES: Marin, that seems to me the issue here from a political
perspective is that, like, we don`t -- there`s enough of this caper, right?
At a certain point, it becomes unmanageable. And also the weird drip,
drip, drip of it.
I mean, his first instinct is to say, well, I told you there were
these other text and messages out there and I was right because I`m a truth
MARIN COGAN, GQ: Look, if they have an arrangement, they should just
say that. That would be the honest thing to do. It really bothers me how
dishonest this feels.
You know, whether or not he said this specifically, we were sort of
sold this bill of goods that when he resigned, he had learned from his
lesson, he was going through therapy, he was really going to learn from all
this. We`re finding out now that that`s not true. If they have an
arrangement, the brave thing to do would be to say that.
I was not persuaded by Huma`s lovely and eloquent statement. To me it
seems le evidence the two of them think he`s so important and so talented
that there`s no other public servant who could be doing a better job sort
of running the city, and there`s something to me that feels very
narcissistic about that.
HAYES: I will say that, Ryan, his bizarre seeming relish in being in
the middle of this, which, again, I don`t know inside the guy`s mind, but
it read a little bit of relish, was genuinely disturbing and off-putting.
RYAN GRIM, THE HUFFINGTON POST: Yes, I mean, there are stories about
how after his last, you know, debacle of a press conference that was
interrupted by Breitbart, et cetera, he went, you know, back to a hotel
room and watched, you know, the coverage afterwards for a significant
amount of time.
That`s -- he, you know, hello, Anthony. He`s probably watching right
now. That`s the kind of guy he is. And, you know, if that`s the kind of
mayor that New York City wants, then that`s the kind they`re going to get.
The only thing -- I would disagree with Rebecca that we don`t want to
see this every six months. Practically the only upside I could see of a
Weiner mayor would be events like this every six months.
TRAISTER: I was going to add to what Ryan said. Among the pieces of
the report today was this woman who he apparently had this ongoing sexting
relationship with, they cut off contact in the fall. But I saw reported
today he got back in touch after the big "New York Times" magazine story
about their revived marriage to see what she thought of it. This woman
he`d been sending these pictures to.
HAYES: I also think, too, I have this thought in these moments about
the just strange perverse nature of being in the public eye at all, about
choosing -- about the choice for them together to do this together. I
think that was the thing about that was persuasive about Huma stepping
forward and saying I own this decision, I am not some non-player in this.
Like, I`m a part of this, we made this decision together.
But also it made them very un-relatable, like, what is wrong with you
people that you want to go through this?
COGAN: Yes, I was totally not charmed by that. It seemed to me like
evidence they both really just believe in him to a crazy, crazy degree.
Like I said, I think there`s something crazy about thinking that despite
the fact you can`t even focus on the issues, that your sense of personal
judgment is so bad, that you can`t not make your political campaigns into
freak shows is -- did not reflect well on them.
GRIM: Yes, I mean, the thing about -- the strange thing about that
posture is that it`s not as if Anthony Weiner has a career of
accomplishments -- you know, where you can say that, okay, you know, these
are the things that you have to put up with, but look what he got done.
Look what we got done for New York. Look what he got done for the country.
You know, he`s been in politics basically since he was a teenager. He
was in congress for a fairly long time. He never joined the Progressive
Caucus or any other, you know, organized entity in there. He was -- he was
never interested in legislation. He wasn`t interested even in, you know,
trying to rise in leadership, none of that.
He had no close colleagues in the House. What he wanted to do was get
on MSNBC and get on cable and go down to the House floor and --
HAYES: Which is the most debase thing in the freaking universe as we
GRIM: You know, he gave amazing speeches on the House floor and slash
and destroy Republicans from the podium there. That was kind of it.
GRIM: So the question is, is that what this is about?
HAYES: What are you getting?
TRAISTER: Well, I also think that one of the things that happened
today, is that Huma was drawn in in a way that I don`t know is ultimately
going to do her good, because up until now, first of all, they are going to
-- those of us thought, perhaps, that the sexting and the scandal shouldn`t
destroy a political career, but perhaps this is a bridge of stupidity too
far, a lack of self-control. Now, Huma is coming in and becoming slightly
more culpable than she ever has before. And I`m not sure it`s going to do
her any favor down the road.
HAYES: That`s a really good point. Same world, saying West Bank is
not occupied, which Anthony Weiner said very casually, would be a bigger
scandal than any of this, but just me. Journalist Rebecca Traister, Ryan
Grim from "The Huffington Post", and writer Marin Cogan -- thank you, all.
While we`re all collectively obsessing over Anthony Weiner`s sex
scandal, there`s a guy on the other side of the country who is accused of
doing something much, much, much worse than what Anthony Weiner did and
he`s refusing to resign. I`m going to introduce you to him, coming up.
HAYES: There`s another sex scandal that`s gotten a lot less attention
than Anthony Weiner but is a lot, lot more serious. I`ll tell you about
HAYES: Former Congressman Anthony Weiner`s latest sexting and selfie
scandal is taking up most of our collective sex-scandal bandwidth right
There`s another former congressman, another Democrat, who should be
way more famous than he is for his own scandal, which has been spiraling
out of control for days now and is, I think, far more serious and worthy of
public scrutiny and condemnation than new pics of Anthony Weiner`s junk.
Bob Filner is the former 10-term California congressman who`s now
mayor of San Diego and oh, boy, does he have himself a scandal. What sets
Bob Filner`s sex scandal apart from Anthony Weiner`s is the foundational
moral concept of consent. Nearly all of what Weiner did was consensual,
creepy as people find it.
Not so with Filner, who is being accused of chronic, ongoing, and
systematic sexual harassment of staffers and constituents alike. At a
press conference last week, a lawyer described what are allegedly commonly
used terms around the mayor`s office. Quote, "The Filner head lock"
meaning the mayor wrapping his arm around a woman and directing her to a
place where they can be alone. And the Filner dance where the mayor
attempts to kiss the woman and she pulls away.
At that same press conference, a former San Diego City councilwoman
and former Filner staffer read accounts from two unidentified women who
reported run-ins with Filner.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
FORMER COUNCILWOMAN DONNA FRYE (D), SAN DIEGO: Over the past many
weeks, the mayor`s pattern of behavior has become clear to me. It begins
with him checking a woman`s availability through asking her about a spouse
or a boyfriend. Then, isolating the women somewhere off where they can
talk. I would like to read to you the stories from two women who met with
the mayor, and I want to provide you some specifics.
"Mayor Filner grabbed me and kissed me. I was able to push myself
away and hurriedly left the room, very upset."
On the sidewalk, the mayor suddenly in clear view of anyone who might
pass by, grabbed and kissed her, jamming his tongue down her throat. The
mayor quickly had his hand on the inside of her bra and was, again, trying
to put his tongue down her throat.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HAYES: Those details emerged last week. By the weekend the San Diego
County Sheriffs Department had set up a hotline for people who wanted to
report sexual misconduct by the mayor of San Diego.
Then yesterday, one of Mayor Filner`s accusers, his former
communications director, filed a lawsuit against him and aired her own set
of allegations in front of a camera.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
IRENE MCCORMACK JACKSON, FORMER COMM. DIRE FOR MAYOR FILNER: The past
six months turned out to be the worst time of my entire working life. I
was placed in the Filner head lock and moved around as a rag doll while he
whispered sexual comments in my ear. We did not have a relationship other
than work. That is all I wanted, and I never gave him any reason to think
Mayor Filner challenged me to give him one example of how his behavior
toward me was improper. I pointed out that he had asked me to work without
my underwear on. He had no comeback. His behavior made me feel ashamed,
frightened and violated.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HAYES: The charges against him first began to emerge about two weeks
ago. Bob Filner released a video message in which he apologized for his
behavior and promised to change but refused calls to resign.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MAYOR BOB FILNER (D), SAN DIEGO: I`ve reached into my heart and soul
and realized I must and will change my behavior. I have begun to work with
professionals to make changes in my behavior and approach. In addition, my
staff and I will participate in sexual harassment training provided by the
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HAYES: And who knows, maybe a little workplace sexual harassment
training would clear up any potential unwanted kissing, groping, head
locking and panty removal requests that may be going on in the mayor`s
As the allegations against him have grown in number and specificity,
Mayor Filner`s response to the scandal has been to dig in his heels even
further. After his former communication director`s press conference
yesterday, the mayor issued a statement saying in part, quote, "Once due
process is allowed to unfold, I`m certain there will be a better
understanding of this situation."
Maybe there will be. In the meantime, the calls for his resignation
from his own allies are growing, as they should.
Joining me now, Todd Gloria, a Democrat who is president of the San
Diego City Council. If Filner resigns, he could become interim mayor.
And, Council Member, my understanding is that you`re calling for the
mayor to resign, and my question to you is, how is it possible he has not
TODD GLORIA, PRESIDENT, SAN DIEGO CITY COUNCIL: Well, I think it`s a
situation where his ego and thirst for power really exceed his willingness
or desire to continue to do the right thing, which would be to step down.
It`s unfortunate. It has left the city in disarray. He is not capable of
running our city.
And that`s why myself and so many others have called on him to resign.
HAYES: Are you saying this because you would become the interim mayor
if he were to step down?
GLORIA: Absolutely not, Chris. As a native San Diegan and as a proud
progressive Democrat, we worked hard to get our first Democratic mayor in a
generation and we got this man who now eight months later clearly is
incapable of leading our city. This has nothing to do with anything about
an acting mayor situation.
This is everything to do about righting a wrong, respecting these
women that he clearly does not respect, and stopping the increasing
liability of the taxpayers who will have to pay off settlements to these
women who are coming forward.
HAYES: So, here is my question. This is a guy who served in Congress
for 20 years. OK? And my sense is that if these allegations are true, and
I`m inclined to believe them based on number and specificity of people who
have come forward, this is not something he started doing several months
ago when he became the mayor of San Diego.
What does it say to you, what do you think about Washington, D.C., and
the culture of Capitol Hill when you think art the fact this guy was there
for 20 years and we didn`t hear a peep about any of this?
GLORIA: Well, that`s one of difficulties the mayor has found,
becoming mayor where he is the chief executive of the eighth largest city
in the country. He hasn`t been able to escape the scrutiny he may have
been able to get away with it Washington, D.C. Here, he`s in the
unfortunate position of avoiding meetings with the public, of evading the
press and that`s what makes him incapable of leading our city.
You know, he is not meeting with the public any longer, and it`s just
an unfortunate situation. One of the reasons why so many people are asking
for him to go, we do not need Washington-style politics running America`s
HAYES: Here -- well, America`s finest city. I want to play this from
Bob Filner in sort of kind of explaining and copping to the behavior. He
had this very interesting explanation of it.
Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
FILNER: I am embarrassed to admit I have failed to fully respect the
women who work for me and with me and that at times I have intimidated
them. It`s a good thing that behavior that would have been tolerated in
the past is being called out in this generation for what it is,
inappropriate and wrong.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HAYES: What do you make of that explanation? That I`m from a
different generation where this was OK? And it`s good that it`s not now OK
but also a product of my times?
GLORIA: It`s ridiculous. This was never acceptable. Harassment and
disrespect of women was not acceptable then. It surely isn`t acceptable
And it -- what`s most disturbing about those comments is that he
basically is admitting to this behavior. He subsequently goes on to admit
that he needs help. He has told reporters that he has a monster living
inside of him, and he`s sort of also excused this by saying that he`s a
hugger of men and women.
Well, this is not about hugging. This is about sexual harassment of
women, of violating their personal space, of using his authority as mayor
against women who are under his supervision. All of this is wrong.
HAYES: And it is about violating the foundation concept of content
which should guide every single ethical decision that a human being makes
in whatever situation they find themselves, whether it`s sex or not.
Todd Gloria, president of San Diego City Council. Thank you so much.
GLORID: Thank you.
HAYES: If you`re enjoying a nice, frosty beverage in a can right now,
you`ll be very interested in my next story. Don`t go away.
HAYES: I`m about to tell you something that might really surprise you
about this simple can of coke. I usually indulge in the diet variety,
myself, being honest. You might expect the cost of it to be traced back to
the beverage and company and aluminum can, itself, and its manufacturer --
as well as the cost of the raw materials of all those components. You also
wouldn`t be surprised part of the cost includes the distributor, the means
of moving all these products, its subparts around the country and around
But here is the surprise. Every time you buy a can of Coke, or any
product involving an aluminum can, Goldman Sachs is making a fraction of a
penny off it. And, they are doing it by manipulating the availability of
the aluminum, itself.
According to an expose by "The New York Times," before you say, "Well,
no big deal." Consider that when even one-tenth of one cent is multiplied
by the 90 billion aluminum cans used in this country every year, that`s $5
billion over the last 3 years. That is how much the inflated aluminum
pricing by Goldman and other financial player has cost American consumers
according to the "The New York Times."
And, that includes the affected aluminum sold for cars and house
siding and electronics. And, there is a picture of the very raw materials
in question, Aluminum ingot. A 2003 regulation allows Wall Street banks to
purchase actual physical commodities. The Federal Reserve is now
considering whether this regulation should end.
The Fed should consider this very carefully because it certainly looks
like the banks have figured out how to game the system to make a fat lot of
money with no actual benefit to anyone but themselves. So listen to this.
OK. For example, Goldman Sachs bought metro international trade services
and more than 25 percent of the available supply of aluminum is stored in
that company`s Detroit warehouses.
And, on a daily basis, a fleet of trucks moves the aluminum around and
around from one warehouse to another. A fork lift driver calls it a merry-
go-round of metal. The purpose is to slow delivery times, and it is
working. Slowing delivery times from six weeks on average to 16 months
And, because of the way commodities are priced, that raises the cost
of aluminum on the market and that puts some extra money in the pockets of
the financial institutions that own these materials. In fact, coca cola,
itself, and other manufacturers avoid buying the aluminum from these
warehouses because of the incredible delays.
But, they cannot avoid paying the inflated market price. Financial
companies are -- and other markets as well, oil, wheat, cotton and coffee.
If you consume it -- if it is a commodity, they are into it. The Federal
Reserve could do one simple thing to stop this. The Fed can decide to end
this practice. One that never should have been allowed in the first place.
There are companies out there that actually do productive work than
actually take raw materials and turn them into a thing they sell to people.
Banks move money around. And, if you let the banks hijack the actual raw
materials we actually make products from, then they can rip us off yet
This very issue, in fact, was addressed today in the United States
senate. Joining me now is Senator Sherrod Brown, democrat from Ohio. He
led senate committee hearings today that focused on bank ownership of
commodities operations. My first question to you, senator, is how has this
been going on under everyone`s noses for three years and my sense is no one
knew this was happening until the "The New York Times" wrote about it?
SEN. SHERROD BROWN, (D) OHIO REPRESENTATIVE: We found out it was
happening because some of the can manufacturer -- the soft drink and the
beer manufacturers came to us and said that they have been affected -- that
the whole laws of supply and demand were upside down; that the Wall Street
companies, you mentioned Goldman Sachs, there are two other banks that have
been part of this. There`s Goldman. There is JP Morgan Chase, and there`s
Morgan Stanley, I guess, for the three.
That those three banks, whether it`s oil or copper or aluminum, they
have gamed the system and they`ve only been allowed to do this for around a
decade and they are getting more and more inquisitive, if you will, as they
gain more and more power in the marketplace.
Let me give you a good example. One of these, Morgan Stanley has owns
80 tankers -- 80 oil tankers and also owns refining capacity. They also
bet on side bets on the price of oil. So, if 80 of these tankers, if some
of their tankers, they decided to just not deliver oil for a period of "X"
number of days and then bet on oil prices spiking because of supply and
SEN. BROWN: -- They could probably make a killing. So, it`s this
kind of reaching into the real economy that can cause such damage in terms
of stability among in the financial system, in terms of the profits they
make, in terms of gaming the public and fleecing, in many cases, the
manufacturers who then have to pass these costs on to the public.
HAYES: So, am I right that the Fed, essentially, this is one of those
problems we cover. A lot of stuff on this show that`s complicated, and you
throw up your hands and say, how do we solve this? There is a solution
here, right? The Fed can make it the case that JP Morgan can`t be running
oil tankers around and Goldman Sachs can`t have warehouses full of aluminum
if they want to.
SEN. BROWN: Yes. There is probably a solution here. We think that`s
the solution you just suggest. Part of the problem is the Federal Reserve
won`t -- we don`t have enough information from banks yet. That will
probably be the next subcommittee hearing.
We also can`t get enough information from the Fed in terms of there is
a five or a ten-year renewal, if you will, on these rules that they have
promulgated. The Fed hasn`t even told us yet when this deadline is up
because they simply are not releasing the information. And, so, we likely
bring them in front of the committee --
HAYES: Wait a second. Wait a second. Wait a second. Senator,
you`re saying the Federal Reserve will not tell you, United States senator
on the senate banking committee, will no tell you when the rule in question
that is allowing this activity is up for renewal?
SEN. BROWN: That`s correct. They have not told us. We have not done
it through a hearing. We have done it through conversations with the Fed,
but they have not released that information yet.
And, I mean, this whole thing is so difficult to look into and to
understand, and that`s what -- I mean, Wall Street`s counted on that for
decades particularly the last decade, that nobody can quite understand the
language they use and the way they talk.
The regulators too often, as you have pointed out on this show, Chris,
are captured by the industry, which they are regulating. And, that is why
delving into this with more depth is so very, very important because, you
know, when you fill up your gas tank, it effects the price.
We know that there is speculation in oil. In oil prices, ultimately
gas prices. When you use copper, it looks more and more like they`re going
to go into that business more than they have. Copper is in so many
manufactured products --
HAYES: And, if you go back to American history and look at the
history of banks trying to corner the market on valuable commodities, you
will read a chronicle of ruin, crisis, and catastrophe. Senator Sherrod
Brown from Ohio. Thank you for holding the hearing today. Thank you for
SEN. BROWN: We will continue. Thanks.
HAYES: Goldman Sachs responded to "The New York Times" story. Their
statement reading in part, "As part of our activities as a market maker or
intermediary between buyers and sellers in commodities and commodity
futures and derivatives, Goldman Sachs like a number of other financial
institutions holds physical commodities in inventory.
We hold an inventory position in a particular physical commodity for
the purposes of meeting the needs of our clients or as a hedge for
positions in commodity futures or derivatives we assume as a market maker."
If you understood that, you are better than me. We will be right back.
HAYES: #Click3 will be back tomorrow. But, coming up next, if you
missed Bill O`Reilly`s racist rant last night, I really hope you did, we`re
going to break it down for you and tell you what he has in common with New
York city Police Commissioner Ray Kelly. That`s ahead.
HAYES: And now, the other side of the race conversation. The side
not interested in understanding the causes of racial tension, resentments
and frustrations in this country. A side that doesn`t want to hear about
history because history was yesterday and it`s annoying to have to think
about. You probably missed Bill O`Reilly`s super racist rant last night.
Here are some choice bits that give you an overall sense of the full 7-
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BILL O`REILLY, HOST OF "THE O`REILLY FACTOR" SHOW: Young black men
commit homicides at a rate ten times greater than whites and Hispanics
combined. Right now about 73 percent of all black babies are born out of
wedlock. White people don`t force black people to have babies out of
wedlock, but the entertainment industry encourages the irresponsibility by
marketing a gangster culture.
When was the last time you heard the congressional black caucus say
that? How about Jackson and Sharpton? How about President Obama? You
want a conversation? You got it. You want a better situation for blacks?
Give them a chance to revive their neighborhoods and culture.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HAYES: Bill O`Reilly only wants to create a better situation for
blacks. But, according to him, its liberals, people like you and me who
are ignoring the problems facing African-Americans.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
O`REILLY: Go to Detroit and ask anyone living on the south side of
the 8 mile road what destroyed their city. They will tell you narcotics.
They know addiction leads to crime and debasement. But, what do the race
hustlers and limousine liberals yell about? The number of black men in
prison for selling drugs. Oh, it`s so unfair. It`s a nonviolent crime and
blacks are targeted. That is one of the biggest lies in the history of
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HAYES: Just so we`re all clear on this. That is not a lie. It is
something tangible, knowable, in fact, it is something we know. White
people and black people use drugs at virtually the same rate. In fact, I`m
sure Bill O`Reilly knows white people who use drugs.
Maybe Bill O`Reilly uses drugs for all I know. But, here is the
thing. Black people go to prison for something as simple as marijuana
possession more than four times as much as white people. That is a true
thing about the world. Full stop.
And, if you want further proof about the real cause of long-term harm
to urban youth that Bill O`Reilly seems so concerned about, you need to
look at the result of a jaw-dropping two-decade-long study. Began in 1989,
the peak of the crack cocaine epidemic in Philadelphia.
Researchers tracked literal crack babies from birth to adulthood to
see if exposure to drugs in utero harmed their development. The years of
tracking kids have led researcher to a conclusion that she did not see
coming. Poverty is a more powerful influence on the outcome of inner city
children than gestational exposure to cocaine.
In other words, poverty is worse for kids than crack. I don`t know if
Bill O`Reilly is aware that everything he is saying is easily debunked with
about 20 minutes of Googling. But, that`s not really the point.
The real reason Bill O`Reilly peddles this stuff is because it gives a
cheap crack-like high to the old fearful white audience that watches Bill
O`Reilly and gives fox news its power, also known as the republican base.
These are the folks Bill O`Reilly is feeding when he laments not being able
to criticize black culture.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
O`REILLY: That`s because race hustlers and the grievance industry
have intimidated the so-called conversation, turning any valid criticism of
African-American culture into charges of racial bias.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HAYES: I am not entirely sure of what a singular African-American
culture is. Bill O`Reilly is very sure. In fact, he is so sure when he
encounters African-Americans, who don`t conform to his vision of their
culture. He is amazed. Listen to how he described a trip to a seafood
restaurant in Harlem.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
O`REILLY: There wasn`t one person in Sylvia`s who was screaming M-
Fer, I want more iced tea.
JUAN WILLIAMS: Please.
O`REILLY: You know? I mean everybody was -- it was like going into
an Italian restaurant in an all-white suburb, in a sense of people were
sitting there and they were ordering and having fun and there wasn`t any
kind of craziness at all.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O`REILLY: Further proof that Bill O`Reilly has, let`s say, a limited
view of African-American culture. "Oh, look, they`re eating with
utensils." But it`s also proof that if Bill O`Reilly is representative of
white culture, with his stereotyping and his victim blaming and domineering
tone, then I`m pretty sure we need to start having a national conversation
about the problems with white culture.
When we come back, I`ll show you what it looks like when the mindset
of Bill O`Reilly gets turned into actual policy and what that does to young
black men in the biggest city in the country. That is next.
HAYES: Bill O`Reilly and the right wing media have something in
common with New York City Police Commissioner Ray Kelly. They seem to know
what is best for the lives of young half black men. For them black on
black crime is never an extremely significant or complicated issue or a
short condemnation of poverty instead it`s about how young black men have
failed to understand that this is a nation of laws.
And, that is one of the reasons why Ray Kelly is out there defending
New York`s stop and frisk program, which stops hundreds of thousands of
men, most of them black or brown, even though very few of those stops lead
to actual charges. Now, Kelly`s name has been floated to replace Janet
Napolitano as the head of the Department of Homeland Security.
But, he is now on a charm offensive after critics have called
attention to the dramatic disconnect between Kelly`s record and the
national conversation on racial profiling we`re having in the wake of the
Today, in a piece he wrote for the "Wall Street Journal" Kelly said
the practice stop and frisk saves lives. In the 11 years before Mayor
Michael Bloomberg took office, there were 13,212 murders in New York City.
During the 11 years of his administration, there have been 5,849. That`s
7,383 lives saved and if history is a guide, they are largely the lives of
young men of color.
And, remind the fact that violent crime, not just here in New York but
nationwide has been declining since 1990. And, never mind the fact, some
cities saw their violence decrease by doing the exact opposite of stop and
risk and relied on "close cooperation between the police and community that
have ended up improving race relations."
In fact "The Wall Street Journal," the very same paper in which he
raved about the success of stop and frisk ran a piece saying that a 50
percent decrease in the number of stop and frisk coincided with a 30
percent decline in murder in New York, which doesn`t make a lot of sense if
the number of frisks is the thing that determines the murder rate.
The case against stop and frisk was once quite nicely signed up by a
former NYPD commissioner who observed "A large reservoir of good will was
under construction when I left the police department in 1994. It was
called community policing but it was quickly abandoned for tough-sounding
rhetoric and dubious stop and frisk tactics that sowed new seeds of
That man of course was Ray Kelly. If there are way to nominate that
guy to DHS, I will be all for it. Joining me now is New York City
Councilwoman Letitia James, a democrat who is running for public advocate
in New York and Bryan Stevenson, founder and executive director of the
Equal Justice Initiative and professor at the New York University School of
Law. Councilwoman, I`ll begin with you. The argument is 7,000 lives have
been saved. What`s your problem? Do you wish those people were dead
LETITIA JAMES, NEW YORK CITY COUNCILWOMAN: It`s really not the case.
We should not be looking at these policies through the lens of how many
lives were saved, but it should be basked on whether or not they are legal
or whether or not they comport to the constitution of the United States of
America and whether or not we`re violating the rights primarily of young
brown people --
HAYES: OK. But, here`s the argument that`s made, that the people in
the neighborhood you represent --
HAYES: -- worry about crime and want to see the police do something
about it and this is what the police are doing, and in fact, that if you
look at polling in the city, Ray Kelly has a fairly high approval rating.
He has a fairly high approval rating among African-Americans in the city
that this is delivering the goods and this is essentially just carping from
the side of critics.
JAMES: Since I`m on the ground, the vast majority of the constituents
that I represent, New Yorkers overall have informed me that they want more
smart policing, that they want community policing, that they would like a
police officer on the beat, a police officer that they can trust. They
recognize that stopping and frisking men of color in the city of New York
sews the seeds of distrust.
HAYES: Bryan, the thing that I think links what Bill O`Reilly had to
said on his program last night and Ray Kelly`s defense of his record is the
idea that the best thing you can do for young African-American men, young
African-Americans in general is have a very intense law and order state
that is very aggressive about policing and putting wrongdoers in jail,
because the victims of those wrongdoers are, themselves, African-American,
and you have spent your adult career working in the criminal justice
system. My question to you is, does that argument have purchase with you?
BRYAN STEVENSON, FOUNDER AND EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF THE EQUAL JUSTICE
INITIATIVE: No, it really doesn`t. It`s a distraction. And, Trayvon
Martin wasn`t killed because he didn`t have two parents who loved him. He
wasn`t killed because of some social deficit or some cultural deficit.
He was killed because of a presumption of guilt. And, what happened
to him and what is happening in New York, what is happening all over this
country is that we are actually allowing black and brown children to be
burdened with this presumption of guilt, so that they live their whole
lives always being suspected, always being feared.
We had the president of the United States who has achieved more than
any African American acknowledging his own dealings with this presumption
of guilt. And, not only does it create distress. It actually creates
Now, when anyone says that`s not a problem. When anyone says, you
should just learn to tolerate that, you`re actually feeding this history of
distrust and abuse and presumptions of danger and all of these things that
mark the African-American experience in this country, and we will not
recover until we address this.
HAYES: What`s remarkable to me is that the hidden truth behind all of
this, behind the stop and frisk conversation, when we`re talking about
profiling and about suspicion and black-on-black crime, which is this phase
that I think has a really an ugly undercurrent to it, is a fact a miracle
has happened in this country, is that the crime rate has gone down
incredibly across all different kinds of cities, in all kinds of different
of environments and now I have to say has produced tangible benefits. I am
a lifetime New Yorker. I know you are as well. It does make a big
difference that there is a lot less crime in New York now.
JAMES: But, it`s not tied to the abuse of stop and frisk. The
reality is that crime is down for a number of reasons. The trajectory of
violent crime in our country has been going down since the 1990s, since the
epidemic of the crack industry in the city of New York and throughout this
And, in addition to that, in the city of New York, we`ve had more
community policing and we`ve had more community-based organizations
involved in the lives of primarily black and brown people in the city of
New York. So, crime has gone down, again, but there`s no correlation
between crime going down and the abuse of stop and frisk.
HAYES: And, Bryan, the criminal justice system you navigate every day
as a lawyer was created by politics that happened largely in the `70s, `80s
and `90s when crime was much higher yet we have these laws and suspicion
from that era.
PROF. STEVENSON: Well, that`s right. The metric isn`t just crime,
alone. I mean, we had 300,000 people in jails and prisons in 1972. 2.3
million peoples in jails and prisons today. Our prison population has
continued to increase as these rates have gone down.
I mean, in this century, a black child born in 2001 has a 32 percent
chance of going to jail or prison compared to a white child, a white boy
with a 6 percent chance. That`s horrific. And, it creates a new issue for
this country to deal with and we have to understand the seriousness of
HAYES: New York City Councilwoman Letitia James and Bryan Stevenson
from Equal Justice Initiatives. Thank you both for coming in tonight.
JAMES: Thank you as well.
HAYES: That is "All In" for this evening. "The Rachel Maddow Show"
starts right now. Good evening Rachel.
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ALL IN with CHRIS HAYES