PoliticsNation, Tuesday, November 26th, 2013

November 26, 2013
Guest: Margie Omero, Joe Madison, Clint Van Zandt, Dana Milbank

REV. AL SHARPTON, MSNBC HOST: Good evening Ed and thanks to you for
tuning in.

Tonight`s Lead toward a more perfect union, the great fight of our
time is the fight for fairness in this country. We see that on issue after
issue, health care of course and voting rights. But no issue is more
central to who we are as a people than the issue of income equality.

Over the last 30 years, the income for the top 1 percent has grown 275
percent, but the poorest in this country they barely made any gain at all.
Nothing about that graph is fair, nothing. And today Pope Francis made a
powerful statement asking politicians around the world to turn their backs
on policies that contribute to this great divide. He slammed the idolatry
of money, asking how can it be that it is not a news item when an elderly
homeless person dies of exposure, but it is news when the stock market
loses two points?

He went on to say, just as the commandment thou shall not kill sets a
clear limit in order to safeguard the value of human life. Today, we also
have to say thou shall not to an economy of exclusion an inequality. Such
an economy kills.

This was a call for fairness for a better society. And it is in stark
contrast to the shameful false moral arguments we hear from the right wing
in this country. Evoking faith to justify their cruelty.


REP. MICHELE BACHMANN (R), MINNESOTA: Self-reliance means if anyone
will not work, neither should he eat.

REP. STEPHEN FINCHER (R), TENNESSEE: The role of citizens, of
Christians, of humanity is to take care of each other. But not for
Washington to steal money from those in the country and give it to others
in the country.

The one who is unwilling to work shall not eat. So we have to be
careful how we pick and choose verses out of the bible.

primary tenants of catholic social teaching means don`t keep people poor.
Don`t make people dependent on government.


SHARPTON: If a truly great society is judged on how we treat the
least among us, then we need to change this thanksgiving. It`s almost upon
us. We must be clear eyed about that fact that 47 million Americans will
feel the brunt of devastating food stamp cuts.

What`s Congresswoman Bachmann`s phrase? They shall not eat? And how
about this. Just days after Christmas, unemployment benefits will expire
for 1.3 million people, but the House Republicans won`t even allow a vote
to stop that from happening.

This party has shown a malicious disdain for the safety net, casually
dismissing policies to help those in need.


RYAN: I don`t think raising the minimum wage and history is clear
about this, doesn`t actually accomplish those goals.

the minimum wage issue because right now we`re trying to provide a more
jobs for everyone.

paid the minimum wage are being paid that because they come to the
workforce with no skills.


SHARPTON: Maybe it`s simply too easy for many in power to dismiss
raising the minimum wage. After all, the median income worth of a member
of Congress is about a million dollars. But a typical U.S. household, just
around $67,000. Maybe that statistic explains the indifference we`re
seeing from too many in Washington.

This is not an attack on capitalism. It`s a call on our political
leaders, especially congressional Republicans to shows some heart.
Shouldn`t we all want an economy in which everyone can succeed?

Joining me now are Richard Wolffe and Goldie Taylor.

Thank you both for coming on the show.


GOLDIE TAYLOR, MSNBC CONTRIBUTOR: Thank you, Reverend Sharpton.

SHARPTON: Goldie, the right talks about religion. But what about
taking care of thy brother and thy sister?

TAYLOR: Yes. I think it`s fairly interesting to hear them talk about
people who select, you know, their own pieces of the bible to fit their
common narrative.

Now, my pastor likes to say that you ought to be seeing in your
politics through the lens of your faith rather than the faith through the
lens of your politics. And that is really what is happening here is that
people are using their politics to really shake what their faith are look
like or what their bible tells them according to what they think is right

At the end of the day, we`ve got 47 million hungry people in this
country. And even more, who have food and stable tonight, who may or may
not be would have count on a meal tonight.

You know, there were Haitians today who are in a boat-lift who
capsized and killed today on the ocean, but that`s not a story tonight.
The story tonight is, you know, what stock prices twitter is trading at.

We`ve got tons of businesses in this country that are frankly more
profitable than at any other time in American history. But American wages
are depressed lower than any other time in history. And there`s something
that`s immoral about that.

SHARPTON: No doubt about it.

And you know, Richard, a group of conservative lawmakers in the house
are pushing a new government funding bill that would cut $20 billion from
Medicaid and transfer it to the Pentagon.

WOLFFE: Yes. Reverend, I remember a Republican not so long ago who
disagreed with House Republicans because they wanted to, in his words,
balance the budgets on the backs of the poor. And he had a whole brand of
what he compassionate conservatism. That was, of course, George W. Bush.
Actually, the British conservative prime minister today, David Cameron, has
kind of modeled himself on something very similar.

I think it`s hard for Republicans to do anything than speak to their
base with this kind of harsh rhetoric. They are much better off having a
principled approach to how there`s a common purpose, a community purpose
that they represent. It could be community purpose based through faith.
That was the right faith-based solutions that President Bush was talking

But they have to speak to a bigger audience and not pretend like, you
know, the 47 percent of the country are un-deserving poor too, were too
lazy to go to find work. That is a very narrow argument for them to win
mass support. It didn`t work for Romney before and it`s not going to work
for them this time around.

SHARPTON: You know, Goldie, the Pope directly attacked the GOP theory
of trickledown economics saying, quote, "some people continue to defend
trickle down theories. This opinion which has never been confirmed by the
facts expresses a crude and naive trust in the goodness of those wielding
economic power. Meanwhile, the excluded are still waiting."

Powerful statement from the Pope.

TAYLOR: I`ve got t admit, Reverend Sharpton. I`m completely and
utterly in love with this Pope. You know, the kinds of real messages that
speaks to the hearts of people, now are simply just inspiring. And so, I`d
like to hear more of this from this Pope. But I hope that this message,
you know, reach in some of the hardened hearts that we`ve got here in our

And so, at the end of the day, this is what we`ve got to focus on
here. We`ve got to focus on people coming to the workforce, yes, with more
skills. But that means we`ve got to fix a broken education system, that
means we got to fix a broken health care system. That means we have to get
people economically ready to participate in this society.

But we can`t break those things. We can`t break those things and then
turn around and say you`re not prepared or you`re not ready to earn. You
know, we`ve got to fix this first.

SHARPTON: That was, you`ve got to deal with the economy and you`ve
got to deal with the fairness question in terms of inequality in income.

You know, when you look at a guy like Paul Ryan of all people trying
to sell himself as someone who is fighting poverty and winning minds,
Richard, I mean, you wonder what they`re talking about. Do they really
believe that what they`re doing is going to really help to fight poverty by
cutting the budgets of food stamps, cutting the unemployment insurance of
people who really can`t find work, many of them working? I mean, what
could they be thinking to convince themselves that this is somehow helping
to fight poverty?

WOLFFE: Yes. Look, I think Paul Ryan is clearly sending out signals
he`s trying to pick up that George W. Bush playbook from 2000. And in some
ways put distance between himself and his own plan especially when it comes
to things like Medicaid.

You know, it was harsh. He was being encouraged to be bold and to
break the deadlock, but you don`t break the deadlock by showing absolutely
no compassion. We`re talking about extremely low levels of income to
qualify for Medicaid at all.

So, you know, it`s not like you`re going to attract the votes of
people who get Medicaid. It`s what you express about your party`s values
and about your own values. I think, again, Paul Ryan`s a smart guy. He
recognizes this is not a winning track that he was on before.

SHARPTON: No. And when you look at the fact that even a late as
yesterday, Goldie, FOX was mocking the president`s recent statement that
he`s not a socialist. Watch this.


ERIC BOLLING, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: Conservatives like me think he`s a
socialist, but the president doesn`t always see it that way. Here`s what
he said last week.

between the rhetoric and the tactics versus the ideological differences.
In most countries you`ve got -- people call me a socialist sometimes, but
you`ve got to meet real socialists. You`ll have a real sense of what a
socialist is.

BOLLING: He`s not a real socialist. He`s just a fake socialist.


SHARPTON: I mean, when you look at the stock market and Wall Street
and the top one percent and what they`re doing and you look at the average
American has made little progress and you call that socialism under this
president? I mean, this is absurd.

TAYLOR: You know, if this president was a socialist, then maybe we
would have some wage parity in this country. Maybe we would have no less
inequality, gender inequality in this country. You know, maybe, just
maybe, more people would be able to find affordable housing in this country
to be able to access affordable, meaningful health care.

Maybe if this president were a socialist, you know, then a child in
inner city Atlanta would have just as great of a chance at a great
education than a child in Alpharetta if this president was a socialist they
think that he is. And the fact of the matter is they are really not about
attacking the problem of --

SHARPTON: The real point is he said now would they say it. I`m sure
he supports a lot of what you just said and what I said. But that does not
make you a socialist. That makes you, in my opinion, an American patriot.

Richard Wolffe and Goldie Taylor, thank you both for your time this

WOLFFE: Thanks, Reverend.

TAYLOR: Thank you.

SHARPTON: Coming up, more ugly reaction from the right to President
Obama`s nuclear deal with Iran. From appeasement to negotiating with
terrorists to distraction, it`s about one thing, dehumanizing President

Plus more signs Obamacare is working and today President Obama had a
stern message for Republicans routing for failure.

And inside George Zimmerman`s house, police reveal the gun they found
and other findings that may surprise you. Stay with us.


SHARPTON: The knee jerk reaction to President Obama`s Iran deal. You
know who isn`t allowed to weigh? Anyone in the Bush administration. But
they`re first in line to criticize. Amazing. That`s next.


SHARPTON: Right wing pundits and politicians are ramping up their
deranged response to President Obama`s new deal with Iran. Lacing their
comments with ridiculous accusation and ugly disrespect. Take a look.


SEAN HANNITY, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: Under the cover of darkness were our
fearless commander in chief addressed the e country and announced he`s
willing to enter into a nuclear agreement with role regime in Tehran.
That`s right, President Obama is now openly negotiating with terrorists.


SHARPTON: Openly negotiating with terrorists? This is ugly stuff.

President Obama is working to take away nuclear weapons from Iran.
Have Republicans forgotten who actually gave weapons to Iran? The Reagan
administration. That`s right. During the Iran affair in the 1980s, the
Reaganites traded arms to Iran in exchange for hostages. It was a scandal,
but Republicans don`t want to talk about that, do they?

Joining me now is Dana Milbank from the "Washington Post."

Dana, thank you for joining me.


SHARPTON: You wrote something in your new column that really struck
me, Dana. The president announced the details of the Iran nuke deal at
10:34 p.m. Saturday night. But an hour and a half earlier at 9:08 p.m.,
former Bush press secretary Ari Fleischer sent out a tweet that said,
quote, "the Iran deal and our allies. You can`t spell abandonment without

Attacking the deal before it was even announced? Classic. They
exposed their true agenda. They don`t care about policy. They only care
about opposing this president, Dana.

MILBANK: I think, Reverend, that the president could have struck a
deal to promote mother hood, baseball, and apple pie around the world and
Republicans would have reflexively disapproved of it. And it is sort of --
I mean, to call it knee jerk, I think is -- I think the rejection of
anything Obama does goes more quickly than a knee jerk response. It is
truly automatic here.

Now, in this case, what they`re saying is any talking with Iran,
unacceptable. So that means, well, then I guess we have to go to war with
Iran. Of course, we tried that once before going to war before exhausting
diplomatic possibilities. That`s when Ari Fleischer was speaking from the
White House podium, and we know how that turned out.

SHARPTON: Yes. And the reaction to this nuke deal has been as you
said automatic and ugly. When you look at Representative Culberson says
it`s worse than Munich. Representative Poe, it`s a bum deal. Bachmann
says it`s total surrender. And other Republicans claim the deal was just a
distraction from Obamacare. Listen to this.


RUSH LIMBAUGH, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: These people will do anything
to distract us from how bad Obamacare is, including let the Iranians get a
nuclear weapon down the road.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Now sparking many to believe that it is yet
another attempt to distract from the disastrous rollout.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Isn`t that curious timing? Then look, John Kerry
pulls a rabbit out of his hat and changes the subject. It`s handy for

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It is handy for them. Let`s just put it that way.


SHARPTON: So the fact they`ve been working on this for over a year,
many months, had nothing to do that this was all about Obamacare. I mean,
it`s from one conspiracy theory to another ugly attack and we`re talking
about avoiding war here, Dana.

MILBANK: Right. You`ve heard of the wag the dog thing in the past
where a president`s accused of launching a military strike to distract from
domestic problems. So, this is the first time a president has been accused
of peace to distract from domestic problems. I think we have called this
wag-a-dove (ph).

And it is particularly silly to say that they would have been awfully
pressured to know they had these problems with Obamacare to start
negotiating several months ago with Iran and our European partners and
others just to have the idea of making this distraction for this thing that
popped up in the last two weeks. It`s really quite devious, don`t you

SHARPTON: No, it is. It`s baffling, it`s so devious.

But, you know, what is interesting to note is that this deal in Iran
shouldn`t really be a surprise. The president ran on a platform that
included direct talks with Iran. Listen to him on "Meet The Press" back in
2008. Listen to this.


OBAMA: I have consistently said that we`ve got to talk directly to
Iran. Those kinds of direct talks have not taken place. That`s the kind
of change in foreign policy that I plan to put in place when I`m president
of the united stat.


SHARPTON: He said he would talk to Iran direct. He said that these
things have not happened. He`s doing that, and the American people voted
for him. They voted to change direction from the Bush years when they
voted for Obama. So what`s the big news here to our right wing friends?

MILBANK: Well, the American people did that and the Iranian people
approved a new leader there who seems more willing to deal in good faith.
Now, we don`t know if the Iranians are going to deal in good faith, but
that`s the silliness of the criticism of this. It`s a temporary six-month
deal completely reversible. The Iranians don`t continue to do what they
were told to do, guess what, the sanctions go back into place. Tougher
sanctions for Congress is seems likely to pass. It will go and place them.
Nothing lost.

The only reason not to do it is to say well, we were just -- we would
prefer to launch a military strike before finding out if these guys are
real. They`re probably not for real, but it would be a shame not to
explore that possibly first.

SHARPTON: And I think you`re right. We don`t know what they will do.
It`s likely they may not live up to it. But you have to always try peace
before you go into risking lives and losing lives.

Dana Milbank, thanks for your time tonight. Have a great

MILBANK: You too. Thanks, Reverend.

SHARPTON: Still ahead, Mitch McConnell tries to play fast and loose
with his own record and instead lands in tonight`s got you.

Plus, the stunning discovery police made inside the home of George
Zimmerman. Could it affect the case against him? Stay with us.


SHARPTON: Welcome to tonight`s episode of bewitched where Senate
minority leading Mitch McConnell tries and fails to make his record
magically disappear. Tonight, women`s issues.

His campaign recently released a statement saying, quote, "as the
father of three daughters, fair pay for women is more than a talking point
for Senator McConnell. It`s something he`s worked to achieve his entire

His whole career? What about Senator McConnell`s vote against the
historic Lilly Ledbetter act in 2008?


another special address vote. This time for the plan employers with the
Ledbetter vote.


SHARPTON: Fair pay for women is a special interest? He doubled down
on that again a year later, once again voting against fair pay.


MCCONNELL: But this so-called Ledbetter bill is really a trial
lawyer`s bailout. It`s not about fair pay. As we all know, job creators
have enough to worry about these days. We shouldn`t add the threat of
never-ending lawsuits.


SHARPTON: He also voted against the paycheck fairness act in 2010 and
again in 2012.


MCCONNELL: Look, we don`t think America suffers from a lack of

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE REPORTER: So there is no concern about women
voting in this election on this issue?

MCCONNELL: I`d be happy to repeat the answer. We don`t think
Americans has any problem related to two little litigations.


SHARPTON: Doesn`t the senator realize a woman still makes just 77
cents for every dollar a man makes? The show bewitched may be straight out
of the `60s, but that doesn`t mean women`s pay should be.

Did Mitch McConnell think he could wiggle his nose to get out of this
one? Nice try, but we got you.


SHARPTON: Forget the Republican doom and gloom. The health care law
is helping real people. More and more of them every day. Just look at
what`s going on in California.


UNIDENTIFIED WOMAN: Twenty two-year-old Skyla Walton is seven months
pregnant and uninsured. She`s excited to the opportunity to get affordable
coverage she wasn`t able to before. For Skyla, applying online has been
pretty simple. But there are many ways to sign up.

UNIDENTIFIED WOMAN: A pre-existing condition not only drained Cindy`s
savings, but made it virtually impossible to get health care at any cost.
That is, until the affordable care act. Cindy settled on the bronze plan.
It`s a monthly premium that she feels she can afford.

UNIDENTIFIED WOMAN: He was stunned to learn that through cover
California he can get a similar Kaiser plan for his family for $400 less,
that`s $5,000 a year.

UNIDENTIFIED MAN: Just a middle class family, $5,000 a lot of money.


SHARPTON: Real families saving thousands of dollars. It is not just
in California. Enrollment is surging across the country. New numbers show
more than 76,000 people have signed up for an insurance in New York State.
That number`s up 58 percent in just two weeks. Nationwide the law has
helped more than seven million seniors save nearly $9 billion on
prescription drugs. On average each person saved $1200. We know Speaker
Boehner signed up through the exchange website.

It turns out, his constituents back home in Ohio like the health care
law too. Fifty one percent say, expanding Medicaid under the law was good
idea. Yes, there have been problems with the law, but it`s working. More
people are signing up and finding out for themselves. The White House
says, is ramping up efforts to enroll young people. And today, President
Obama says he won`t accept Republicans` obstruction.


PRES. BARACK OBAMA (D), UNITED STATES: Instead of rooting for failure
or re-fighting old battles, Republicans in Congress need to work with us
to improve those things about the Affordable Care Act that aren`t working
as well as they should. And implement policies to strengthen the middle
class and create jobs.


SHARPTON: How`s that for a plan? It`s time to stop fighting the old
battles. Time to work together and get this law to help even more people.

Joining me now are Margie Omero and Joe Madison. Thank you both for
being here.



SHARPTON: Margie, more news about the health care law and reports
that the website is getting better and better. Where does this fight go
now? The Republicans knocking it. What does this good news do to their

OMERO: Well, they`re rooting for bad news as the president says. And
it`s unfortunate. Instead of looking to their constituents to find them
with anecdotes showing how ObamaCare might hurt them, they should be
talking to their constituents and saying, hey, how can we help you get
health care? Are you uninsured? Do you need help? Have you been denied
insurance because of a pre-existing condition? I`m your member of
Congress. That`s my job to provide constituent services. But instead
they`re looking for ways to score political points. And hopefully as
enrollment continues, it`s continuing actually at five times the rate as
Romney care at this point. You`ll see more of these stories. You`ll see
more people saying, you know, I need this, I want this. Let`s not get rid
of this. Let`s not have political battles over it but really try to make
it work for everybody.

SHARPTON: You know, Joe Madison, a lot of groups that support the
health care law have been trying to push people out trying to get mothers
to convince their adult children to enroll. "The New York Times" reports,
quote, "When it comes to making major life decisions, many people,
especially young adults, still turn to their mothers for help. Women make
about 80 percent of the health care decisions for their families." But the
right are seeing red over efforts to get moms and families to talk about
insurance over the holidays. Listen to this.


UNIDENTIFIED WOMAN: They`re crafty, but what are you asking mothers
to do? Right here. Bribe your child into signing up for health care?
Mother knows best. Or the government telling the mother.

UNIDENTIFIED MAN: Guilt them in.

UNIDENTIFIED WOMAN: You know, moms are smarter than this. They`re
not going to be used as pawns by the government most likely.

RUSH LIMBAUGH, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: Thanksgiving is a national
American holiday. And its purpose is to thank God for the United States of
America and instead Obama acolytes are being propagandized to take over
Thanksgiving and Christmas dinners to convince people to give thanks to
Obama for ObamaCare.


SHARPTON: Now, having a conversation about getting your family
insured is really propaganda, Joe. I mean --

MADISON: Oh, yes.

SHARPTON: I mean, your family insured is ruing your holiday? I mean,
can you believe this stuff, Joe?

MADISON: No. You know, Rush Limbaugh`s turkey is cooked and just --
somebody just needs to stuff him and just put him away. Look. The reality
is this. There is really no complaint about the product. Let`s go back.
No one is complaining. That list of things you indicated and showed, no
one is complaining about the product. Now, there were complaints about how
the delivery system was flawed, but the product is solid. Number two, I
would say to every mother and our adult children, you know this, I know
this, they always listen to mom.


MADISON: Dads don`t count. So moms at the dinner table, you find out
is that adult child covered and convince them, share with them what you
would have done if you would have had ObamaCare if it had been available
when you were in your 20s. And that`s what will sell it.

SHARPTON: Now, and by the way, I`m sure, Joe means that he`s a
political turkey that you want political stuffing. I just don`t want no
misunderstanding on what you`re saying because I know you.

MADISON: Thanks for the clarification. I appreciate you having my
back. Yes, he is a political turkey. If he were a goose, he`d be cooked

SHARPTON: Now, I was talking earlier about how Republicans accused
the president of trying to distract people from the health care law with
the Iran nuclear deal. That`s not the only distraction they see. Listen
to this.


SEAN HANNITY, FOX NEWS HOST: Liberal Harry Reid used the quote,
"nuclear option to eradicate most filibusters for presidential nominees."
There was absolutely no question. Now, this was politically timed all to
turn your attention away from ObamaCare.

LIMBAUGH: Now Obama is trying to distract us from the ObamaCare
scandal with this Iranian deal. And that, I firmly believe.

UNIDENTIFIED MAN: Forget Iran. Forget ObamaCare. President Obama
wants to talk about immigration? Will changing the subject actually work?


SHARPTON: So to recap this, Marge, filibuster reform was just an
effort to distract people from the health care law. The Iran nuclear deal
was a distraction. And even though the president has been pushing
immigration reform since January, it`s just another big old distraction. I
mean, can the president do anything without the right wingers of accusing
him of trying to distract people from ObamaCare?

OMERO: The thing is we want to be talking about ObamaCare. We want
people to explore the website, learn about ObamaCare, and sign up. That`s
something that we want people to talk about. It`s not something we want to
sweep under the rug.


OMERO: And, you know, just to go back to the point about moms. As a
mom and as someone who studied a lot of moms, I mean, the fact that we are
-- that people are reaching out to moms and use them as a vehicle for
talking about health care makes so much sense because they drive so many
health care purchases. When I talk to moms around the country, it is
frequently the number one thing that they say occupies their mind. That
they think about, that they worry about their kids.

SHARPTON: I`ve got to leave it there, Margie. Thank you so much
Margie Omero, Joe Madison. Thank you both for your time.

OMERO: Thank you.

MADISON: Happy Thanksgiving.

SHARPTON: Same to you.

Coming up, the gun and ammo arsenal inside George Zimmerman`s home.
That`s next.


SHARPTON: George Zimmerman`s girlfriend said he had a fascination
with guns. And today we`re learning how deep that fascination may have
run. A search warrant made public by the Seminole County Court reveals
what police found in Zimmerman`s home. They performed the search just days
after Zimmerman allegedly pointed a gun in his girlfriend`s face, a claim
he denies. Police found five guns and over a hundred rounds of ammunition.
Among the firearms was an ar-15 semiautomatic assault rifle, three
handguns, and interarms.38, a Taurus 9 mm and a glock 19. And a high
capacity Kel-Tec 12 gauge shotgun. The one presumably mentioned in her 911


DISPATCHER: What`s going on?

housebreaking all my (bleep) because I asked him to leave. He has a
freaking gun breaking all of my stuff right now. No. This is not --


SCHEIBE: I`m doing this again? You just broke my glass table. You
just broke my sunglasses and you put your gun in my freaking face and told
me to get the (bleep) out. This is not your house. No. Get out of here.


SHARPTON: Zimmerman denies those allegations. In the warrant, police
say, it appeared Zimmerman locked the shotgun back up before they entered
his home and arrested him. He is free on bail, but under a court order
forbidding him from carrying guns. The question now is, how might these
guns impact a potential trial?

Joining me now, NCB News legal analyst Lisa Bloom. Her upcoming book
is called "Suspicion Nation: The Inside Story of the Trayvon Martin
Injustice and Why We are Doomed to Repeat it." And former FBI profiler
Clint Van Zandt. Thank you both for being here.

Lisa, let me go to you first. This is quite an arsenal. I mean, does
this validate the story the girlfriend told the police from Seminole

LISA BLOOM, NCB NEWS LEGAL ANALYST: Well, it certainly confirms that
he has weapons of the kind that she was complaining about in the home. I
don`t think there was really much doubt about that. I think bigger
picture, this has to send a chill up the spine of anybody who`s concerned
about safety. This is the third woman who`s complained about being
threatened by George Zimmerman. Three women who loved him. Each of them
at one point and then they say, ultimately he was threatening them.

You know, what`s interesting to me, Reverend now and a lot of people
don`t know this, if he is convicted of any domestic violence crime, even a
misdemeanor, a low level crime, he will be barred from having guns for the
rest of his life under federal law. There`s a case in the U.S. Supreme
Court right now challenging that, but under current law, even a misdemeanor
conviction, he will never own guns again for the rest of his life.

SHARPTON: Now, Clint, I mentioned the police found over a hundred
rounds of ammunition. That included nine millimeter rounds, 13, 12 gauge
shotgun rounds and 59 AR-15 rounds. What does this investigate -- to
understand Zimmerman`s thinking?

CLINT VAN ZANDT, FORMER FBI PROFILER: Well, you got to look at his
thinking, Al. This is a guy who says he is dead broke who originally had
to have a court appointed attorney and yet he`s got what? Three or four
thousand dollars worth of guns right there. And as Lisa says, this is the
same guy who not only killed this black teenager, but in September he takes
a gun and he -- first he punches out his father-in-law and then he
threatens his estranged wife. Well, it`s just a couple months later Al
that he moves on and now he threatens his girlfriend. This guy, it seems
like guns are some type of an extension of his personality. Not only can
he not keep out of trouble, he can`t keep out of the news. And everything
seems to have a firearms connotation with him.

SHARPTON: Now, look at this arsenal. This is the arsenal found in
Zimmerman`s house, Lisa and Clint. Look at this arsenal. And when you
look at the arsenal and you think about two women who were involved with
Zimmerman described him just in the last week as emotionally unstable,
here`s what his estranged wife Shellie Zimmerman said. Now, think of this
arsenal while you hear this.


couple months. But it certainly seems like something snapped in his

KATIE COURIC, ABC ANCHOR: And made him behave like what?

ZIMMERMAN: Like a monster.

COURIC: It seems as if George is a ticking time bomb. I mean, given
all these incidents, these run-ins, you know, repeated incidents over just
this last year. What do you think is going to happen to him?

ZIMMERMAN: I don`t know. I certainly hope that there are no
casualties. I hope that there`s no violence. But he does seem like a
ticking time bomb. I know I`m certainly afraid.


SHARPTON: She`s afraid, ticking time bomb, and if he is a ticking
time bomb, a well armed one, Zimmerman`s girlfriend and her mother made the
following claims to an Orlando TV reporter who was on our show. They said,
Zimmerman was in a deep depression, that he talked of suicide especially
when he wasn`t in the headlines, and that he had a fascination with guns,

BLOOM: Right.

SHARPTON: This is what the girlfriend says.

BLOOM: Right. And he`s clearly had that fascination with guns for
some time. I mean, this is a guy who wore a concealed weapon. He put it
behind him. He had a jacket over it. He had a concealed weapon. When he
was just going to target. I mean, that was the beginning of the Trayvon
Martin incident that resulted in the death of a 17-year-old boy. Look, we
have to start listening to women in this country and in this case.

We have to listen to Shellie Zimmerman who also said in that interview
police, I`m very sorry to say that the police told her, said she would go
to jail if she pressed domestic violence charges against George Zimmerman.
Boy, I hope that`s not true. And now, Samantha Scheibe making a very
similar allegation. I think people can responsibly own guns in this
country. But George Zimmerman is clearly not one of them.

SHARPTON: Clint, what do you think about this allegation that Mrs.
Zimmerman was told she could go to jail if she press charges on George

ZANDT: Well, number one that`s nuts, and I would hope somebody like
Lisa would be there to stand up and defend her. Al, this is a guy who
allegedly was taking four different prescription drugs at the time of the
shooting to include an anti-anxiety medication. His girlfriend recently
reported that he was depressed, that he had fought with his wife the night
of the shooting. You know, you take that terrible motion, Al --

SHARPTON: Shooting of Trayvon Martin.

ZANDT: -- of anger, depression, rage, and guns. That spelled murder
that night.

SHARPTON: You`re talking about the night of Trayvon Martin shooting
when he killed Trayvon Martin.

ZANDT: Yes, exactly, yes. The night of Trayvon Martin shooting,
supposedly he had four different prescription drugs, anti-anxiety included,
that he had fought with his wife that night, and she had left and Al you`ve
got this volcano of emotions that was moving through this guy. And what
does he do? He picks up his gun and he goes out to take control of his
life again, to be somebody in that neighborhood. And then this terrible
confrontation occurs. What does the police dispatcher tell him? Don`t
follow that man. And he does it anyway. And then we have a death that
arises from it. Wrong place, wrong time, wrong emotions, Al.

SHARPTON: Lisa Bloom, Clint Van Zandt, I`m going to have to leave it
there, but thanks for your time tonight. We`ll be right back.

BLOOM: Thanks, Rev.


SHARPTON: The holiday season is here. It`s a festive time, but it`s
also a time to reflect on the millions of Americans who are struggling and
looking for work. More than 11 million Americans are looking for jobs, but
more than three million jobs remain unfulfilled right now. There are a lot
of reasons for this, but the biggest is the skills gap. Too few people
have the right skills to fill those jobs, in this great country, that`s
just not acceptable. We need to come together to refocus our priorities.
One step is to fully fund training programs so more people can get the
skills they need. The president talks about it.


OBAMA: We`ve got to help our workers get the training to compete for
the industries of tomorrow. No job in America should go unfilled because
somebody doesn`t have the right skills to get that job. Nobody.


So if there`s a job open, we should train those folks right away so
that they can do the job.


SHARPTON: The industry is expected to have the most job growth in the
next seven years, are health care, leisure and hospitality, professional
and business services, business and financial operations, and technology
and information services. In our advancing the dream series, we highlight
programs doing the great work of training people. Programs that give
people new skills and new hope. Tonight we focus on the gear up program in
San Francisco and a 22-year-old`s success story.


UNIDENTIFIED WOMAN: My mother and siblings and I were basically on
the streets of San Francisco for six months.

UNIDENTIFIED MAN: Hello, my name is Diego --

UNIDENTIFIED MAN: What gear up does is take groups of 18 to 24-year-
olds from low income backgrounds and spent five months intensively teaching
them the skills they need to survive in the business world then places them
in internships with Bay Area Companies.

UNIDENTIFIED WOMAN: I`m so proud of Ellie. I`m so proud of her.
She`s taken a gift that she has naturally and she`s taken it to the next

UNIDENTIFIED WOMAN: I feel like I`m a much better example for my
siblings. I`m going to cry now.


SHARPTON: That`s advancing the dream with training, education, and
working to close the skills gap. For me information on this program,
please go to our website politicsnation.msnbc.com. And if you know of a
great program doing this work, we want to hear from you. Please go to our
Facebook page and click on our Advancing the Dream tab to tell us your
story. We`ll be right back.


SHARPTON: Finally tonight, remembering a civil rights pioneer.
Reverend T.J. Jemison, one of the founding leaders of the civil rights
movement. He cofounded the Southern Christian leadership conference along
with Reverend Dr. King, Reverend Abernathy and Reverend Shuttlesworth. In
Louisiana in 1953, he organized the nation`s first boycott of segregated
buses. It became the blueprint for the Montgomery bus boycott led by Rosa
Parks and Dr. King.


UNIDENTIFIED MAN: Dr. Martin Luther King came to me because he knew
that two years prior to them, we had had a bus boycott. We gave him the
know how sort of speak.


SHARPTON: Reverend Jemison commanded respect from politicians on both
sides of the aisle later becoming the president of the National Baptist
Convention. He passed away in Baton Rouge earlier this month at the age of
95. Lying in repose at the Louisiana State Capitol, something that would
have been unthinkable in that state before he came along to do what he did.
Reverend W. Franklin Richardson who eulogized him and one of my mentors
said you don`t judge a giant by how tall he stands. You judge him by the
footprint he leaves in history. We will miss Reverend Jemison because when
it was time for justice, when it was time for fairness, when it was time
for courage, he never missed showing up for us.

Thanks for watching. I`m Al Sharpton. "HARDBALL" starts right now.


Transcription Copyright 2013 ASC LLC ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. No license is
granted to the user of this material other than for research. User may not
reproduce or redistribute the material except for user`s personal or
internal use and, in such case, only one copy may be printed, nor shall
user use any material for commercial purposes or in any fashion that may
infringe upon MSNBC and ASC LLC`s copyright or other proprietary rights or
interests in the material. This is not a legal transcript for purposes of