IE 11 is not supported. For an optimal experience visit our site on another browser.

PoliticsNation, Thursday, November 14th, 2013

Read the transcript from the Thursday show

November 14, 2013
Guest: Chaka Fattah; Steve Israel, Adam Schiff, Goldie Taylor, Bill Press,
Ryan Grim

AL SHARPTON, MSNBC HOST: Good evening Ed and thanks to you for tuning

Tonight`s Lead, "Setting the Record Straight." President Obama spoke
directly to the American people today vowing his health care law will work.
He also took responsibility for the problems.


OBAMA: I think it`s legitimate for them to expect me to have to win
back some credibility on this health care law in particular and on a whole
range of these issues, in general. And, you know, that`s on me. I mean,
we fumbled the roll out on this health care law.


SHARPTON: That`s attended honest assessment. The President owning up
to it. He also announced to change saying insurance companies can renew
canceled plans for another year. But he drew the line at those who are
just rooting for the law to fail.


proposals that are just another brazen attempt to undermine or repeal the
overall law and drag us back into a broken system. When I see sometimes
folks up on Capitol Hill and Republicans in particular who have been
suggesting repeal, repeal, let`s get rid of this thing. I keep on asking,
what is it that you want to do? Are you suggesting that the status quo is
working? Because it wasn`t. And everybody knows it. It wasn`t working in
the individual market. And it certainly wasn`t working for the 41 million
people who didn`t have health insurance.


SHARPTON: At the exact same time president Obama talked about ways to
improve the law, Speaker Boehner went on the house floor to complain about
it. And minutes before he went before the cameras to say this.


The only way to fully protect the American people is to scrap this law once
and for all. There is no way to fix this.


SHARPTON: There`s that positive attitude from the speaker. Their old
refrain get rid of the law. And it was the same story last night from
senator shutdown.


SEN. TED CRUZ (R), TEXAS: We need to repeal it altogether because
it`s not working. And in the coming weeks I intend to lay out a plan to
provide exactly that a plan to repeal Obamacare altogether and at the same
time expand options for the five million-plus people who have lost their
health insurance.


SHARPTON: It`s not working? They pretend to care? But they don`t
care about the people this law is already helping. Half a million people
who were uninsured have signed up for coverage. More than six million
seniors have saved $7 billion on prescription drugs. And 71 million have
gotten free preventive care. Republicans aren`t worried about taking away
those benefits. But President Obama`s making it clear he won`t walk away
from the people who need health care.


OBAMA: I think I said early on when I was running I`m not a perfect
man and I will not be a perfect president. But I will wake up every single
day working as hard as I can on behalf of Americans out there from every
walk of life who are working hard meeting their responsibilities but
sometimes are struggling because of the way the system works isn`t giving
them a fair shot. As long as I`ve got the honor in this office, the harder
I`m going to work as hard as I can to make things better for folks.


SHARPTON: He won`t quit on the American people. That`s the message.

Joining me now are Congressman Chaka Fattah and MSNBC`s Krystal Ball.

Thank you both for being here.

KRYSTAL BALL, MSNBC HOST, THE CYCLE: Thanks for having us here.

SHARPTON: Congressman, let me start with you. The president,
offering an honest assessment of the problems with the law while Boehner
calls for total repeal.

Let me give this to you, Krystal. Are these guys serious? He`s
giving an assessment of the law. They`re saying repeal, repeal.

BALL: Yes. And that what they`ve been about that from the beginning
which they know, I mean, cynically, they know that they can`t repeal it
because the Democrats hold the Senate. The president is in the White House
waiting to veto it. But it`s the thing that feeds their base. So, they
keep saying repeal.

And the part this is really cynical and the parts of the Republicans
have never addressed, is let`s say they did magically get their wish and
this law was repealed. What are they going to do about the millions of
Americans that don`t have health insurance? And that`s what they`ve never
answered. So, they have all this faux concern for the people whose rates
are going up or who are getting cancellation notices with absolutely no
concern for people who are deny coverage because of pre-existing conditions
or people who has coverage or think they have coverage. But when they
actually get sick find out they didn`t have the coverage that they have.

SHARPTON: That is what is the most outrageous to me, Congressman.
We`re not talking about the president`s plan versus their plan. We`re
talking about the president`s plan versus their repealing the president`s
plan. They have no plan. They have no alternative way to help the people
who need health insurance.

REP. CHAKA FATTAH (D), PENNSYLVANIA: Look, when the president won re-
election, the question about any repeal of this program was settled then.
What you have is a gigantic lie being told to the American people that
they`re going to somehow repeal this program. It`s not going to be
repealed. What they`re doing is raising money and getting their base
excited. But it has no relevance in the truth.

There`s not going to be any repeal. The U.S. Senate is not going to
repeal it. We just went through a government shutdown, and you know what?
There`s no reason to repeal it because I`m proud to be on a team in which a
half a million people have gotten health insurance that didn`t have it a
month ago. And I`m happy to be on a team in which 50 million Americans who
could be denied because of a pre-existing condition can`t be denied. And
you went through the numbers on seniors who`ve saved $7 billion. And I
could go through the laundry list of others who have benefitted. This is a
program that`s being put in place brick by brick over the last two years
and almost every American has benefitted by it.

SHARPTON: And those are the same people, Congressman, that were not
serviced. So, I think we`ve got to keep emphasizing these a people that
had no health care, had no way in, and they`re finally being included while
people are talking about no, you`re just collateral damage for our
political fight with the president.

FATTAH: And it`s phony to suggest some sympathy for someone who has
been losing their insurance and ignore the 40 million who didn`t have
insurance. You can`t really say that you`re emphasizing with people who
don`t have health insurance if you`re willing to ignore these people. And
I put out a report today from Harvard University that showed 45 million
Americans, 2007, before Obamacare without health insurance. And 45,000 un-
needed deaths a year in our country without this-

SHARPTON: 45,000 un-needed deaths?

FATTAH: Absolutely.

BALL: Wow.

SHARPTON: And now, Krystal, let me roll this -- these figures at you.
Because the right wing loves to point out how many people signed up for the
insurance plans with the low numbers. But let`s remember what happened in
Massachusetts with Romney care. He was their candidate last year.

BALL: I`ve heard of him.

SHARPTON: Right. When he was governor of Massachusetts, he had
Romney care. Only 123 people signed up in the first month of the
Massachusetts health care law, 123. That`s all that signed up or just 0.3
percent of the total who signed up by the end.

BALL: Right.

SHARPTON: Twenty percent signed up in the last month of enrollment.
So just look what happened with Romney care. The potential head of their
party last year, we had less than one percent in the first month, 0.3
percent to be exact. And in the last month, 20 percent because as it gets
closer to the due date, that`s when people make a rush. It`s almost like
Christmas shopping.

BALL: Exactly. Yes.

SHARPTON: So it takes time and there`s a demand. We see a similar
trend nationally.

BALL: We do. And, you know, we all have to be frustrated with the
Web site problems. And I`m sure there were some missed opportunities
there, but in terms of being on track for this law to work and for people
to sign up by the date they need to sign up, we are still on track to be
able to make things work.

And even beyond the enrollment numbers, you know, Boehner keeps saying
I guess the line from the Republicans is, this a train wreck. Well, we`ve
seen this law work in action in Massachusetts. So we know that the law can
work. Not to say there aren`t going to be bumps along the way, but it is a
well-crafted law. What we`re seeing of the actual policy putting the
messaging and putting the Web site aside, the actual policy seems to be
working quite well, and working as intended. So those are reasons to be

SHARPTON: Now, Congressman, the de facto leader of the Republican
Party, Rush Limbaugh, revealed to me what this is really all about. Listen
to this.


RUSH LIMBAUGH, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: The Republicans need to be
pushing for total repeal and they should settle for nothing that helps fix
this. They do not -- they should not -- I can`t understand even why they
would want to be seen as being part of the fix.


SHARPTON: Why would they want to be part of the fix? Millions of
people need it. Why would they want to part of the fix? Don`t do anything
to help fix this. This is really just a game to them, isn`t it,

FATTAH: Look, you`ve got two teams. It is almost like a football
game on Sunday, right? One team is fighting to get Americans health care
coverage. The other team`s fighting against them getting health care
coverage. And this shouldn`t be any question about what the people in the
stands are rooting for. We should be wanting to live in a country where
every single person can have health care coverage. That is the country
we`ve been fighting for 100 years and now we have through one month. And
in that one month, we`ve seen a half a million more on the rolls. And if
that was your church, Reverend, would be a 100 more -- 500,000 more people
sign up for the roles, that would be a good month.

SHARPTON: That would worth an amen in my church.

You know, Krystal, Ted Cruz who really led the charge to shut down the
government in an effort to defund health care, he was on FOX News with
Chris Wallace. And to show you just how political and to me insensitive
these guys are, Chris Wallace said to him with all of the criticism he had,
even Republicans was feeding him things was it worth it? Listen to this.


CHRIS WALLACE, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: I literally had top Republicans
unsolicited offering me research and questions to confront you because they
were upset can you. Simple question. Was it worth it?

CRUZ: Absolutely.


BALL: Wow.

SHARPTON: I mean, absolutely. He shut down the government, didn`t
get the health care law repealed, caused bedlam for 800,000 federal
workers. And it`s worth it?

BALL: And threaten the nation with the first-ever default and he
still thinks this is great.

SHARPTON: I`ll leave the public to judge it for themselves.

Congressman Chaka Fattah, I`m going to have to leave it there.
Krystal Ball, thank you both for your time.

FATTAH: Thanks.

BALL: Thanks, Rev.

SHARPTON: Be sure to catch Krystal on "the Cycle" week days at 3:00
p.m. eastern right here on MSNBC.

Coming up, the GOP refuses raise the minimum wage. Heck, many of them
don`t want any minimum wage at all. But now the Democrats have a plan to
raise the pressure.

Plus, impeachment insanity. Republicans are obsessed with smearing
attorney general Eric Holder. Today they`re trying to impeach. We`ll
answer back tonight.

And get out our paper and pencils. It`s fact check time. We`ll look
at the newest right wing conspiracy. It`s a doozy.

And friend or foe, I want to know. "Reply Al" is ahead.


SHARPTON: Have you joined the "Politics Nation" conversation on
facebook yet? We hope you will. Today everyone has been talking about the
new GOP plan to impeach attorney general Eric Holder.

Elizabeth says, he`s hitting too close to home so he must be doing his

Wayne says, it might seem senseless to attack the attorney general
with ridiculous charges, but the more of his time that they waste, the less
time he has to go after voter suppression and gerrymandering.

Lareta says, this is all they have to do until 2016. Anything to
obstruct President Obama and American progress.

She`s right. And we`re not letting them get away with it.

Coming up, I`ll be joined by a lawmaker who`s calling them out for
their political attacks. We want to hear from and what you think too.
Please head over to facebook and SEARCH "Politics Nation" and like us to
join the conversation that keeps going long after the show ends.



OBAMA: That`s what all these tough decisions are about reversing the
forces that have hurt the middle class for a long, long time. And building
an economy where everybody if you work hard, you can get ahead. I didn`t
run for president to go back to where we were. I want us to go forward. I
want us to go towards the future. I want us to get to where we need to be.


SHARPTON: The fight for economic fairness has been at the heart of
the Obama presidency. And it`s an issue that he and Democrats plan to
hammer the GOP with in the coming months. Today, we learn Democrats are
going to make the battle to raise the minimum wage central to the 2014
election. And why shouldn`t they? It`s a winning proposal for millions of
Americans struggling to get by and it`s a winner politically too.

Ninety-one percent of Democrats support raising the minimum wage. So
do 76 percent of independents. And yes, even 58 percent of Republicans
support it. But what about GOP lawmakers?


raising minimum wage doesn`t actually accomplish those goals.

BOEHNER: A lot of people who are being paid the minimum wage are
being paid that because they come to the workforce with no skills.


SHARPTON: Easy for you to say, Speaker Boehner. He`s worth as much
as $5.5 million. That sure makes it easy to oppose a $10 minimum wage.
And Mr. Paul Ryan, Mr. Kill the safety net, yes, he`s worth up to 8.4
million dollars. No wonder he doesn`t care about raising the minimum wage.
How does the GOP plan to spend that? The truth is they can`t. And
Democrats and the president are all ready to attack this on the basis of

Joining me now is Democrat from New York, Congressman Steve Israel.
He chairs the Democratic congressional campaign committee.

Congressman, it`s your job to help Democrats get elected. How
important will the minimum wage issue be for your candidates?

REP. STEVE ISRAEL (D), NEW YORK: Well, thank you for having me on.

And the answer to your question is it`s going to be critically
important. There`s a choice to be made in every election. And so people
can choose Republicans who are willing to spend $40 billion every ten years
to enrich the richest oil companies on earth. Or they can choose to elect
Democrats who are going to increase the minimum wage. The last time it was
increased was in 2007. It`s $7.25 an hour. That means that equates to
about $15,000 a year which is $3,000 less than the poverty level, Reverend.
It is not a minimum wage. It is a poverty wage.

SHARPTON: Now, the last time it was raised in 2007, which was right
after the 2006 midterm elections in which the Democrats ran on raising the
minimum wage and you picked up 30 seats. Not only is it the right thing to
do, it was politically wise. You picked up 30 seats and then went ahead
and raised the minimum wage in 2007.

ISRAEL: Well, that`s right. You know, when good -- it is good
politics and it`s good policy, just pass it. Unfortunately, we have a
House Republican in caucus right now that is all about politics,
obstruction and inflicting harm on the economy. And even when the policy
is clear, they`re going to obstruct it, if it hurts working families and
middle class families.

SHARPTON: I think good policy is good politics. But, you know, it`s
not only where you have, in my opinion, bad policy. They`re demonizing the
poor, denigrating people for being less than fortunate. Listen,
Congressman, to right wing pundits and politicians as they routinely use
lines like this. Listen to this.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I got news for you. In other countries, they`re
not washing their clothes and sit in an air conditioning watching their big
screen TV. They`re dying. That is poor.

REP. MICHELE BACHMANN (R), MINNESOTA: Self-reliance means if anyone
will not work, neither should he eat.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Look at the poverty in this country. Everybody
out of work is eating. They`ve got big screen TV, probably have a car,
probably have a cell phone.

RYAN: We don`t want to turn this safety net into a hammock that
allows able-bodied people into the lives of complacency.

BILL O`REILLY, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: My contention is that the Obama
Administration is encouraging parasites to come out and, you know, take as
much as they can with no remorse.


SHARPTON: I mean, I don`t know what kind of people they know, but for
people to be unfortunately in an economic situation of need, for them to be
poor, for them to be in the working poor makes them all of these names? I
mean, this is grotesque.

ISRAEL: Well, it is. And what you just heard, that these guys were
all member of the clueless caucus. They are so out of touch. They have no
idea what it`s like to be struggling in this country. And which is exactly
why we need to increase the minimum wage.

Reverend, let me just give you another example of how hypocritical and
how cruel they can be. They passed a farm bill that initially stripped out
all funding for food stamps, then cut $40 billion. But 11 of them, 11
Republican members of Congress who tried to strip food stamps out of the
farm bill got a check from the federal government. One member of Congress
got a $3 million check from the federal government in the form of subsidies
because they own or co-own a farm. So the level of hypocrisy is stunning
and it is hurting our economy.

SHARPTON: Wait a minute. Let me go through that slow. Eleven
Republicans got government checks while they were voting to end food
stamps. One got $3 million. I just want to repeat that. Somebody might
have been getting their food out of the microwave. People need to hear
this. Are you serious?

ISRAEL: I am absolutely serious. One member of Congress who gave a
sanctimonious speech on the floor about how the Lord helps those who help
themselves helped himself to a $3 million subsidy from the federal
government because he co-owns a farm, while at the same time voting to
eliminate food stamps for the poor in that farm bill. So these people, you
know, they say they`re against spending. No, they`re all for spending as
long as it helps them, the rich, their special interest friends, and oil
companies. They`re against spending and investments when it helps the
poor. By the way, those investments help everybody. If we were to
increase the minimum wage, it would increase gross domestic product by $33

SHARPTON: Congressman, this is incredible stuff and we`re going to be
following it closely.

Congressman Steve Israel, thank you for coming on the show.

ISRAEL: Thank you, Reverend.

SHARPTON: Coming up, the GOP obsession with attorney general Eric
Holder. I`m taking down their latest scheme tonight.

And governor ultrasound says he`s never abused his position. Oh, yes,
we got him next.


SHARPTON: Let the farewell tour for governor ultrasound begin. Bob
McDonnell, the scandal ridden Republican governor of Virginia is nearing
the end of his term. But suddenly he`s trying to rewrite history.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE REPORTER: Do you agree that it looks like you
abused the position?

GOV. BOB MCDONNELL, VIRGINIA: No, absolutely not. I have never.


SHARPTON: Never? As in never ever? I`m pretty sure you`re under
investigation for accepting gifts and money from this guy. A CEO and
campaign donor. And you didn`t disclose it. The gifts included $15,000
for catering at your daughter`s wedding, the use of a Ferrari, a $6500
engraved Rolex watch, and $15,000 worth of clothing for your wife, all
totaling more than $160,000 in gifts and money.

And then there was those spending records showing the governor charged
the state for personal items like dog vitamins and body wash. And who can
forget a digestive system detox cleanse. But governor McDonnell denies
breaking any laws. And after this was revealed, he returned the gifts and
pay it back the so-called loans. But he`s about to leave the governor`s
mansion and he`s getting a little sentimental.


MCDONNELL: I love the people of Virginia. I love this office.


SHARPTON: He loves the people of Virginia? He sure has a funny way
of showing it. I mean, nothing says love like forcing women to have
invasive ultrasounds before having a legal abortion even though a majority
of Virginians oppose the law. I guess love means never having to say
you`re sorry. So let me ask you again, Governor, did you abuse your


MCDONNELL: No, absolutely not. I have never.


SHARPTON: Governor Ultrasound, did you think we wouldn`t notice your
invasive answer? Nice try, but we -- here`s a gift from us to you, because
we got you.


SHARPTON: Just what is the Republicans` problem with Attorney General
Eric Holder? Again and again, we`ve seen him treated rudely and roughly
and unfairly. And now a group of right wing Republicans have gone a step
farther. Impeachment. Actually trying to kick him out of office. Today
20 right wingers introduced articles of impeachment against Holder.

Including several die hard birthers. The bill says, the Attorney
General didn`t comply with Congressional investigation into operation Fast
and Furious. That he`s refusing to enforce certain laws including the
Defense of Marriage Act. And that he won`t prosecute individuals involved
in the IRS scandal. Right. Same old lines we`ve heard before. But the
truth is, these right wingers have been on a rampage against Attorney
General Holder for years. Showing a stunning lack of respect for him and
for his office.


REP. RAUL LABRADOR (R), IDAHO: You either lied or you were grossly
incompetent in your actions.

REP. TIM WALBERG (R), MICHIGAN: You`re well known in this town for
not reading memos.

REP. ANN MARIE BUERKLE (R), NEW YORK: How many more border patrol
agents would have had to die as part of operation Fast and Furious for you
to take responsibility?


SHARPTON: And it doesn`t stop there. Republicans have even attacked
him for doing his job.


SEN. JOHN CORNYN (R), TEXAS: You won`t cooperate with the legitimate
Congressional investigation and you won`t hold anyone including yourself
accountable. Your department blocked states from implementing attempts to
combat voter fraud.


SHARPTON: The Attorney General defends voting rights, so he should be
run out of office? How sick is that? For his part the Attorney General
knows what this really all about. A couple years ago, he told "The New
York Times," quote, "This is a way to get at the president because of the
way I can be identified with him. Both due to the nature of our
relationship and the fact that we`re both African-American."

Joining me now are Congressman Adam Schiff, democrat from California
and MSNBC contributor Goldie Taylor. Thanks for both of you being here



SHARPTON: Congressman, what`s behind this witch hunt against the
Attorney General?

SCHIFF: Well, Al, I think you put your finger on it. This is a
stunning lack of respect for not only for the Attorney General but his
office. And I go beyond that and say, it`s a stunning lack of respect for
the constitution itself to even contemplate such an abuse of the
impeachment power which is rarely used, judiciously used. There`s a very
high bar on the constitution. And it is ludicrous to suggest that
impeachment is warranted, for example, where the Attorney General refused
to enforce a law DOMA which the Attorney General believed to be
unconstitutional and which the Supreme Court found to be unconstitutional.

SHARPTON: Let me stop you right there. Because I think it`s very
important for the American people to understand this. You have been
involved in impeachment proceedings as a member of Congress in terms of a
judge, I think, in 2010. You were involved. So you know where the bar is
for impeachment. And the bar has nothing to do with these almost ludicrous
charges that they`re raising. Don`t come anywhere near the bar of
impeachment. Congressman, am I correct?

SCHIFF: Reverend, you`re absolutely correct. And, you know, we had a
couple impeachments within the last decade. Two federal judges. Both
impeachment proceedings the prosecutions I helped co-chair. And the bar is
very high. It`s done that way deliberately because we don`t want
impeachment to become just another partisan tool in the tool box. But
that`s exactly what these members want to do. They want to tear down this
attorney general, they want to tear down this president. And they`re
willing to do anything including ignoring the provisions of the
constitution which they claim to want to uphold by abusing the impeachment
power this way.

It is -- it would be laughable if it weren`t so destructive. And I
think what they don`t realize is, these ridiculous allegations won`t harm
the Attorney General or his office, but they will harm the Congress itself
by undermining the seriousness that we ought to give to that rare authority
the use of impeachment.

SHARPTON: You know, Goldie, let me show you what the President and
Attorney General have been fighting for since he took office. Watch this.



ERIC HOLDER, U.S. ATTORNEY GENERAL: We must take action to combat the
gun violence that devastates too many lives and communities every day.
Today a vicious cycle of poverty, criminality, and incarceration traps too
many Americans and weakens too many communities. This isn`t just
unacceptable, it is shameful, it is --


The 1965 voting rights act is the signature achievement, I think, of
the civil rights movement. And I`m bound and determined not to let that be
unraveled while I`m attorney general.


SHARPTON: Is this obsession with Attorney General Holder based on the
fact that he stands for laws that they want to see overturned and in many
cases never want to see in the books? He stands for causes that they
disagree with. And because to attack him is to attack President Obama and
there`s some racial elements involved in this, Goldie.

TAYLOR: Well, I think you Reverend Sharpton and Attorney General
Holder are right about that. That they are attacking him because of his
proximity to the president. He is in fact the president wing man. And so,
they are extraordinary close, they both happen to be African-American as
well. But it goes even further than that. This is about codifying or
putting their crazy down into a document, so they can feed it back to their
base. They can raise money, they can get people out to the polls in 2014
to say, look here.

We took on Eric Holder over Fast and Furious. We told him it was
wrong. We took him on over Benghazi. We took him on, you know, over DOMA
and other things that we told you we would fight for you for. So what this
is about is about fanning the flames of hatred and bigotry and pushing
people to the polls on their behalf. And so the problem with that is it
keeps your base incredibly small. And so the necessity of reaching out and
broadening that base in order to win national election, that gets lost in
the mush. But I`m not sure that any of the people that belong to what I
call the bozo caucus, I`m not sure they really care about that.

SHARPTON: You know, Congressman, I think that it is clear that this
obsession has many motives. I think that one of the things that is
problematic is the more that the Attorney General and his office has to
deal with all of this, the less time they have to fight gun violence and
other things. But I also hate to think -- and I`ve been an activist all my
life and I believe in what I believe in, but do we -- have we come so to
the point in this country where we would denigrate an office and bring down
the stature of the chief law enforcement office in this country to make
some cheap political points and to raise some money from a narrow base? I
mean, there ought to be some things we all respect and regard because the
office may be held by people that agree with us one day.

SCHIFF: Well, that`s absolutely right. And you know, I would give
this little thought except for the fact that this is the same group of
people that went through with the utterly destructive and unwarranted
contempt process a few years ago.


SCHIFF: I never would have thought they would have actually go to
that extraordinarily absurd length, but they did. So you can`t exclude
anything here. And I would like to see the speaker in a more rational
leadership within the GOP condemn this, but they haven`t been willing to.
And I think Goldie is exactly right. This is a way for these members and
others to throw some meat to their base. And whether they tear down the
office of Attorney General or not, they really don`t care. It`s also I
think is quite correct as you point out, they don`t like what this attorney
general is doing.

They don`t want to see these laws, these restrictive voting laws
struck down. They don`t want to see the policies he`s trying to promulgate
in terms of some of the unfairness and inequality and disproportionate
impact of our sentencing policies changed. They like the status quo or
they want to roll us back to a prior age. And it`s no surprise, I guess,
that they would try an impeachment of a cabinet official. Something we
haven`t had since the 1870s, since they like that period of American
history better than the president.

SHARPTON: Well, it`s that period of history that they seem to like,
Goldie, that may be the reason for this obsession. You have to say
obsession from contempt to this on the same stuff that doesn`t reach
anywhere near the bar. Not even in the same ballpark of an impeachment

TAYLOR: It`s not even close, but let`s play this out. Let`s just say
that Speaker Boehner lets this come to the floor of the House and at the
House votes in favor of an impeachment. This then has to go to the
democratically controlled U.S. Senate.


TAYLOR: And if you think for one moment that the Harry Reid Senate is
going to convict and impeach this for Secretary Holder, then you`ve got
another thing coming.

SHARPTON: Thanks to General Holder for doing his job.

TAYLOR: For doing his job.

SHARPTON: Congressman Schiff and Goldie Taylor, thank you both for
your time tonight.

SCHIFF: Thank you.

TAYLOR: Thank you.

SHARPTON: Ahead, did you know ObamaCare creates a secret private
army? Or that it lets Obama take away your guns? Yes. Neither did I.
We`ll expose the new ObamaCare lies.

And my meeting with Oprah. She asked all the questions and it was a
lot of fun. Stay with us.


SHARPTON: Republicans have been lying about the Affordable Care Act
for years. Remember death panels?


SARAH PALIN (R), FORMER ALASKA GOVERNOR: One aspect of it is the
death panels. Who will be worthy of receiving the health care that
government is going to provide? So that is the death panel.

RUSH LIMBAUGH, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: Death panels. This is how
they`re going to manifest themselves.

REP. LOUIE GOHMERT (R), TEXAS: The nationalization of health care
that is going to absolutely kill senior citizens, they`ll put them on lists
and force them to die early.

SEN. CHUCK GRASSLEY (R), IOWA: We should not have a government
program that determines you`re going to pull the plug on grandma.


SHARPTON: Pull the plug on grandma? Well, I think grandma is doing
just fine. But since then the conspiracy theories have gotten even worse.
This week, GOP Congressman Louie Gohmert has said he thinks the law creates
some sort of private army for the president.


GOHMERT: It provides in ObamaCare that this commission and non-
commissioned officer corps will be trained. But I want to know, are they
using weapons to train or that being taught to use syringes?


SHARPTON: An ObamaCare officer corps armed with weapons of syringes.
Sounds scary. But that`s not all. Michele Bachmann thinks the law creates
a secret data base the IRS will use to deny you health care.


REP. MICHELE BACHMANN (R), MINNESOTA: There`s a huge and national
data base that`s being created right now. The IRS is in charge of that
data base, so the IRS will have the ability potentially will they, to deny
health care.


SHARPTON: And Rand Paul, his word the president will use doctors to
take away your guns.


REP. RAND PAUL (R), KENTUCKY: He`s doing to use ObamaCare apparently
to have doctors informing on their patients whether or not they have guns.
I fear that the time will come when this data will be misused.


SHARPTON: These conspiracies theories -- deepened the old archives.
They come from this year, 2013. Republicans will continue pushing lie
after lie to stop and try this law. Because they have no alternative. And
that goes for President Obama`s entire agenda. They have no alternatives.
Republicans are for nothing. They`re against everything. And they`ll say
anything to try and stop this president.

Joining me now are Bill Press and Ryan Grim. Thank you both for being


SHARPTON: Bill, are all these lies about ObamaCare just a smoke
screen to hide the fact that Republicans don`t have any real ideas of their

PRESS: But first of all, I can`t believe that line of lunatics you
just showed Reverend Al. But we deal with them every day. But the biggest
lie of all we still hear, I heard it from John Boehner today that this is
government-run insurance. This is a total collection of different private
plans that people can buy.


PRESS: So, yes, they have no alternative. Yes, the only way they can
-- they think they can kill this plan is to lie about it. And what they`re
really afraid of is going to succeed and ObamaCare will join Social
Security and Medicare as one of the three legs of the stool that all
Americans depend on. That`s what they don`t want to happen.

SHARPTON: You know, Ryan, today Speaker Boehner talking about
ObamaCare says this. Listen to this.


REP. JOHN BOEHNER (R-OH), HOUSE SPEAKER: Let`s be clear. The only
way to fully protect the American people is to scrap this law once and for
all. There is no way to fix this.


SHARPTON: Scrap it. I mean, doesn`t that pretty much sum up the
GOP`s entire agenda in Congress? Just scrap it.

RYAN GRIM, THE HUFFINGTON POST: Right. And then what do you have?
You know, you go back to a system where you have, you know, 50 million
people who are uninsured. You know, if you look back at his language, the
only way to protect the American people. You know, what is protective
about 50 million people, you know, that one in six people in this country
not having health insurance? You know, it`s just a bizarre way to look at
the world.

And it underscores that, you know, the main problem that Republicans
have in the health care debate is that there`s nothing that fits within the
kind of conservative ideology that could solve the problem. It just does
not exist, because you can`t have widespread poverty and also a free market
for health care, because if people don`t have any money to pay for health
care and they suffer, you know, the dramatic consequences of cancer or
something else, there`s nothing they can do. So the Republicans just don`t
have a plan.

SHARPTON: You know, Bill, there is a political method to this
political madness. And I think Congressman Pete Sessions really kind of
let the top priority of the bag. Listen to this. It says everything we --
I`m reading the quote. Listen. "Everything we do in this body should be
about messaging to win back the Senate. That`s it." So they`re just
really throwing all kind of outrageous, outlandish stuff around because
they`re trying to frame and message and really play on the emotions of
their base and the public to try to take the Senate back next year.

PRESS: You know, Reverend, I`m glad you played that quote -- or read
that quote. Because I talked about it last couple of days ago on my show.
I think most people missed that quote and a very, very telling. It shows
what the entire agenda is. And of course it is echoes of Mitch McConnell,
right, 2009, who said our number one priority in the United States Senate
is to deny President Obama a second term. Now that he`s got a second term,
their number one agenda, Pete Sessions puts it right there, right? Is to
deny President Obama everything. It`s all political all the time.

SHARPTON: Now, and they`re well financed, Ryan, because if you look
at spending by the Koch Brothers-backed Americans for prosperity group,
$122 million spent in the 2012 election. That`s an all-time record for the
group. Now, when we look at this kind of money, backing things that anyone
knows is obviously ludicrous, you know this is about political power
against this president and it`s scary.

GRIM: I mean, it`s just an astounding amount of money. And you know,
that`s just what we`re learning about. You know, there are a lot of other
ways that the Kochs spend money to influence policy. And, you know,
remember where this money comes from. This is a private company engaged in
the fossil fuel industry. And so, you know, and they have decided that
they`re going to have as much say as they can in the political process.
And therefore because of the system we have, you know, fossil fuels have
this insane amount of extra leverage in our system.

SHARPTON: And, Bill, I think that we must really understand the
American public must understand what`s going on. We can laugh at these
kind of conspiracy theories, but if they`re back with this kind of money
and you keep drumming it in people`s heads, some of it will stick by people
who innocently just want to protect themselves and their families.

PRESS: Like helicopters Reverend, this is it. All over again. Never
goes away.

SHARPTON: Ryan Grim, Bill Press, I`m going to let it go on that line,
Bill. Thanks for your time tonight.

PRESS: My pleasure.

SHARPTON: Coming up, my meeting with Oprah. That`s ahead.

My meeting with Oprah. So what does she ask me? I`ll tell you, next.


SHARPTON: Finally tonight, one of the most exciting and greatest
things about my new book "The Rejected Stone," it`s going out all over the
country and talking to Americans. I`ve been interviewed by a lot of people
now, including Oprah. It was a comprehensive interview and in true Oprah
fashion, she asked all the questions.


OPRAH WINFREY, TALK SHOW HOST: When did you know or feel that you had
the calling to be a preacher?

SHARPTON: I was four. There was a junior usher board, and we were
having our anniversary. And the lady that was the senior adviser, his name
was Hazell Griffin (ph), I still remember it. And she sat us all down,
about 30 others, and said, what do you all want to do on program? And I
said, preach. All the kids were laughing. I said, I want to preach. She
said don`t laugh. She took me to the bishop. And he said, well, I started
preaching as a kid. And they let me preach. In an anniversary, about 900
people there and they stood me on a box. And I preached from St. Johns at
14th Chapel. First verse. Let not your heart be trouble. And I`ve been
preaching ever since.


SHARPTON: You can watch the full interview on the OWN Network, Oprah
Winfrey`s network this Sunday at 9:00 p.m. Eastern and at 5:00 p.m.
Pacific., 9:00 p.m. Pacific as well. I`m still preaching on a box. I
still believe in my calling, but the main thing is you find your calling.
And no matter how marginalized and rejected you have been and may think you
still are, you can still come out and be what you want to be. Rejected
stones become corner stones if you have faith and belief in yourself and
what you`re about. That`s what we`re all about in this country. And
that`s what we have to make America be for everybody.

Thanks for watching. I`m Al Sharpton. "HARDBALL" starts right now.


RESERVED. Transcription Copyright 2013 ASC LLC ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. No
license is granted to the user of this material other than for research.
User may not reproduce or redistribute the material except for user`s
personal or internal use and, in such case, only one copy may be printed,
nor shall user use any material for commercial purposes or in any fashion
that may infringe upon MSNBC and ASC LLC`s copyright or other proprietary
rights or interests in the material. This is not a legal transcript for
purposes of litigation.>