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The Ed Show for Tuesday, March 18th, 2014

Read the transcript to the Tuesday show

March 18, 2014

Guests: Wendell Potter, Bob Shrum, Alexander Pourbaix, Lauren Donovan


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Republicans continue to ride the anti-Obamacare way
through November.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Excitement, the enthusiasm is on the part of
Republicans whether it`s to kill Obamacare or for -- or against the

REP. JOHN BOEHNER, (R-OH) HOUSE SPEAKER: The heart of Obamacare itself.

JULIE BOONSTRA, CANCER SURVIVOR: Obamacare is not the answer.

GOV. CHRIS CHRISTIE, (R) NEW JERSEY: I don`t like Obamacare.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Nowhere just to say Congress has the right to
federalize healthcare.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Many people are being harmed.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: At the end of the day, the Obamacare vote is a huge

BOEHNER: This monstrosity.

BOONSTRA: Obamacare is not the answer.


ED SCHULTZ, MSNBC HOST: Good to have you with us tonight folks. Thanks
for watching. You know, if somebody tells you something or if you have
something written down, which are you more inclined to believe? Well
tonight, we have both. We have what people tell us that`s happening in
their lives and we also have numbers to go along with it.

Let`s start with this number, five million people. That`s right, five
million. Tonight we have proof that Americans are sick and tired of the
attacks on Obamacare, because this is how many people have signed up. And
I felt this over the weekend down in Florida. I did a focus group for the
state of Florida and I asked the group of folks that we were kind enough to
work with down there. They were kind enough to work with us.

If Obamacare would affect how people vote. And they told me across the
board, no. The jury is still out, that was the consensus of this mix of
Americans. Now, in the coming weeks, we`re going to bring you more on our
focus group because the answers were more than interesting.

But, meanwhile, there`s new polling in Michigan which shows that people
aren`t buying Republican lies on Obamacare.

The Republican funded group Americans for Prosperity. Oh yeah, Americans
for Prosperity. Remember that name. The Super PAC, well, they are
slamming Obamacare in the state of Michigan and injecting it into a very
hotly contested Senate raise between Democratic Congressman Gary Peters and
also the Republican Terri Lynn Land.

Now, Republican Super PACs are throwing major cash right into this race.
They really do believe that they can get this seat in Michigan. Well, in
February, Americans for Prosperity started running this commercial. It
tells the story of Julie Boonstra. Boonstra claims she suffered due to the
Affordable Care Act. It turns out there are holes in this story.


BOONSTRA: My name is Julie Boonstra and five years ago I was diagnosed
with leukemia. I found out that I only have a 20 percent chance of
surviving. I found this wonderful doctor and a great healthcare plan.

I was doing barely well fighting the cancer, fighting the leukemia, and
then I received a letter, my insurance was canceled because of Obamacare.

Now the out-of-pocket costs are so high, it`s unaffordable. If I do not
receive my medication, I will die. I believed to president. I believed I
could keep my health insurance plan. I feel lied to. It`s heartbreaking
for me.

Congressman Peters, your decision to vote for Obamacare jeopardized my
health. It is time to listen to me. It is time to listen to the other
American citizens out there who are hurting. This is serious. It`s not a
game. Congressman Peters, Obamacare is not the answer.


SCHULTZ: Well, let`s take a look at Boonstra`s allegations against
Obamacare. First, I think the ad implies that she lost her doctor.
Second, she claims the out-of-pocket cost are so high, it`s unaffordable.

Well, the Washington Post has thoroughly checked out Boonstra`s claims.
Let`s take a look at the facts that they come up with.

Boonstra was actually able to keep her doctor under Obamacare. Americans
for Prosperity, well, they turned around and they have confirmed this fact.

Boonstra told the Detroit News under Obamacare, her premiums had been cut
from $1100 a month to $571 a month, it`s quite a savings. Overall,
Boonstra`s old plan cost her $13,200 a year. This was before co-pays and
out-of-pocket expenses. Her Obamacare plan is just under $12,000 a year,
this includes co-pays and out-of-pocket expenses. It amounts to over $1200
a year in savings. I`d say the claim that Obamacare is unaffordable, is a
plot out lie. She`s been used.

To be fair, Boonstra`s old insurance policy was canceled. Now, think about
that. Let`s be fair. Her insurance policy was canceled. That`s because
it didn`t meet the federal standards which is setup by Obamacare. You know
what she had? Junk insurance.

Now, about having a hard time signing up through the exchange, completely
valid, no questions about it, she and a lot of other Americans have gone
down that road. There is no excuse for not working from day
one. But those problems have been solved, all of that is in the rearview
mirror. It`s a different day dawning right now when it comes to healthcare
in America and the website has come a long, long way.

How do I know? Because Fox News doesn`t do the stories on the website
anymore. That`s about as best proof you can find, isn`t it? Because
they`re always looking for the negative on the president.

Now, Americans for Prosperity provided us with a statement not long ago and
it read, "Despite the claims of television personalities or self-appointed
fact checkers, Obamacare has made Julie Boonstra`s fight with Leukemia
harder, not easier. Instead of trying to help Julie, powerful politicians
attacked and vilified her for speaking out. Those who continue to these
attacks and pretend to know more about Julie`s life and circumstances than
she does should be ashamed."

Well, it sounds to me like TV personalities, whoever they`re talking about,
are getting a lecture from Americans for Prosperity. You bastards, don`t
talk to me about cancer and women. Don`t do that. That`s not good. Our
family, my wife, has walked the walk. We know what it`s all about.

We should point out that Julie preexisting condition, she`ll never get
dropped. Lifetime limits, they will spend whatever they have to spend to
make sure that she will keep her health. And what about the cost? The
savings is quite clear. So it seems to me that Americans for Prosperity
has hoodwinked this cancer patient and put her on an ad that is an absolute

No matter what they say, the ad is blatantly dishonest. They can`t fight
facts. It`s a solid example surely how the Republican Super PAC, Americans
for Prosperity are trying to buy a Senate seat with lies in the State of

Americans for Prosperity has even created a new version of the ad, leaving
out the unaffordable lie. You see folks, this is what we`re going to get
between now and November. This is how Republicans play the game, but this
time, they got caught and it`s seriously backfiring on them.

How do I know? A new poll, out. Gary Peters should not be leading this
poll with the money that`s been spend against him. A new poll out Monday
shows that Gary Peters now has a three-point lead over Land.

And Democrats, I believe, need to keep this example in mind heading right
into the midterms. Democrats don`t turn on Obamacare, because all you`re
going to do is support the lies that are out there with the Super PACs.
And don`t runaway from something that is really good.

Now, here`s how I break it down. The Democrats seemed to be having
somewhat of a confidence problem when it comes to healthcare in America
right now. They know what it is. They know how good it is. But they`re
not quite sure on how they`re going to talk about it. The numbers, the
numbers, the numbers don`t lie. The fact to the matter is, by the end of
this month, there will be six million people who have signed up. I said 5
million by March 1st. Gosh, I apologize. I missed it by 16 days.

So, the bottom line is the next four months, April, May, June, July, the
Democrats are going to have four more months of numbers. Because you see,
in August, when they go home and do Town Halls, they better have it figured
out how they want to explain how wonderful the American -- the Affordable
Healthcare Act really is. So the Democrats will have more numbers and
they`ll have almost a year of positive things happening in the healthcare

There will be lives that have been saved, there will be expenses that have
been brought down, and there will be Americans who will never be denied. I
think it`s pretty easy to sell that to anybody because that really affects
people and it affects the bottom line for the insurance industry too. I
don`t see any of those commercials complaining about Obamacare. Do you?

Get your cell phones out. I want to know what you think tonight`s
question. Should Americans for Prosperity be ashamed of their lies about
Obamacare? Text A for Yes, text B for No to 67622. You can always go to
our blog at We`ll bring you the results later on in this

And I want to make it very clear that at no time on this broadcast that we
ever attacked Julie and her fight with leukemia. We attack and will
continue to attack the lies that are being put out there in the marketplace
by Americans for Prosperity. This is how they play the game. They use
people and they lie.

For more, let me bring in Wendell Potter, Senior Analyst for the Center for
Public Integrity. Mr. Potter, good to have with you with us tonight.

having me.

SCHULTZ: Do you think Obamacare has made Julie Boonstra`s life harder?

POTTER: No, I do not. I think maybe Americans for Prosperity has made her
life harder. Keep in mind that that statement does not address the facts
in this case at all. Certainly, didn`t address what the Washington Post
and other media have found out about this case. And I think that`s very
telling. And I wouldn`t be here today myself, I did not been, you know, I
can`t speak to her illness. She certainly is suspected -- a legitimate
leukemia patient.

SCHULTZ: No doubt.

POTTER: But, I am here because of another leukemia patient, Ed, and the
role that I`ve played several years ago. When a corporate executive got
between a 17-year-old woman, young woman, who was fighting for her life,
but he decided to overrule the decision that was made by her doctors, the
UCLA Medical Center, she died five days before Christmas, because the
insurance company said it did not think with this guy who worked there. He
didn`t think that it was a medically appropriate procedure for her.

And I -- when she died, Madeline Sarchizian (ph), I made a decision that I
was going to find some new way to earn a living because I just couldn`t
keep doing it anymore. Obamacare is helping a lot of people, Ed, a lot of
people. It`s saving lives. I`ve met many people who`ve told me that
they`re certain that they are alive today because of that law. And it
makes a lot of the practices of insurance companies unlawful. It provides
a way for people to get care that they`ve never had, the chance to buy
coverage in the past. So, it`s here and it`s here to stay.

SCHULTZ: The dishonesty in these ads is abound, isn`t it?

POTTER: It absolutely is. And they`re making facts up and they`re
misleading people, as you said, to get them to appear in ads like this.
It`s really quite frankly despicable and it`s all for political ends.

SCHULTZ: What`s the insurance industry going to do at this point? What`s
your prediction between now and the next four or five months? As I said,
that these numbers continue to grow, these stories continue to compile in
neighborhoods across America. What`s the insurance industry? What is
their reaction going to be?

POTTER: Well, they`re going to continue to advertise to try to keep people
to sign up for their plans. You are right. Their bottom lines are healthy
and they will continue to be because this law is built on Republican
principles of maintaining the multi payer system that we have in this

So they`re going to be doing well. They`re going to be trying to attract
the customers that they want and that they need. I think you will see that
they will actually applaud some of these ads because many of the executives
that I used to work with would like nothing more than to see more
Republicans elected because there`s a chance that some of the consumer
protections can be rolled back if Republicans are indeed in controlled of

SCHULTZ: So, this midterm is very important when it comes to the
survivability of Obamacare, the Affordable Care Act .

POTTER: Absolutely.

SCHULTZ: . because of the protections that could be rolled back.

POTTER: Right.

SCHULTZ: Of course the president would end up doing a lot of vetoes
between now when he got in office, which of course would take this
healthcare law and play it huge right in the 2016.

POTTER: You`re exactly right. The midterms are extraordinary important.

SCHULTZ: OK. Mr. Potter, great to have you with us tonight.

POTTER: Thank you Ed.

SCHULTZ: And thank you for you commitment to what you`ve done for people
in the healthcare field. Thanks so much.

I want to bring in Democratic strategist in NYU, Professor Bob Shrum. Bob,
great to have you with us tonight. You`ve recently written a piece about
how the Democrats should handle healthcare on the road back home and in
getting the message across. Your reaction to these dishonest ads in the
environment that`s starting to unfold in front of our eyes.

BOB SHRUM, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Well, it`s the same thing actually how
they`ve been doing from the beginning. From the beginning, they wanted to
turn Obamacare into "Obama scare" and they made up all sorts of lies, death
panels. We just moved on. This Americans for Prosperity ad is a linear
descendant of that. I think it`s very, very good to call them out on these
lies. I think you did it brilliantly today. But I think the other thing
Democrats have to do is they have to stop being wimpy. They have to stop
miscalculating this. They have to get off the defensive and then go on the

They have to say, "Look, Congressional Republicans have voted 51 times to
let insurance companies deny coverage for preexisting conditions, 51 times
to let them cancel your insurance policy when you need it most when you`re
sickest, 51 times to kick kids who are up to the age of 26 on their
parent`s insurance policies off." And those are ads that can be run, that
can, I think, counter Republican charges. And what Republicans are trying
to do is have this amorphous creation called Obamacare. Never discuss the


SHRUM: I think Democrats can make real progress here by holding
Republicans responsible for their specific position.

SCHULTZ: The truth is in the details and getting to the details on the
surface is pre -- you don`t have to dig very far to get to the real
positives surrounding this. So, I think you`ve answered how Democrats
should combat this, money talks on this. So, there`s going to be a
calculation by everybody running how much effort do I put into Obamacare
when there`s so much negative out there and are the people going to know
who I really am and what I stand for? What about that?

SHRUM: Well, if you don`t tell him or if you try to cut and run and
pretend that somehow that you`re against it or you changed your mind, you
know, voters are going to end the end vote for the real Republican, not the
ersatz are made up Republican.

In 1994, when Bill Clinton was in trouble on this, I wrote this in The
Daily Beast, when Clinton was in trouble, a lot of Democrats run away from
him. And you know what? A lot of them lost.


SHRUM: It was people who stood up for their beliefs, stood up for their
record, people like Ted Kennedy in Massachusetts, by the top of his race,
it was life against Mitt Romney, Chuck Robb in Virginia, Paul Sarbanes in
Maryland, who didn`t walk away from their beliefs, who actually did very
well in that election.


SHRUM: So history suggests that what Democrats ought to do is stand up for
what they believe in. That`s the best way to win. Cutting and running
isn`t the best way to win. Being defensive isn`t the best way to win.

Look, Obamacare is going to be an issue in this election. I think your
voters in that focus group in Florida are right. Right now, the jury`s
out, they`re not sure what they`re going to do. Republicans are going to
try to push them on this issue. But Democrats have all the high cards
here. Because the details, which you`re right, are not very deep, are the
heart of the mater. And Democrats have to campaign on that.

SCHULTZ: And I see that some Democrats are just fixated on running home
saying that they are going to run on fixing Obamacare. I mean, I just
think that just plays into the negative that one of the reasons why they`ve
held 50 somewhat votes on the House is because they want to fix it and then
it`s being supported by -- some of these says, "Well, I want to go back and
fix it." What does that do?

SHRUM: That`s what I mean by a purely defensive post (ph).


SHRUM: You know, I don`t want to replace it, I want to fix it. No, take
your opponent and say, "This guy voted to say that the insurance companies
could cut off your insurance when you`re really sick, when you have cancer,
when your wife has cancer, when your kids have some kind of terrible
disease." I think you hold them responsible for that. It`s the same kind
of fight we ought to make, for example, on the minimum wage and
unemployment compensation.


SHRUM: We got to hold these folks responsible for the positions they`ve
taken and not let them operate at the surface level where they say, "Oh, we
don`t want the government interfering with your healthcare which is not
what`s happening at all. All the government is doing is preventing
insurance companies from interfering with your healthcare."

SCHULTZ: Bob Shrum, always great to have you with us, always excellent
analysis. No question about that. Thanks so much.

SHRUM: Thanks Ed.

SCHULTZ: Remember to answer tonight`s questions there at the bottom of the
screen. Share you thoughts with us on Twitter @EdShow and on Facebook. We
want to know what you think.

Coming up, bad trade deals are threatening the way of life for residents in
American`s cities where manufacturing provides the economy`s backbone.

I went to Lorain, Ohio to talk with frustrated workers about the cities
once booming steel industry. More from our series coming up, "Fighting
Chance: American Steel."

Still to come, first, Senator Mary Landrieu says the tar sands produces the
cleanest barrel of oil in North America. Well, I`ll ask a professional
about that when we come back. Trenders is next, stay with us.


SCHULTZ: Time now for the Trenders social media action. Here`s where you
can find us and I appreciate you being part of the Ed team,, and You can catch me
on the radio on SiriusXM Channel 127, Monday through Friday, noon to 3:00.
May radio podcast, you can get on my radio website at

Ed Show social media nation has decided. We are reporting. Here are
today`s top Trenders voted on by you.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Show me the money.

SCHULTZ: The number three trender, lotto loot.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Across America with mega jackpot, it`s mega million.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: How rich can you get?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The jackpot now estimated to $400 million.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Dollar, dollar bill, you all.

SCHULTZ: Someone could become a mega millionaire tonight.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Chances of winning the big money, one in 258 million.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I like those odds.

YOLANDA DENNISON: $400 million will make my nice retirement.


SCHULTZ: The number two trender, foe sure.

colored glasses when it comes to Russia.

If this is, without question, our number one geopolitical foe.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Does this mean Mitt Romney was right?

SCHULTZ: Mitt Romney takes on President Obama`s timing on foreign policy.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The Obama Administration enacts (ph) sanctions against
11 people.

further sanctions.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If we stay our ground and we ratchet (ph) up the
sanctions, we can make Russia pay enormous cost.

SCHULTZ: And today`s top trender, clean and unclear.

looked at this issue of -- if oil-sands oil different from other oil.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oil that is black gold, Texas (inaudible).

SEN. MARY LANDRIEU, (D) LOUISIANA: The Keystone Pipeline will transport
safely the cleanest barrel of oil produced in North America.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have heard that one.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m sure it`s practically safe for droit (ph).

SCHULTZ: Questions surround the safety of tar sands oil.

POURBAIX: The U.S. Academy of Science based on absolutely no material
difference between oil-sands oil or any of the other oils.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Tar sands are among the dirtiest and most carbon
intensive fuels.

POURBAIX: This issue, it is nothing but a red herring.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Tar sands have 17 percent more carbon emissions than
regular oil crude.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This creates a huge pile called pet coke, carries
heavy metals throughout communities. This is very bad for people`s health.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A thin whole leak can empty 700,000 gallons of crude
oil a day.

LANDRIEU: The cleanest barrel of oil produced in North America.


SCHULTZ: Joining us tonight on the Ed Show is Alexander Pourbaix. He is
the executive vice president and president of development for TransCanada.
Mr. Pourbaix, great to have you on the Ed Show tonight. I appreciate your

I want to get right to the quality of the oil. Is the tar sands oil the
cleanest barrel of oil produced in North America? That was the claim made
by Senator Landrieu of Louisiana. And what`s your response to that?

POURBAIX: You know, Ed, I think this debate over oil and the relative
dirtiness of oil is far over state. Let`s be clear, oil is oil. The State
Department in the -- any of the several environmental impacts statements
that they did on the Keystone Pipeline, most notably that finally I asked,
came to the conclusion that a barrel of oil from the oil sands is about 16
or 17 percent more carbon intensive than the average barrel of oil refined
in the U.S.

I think the important thing to remember is we`re not displacing the average
barrel of oil refined in the U.S. We`re going to be displacing heavy oil
imported out of Venezuela, in Mexico, and even an oil from California. All
of those oils have basically the exact same chemical composition and the
exact same CO2 intensity.

SCHULTZ: But isn`t that a statement that you would rally around that it is
going to be the cleanest barrel of oil produced in North America? I mean
it`s either true or it`s false.

POURBAIX: You know, my take on this, and I think, once again, people are
missing the bigger picture here when it comes to a barrel of oil. It
doesn`t matter what kind of oil. On average about 70 or 80 percent of the
emissions from a barrel of oil don`t come from the production, the
refining, but they come from the combustion of that oil as refined products
in a car, in a vehicle. And if you really want to go after CO2 emissions,
you got to go after those tailpipe emissions setting in and splitting atoms
over differences between oils that are almost identical. I just don`t
think it`s very productive.

SCHULTZ: But you have someone in the United States Senate who was making a
statement, an absolute, is the way it comes across, and I will have to say
that you have not confirmed that tonight. You have -- you will give me a
true or false on that. I mean it is either cleaner than Venezuelan oil or
it isn`t. It`s either the cleanest barrel produced in North America or it

POURBAIX: Sorry, if I wasn`t clear on that. I think it is absolutely
identical to Venezuelan heavy. It`s identical to heavy from California or
Mexico. You know .

SCHULTZ: Well, that would not make it the cleanest that it would be, you
know, and exact is what people are looking for in this, because the
environmental conversation both with your country in Canada and the United
States need to be on par. What about the dangers to the environment? Is
there no more danger to the environment with tar sands oil than any other
oil that comes in?

POURBAIX: No. Ed, I think, we can really take a look at the findings of
the State Department in those exhaustive environmental impact statements.
They looked at everything to do with the oil that`s going to be moved by
this pipeline. And they came to the conclusion that to the extent the oil
is moving, Canadian oil-sands oil, there is no difference in terms of leaks
in pipelines, no impact on the environment. They take a look at this issue


POURBAIX: . exhaustively and they found no difference, whatsoever.

SCHULTZ: But they did not address water in the aquifer being exposed to
the risk. And this is what has got a lot of Americans who are very
concern. I know that there`s already one Keystone Pipeline over the top.
They`re saying why do another one? Can you guarantee that there will be no
health risks with the pipeline going over the aquifer?

POURBAIX: Ed, actually, I would disagree with that first comment of yours.


POURBAIX: The State Department in fact did look specifically at the issue
of oil spills over the Ogallala Aquifer. And they came to the conclusion
that in the unlikely event that there was a very large scale spill above
the aquifer that at best it would only move several hundred feet down
grade, a gradient in the aquifer. And I think it`s important for your
viewers to understand that aquifers are not giant tanks of underground
water. What they are, is water saturated rock and gravel. Oil moves
through this incredibly slowly.

And just a final point, there are thousands of miles of oil pipelines that
presently cross the aquifer. None of them are safe as the Keystone XL
Pipeline will be. And those pipelines have safely delivered billions of
barrels of oil. This is not an issue that I think your viewers need to
have a great deal of concern over.

SCHULTZ: OK. Alexander Pourbaix. I appreciate your time tonight on the
Ed Show and we`ll have you back. Thanks so much for joining us. Coming up

POURBAIX: Thanks Ed.

SCHULTZ: You bet. Coming up, the American Steel industry is the best to
the world. But bad trade deals are threatening the great American
industry. More from our series, "Fighting Chance: American Steel." And
later, an abandon gas station filled with radioactive material, this is
what happens when the oil industry is allowed to operate without
regulations. This is a classic example of that.

But next, I`m taking your questions, Ask Ed Live coming up in the Ed Show
on MSNBC. We`re right back.


SCHULTZ: Welcome back to the Ed Show. Love hearing from our viewers, love
the questions. Ask Ed Live.

Our first question tonight comes from Dan. He wants to know, "Why is it
that Democrats only turn out in presidential elections?"

Well, I know that history is not on the side to the Democrats in off-year
elections, but the fact of the matter is that in 2006, the Democrats took
over the House and Bush was in for another two years after that. So that
midterm election went very well for the Democrats but they were running
against a very unpopular war and a very unpopular president.

It was in 2008 and `10 and `12 was when all the Gerrymandering took place.
Now the presidential elections obviously the popular vote, things are a
heck a lot of different. But when it comes to House I think that this
Gerrymandering can work one of two ways. It`s either really going to
motivate Democrats to come out and do something about it and overcome the
Gerrymandering or they`re going to get apathetic. And I hope they don`t.

Out next question is from India. "Do you believe the Malaysian flight will
eventually be found?" Yes I do. I do think that they will get a
conclusion on this and find this aircraft.

Let`s just hope that they`re pulling the Tom Hanks in -- on an island right
now, grilling seafood. Our series "Fighting Change: American Steel"
continues next.

Stay with us.

MARY THOMPSON, CNBC CORRESPONDENT: I`m Mary Thompson with your CNBC Market

Stocks climbing for the second straight day with DOW adding 88 points, the
S and P gaining 13, and the NASDAQ finishing up with 53.

Federal Reserve Policy makers begin a two-day meeting or begin a two-day
meeting today and it`s expected another round tapering will be announced

Meanwhile, housing starts fall for the third month in a row but permits
which are assigned at future activity rose more than seven percent.

Lastly, Oracle shares are lower following the software company`s latest
earnings report.

That`s it from CNBC first in business world wide.


SCHULTZ: Welcome back to the Ed Show.

You hear it all the time, politicians in Washington D.C. talk about
protecting the middle class, middle class jobs, middle class Americans.
But when this country enters into bad trade agreements, it cuts right down
to those middle class jobs on Main Street.

Tonight in our part two of our series, "Fighting Change: American Steel",
we`re taking you to the City of Lorain, Ohio. It`s a once thriving city
built on steel and now Lorain is struggling in the aftermath of lousy trade


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m third generation steel worker and this is what we
know on the City of Lorain, steel. We`re considered the melting pot.
We`re so diverse as far as heritage and nationality. And steel is Lorain.

SCHULTZ: For more than 100 years, United States Steel has called the City
of Lorain, Ohio home. In 1894, the Lorain facility was founded as a rail
mill. It became part of U.S. Steel corporation in 1901. And in1903 Lorain
Steel Company produced its first piece of pipe.

For most folks in Lorain steel is more than just a business it`s their
family, it`s their community, and it`s their way of life.

ANDY RAMOS, USW LOCAL 1104: Loraine had a long history of steel making.
And I`m third generation also. Both of my grandfathers worked in the mill,
retired from the mill. My father worked in the mill.

STATE REP. DAN RAMOS, (D) LORAIN, OHIO: Steel, they -- except before, the
history of American steel is the history of City of Lorain. It`s the same
thing, it`s one -- one goes hand and hand. But we need to look at it, not
just its history, but steel should be our precedent, should be our future.

You know, the people of Loraine, these guys are resilient. You know, we`re
hardworking people, we`ve always have been. We are a people of many
things, you know, with our hands, we`re people who know the meaning to hard
work, you know, my families worked in that mill and my families, you know,
been here the same amount of time the steel mill`s been here and there`s a
reason for that.

PATRICK GALLAGHER, USW: Lorain is a steel town an auto town, it`s an
industrial town. It`s actually used to be known as Ford`s second city.
Fold had a big plant here that closed down about 10 years ago. We still
have a Ford plant located down in Avon which is suburb Lorain.

But Lorain was a huge powerful industrial town in its day. And last
investors we have is our steel mill and we want to continue to keep that
going because the community depends on that tremendously for the economic

SCHULTZ: That way of life came under attack when China flooded the global
market with below-cost steel.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In your particular industry, the capacity to produce
steel in China is expanding significantly, is that accurate?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. Chairman, it`s extraordinary.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The expansion of their steel productive or capacity is
outstripping their objected domestic of demand, is that fair (inaudible)?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That`s absolutely the case. They`re the most
underpriced market on the globe today and it`s the consequence of over

SCHULTZ: Domestic production took a hit. And thousands of Ohioans were
left without jobs. From 2008 to 2012 almost 30 percent of Lorain residents
found themselves living below the poverty level.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You could go down to 28th Street when I was a young
man, there was clubs all over, there was store all over, you know, it`s a
different economy because people were working. One guy supports probably,
I don`t know their math in that one but about 10 jobs.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This was a beautiful community. And it has overtime
disintegrated. The interest and development of manufacturing is gone. So
the basis for American life, the American way is gone with our jobs. So
you look around not only in this organization that we`re in, in this place
that we`re in, when you look at out community, you know, when we grew up,
this is not the Lorain we grew up. Manufacturing is the backbone.

SCHULTZ: U.S. steel won the trade case against the Chinese dumping. The
steel city of Lorain got a second chance.

Today, Lorain tubular operations employs 700 workers and has annual
production capability of 780,000 net tons of steel pipe. The expansion of
horizontal shale drilling in the United States has filled a strong demand
for OCTG steel pipe products over the last few years. It should be Lorain,
Ohio`s chance to shine. But their way of life is under attack yet again.
This time thanks to South Korean steel.

RAMOS: We saw this just five or six years ago. In 2008, we saw Chinese
dumping steel into the United States. We found a solution that we have to
tear it, put into place to regulate the system. Basically to make it so
that everyone was one a level playing field. As soon as that happens,
American steel started to rebound. We were down, you know, basically most
plants in the United States were under 30 percent production at that point.
Almost everyone was laid off here in Lorain, all around the country. We
saw all these mills being -- everyone was laid off, a few people

Now, what we`re seeing is it`s the exact same situation just six years
later, now it`s with Korean instead of China. So what we need to do is
look at what we did then and do the same thing.

SCHULTZ: Through thick and thin, the steel workers of Lorain Ohio are
proud of what they do and they aren`t going down without a fight.

DAN VORHEES, PRESIDENT, USW LOCAL 1104: Until we get public service who
say, "Your a family is important as mine and mine is important as your".
We`re always going to be in this fight. His brother`s family is just as
important to mine, and mine this important as his, and we`re in this fight
together and it is fight.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It could be with anybody in the world, the quality that
we have here, and we make it best in America. We can compete with anybody,
a little playing field if you give us the opportunity to compete fairly.


SCHULTZ: And tomorrow night, we continue our series here on the Ed Show, a
phenomenal investment by United States Steel Corporation of over $200
million in the City of Lorain Ohio. They`re banking on America. They`re
banking on American workers. That`s story tomorrow night.

Coming up, in the oil rich states, a lack of oversight can turn dangerous.

Bismarck Tribune Reporter Lauren Donovan, uncovered an abandoned building
where oil companies have illegally been dumping radioactive waste. She
joins me ahead of the Ed Show.

Stay with us. We`ll be right back.


SCHULTZ: And the Pretenders tonight, bad business.

Phil Jensen the South Dakota States Senator wants to put discrimination on
the books. That`s right.

Jensen went one step further than the Arizona failed Senate Bill 1062. He
sponsored legislation explicitly allowing merchants to deny services based
on sexual orientation.


STATE SEN. PHIL JENSEN, (R) NORTH DAKOTA: Love is not on trial here. As a
follower of Jesus Christ I am commanded to love, to love everyone. That
does not mean I must condone the lifestyle choices that certain groups of
people choose. The GLBT movement doesn`t just want society`s approval.
They want their lifestyle choices plotted, they want standing ovation, if I


SCHULTZ: Well, the bill failed but Phil Jensen is still standing by the
propose law.

He says raising religion should be free game for discrimination as well in
an interview where he professed his love for unpasteurized milk and drug
testing welfare recipients. Jensen also says the KKK should be able to run
a bakery of bigotry.

Phil Jensen wants to dish out discrimination, but if he thinks voters well
dump the Civil Rights Act for his hot plate of hate he can keep on


SCHULTZ: Welcome back to the Ed show. This is the story for the folks who
take a shower after work.

A dangerous situation is unfolding in the State of North Dakota, the State
of course is booming with oil. In fact, North Dakota is the second largest
oil producing state in this country after the State of Texas.

It`s an anti-regulation Republican-led state with pretty much the mindset
if you can drill it you can do whatever you want with it.

The state also has a massive surplus and a very small oil extraction tax
which is added up over the years. North Dakota State Budget Director
estimates the general fund surplus will be at $457 million when the two
year budget cycle ends on June 30th of the next year.

Now, one of the buy products of all the drilling is several dozen tons of
what`s known as nets known as filter socks. Now, these socks are being
just throw away everyday.

The socks basically are used to capture the solids in the waste water used
in hydraulic fracking. The filter socks are a notorious source of radio
active material. They concentrate naturally occurring radiation from
geology down in a well-hole.

Now North Dakota State health department says the filters should not be put
in landfills anywhere in the state. Instead, they should be handled by
certified companies for disposal on hazardous waste sites in other states
around the country. That`s not happening.

Oil companies are cutting corners and socks are being dumped illegally.
Thousands of pounds of potentially radioactive filter socks were found on a
rural property in South West of Watford City just a few weeks ago.
Bismarck Tribune Reporter Lauren Donovan wrote about the dangerous findings
in an abandoned gas station in a place known as Noonan, North Dakota.

Lauren Donovan of the Bismarck Tribune joins us tonight for more on the
story. Lauren, good to have you with us tonight. Excellent work as
always. How dangerous is this?

LAUREN DONOVAN, BISMARK TRIBUNE REPORTER: Well, that`s the tough question
to answer, Ed.

Part of the problem with the radioactive filter socks in North Dakota is
that there is not a lot of really good data yet about how radioactive they
really are. Now, at the present time, North Dakota State Health Department
has hired a national laboratory that will be doing a lot of testing on
various materials from the oilfield including filter socks and at the time
when that study is concluded we`ll know a lot more about the radioactivity.

We do know that they tend to be higher than background and they tend to be
in some cases pretty high or pretty hot as it work.

SCHULTZ: So these socks are not supposed to be handled the way they`re
being handled right now. There is a real danger to it?

DONOVAN: Well, yeah. I mean, nobody should be around these socks. People
should not be injecting or inhaling, you know, if they touched them they
shouldn`t obviously put their hands in their mouth. So yeah, there is a
need for care.

The State Health Department estimates that about 27 tons of these socks are
generated everyday in the oilfield. It`s not known because we don`t have
any rural system for tracking where they go and how they get there. So
it`s not really known how much of this is illegally dumped in a way that
you described.

But we know obviously that some of it is. The state health department
thinks that more -- most of it is properly handled. So this incident, you
know, I`ve only covered two incidences of this severity so though
ultimately that would tell us that most of the time these are being put
where they`re supposed to go.

SCHULTZ: Well, it seem to me the state officials would know exactly who`s
supposed to be handling this stuff and what they`re supposed to be doing
with it which the question begs our regulations and the oversight basically
keeping pace with the growth of the oil and gas industry in North Dakota.

DONOVAN: Well, you know, Ed, you know. You know North Dakota very well
too and you know that 70,000 square miles is the size of North Dakota
15,000 square miles as the size of the Bakken Oilfield. Right now we have
about 185 rigs in there. We have hundreds of service companies. We have -
- I mean there are more moving parts in the oilfield than there are in a
net of centipedes. And so, I think a very difficult to know exactly which
companies are handling all of these products.

So at some point it might be required that that kind of registration occur.
Right now, it does not.

SCHULTZ: All right. So what`s the reaction of the residents on the heels
of this story? This is something that no one knew was taking place.

DONOVAN: Well, I can`t say that nobody knew that this was taking place.
The scale of these two incidences was very surprising. But we know, we
found in the past or we`ve covered in the past that these filter socks
which contains some level of radioactivity have been found in community
dumpsters. They look -- I don`t know if you`re showing any pictures here
today .

SCHULTS: Yes we are.


SCHULTS: Yeah we`re showing pictures of them right now. It doesn`t look

DONOVAN: Well, they are pretty. But -- they look a lot like a butterfly
net that a child might, you know, pick up and use or a little net that he
might want to use to trap minnows or something like that. So there`s a lot
of worry that in this sort of community settings and community dumpsters
the children might actually play with these.

So they`re--they shouldn`t be left out where the public can .


DONOVAN: . interact with them.

SCHULTZ: All right. Lauren Donovan, I appreciate your time tonight.
Great reporting as always. I think that this is really a classic example
of what happens when oil gets its way, there`s a lack of oversight big
time. There should be some regulation on this. It`s kind of like cleaning
up after work, isn`t it?

That`s the Ed Show. I`m Ed Schultz.

Politics Nation with Reverend Al Sharpton starts right now. Good evening,


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