IE 11 is not supported. For an optimal experience visit our site on another browser.

PoliticsNation, Friday, November 22nd, 2013

Read the transcript from the Friday show

November 22, 2013
Guest: Susan Milligan; Emanuel Cleaver, Jonathan Capehart, Goldie Taylor,
Patricia Murphy, Joe Madison

REV. AL SHARPTON, POLITICS NATION HOST: Good evening, Ed. And thanks
to you for tuning in. Tonight`s lead, standing up to the bully. For the
past five years, the GOP has denied this president`s legitimacy. They
didn`t know the mandate of the past two presidential elections dismissed
the idea of compromise. But now, the president and Democrats are saying
enough is enough. They made the bold decision to scale back Senate rules
that Republicans have used to block the president`s nominees. And would
you believe it? The GOP, the same obstructionist party that ended
political civility in this country, is now whining.


SEN. RAND PAUL, (R) KENTUCKY: I mean now we`ve got a big bully.
Harry Reid says he just going to break the rules and make new rules.
Basically, he`s become the dictator of the Senate.


SHARPTON: Senator Paul doesn`t like bullies. This is the man who
called President Obama, "un-American" and who compared the president`s rise
to that of Hitler but his feelings are hurt. And so are Senator


games, set yet another precedent that you will doubt come to regret, say to
my friends on the other side of the aisle, you`ll regret this and you may
regret it a lot sooner than you think.


SHARPTON: Democrats will regret this? This from the man who proudly
declared that he wanted to make President Obama a one-term president? And
how about this?


SEN. LAMAR ALEXANDER (R), TENNESSEE: This action today creates a
perpetual opportunity for the tyranny of the majority because it permits a
majority in this body to do whatever it wants do, any time it wants to do


SHARPTON: A tyranny? Really?

Just last month Senator Alexander voted to block this man, Congressman
Mel Watt, from a position with the federal housing finance agency. He
became the first sitting member of Congress to be successfully filibustered
since before the civil war. And yet Senator Alexander has a problem with

Here`s what Republicans really don`t like. By invoking this option,
the president will be able to get things done. Just look at this.

Right now there are eight judges on the powerful D.C. circuit court.
Four Democrats, four Republicans and three sets are open. With that split
in power, the court has overturned the president`s regulation on financial
reform on recess appointments.

Most recently, a panel on the court struck down Obamacare`s
contraception mandate. But with yesterday`s decision, this court become 7-
4 Democratic, one of the biggest road blocks to the president`s agenda will
be gone.

Growing up in Brooklyn, I learned one thing, you have to stand up to
the neighborhood bully. President Obama and the Democrats have done just

Joining me now are Melissa Harris-Perry and Susan Milligan. Thank you
both for coming on the show.



SHARPTON: Melissa, let me start with you.


SHARPTON: Are Republicans angry about this change because they`ve
lost a tool to obstruct the president?

HARRIS-PERRY: I mean, I think that`s right. I do think that members
of the U.S. Senate take very seriously these rules. They see themselves in
this 100-person, you know, body as sort of these gentlemen who do work this

But what we can see just empirically, is that this Senate and its
behavior towards this president is unprecedented. There is not any other
time in the American history when the president hasn`t been able to fill,
not in this case, even Supreme Court decisions. But just the people who
work for him, right, it is a basic assumption that a president ought to be
able to hire his own appointees. And they have made it impossible for that
to happen.

So, I do think part of it is just some outrage that rules have
changed. But for the most part, I think it`s because they recognize that
at least in the short-term it`ll make it impossible to continue to block
these low-level appointments.

SHARPTON: Susan, at one level, you want to say, as Melissa has, that
some of them are so respectful of the Senate procedures and customs and
traditions. But they made a perversion out of them using them in all kinds
of ways, extending it way beyond the boundaries they have that it is
against anybody`s procedure that we`ve seen the last 150 years, to block a
sitting member of Congress or to not have the president pick his judicial
choices. So many ways, they themselves had began disrespecting Senate
procedure and tradition. Now, they want to be selective on which ones the
president and the democrat should uphold when they`ve already tore down a
lot of them?

MILLIGAN: Yes. Well, you know, look, when the vote was over -- and
by the way, it was a somber vote. It was, really, nobody was happy about
this. And senator McCain who I truly believe is very much is very much an
institutionalist (ph) and respects the institution. But he came out and
said I`m not angry, I`m just very sad. And at first, I felt sad too
because it seemed like a part of the old Senate had died. But out of the
reality is, that part of the old Senate died a long time ago. And it died
when they stopped using the filibuster just as a rare thing to sort of keep
the majority in check and to reject appointees who might be incompetent or

They started to use and the Democrats did, as well, because they
thought somebody was too extreme and that, of course, in the eye of the
beholder. But then, it got to the point where they would just filibuster
somebody because it`s not the person they would have picked. That`s not
your choice, you`re not president. I get that they don`t like this
president. I get they don`t like this presidency. But he was elected, he
gets to pick his cabinet.

SHARPTON: And it has consequences, you know.

And I`m n saying that we should click our heels in the air, but look
at the fact we can get things done now, Melissa. I mean, with the GOP,
aren`t they angry because the filibuster change will boost the president`s
agenda? There are currently 93 judicial vacancies that he`ll now be able
to fill. I mean, how important is this filling judicial vacancies given
the political and legal obstruction against his policy?

HARRIS-PERRY: So, actually, I think this is more important than the
question of the president`s agenda. In other words, the House of
Representatives is so obstructionist right now, still in GOP control that
it may not do much to get President Obama`s policy agenda through. But
here is what it will do.

It will impact President Obama`s legacy. There is nothing more
important that a president does in terms of things that go on long after
him than those federal judicial appointments. And particularly that D.C.
court which is the feeder court for the Supreme Court of the United States
whomever becomes president in 2016, Democrat or Republican, it will make an
enormous difference what those federal vacancies on the bench, how they are

This was the last opportunity for President Obama to have a meaningful
legacy left in the judiciary. And that was the thing these Republicans in
the Senate were most interested in obstructing.

SHARPTON: But Susan, not only his legacy, but the progress and the
moving forward for American people on policies that we could not move
because of the obstructionism, practice in a real, real hard way by the

MILLIGAN: Well, that`s true. Because some of the appointments that
have been held up were held up because the Republicans didn`t like the law
that person was going to be administering or supporting.

So, for example, Richard Cordray for the consumer board, he was held
up because they don`t like that board that was created under the financial
reform law. Other people have been held up because, you know, they`re
trying to get something on another issue.

Senator Graham has been holding up all appointments because he wants
information on Benghazi. I get that he wants that information. I get that
he wants those documents, but you can`t mix the two.

And also, what we`re doing, is why would anybody want to go into
public service anymore? Peter Diamond is a Nobel Prize winner in
economics. And he was filibustered to be on the fed board. Why would
anybody bother anymore? What kind of people are we going to get seeking

SHARPTON: And that`s my point. And it hurts the American people who
need that kind of talent. You know, Senator McConnell is outraged now,
Melissa. But he had a different feeling about the filibuster in 2005.
Then he said, quote, "regardless of party, any president`s judicial
nominees after full debate deserve a simple up and down vote."


SHARPTON: Now, there`s been hypocrisy on both sides because Democrats
have taken a different position. But Republicans say Democrats are
hypocritical too. But look at the obstruction under President Obama. It`s
been unprecedented.

In all of U.S. history, under all previous presidents, Melissa, a
total of 86 presidential nominees have been filibustered. But during the
past five years, Republicans have blocked 82 of President Obama`s nominees.
That`s nearly the same as all of the previous presidents combined.

HARRIS-PERRY: You cannot overemphasize this point. And I want to
connect it back to Susan`s earlier point. What that means is, here the
president is reelected, reelected by a strong majority of the American
people who are saying we want you to go back and govern.

SHARPTON: Correct.

HARRIS-PERRY: Now, to govern with, you know, all the problems of the
Republican House, but go back and govern. When this president calls people
around the country and says I want you to come and serve your country. I
want you to serve your country on this board or in this role or in this
level, people are going to say, well, of course not. Why would I put
myself in that position. And they can say that because they can look at a
track record that at this point is appalling.

I think the important thing here to know is -- I mean, the hypocrisy
thing, whatever. The point is that neither Democrats nor Republicans
wanted to change these rules. Democrats ended up changing these rules
because they felt there was no other option.

SHARPTON: Melissa Harris-Perry and Susan Milligan, thank you both for
coming on the show tonight.

MILLIGAN: Thank you so much.

SHARPTON: And be sure to catch Melissa Harris-Perry on "Melissa
Harris-Perry" weekends at 10:00 a.m. right here on MSNBC.

Coming up, Obamacare is working. Don`t believe me, just ask John
Boehner, big news from the speaker today.

Plus, the right wing championed George Zimmerman to push gun rights
and made him the pollster boy for stand your ground laws. Now, the people
that know him best say he acted like, quote, "a monster." Where`s the
right wing now?

And we`re learning more about why New Mexico police shot at a van with
five kids inside. We hear from the mom and a new tape you have to see


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Open the door! Open the door!


SHARPTON: My commentary on deadly force is ahead.

Stay with us.


SHARPTON: Conservatives champion George Zimmerman before and during
the Trayvon Martin trial.


SEAN HANNITY, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: Is there anything you regret? Do you
regret getting out o the car to follow Trayvon that night?



SHARPTON: No regrets. But this week, there`s silence from the right
wing. But why? That`s coming up.


SHARPTON: From day one, speaker John Boehner has been one of
Obamacare`s biggest critics. Take a look.


needs to be scrapped now. We want to repeal Obamacare. And a dire
position is very clear and the law`s a train wreck. It is a train wreck.
It has to go.


SHARPTON: Tough talk. But guess what, tonight he`s covered. That`s
right. John Boehner is now enrolled in Obamacare. He signed up yesterday
as required by the law. Congratulations, Speaker Boehner, you have reason
to smile. You`re now one of millions of Americans who are benefiting from

He didn`t reveal what plan he got but Salon crunched the numbers to
produce a good guesstimate, a 64-year-old smoker, Boehner is said to smoke
two packs a day who lives in Washington earns $200,000 a year, he can get a
bronze Obamacare plan for $370 a month. That`s less than two percent of
his income.

Great news, Speaker Boehner, maybe you can share with some of your
fellow Republicans, like Congressman Darrell Issa who today kicked off his
anti-Obamacare road show with a hearing in North Carolina, or Governor Rick
Perry who said that expanding Medicaid under Obamacare would, quote, "be
like putting 1,000 more people on the titanic."

Extending health care to the poor is like a disaster that killed
innocent people? Really? Republicans are out of touch and need a reality

Joining me now is Congressman Emanuel Cleaver, a Democrat from

Thanks for your time tonight, Congressman.

REP. EMANUEL CLEAVER (D), MISSOURI: Yes, good to be with you,

SHARPTON: Now that Speaker Boehner is happily enrolled in Obamacare,
any chance he will have a change of heart a join you in trying to make the
law work better?

CLEAVER: No, I don`t think there`s any chance because I think the
Republicans have designed a pathway to retaining the House and winning the
Senate and maybe even the presidency ultimately by attacking Obamacare.
And they`re going to continue to do it even as they are all enrolling in it
with their families.

And they perhaps, you know, don`t understand or need to be reminded
that it is foolish to blow out a candle if you don`t have another candle
that`s brighter and bigger to eliminate the darkness. And they don`t have
a candle. That`s the problem. They don`t have a candle. They cannot
present light. And so, the only thing remaining is to attack, criticize.
And it`s always important to find out the purpose behind criticism because
it then reveals the legitimacy of criticism. And there`s nothing behind
this but politics.

SHARPTON: Now, Boehner`s not the only one signing up for Obamacare.
Look at these new numbers from California, 30,000 enrolled in October. But
nearly 50,000 signed up in less than three weeks of November. In fact, the
"Washington Post" reports, Congressman, there`s a November surge in
enrollment nationwide. Will Republicans admit that the law is gaining

CLEAVER: No, they won`t. And if you go back and look at the
predictions, we knew from the very beginning that it was going to be slow
enrollment. And if we had cooperation from all the governors and all the
cooperation from the members of the House and the Senate, there`s no
question that we can do quality health care, affordable health care for all
of the people in this country. And they`re not going to back up. I don`t
care how great the statistics look in California or in Missouri, any place
else, they`re not going to back up. As I said earlier, it`s about
politics, pure, undefiled politics.

SHARPTON: Now, you know, the other huge story this weekend is how
Obamacare is reducing the growth of health care spending. In the three
decades before Obamacare, spending rose by an average of 4.5 percent. In
the three years after Obamacare, spending rose just 1.3 percent. That`s
the best ever. The law is working. When will the right wingers admit
this, Congressman?

CLEAVER: Well, I was glad to see those new numbers about how the cost
is dropping. And almost any reasonable person would say, hey, we`re moving
in the right direction. But I don`t think -- I think reason has been
thrown out the window when it comes to the affordable care act, even though
it is really something that was picked up from the heritage foundation and

And so, this is really a Republican plan. And that`s why I`m confused
over all of the hatred. Anybody can criticize. No talent is required. No
vision is necessary. No deep thought is entailed. You just criticize.
And if you are legislatively lifeless, which is what we see right now with
the leadership in the House, then you`ve got to do something. So you just
talk and criticize.

SHARPTON: Congressman Cleaver, thanks for your time. Have a great

CLEAVER: You too, Rev. Thank you.

SHARPTON: Coming up, Rush Limbaugh`s latest vile comment trying to
attack Obamacare and the Democrats.

Plus, remember all those conservatives who were praising George
Zimmerman as a champion for gun rights and stand your ground laws? Why are
they totally silent now?

But first, on a day to remember President Kennedy, conservatives are
trying to rewrite history. That`s next.


SHARPTON: Today on the 50th anniversary of John F. Kennedy`s
assassination, we remember his legacy as a strong Democrat and a strong
liberal. But the right wing is distorting his record, trying to claim JFK
would be a conservative today.


GLENN BECK, RADIO SHOW HOST: If you could bring back the politician
that JFK was, he wouldn`t be accepted by the Republican Party because he
would be a tea party radical. He wouldn`t even recognize what this country
had become.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What if I told you he was more to the right than
the left likes to admit?

have been in terms foreign affairs conservative, and on domestic affairs,
as you say it, a tax cutter.

RUSH LIMBAUGH, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: He was not in any way a liberal
as you know liberals today.


SHARPTON: Actually, President Kennedy was exactly the kind of liberal
we see in America today. The right wing has it all wrong. For example, on
taxes, President Kennedy proposed a 65 percent tax rate on the rich. That
would be laughable in today`s GOP. The top rate under President Bush was
35 percent. Got to protect those millionaires.

Modern day Republicans have voted repeatedly to gut Medicare. But
President Kennedy is the one who proposed the original version of Medicare
that passed after his death. Here`s what he said about it.


cooperation between a (INAUDIBLE) progressive citizen and a progressive
government is what has made this country great. What we are now talking
about in our children`s day will seem to be the ordinary business of


SHARPTON: Progressive government doesn`t sound too Republican to me.
And modern right wingers cheered when conservatives on the Supreme Court
gutted the voting rights act. The act that was a critical part of
Kennedy`s call for civil rights.


KENNEDY: It`ll be possible for American citizens of any color to
register and to vote in a free election without interference or fear of


SHARPTON: The truth is, President Kennedy embodied the best of
American liberalism. Those who say otherwise don`t understand his legacy
at all.

Nice try, but we got you.


SHARPTON: It`s been a damning week for conservatives who tried to
turn George Zimmerman into a right wing hero. Zimmerman was arrested on
Monday on charges he pointed a shotgun at his girlfriend. A claim he
denies. On Tuesday, the world saw him in handcuffs in a jump suit. Once
again facing a Florida judge. On Wednesday, a reporter revealed on this
show Zimmerman`s girlfriend said she was afraid of him, felt threatened and
said he was fascinated with guns. And on Thursday, Zimmerman`s estranged
wife spoke out doubting George`s actions on the night of the murder and had
her own story of fear.


something snapped in his spirit.

KATIE COURIC, ABC NEWS ANCHOR: And made him behave like what?

SHELLIE ZIMMERMAN: Like a monster.


SHARPTON: Like a monster. Far from what the right wing painted after
he killed Trayvon Martin and the months leading up to the trial. He was
treated with kid gloves in his prime time interview with Sean Hannity.


SEAN HANNITY, FOX NEWS HOST: Is there anything you regret? Do you
regret getting out of the car to follow Trayvon that night?


HANNITY: Do you regret you had a gun that night?


HANNITY: Do you feel you wouldn`t be here for this interview if you
didn`t have that gun?


HANNITY: Do you feel you would not be here?

GEORGE ZIMMERMAN: I feel that it was all God`s plan.


SHARPTON: And time and again Hannity would use his show to play
devil`s advocate for Zimmerman.


HANNITY: If this was some type of racially motivated killing and
George Zimmerman does not seem to fit the profile as somebody who mentored
minority children. A bounty on Zimmerman`s head. Bounty on George
Zimmerman`s head. There`s a bounty out on the head of George Zimmerman.
There`s been this rush to judgment by so many?


HANNITY: This idea that Zimmerman was being unfairly criticized by
the media was a major theme on the right.


MARK LEVIN, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: Who`s going to protect Zimmerman?
If Zimmerman is harmed, I blame the president of the United States.

UNIDENTIFIED MAN: A good citizen, George Zimmerman cared about his
neighborhood that had been inundated with crime and burglaries.

RUSH LIMBAUGH, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: If anybody had a crime committed
against him to get this thing started it was Zimmerman.


SHARPTON: So why would they champion a man who killed an unarmed 17-
year-old? In part, to make a political argument. To oppose gun laws and
to support the controversial stand your ground law. Many of those same
voices have been silent this week.

Joining me now are Jonathan Capehart and Goldie Taylor. Thanks for
being here.



SHARPTON: George, I mean, Jonathan, George Zimmerman has been in the
news all week, yet silence from the right. Why, Jonathan?

CAPEHART: Well, could it be that they`re embarrassed or embarrassed
by what George Zimmerman has been doing since he was found not guilty in
July. I mean, this guy has been in our faces and in the news and, you
know, involved with law enforcement since July. Yes, they`re the parking
tickets -- or is it the speeding tickets? That`s one thing. But the 911
call from Samantha Scheibe this week, the 911 call from his ex-wife back in


CAPEHART: Both domestic violence calls, both involving the police.
This is something where understandably the right wing wouldn`t want to wrap
their arms around this guy. Rev, these things that are happening right now
are things that folks who have been following the case very closely sort of
knew would happen. These things that he -- that police have been --

SHARPTON: But folks like who Jonathan, because the media wasn`t
bringing this out?

CAPEHART: Well, remember, thanks to the sunshine laws in Florida, we
know a whole lot more than what could have been introduced in the Florida
courtroom. So, for instance, 2005, a restraining order was taken out by
George Zimmerman`s fiancee against him, he took one out against her. There
were anger management classes and, you know, assaulting a police officer.
These are all things that we knew in the media. And also that had been
reported but never made it into the courtroom.

SHARPTON: But Goldie, these are things that were known but still they
made him a symbol and a hero for stand your ground in gun laws.

TAYLOR: Well, certainly. You know, the idea that, you know, rush to
judgment maybe was in place really cuts both ways. We are more inclined to
believe the narrative of someone who really fits our agenda. And that`s
what happened on the right. Those few minutes that Trayvon Martin
encountered, unfortunately, George Zimmerman that night really became the
embodiment a lot of issues on the right wing in terms of gun ownership, at
the so-called right to bear arms in terms of stand your ground.

You know, this whole boogieman of black on white crime out there. And
so, there were a lot of things that really came together. And Zimmerman
was embodiment and easy to lift up. But now those issues have gone away.
Now that the real George Zimmerman has stood up publicly and done this
again and again in terms of domestic violence issues. You know, they`re
beginning to see a George Zimmerman that they would not want to have seen
before. And so they`re confronted with that. You`re seeing an awful lot
of silence. But I would say there have been a couple of pundits on that
side who have pointed to the notion that George Zimmerman is in trouble.
But they pointed to the notion that maybe he got into this, you know,
psychological motion of trouble after the death of Trayvon Martin. It
probably started happening long before that.

SHARPTON: That`s exactly right. And I think that that`s the point.
And in both sides, Zimmerman`s defense team tried to portray Trayvon Martin
as aggressive. Including a notoriously incorrect statement from Mark
O`Mara, Jonathan, listen to this.


MARK O`MARA, GEORGE ZIMMERMAN`S LAWYER: Keep your mind open when we
present to you the videos of him at these fights, not just as a pure
spectator, but refereeing, one and being involved in taping one where two
buddies of his are beating up a homeless guy.


SHARPTON: Now, this is in the courtroom to the jury. But a few days
later, O`Mara apologized and admitted there weren`t any such video of
Trayvon Martin`s buddies. But the statement was already out there
portraying Trayvon Martin as aggressive. Implying it was plausible that
Zimmerman was merely defending himself, Jonathan.

CAPEHART: You know, that was the courtroom strategy that we knew
would be employed by the defense team and that Mark O`Mara employed.
Trying to put Trayvon Martin on trial, trying to make Trayvon Martin look
like he was threatening, he was a predator. He was the one who was as
George Zimmerman said in his 911 call up to no good. And it was -- it was
a painful thing to watch and a troubling thing to watch, especially knowing
what we knew that was never going to be introduced in court about George
Zimmerman`s background.

SHARPTON: Now, and I might add that I know that O`Mara`s statement
was in open court. I believe it was to the judge. I`m not certain, I
don`t think the jury was there. But this week Shellie Zimmerman, Goldie,
who stood by George during the trial talked about what her husband`s
personality was like. Listen.


SHELLIE ZIMMERMAN: I found out he was lying about a lot of things.
And he became like a pacing lion. Very unpredictable. I haven`t seen him
in a couple of months, but it certainly seems like something snapped in his

COURIC: And made him behave like what?

SHELLIE ZIMMERMAN: Like a monster.

COURIC: It seems as if George is a ticking time bomb. I mean, given
all these incidents, these run-ins, you know repeated incidents over just
this last year. What do you think is going to happen to him?

SHELLIE ZIMMERMAN: I don`t know. I certainly hope that there are no
casualties. I hope that there`s no violence. But he does seem like a
ticking time bomb. I know I`m certainly afraid.


SHARPTON: Now, here is his wife, Goldie.

TAYLOR: Yes, sir.

SHARPTON: Here is a woman that stayed with him seven years using
terms like a ticking time bomb. All these kinds of things. Where is the
outrage on the right? I mean, you could be misled, you could feel
something and find out later it wasn`t that. But they`ve said nothing.
And they knew he had these questions in his background. They`ve gone radio

TAYLOR: You know, again, we`re talking about protecting a narrative
here and that George Zimmerman, this George Zimmerman is no longer useful
to the narrative they needed to advance. Listen, you know, fame and glory
and spotlights, they don`t change people, they simply reveal them. And so
George Zimmerman under this national -- no really this global glare has
really been revealed for he is.


TAYLOR: And I think there`s a lot of emotional and instability there
that hadn`t been checked before. But unless something -- and I have to
agree with this wife here, unless something gets in his way, whether it is
jail or therapy and counseling or some other kind of intervention, you
know, we all have to fear what George Zimmerman might do and to whom the
next time.

SHARPTON: Jonathan Capehart and Goldie Taylor, thanks for your time
tonight. Have a great weekend.

CAPEHART: Thanks, Rev.

TAYLOR: Thank you.

SHARPTON: Coming up, the talkers have the late night comedians going
nuclear. And a new video from a police shooting at a van with five kids
inside. It`s raising questions. Stay with us.


SHARPTON: The Senate changed its rules and the comedians are loving


UNIDENTIFIED MAN: Thank you for joining us on this the last day of
America. Because folks, it is all over. They used the nuclear option.
That`ll give Congress radiation burns. Too late.


SHARPTON: Good one. Anyone else want to pile on?


UNIDENTIFIED MAN: At one point he said, well, the American business
is far too important for the rules. Well, how far do you take that? You
could just ignore the house, and just have a military coup.

UNIDENTIFIED WOMAN: There`s a ton --


SHARPTON: A military coup, hilarious, comedy gold. So, who else is
throwing out the zingers?


LIMBAUGH: If they want to nominate the bad communists to be judges,
there`s no stopping them now.


SHARPTON: Avowed communists becoming judges, look out Jimmy Fallon,
here comes Rush Limbaugh. But the late night war is just getting started.


HANNITY: Tonight, this administration proved just how low they will
go to push through the radical agenda.

UNIDENTIFIED WOMAN: Ended up throwing gasoline on the brush fire of

LEVIN: Perfectly comfortable with tyranny. They really are.

HANNITY: This is becoming the most lawless regime in the history of
this country.


SHARPTON: Hilarious. But just one problem, they aren`t comedians.
They`re the Republican Party.


LIMBAUGH: Really, it`s almost now one party -- whatever they want to
do, they`re going to do, they`re not afraid of any ramifications. What
Obama will now be able to do is pack this court. And there`s no stopping
him. So if Obama wants to nominate, oh, I don`t know, Bashar Assad to the
Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals, there`s no stopping him.


SHARPTON: President Obama would nominate a brutal dictator to a
judgeship? Forget late night comics, this crowd is a bad reality show.

Joining me now are Patricia Murphy and Joe Madison. Thank you for
being here.



SHARPTON: Joe, they can be unhappy about the rule change but what do
you make of this language?

MURPHY: Well, I -- I usually don`t disagree with you, Reverend
Sharpton, but I`m going to take strong disagreement with you this one.
They are comedians. They are funny. There`s no if, and, buts about it.
And the thing they don`t understand in all seriousness, the Senate is the
deliberate body. That`s what they`re known as the most deliberate body.
And that`s why you heard in your previous segments with Melissa saying
that, look, no one wanted to do this, we were forced to do this.

And here`s what they`re very upset about. They`ve lost again. They
lost in 2008. They lost in 2012. They`ve lost the birther argument.
They`ve lost every argument that they`ve put forth and they have now lost
and here`s the great thing about what is happening. I think most Americans
are very pleased with this. They can -- they can`t do anything about it.
Because when you don`t fill judicial seats, you have justice delayed.
Justice delayed is justice denied.

SHARPTON: You know, when you look at the fact that the head of the
Republicans Rush Limbaugh made another ridiculous comparison about the
Senate change, he compared the Senate to a group of ten people that was --
that banned rape and needed six votes to overturn the ban. Listen to what
he said.


LIMBAUGH: Every now and then some lunatic in the group proposes to
change the rule to allow women to be raped. But they never were able to
get six votes for it. There were always the four women voting against hit
and there was two guys. Well, the guy that kept proposing that women be
rape, finally got tired of it. He was in the majority, and said, you know
what, we`re going to change the rule. Now all we need is five.


SHARPTON: You know, Patricia, it seems like it`s par for the cause.
A Republican making a wildly inappropriate comment about rape.

MURPHY: That comment is disgusting, it`s totally uncalled for. It
has nothing to do with what happened in the Senate. I actually don`t think
that the Democrats should`ve changed those rules. I think that those rules
are nonpartisan. I think that by changing the rules they have played into
Republicans` hands and who want to call them tyrannical and want to say
that they`re doing a power grab. I think they should have tried to beat
the Republicans within the rules and not by changing the rules. That`s my
personal opinion.

But there is no reason, no justification, no way under the sun that
you can compare that to what Rush Limbaugh just compared that to. And I
think it is just another example of trying to win people over through
distortions and through disgusting comparisons and with something that has
absolutely nothing to do with facts.

SHARPTON: But isn`t that the problem, Joe, that even when they may
have some basis of making an argument that many in the middle, some
independents might hear, they over jump the runway. They go way to the
extreme and turn off their own potential support.

MADISON: And where I disagree and I understand exactly what`s being
said here. But let me just respectfully disagree. That approach that you
just described would be great if you were dealing with honest brokers.
You`re not dealing with honest brokers. When the leader of the Republican
Party in the Senate says, what, just a year or so after the election if not
that long.


MADISON: .my number one legislative goal is to do whatever it takes
not to help America but to defeat this president. Even if it`s not in the
best interest of Americans, then you`re not dealing with an honest broker.
And so as I pointed out, I`m certain no one wanted to do this. But you
know, if nuclear destruction comes something we forget this called mutual
assured destruction. And that`s exactly what the Republicans have done to
themselves with all this record filibustering that you so aptly pointed out
earlier in the show.

SHARPTON: And I that think they`d already the Republicans cast a lot
of the House, Senate rather traditions and protocol to the wind. I mean
when you`ve got, for the first time, 150 years you`re going to deny a
sitting member of Congress. When you`re going to deny every nominee that
the president nominates to a court and not even go down the record. And
then the president is being accused by the right of acting like a dictator
over the rule changed. And that`s a frequent attack. But they also accuse
him of being weak at the same time, Patricia. So, what is it? Are you a
dictator or are you weak? I mean, listen to this.


LIMBAUGH: Every time I hear him say he`s not a dictator, he doesn`t
complete the statement but I wish I was. The absence of a leadership,
which is what we`ve got here.

HANNITY: My next guest has decided to stand up to King Obama.

Obama is weak. He`s an appeaser.


SHARPTON: I mean how can he be both a king and an appeaser? Doesn`t
this show there`s no substance to these attacks, Patricia?

MURPHY: Well, I think these attacks are entirely personal. I think
that the personal tone of the attacks against President Obama are the
weakest part of the attacks against President Obama from the Republicans,
certainly from talk radio. And I think that we didn`t hear similar attacks
under the Bush administration when it was the most massive expansion of
executive power in American history. And, you know, I think if we had
heard those kinds of attacks during other times when there actually was an
extensive expansion of executive power, it would be easier to take them
more seriously. I think that if President Obama were a dictator, he could
do things like fix the website.


MURPHY: You know, if he could do anything he wanted, I`m sure he`d be
doing more things. But I think these attacks are personal, I think they
are demeaning and I think that they are well beneath the country that these
people say they want --

SHARPTON: Demeaning to the office.

MURPHY: Absolutely.

SHARPTON: Patricia Murphy and Joe Madison, thank you for your time
tonight. Have a great weekend to both of you.

MADISON: You too, Reverend Sharpton.

MURPHY: Thank you so much.

SHARPTON: Coming up, we are learning more about the New Mexico police
shooting at a car with five kids inside. A new tape you have to see. And
the mother speaks out, next.


UNIDENTIFIED MAN: Open the door! Open the door!





SHARPTON: We`re learning more about that New Mexico traffic stop from
early this week that went very wrong. A mother driving with her five kids
in a minivan was pulled over for speeding. She was asked to wait but
disobeyed and drove away. When she was stopped again, chaos ensued. Her
14-year-old son engages the officer and they scuffle. Today, new tape from
that moment including a video of more kids getting out of the van.


UNIDENTIFIED WOMAN: No, no, get back in! Get back in!


UNIDENTIFIED MAN: Get on the ground! Get on the ground! Get on the
ground! Get on the ground!

Get on the ground! Get out right now! Get out!

Get them out.

Open the door. Open the door!



SHARPTON: The police officer that shot says he was aiming at the rear
tire. We`re also hearing the mother`s side. She writes in a local paper
about injustice at its best. Quote, "As a single African-American mother
of five in this country, things are tough enough. I should not have to
endure harassment at the hands of someone who has been hired to protect the
citizens of the land over an alleged speeding offense. No one should."

The mother did disobey the police by driving away. And she was
speeding and authorities say drug paraphernalia was found inside the
minivan. There are lots of details we still don`t know about this case.
But here`s what we do know, nothing justifies using deadly force on a
vehicle with five children inside. That just shouldn`t be acceptable.
We`ll keep following this story.


SHARPTON: In the five decades since President Kennedy`s
assassination, gun violence has become an epidemic in this country. From
unspeakable tragedy in Newtown, Connecticut, to a 15-year-old honor student
killed in a Chicago Park. To a 4-year-old killed by a stray bullet in New
York. I`ve spent the past few months working on a documentary about gun
violence. Fifty years after President Kennedy was killed, "50 Years of

As tonight at 9:00 p.m. Eastern, right here on MSNBC, I`m very proud
of it and I hope you`ll watch. Thanks for watching, I`m Al Sharpton, have
a great weekend. Coming up are two special documentaries, first "JFK: The
Day That Changed America," and at 8:00 p.m., "The Kennedy Brothers." Stay


Transcription Copyright 2013 ASC LLC ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. No license is
granted to the user of this material other than for research. User may not
reproduce or redistribute the material except for user`s personal or
internal use and, in such case, only one copy may be printed, nor shall
user use any material for commercial purposes or in any fashion that may
infringe upon MSNBC and ASC LLC`s copyright or other proprietary rights or
interests in the material. This is not a legal transcript for purposes of