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PoliticsNation, Wednesday, July 30th, 2014

Read the transcript from the Wednesday show

July 30, 2014

Guest: Carmen St. George, Faith Jenkins, Emanuel Cleaver, Chadwick

REVEREND AL SHARPTON, MSNBC ANCHOR: Good evening, Ed. And thanks for
tuning in. I`m live tonight if Birmingham, Alabama. Where we`re kicking
off a nationwide effort to fight for voting rights. We`ll have more on
that later in the show.

But we start with breaking news in the House of Representatives where we`re
awaiting a vote to authorize a lawsuit against President Obama. Remember
Republicans want to sue President Obama for delaying part of the health
care law. Something they wanted in the first place. Democrats blasted the
plan as the cheap political ploy.


REP. JACKIE SPEIER (D), CALIFORNIA: The only other group of people I know
who scream they want something then throw a tantrum when they get it are

REP. LOUISE SLAUGHTER (D), NEW YORK: A political stunt. Time it peak in
November as Americans are head together polls in midterm elections.

REP. STENY HOYER (D), MARYLAND: It is wrong. It is a waste of time. It
is a waste of money. It is a destruction from the important issues, so
important to our people.


SHARPTON: As house Republicans waste time on this stunt, President Obama
told them to do their job and lighten up.


Stop just hating all the time. Come on. Let`s get some work done


SHARPTON: The President wants to work on the economy, on jobs, on real
issues. But the house doesn`t.


OBAMA: The main vote they scheduled for today is whether or not they
decide to sue me for doing my job. No, no, no. First of all -- first of
all, here is something I always say. Do not boo -- vote.

But think about this. They announced they will sue me for taking executive
actions, to help people. So, you know, they`re mad because I`m doing my
job. And by the way, I`ve told them, I said, I`d be happy to do it with
you. So the only reason I`m doing it on my own is because you don`t do


SHARPTON: They won`t do anything. And today one Republican congressman
showed what this lawsuit is really about. He said they would vote no
because they should really be impeaching the President.

Quote, "why not impeach instead of wasting one million to two million of
the taxpayer`s money. If you`re serious, use what the founders of the
constitution gave us."

They aren`t serious about this. They are serious about attacking the

Joining me now, is Jess McIntosh and Jonathan Capehart. Thank you both for
being here.



SHARPTON: Jess, the vote on the lawsuit is under way. But isn`t it all
about throwing a bone to the right wingers who want it impeach him?

MCINTOSH: That`s the absolute only upside. So I have to say, yes. All I
can think is that House Republicans like their caucus exactly the way it
is. They don`t want it to get any bigger. They don`t want to let anybody
else in. Because all this will do is turn off voters in November.

2014 is supposed to be their year. They have the map. We`re talking about
mid terms and is it a Republican wave? And it seems like the house
Republicans are just doing everything they can think of to make sure that
no voter want to elect another Republican.

SHARPTON: You know, Jonathan, conservative talk and Republican lawmakers
have been talking about impeachment for years. But now, some climb the
President is behind this talk. Listen to this.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The President of the United States is cynically
suggesting a constitutional crisis in order to fatten the bank accounts of
democratic fund-raising groups. This man is playing with the American
people by suggesting a constitutional crisis. Shame on him.

ridiculous game by the President and his political team to try and change
the narrative, raise money and turn off their base for an upcoming election
that they feel is not going to go their way.


SHARPTON: Now Jonathan one say that Ryan might want to dismiss
impeachment, but he can`t.

I want to read you your piece, a quote from your piece. Ryan said that
none of what Republicans rail against rises to the level of high crimes and
misdemeanors. But with all of the alarm talk about the President, how does
Ryan expect the less grounded of his caucus to be content with the lawsuit
that won`t punish Obama while he is still President, if at all? Have GOP
leaders like Ryan lost control of the base, this they really have to
create, Jonathan?

CAPEHART: That presumes they had control over that base to begin with.
Look, we have known for a long time that Speaker Boehner is actually
following his caucus ever since the debt ceiling crisis of about three
years ago, this time, 2011, when he and the President couldn`t do the grand
bargain. And then we saw it again in stark relief when the speaker told
the American people there will not be a government shutdown and yet a
government shutdown happened.

Speaker Boehner, in pursuing this lawsuit against the President, a lot of
people think it`s his way of trying to let off some steam of those folks in
his caucus who want to impeach the President. But as I have written and
you just read, thank you, on the show just now, when they realize, when
folks realize that, one, this case may not see the light of day in terms of
being heard by a judge. But two, even if it is the outcome will probably
be -- will come. The case will be resolved long after President Obama has
left the White House, they are going to demand that President Obama be
impeached now.

And so, that`s why, you know, coming election is so important because the
one thing that Republicans who have been calling for impeachment,
especially those in the house and including Senator Ted Cruz over there in
the Senate is that because Democrats control the Senate right now, even if
they have the votes to impeach in the house, which you only need a simple
majority to do that in the house, that it wouldn`t go anywhere in a
Democratic-controlled Senate.

And so, if Republicans take over the Senate in November after the midterms,
I think guaranteed that there will be a move to impeach the President.
That psychological barrier of the Democrats holding the Senate will be
gone. And that`s why you see Democrats jumping to raise money off the
increased chatter of impeachment. And quite frankly, to be perfectly
honest, you know, Democrats would -- should be sued for malpractice if they
didn`t do this. You know, Karl Rove is trying to --

SHARPTON: Well you know, you know at the same time, Jess, let me just
break if here, Jonathan. Because at the same time, Jess, Republicans seem
to be try to have it both ways. They are saying that impeachment is still
valid. But it won`t happen. I mean, listen to this, Jess.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There might be a ton of proof there to say, hey, he
might qualify for impeachment. Democratic strategy, like key right now as
basically drawing up faux fear in terms of an impeachment call when this is
just a call to actually hold the President accountable.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: People make the case for it, but have you --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You can absolutely make a case.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Have you heard anyone in power in Washington, anyone,
privately, publicly, actually make that case?


SEAN HANNITY, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: But no one is calling for -- Sarah Palin
brought it up. I actually agree on the legal side that there`s merit. But
politically, nobody supports it because it would back fire and boomerang.


SHARPTON: I mean, aren`t they trying to have it both ways, Jess?

MCINTOSH: Yes. And they are doing a poor job of it.

Jonathan is absolutely right. There are already top tier Senate
candidates, Joni Ernst in Iowa on the Republican side, who seem open to the
idea of impeachment. So yes, they are absolutely trying to court it.

The thing is, though, Jonathan is also right about them having the bases
just run away. Anybody who thinks that the establishment is still in
control isn`t paying attention to what`s happening either on the campaign
trail or in Congress.

I mean, we know what voters want to hear in order to turn out in November.
We know that women are the key to reelection. We know that they care about
ending gender discrimination in pay. We care about raising minimum wage.
We care about economic opportunity. Access to women`s health care.

This is not rocket science. Every single poll tells you exactly the same
thing that voters want to hear. But Republicans aren`t able to deliver on
any of the issues. So in order to fill a vacuum, they come up with suing a
President and talking about impeaching him. So I`m not sure where they can
go in order to woo voters that they need to win in November, but this
strategy isn`t doing anything other than appealing to that base that is
already completely co-opted them.

SHARPTON: But Jonathan, the voters going down now as we speak. But this
is really a joke, this lawsuit. The fact of the hatter is, is that the
house voted on this Republicans voted to delay the employer mandate last
year, 229 Republicans voted for it. Today they`re voting to authorize a
lawsuit against President Obama for delaying the employer mandate that they
voted that he should delay. I mean, shouldn`t they be happy? They got
what they wanted.

CAPEHART: Well Rev., that`s a logical question for a caucus and base where
logic does not apply. This case here, is that Speaker Boehner is saying he
is sticking up for legislative prerogative, congressional prerogative,
because they passed the law, which Republicans don`t want, and yet the
President using his own executive authority, decided on his own, they say
to delay the employer mandate. And so, they say because of that, because
of that, he trampled over congressional prerogatives and so they want to
fight on these grounds to protect at.

It`s bananas. And you know, I talked to constitutional law professor
Lawrence Tribe over there at Harvard. And you know, he gave me four
reasons, I`m not going through all of them, but the number one reason that
he doesn`t think this case will even have standings is because in order for
someone to bring suit someone has to show they`ve been personally injured
by the action.

It`s going to be almost impossible for Congress, for House of
Representatives to show that it was personally harmed by the President an
employer mandate that many people say that he had the authority to do just
by nature of the legislation.

SHARPTON: Well, I think I can show people personally injured by their
wasting time on a vote on the lawsuit, it won`t vote on immigration and
vote on jobs and vote on infrastructure. But I`ll have to leave it there.

Jess McIntosh and Jonathan Capehart, thank you for your time tonight.

MCINTOSH: Thanks, Rev.

CAPEHART: Thanks, Rev.

SHARPTON: Coming up, much more of today`s breaking news. Republicans
voting to authorize a lawsuit against President Obama. Shouldn`t they be
focused on creating jobs, not court filings?

Also, I`m here in Birmingham, holy ground for the civil rights movement, to
talk about the next phase of the struggle. A new national campaign begins

Also, my interview with Chadwick Boseman, the star of the new James Brown
Biopic. Get on up. It`s a big show tonight. Stay with us.


SHARPTON: Breaking news from Washington. Republicans in the House are
voting to authorize the lawsuit against President Obama, a new low in their
attempts to stop his agenda. Don`t think have anything better to do? Like
maybe work with him on creating jobs. That`s next.


SHARPTON: We`re back with breaking news. Watching the house vote on
Speaker Boehner`s phony lawsuit.

Republicans are playing political games in Washington. While out in the
reel world, the economy is growing by leaps and bounds. Under President
Obama, the economy is continuing to recover from the Bush recession
expanding by an impressive four percent last quarter. And newly revised
numbers show the last half of 2013 saw the fastest growth in a decade.

Today, President Obama called on the GOP to stop with the political stunts
and start focusing on fairness.


OBAMA: So far this year, Republicans and Congress keep blocking or voting
down just about every idea that would have some of the biggest impact on
middle class and working class families. They said no to raising minimum
wage. They said no for fixing our broken immigration system. They
actually voted to give another massive tax cut to the wealthiest Americans.
They haven`t been that helpful. They have not been as constructive as I
would have hoped. America deserves a raise, and it`s good for everybody.


SHARPTON: A minimum wage hike should be a no-brainer. And yet,
Republicans aren`t just blocking progress. They are actually trying to
roll it back. By attacking the safety net. Today Congressman Paul Ryan
trashed the new health care law`s Medicaid expansion.


size fits all top down expansion, which is going to be an unfunded mandate
for Obamacare expansion which is top down dictated by federal government --


SHARPTON: Paul Ryan`s attack on the Medicaid expansion is not just out of
touch. It`s out of date. Forty nine years ago today, President Johnson
signed Medicare and Medicaid into law. Since then, those programs have
helped millions gain access to health care. Half a century later,
Republicans are still on the wrong side of history. They need to drop the
absurd lawsuits and support an agenda that helps real people.

Joining me now is Jared Bernstein. Thank you for being here.


SHARPTON: Jared, are you surprised at how well the economy is doing with
Republicans more focused on Republicans than jobs?

BERNSTEIN: Somewhat. In fact, last year, Congress was whacking pretty
hard with what we call fiscal drag. That is their policies were actually
slowing down economic growth. They actually heard the President talk about
that very compellingly today. And yet, as you mentioned, the second half
of last year was pretty strong.

The first quarter of this year was a anomalous quarter, very weak. But we
bounced back nice in the second quarter. And the underlying pace of job
growth, has also accelerated. In fact, in the first six months of this
year, we have added more payroll employment than any other first half of
the year going all the way back to the late `90s. Yes, the economy
(INAUDIBLE) despite the fact that Congress, as the President said,
certainly isn`t helping.

SHARPTON: You know, here is what Republicans in Congress have blocked or
suggested this year. They blocked minimum wage hike. They blocked the
fair pay act. They refused to spend jobless benefits. And some have
called for repealing Dodd-Frank.

As an economist, what goes through your mind when you see an economic
agenda like that.

BERNSTEIN: I`ll tell you exactly what goes through my mind. It`s a return
to the battle days in a sense. So think about the repeal of Dodd-Frank.
Well, for that matter, the efforts, I think you said 50 vets earlier in the
show to repeal the affordable care act. We know that we absolutely need
financial oversight if we don`t want a speculative market to go off the
rails in such a way that it brings economy to its knees the way we saw in
the late 2000s.

We also know that recovery act -- excuse me, the affordable care act is now
leading to a considerable coverage among people who previously couldn`t
afford it. So it`s interesting. You listen to the President today. And I
thought he gave a great speech. I mean, he really seems to nailed this bit
about the lack of cooperation from Congress. Even be a isn`t their
cooperation, he`s made real progress and they seem to just want it claw it

SHARPTON: You know, recently President Obama has been taking aim at a new
target and namely big corporations, not paying their fair share of taxes
here in the United States. Here`s what he said today.


OBAMA: There`s a loophole in the tax code that lets a small but growing
group of corporation leave the country -- they declare themselves no longer
American companies, just to get out of paying their fair share of taxes.
They take the advantages of being an American company, but now get out of
paying taxes. It isn`t right. Not only is it not right, it isn`t right.


SHARPTON: You know, Jared, did this tax avoiding strategy known as tax
inversion. And it`s expected to cross the U.S. treasury almost $20 billion
over the next decade unless the loophole is closed. Now, how bad is this
practice and will Republicans join with Democrats to put a stop to it?

BERNSTEIN: Well, let me start from the end of your question there. I
mean, while that is precisely what Congress ought to be voting on right
now, closing this tax avoidance aversion loophole, You have been focusing
on your show tonight, on what they are focusing on, what they are voting
on, which is suing the President.

You are absolutely right and the president says but let me make one thing
very clear. They are talking about reincorporating under another country
with a lower tax rate. That`s what this inversion thing is all about. But
the business doesn`t move. The business stays here. So it is pure tax
avoidance. And the tax code enables this. All the President is saying is
let`s close an obvious loophole. One that is costing us revenue on the
bottom line and is allowing these firms to reincorporate overseas when all
of the business is staying here.

SHARPTON: Jared Bernstein, thank you for your time tonight.

BERNSTEIN: Thank you, Rev.

SHARPTON: Still ahead, breaking news from the house floor. Republican
voting to authorize a lawsuit against President Obama.

Also, my interview with Chadwick Boseman, who plays James Brown in the new
hit film "Get On Up." stay with us.


SHARPTON: We`re following breaking news. The house voting to authorize
Speaker Boehner`s lawsuit against the President. Extremists in the GOP
have been champing at the bit for a radical attack like this. And now,
Speaker Boehner is officially enabling them. It`s a busy night. More
straight ahead.


SHARPTON: Breaking news. Republicans have just cleared the threshold
needed for the bill authorizing a suit against President Obama. Coming up,
we`ll get reaction from democratic Congressman Emanuel Cleaver.

But first, we turn to a high profile murder case out of Detroit. After
five days and more than 20 witnesses, today the prosecution rested in the
trial of Theodore Wafer. He is charged with second degree murder and
manslaughter for shorting to-year-old Renisha McBride on his front porch
last November. This morning, Wafer`s defense team tried to offer a
startling new theory on the case. While cross-examining the chief
investigates in the case, the defense suggested that another person might
have been on the scene trying to break into Wafer`s house with Renisha


CHERYL CARPENTER, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: You got information there could have
been someone else at the scene. Did you tell the officer that there was
somebody that you thought there was somebody else. But he said somebody
else was running from the scene at 5:00 a.m.

says, it`s the defendant out there at like 4:00, 5:00 in the morning.

UNIDENTIFIED WOMAN: He clarified in a statement with the police that
(INAUDIBLE) the investigators have the wrong day. He did have information
that there could have been somebody else there. And he didn`t follow up.
And I can just do it like that.

UNIDENTIFIED WOMAN: You`re going to lie to the jury and say it is someone
else and not the defendant? I mean, that`s ridiculous.


UNIDENTIFIED WOMAN: I know but my argument is that there a suspicious --


SHARPTON: The judge ruled the defense couldn`t introduce this strange new
theory of another person at the scene. But now that case is in their hand.
How will lawyers for the shooter try to prove self-defense? Well, Theodore
Wafer testified.

Joining me now, criminal defense attorney Carmen St. George and former
prosecutor and MSNBC legal analyst Faith Jenkins. Thank you both for being



SHARPTON: Faith, what do you make for the defense attempt to introduce
this new theory. I mean, was it a desperation or was it a smart move?

JENKINS: I actually think it is a smart move on their party, they could
get that evidence in. It`s all about ramping up the level of danger. That
Mr. Wafer felt at the time and therefore justifying his actions. So if you
can argue the only thing scarier than one Renisha McBride, would be two. I
also think it is important because there is one undisputed, there`s couple
of undisputed facts in this case. One of them is that Renisha McBride was
knocking on the front door of that home at 4:30 in the morning.

And the argument, the common sense analogy, analysis to that argument is,
if someone is going to break into your home at 4:30 in the morning, they
are doing it because they think you are sleeping or because you`re not
home. So why would someone knock on their front door and alert you that
they are about to break in? It doesn`t make sense with their theory that
she is knocking on the front door of that home if she is about to commit a
burglary. So, it helps them to argue that someone else was possibly there
helping her.

SHARPTON: Well, Carmen, also talking about common sense, if she had a car
accident, they are going suggest if they get it in some kind of way. They
plan to have a car accident and that they used the car accident to go break
into someone`s house. Even if they got some valuables, they didn`t have a
car to leave with it. I mean, it just doesn`t have a lot of logic to this

GEORGE: It doesn`t have a lot of logic if you believe that set of facts.
But what about the point that he can testify, if he takes the stand, or if
can establish to other evidence that he heard knocking on the side door.
He heard knocking on the front door. That made him feel that there may
have been more than one person. You add that testimony or evidence
together with footsteps on an air conditioner on the side, who knows if
there was a getaway car with five guys in it and she is the ploy to bang on
the door and he comes out and faces this. He has no idea. All the defense
is trying to prove --

SHARPTON: So, he wrecked her car, they might have been a getaway car. Was
also set up for somebody that they don`t even know if he had anything.

GEORGE: We got to work with what we have. Where was she for the three
hours? We don`t know. We only can work with the facts that we have and
the testimony and the evidence that this end can present.

SHARPTON: Faith, let`s look at some of the key points that we`ve raised in
this trial so far. Both sides have argued about the gun discharge. Was it
an accident or was it delivery? The defense has focused heavily on
McBride`s past and the quality of the police investigation. And we have
learned that there were no fingerprints or evidence of break-in at the
scene. Based on this evidence so far, how do you see the trial moving

JENKINS: Well, first, I think that the defense focusing on whether or not
there were fingerprint at the scene is really a nonissue. No one is
disputing that Renisha McBride was there. No one is disputing that she was
knocking on the door. So, the defense just want to have a distraction and
say the police didn`t do their job. When it really doesn`t matter. The
fact is, she was knocking on the door and then she was shot after Mr. Wafer
opened the door. So, the main issues still his intent in that moment, was
he in imminent fear of death or great bodily injury.

As for as the accident or intentional shooting here, that`s an issue that
Mr. Wafer is going to have to deal with. Because the state is arguing that
he acted unreasonably. He had other options. He didn`t have to shoot this
young woman in the face. And it is almost as if he knew that himself the
night of this incident because he tells the police and the 911 operator,
well, I didn`t even know there was a round in the chamber. The gun
accidentally went off. I think that supports the state argument that he
knew that there were other options and he overreacted. Now of course, he
has come up with this self-defense case, which I think he will have to
testify in order to get a self-defense charge before this jury.

SHARPTON: I`m going to have to leave it there. Carmen St. George and
Faith Jenkins, thank you both for your time tonight.


GEORGE: Thank you.

SHARPTON: Coming up, the Justice Department jumps into the fight over
voter ID in two critical swing states. The fight is why I`m here in
Birmingham tonight.

Also, my interview with the man who stepped into the James Brown dancing
shoes. Chadwick Boseman, the star of "Get on Up" is next.


UNIDENTIFIED MAN: I`m going to quit.

UNIDENTIFIED MAN: Get up and quit, that`s it.

UNIDENTIFIED MAN: Funk don`t quit.

UNIDENTIFIED MAN: Afraid not Mr. Brown.

UNIDENTIFIED MAN: I said, are we done?

UNIDENTIFIED MAN: I think we got more funk in the trunk.


SHARPTON: We`re back with tonight`s big breaking news. Republicans have
just approved a bill authorizing a suit against President Obama.

Joining me now is Congressman Emanuel Cleaver, democrat from Missouri. The
congressman was with President Obama today in Kansas City. And flew back
to Washington on Air Force One. Thanks for being here.

REP. EMANUEL CLEAVER (D), MISSOURI: Good to be with you, Reverend.

SHARPTON: Congressman, what would you say to your republican colleagues
who voted to authorize this lawsuit?

CLEAVER: Well, first of all, I think it is very, very silly. Jim Clyburn
has suggested that we not call it frivolous. That we ought to take it
seriously, that there is still a very real interest and intent on
impeaching the President of the United States. Now I personally believe
that if that`s their plan and it is very likely is their plan, that that`s
one of the best things that could happen to us. And, you know, sometimes
Reverend, the squeaky wheel doesn`t get the grease.

It`s so noisy for so long that it simply gets replaced. And as we approach
the November elections, we could have replacement that this kind of silly
noise continues. I can`t afford voted against this and watched people.
Many of whom actually believe that they have a legitimate reason. They`ve
been drinking their own kool-aid. They actually believe that they have a
legitimate reason to impeach the president for doing his job.

SHARPTON: Well, some squeaky wheels are squeaking because they have come
off the wagon. But let me ask you this. When you look at what is required
for impeachment, high crimes and misdemeanors, how do you even entertain
seriously that the president moving forward in the way he did even remotely
comes near that?

CLEAVER: Well, most of the constitutional lawyers that have been speaking
with us, coming over here on the hill, talking to us, think that there are
so many flaws in this idea, that they are essentially impeaching the
president because they don`t like him. Because when you look at the list
of some of the executive actions that have been taken by presidents in the
past, nobody ever thought about impeaching FDR, for example, who used an
executive order to actually imprison Japanese in World War II or the
emancipation proclamation or desegregate the military.

And so, you know, I don`t know, you have to have some standing in the
lawsuit, we`re told. And I`m not sure that there is any standing. And you
have to prove that you`ve been injured. So who`s been injured, you know,
in Kansas City today, there are thousands of people out cheering the
president, particularly when he`s told them that, you know, they are voting
to impeach me or sue me and they haven`t voted on increasing the minimum
wage. They haven`t voted on trying to get some kind of a plan through for
an extension of the highway bill. We`ve done absolutely nothing, Reverend.
And I think it is an insult to the people of this country.

SHARPTON: We`ve got to go. But do you think, let me ask you this quickly,
do you think they will ever actually go to vote to impeach the president?

CLEAVER: I think that the base is demanding it now because they are giving
false hope that it is possible. So, I think they are going to do it. And
if they do, I think people can get ready to dance in Washington in January
because I think that the House will turn over to Democrats. No question
about it.

SHARPTON: Congressman Emanuel Cleaver, thank you for your time this

CLEAVER: Good to be with you, Reverend.

SHARPTON: We`ll be right back, with my interview of the star with the new
James Brown film "Get on Up."


SHARPTON: You have probably seen me talk a lot about James Brown in the
past. He was like a father to me. He was a great influence on my life and
of course, he revolutionized music. He was called the Godfather of soul.
The hardest working man in show business. Inspiring everyone from Michael
Jackson to Mick Jagger. Now, that amazing story is on the silver screen.
Actor Chadwick Boseman stars as James Brown in the new film "Get on Up."


UNIDENTIFIED WOMAN: What exactly do you call your style of music?

JAMES BROWN, ACTOR (MAY 1933-DECEMBER, 2006): Well, I got a James Brown
music, because it is so far ahead of its time. Ain`t got a name for it
yet. Take another record, any record you got on your box at home, it ain`t
going to sound like mine. Not even my old records sound like this new bag.
Papa`s got a brand new bag. The bag is in the bag and the bag is in base
and the base never changes. It`s a groove. Soon as you heard that groove,
I know I got you.


SHARPTON: Boseman plays James Brown from age 16 to 60 and perhaps even
more impressive, he mastered all those famous dance moves. Check out this
behind the scenes footage from the film.


SHARPTON: Joining me now is the amazing Chadwick Boseman. Star of the new
biopic, "Get on Up." It`s an honor to have you on the show tonight,

CHADWICK BOSEMAN, ACTOR: It`s an honor to be here, man. An honor to be

SHARPTON: What was it like it take on the role of James Brown for this

BOSEMAN: I had the time of my life. Stepping into this man`s shoes.
Learning about him. Learning the dances. Talking to family members. Talk
to Tommy Ray (ph), talking to Dee Dee Brown, to Deanna Yamma (ph), Jason
Brown, his grandson. It was just the time of my life, and I you know, I
cherish it, I really do cherish it, man.

SHARPTON: Now, you know I had apprehensions about the film, even though I
was there with Mr. Brown when he started to talking to the producers many
years ago about doing it, but you captured it. And one of the hardest
things that I really didn`t think could be done was trying to get those
dance steps down. But you did it. Let me show a clip.


SHARPTON: How did you get yourself prepared to do those James Brown dance
steps that no one can do?

BOSEMAN: Well, I had to get up in the morning and sweat. You know, I
laced them up, and we had an amazing choreographer, AJ and he just put me
through it five hours a day, five days a week. And then he would send me
home with homework. And I would look at footage and continue to dance at
night. So, it was probably around seven, eight hours a day, of just
movement. And once the first two weeks, it was really tough. I was
aching. I was in pain all the time. And as I told you, when we were
together, that I would have dreams -- I had a dream about him. And he came
to me and he said, you know, you`re going to be good. You`re going to be
real good. But you ain`t going to be as good as me. And after that, you
know, I just threw myself into it.

SHARPTON: Well, I can tell you, if he said, you`re not going to be as good
as him, that was definitely him.

BOSEMAN: That was him.

SHARPTON: You know, one of the things, though, I know about him, he was a
perfectionist, and he drove the van hard. And you captured that in the
movie. Let me show a scene of you being James Brown on his van and how he
was a hard it is a tock master.


UNIDENTIFIED MAN: We can`t play that. We can change the part if you like.

UNIDENTIFIED MAN: Did I say change the part? Huh? Fellas, does it sound


UNIDENTIFIED MAN: Does it feel good?


UNIDENTIFIED MAN: God made your ears. You didn`t make them. You going to
argue with God`s ears? If it sound good and feels good, then it`s musical.
So play it like I say play it.


SHARPTON: Why do some of the things, Chadwick, like that, that out of your
research you learn about James Brown.

BOSEMAN: I think the first and foremost, just seeing how his background,
seeing that as a kid, you know, he was abandoned by his mother for a period
of time. He was abandoned by his father for a period of time. Even though
his father went into the armed forces and the sent money home, you know, he
was raised in a brothel. And so to see his individual spirit. The spirit
that rose first probably out of loneliness, and then rose out of the
perseverance, the ability to survive, what was created. You know, that the
type of thing that gives an actor, you know, everything that they need.

He is the type of person, type of character, that you look for, in terms of
roles. So, that there is that. Then there`s his individual spirit. You
know? He is a person who would be against Vietnam but then would go play
for the troops. You know, he is a person that would make a song, like "I`m
black and I`m proud" but then he would play for Nixon`s inauguration. So,
he had an individual spirit. He didn`t look at things, the way that the
politics works today is a very polarizing thing. And we need people like
James Brown really in the Congress and in House right now. Sort of that
individual spirit to make America what it should be.

SHARPTON: And he definitely was an inspirational film, because through it
all, he persevered and you captured that. And as I said, he meant a lot to
me personally. In fact, something I didn`t tell you and Mick Jagger when
we were talking that night, the last time he sang on stage, this is a
picture of it, he came for my birthday ten years ago. And he sang on stage
happy birthday to me. That`s the last time he was on stage live at the
Apollo. But I want to tell you Chad with I learned a lot from him about
determination and inspiration, but I learned how to do a few moves too.
You think you can move? Let me show you this.

Right on the set there.


I did the James Brown there right on POLITICS NATION. So, I just want you
to know, I`m not as good as you, but can I do James Brown too. Chadwick
Boseman, thank you for your time tonight. And be sure to see him as James
Brown in "Get on Up" opening this Friday.

BOSEMAN: All right. Thank you for having me.

SHARPTON: Still ahead, remembering what happened here in Birmingham half a
century ago. These pictures shocked America. And now it`s time to
remember that sacrifice and renew the struggle.


SHARPTON: Children here in Birmingham, Alabama earlier today. Where I am
tonight in my role as president of the National Action Network. Today was
the ribbon cutting for our freedom summer national headquarters. I met
with our chapter leaders, local officials and activists to talk about
voting rights. Birmingham is hallowed ground for the fights for civil
rights. The sacrifice of activists on the streets changed America forever.
But some in Alabama, trying to turn back the clock. I talked about that
earlier today.


SHARPTON: The same forces that wanted to deny our fathers and mothers the
right to vote are trying to suppress our vote today. The same forces that
sicced dogs on us in Birmingham 50 years ago, they are slicker now, they
sent their kids to college, so they don`t call it in raw terms now. It is
more polished. But it`s the same impact.

This year, Alabama enacted our strict voter ID law. And lawmakers are
trying to make it harder for groups to hold voter registration drives. New
voting restrictions have been passed and pending in 15 states to be in
place for the first time this November. This is why we must stay vigilant.


SHARPTON: Today, the Justice Department submitted filings in voting rights
cases in both Ohio and Wisconsin. Continuing the effort to enforce the
remaining parts of the voting rights act against restrictive state laws.
The battle continues. That`s why we`ll be training volunteers at -- new
headquarters here in Birmingham, teaching folks how to register voters,
fight voter suppression and help get people to the polls in November.
People died, white and black, to give us the right to vote. They shed
blood. We cannot now 50 years later allow that to be wiped away. We will
not face dogs, we will not face the hoses from the fire hoses of police.
We only face our own apathy and our own lack -- that everyone of us has an
obligation to make America continue to work for everyone.

Thanks for watching. I`m Al Sharpton. "HARDBALL" starts right now.


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