Show: THE ED SHOW
Date: November 24, 2014
Guest: Daryl Parks, Michael McBride, John Garamendi, Reese Halter
SCHULTZ, MSNBC HOST: Let`s get to work.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: An announcement by the St. Louis County prosecutor is
expected later today.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They have reached a decision...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A very intense situation out in Ferguson, Missouri.
PRES. BARACK OBAMA, UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: ... to engage in a
conversation between law enforcement and communities of color...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Tensions continue to mount...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This time it`s kind of like waiting for a hurricane.
OBAMA: Keep protest peaceful.
MICHAEL BROWN SR., MICHAEL BROWN`S FATHER: Hurting others or destroying
property is not the answer.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I have sons who looks like Mike Brown.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There`s more positive things happening in our community
versus just violence and rioting.
OBAMA: Using any event as an excuse for violence is contrary to rule of
law and contrary of who we are.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCHULTZ: Good to have you with us tonight folks. Thanks for watching.
Obviously we start with big news out at Ferguson, Missouri tonight. We are
expecting an announcement sometime very soon by the St. Louis County
Prosecutor. The grand jury has made a decision. The announcement of that
decision is expected later this evening.
The grand jury could indict Officer Wilson on a range of charges. It could
include 2nd degree murder, voluntary manslaughter and involuntary
manslaughter, any of those.
Police are preparing for protests. On Sunday some officers in Ferguson,
Missouri moved to longer 12-hour shifts. Police have setup a command post
in a shopping center a few blocks from where the protest took place after
the shooting back in August.
At least one school in the area canceled classes for today and tomorrow,
Tuesday of this week. Other schools are preparing for schedule changes as
well. School officials want to limit students from walking through
suspected protest areas.
This past weekend was mostly quiet in Ferguson, Missouri. Protests were
limited and the only two people were arrested on Saturday for just blocking
traffic. On Sunday, President Obama urged protesters to keep
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OBAMA: I think, first and foremost, keep protests peaceful. You know this
is a country that allows everybody to express their views but using any
event as an excuse for violence is contrary to rule of law and contrary to
who we are.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCHULTZ: Michael Brown`s father is also delivering a plea for peaceful
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN SR.: I thank you for lifting your voices to end racial profiling and
police intimidation. But hurting others or destroying property is not the
answer. No matter what the grand jury decides, I do not want my son`s
death to be in vain.
I want it to lead to incredible change, positive change, change that makes
the St. Louis region better for everyone. We live here together. This is
our home. We are stronger united. Continue to lift your voices with us
and let`s work together to heal, to creating lasting change for all people
regardless of race.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCHULTZ: Tensions are no doubt high in Ferguson, Missouri as they of
course await the announcement from the grand jury. In the meantime gun
sales have increased in the area. Businesses are boarding up windows and
there is a general sense of unrest in Ferguson and the surrounding cities.
For more let me bring in Brown Family Attorney Daryl Parks. Mr. Parks good
to have you with us tonight here on the Ed Show, I appreciate it. This
really is the moment of truth for many Americans. It has gone to the
highest level of responding from the President of the United States. I
mean the country is watching this.
Your sense on the way this has all unfolded and the timing of the grand
jury. In your opinion has this taken longer than normal or is this a
normal time and also a Monday announcement. What do you think?
DARYL PARKS, BROWN FAMILY ATTORNEY: Well Ed, I have to tell you. Having
spent a tremendous amount of time with the Brown family especially as we
traveled all over the country a couple of weeks ago. This anticipation has
really worn on them. And that it`s been far too long to get to the answer
and get to the bottom of arresting the killer of their son.
Remember, Michael Brown Jr. was killed on August 9th of this year. We`re
now at November 23rd -- 24th right now. It`s been a while, where this guy
continues to go free. They are very unrestful and had been very unrestful
for many months now given the fact of this injustice. So, they have not
rested well as a result of all of these.
SCHULTZ: Mr. Parks does the family know what the decision is?
PARKS: No they don`t, the decision is -- we got, shortly I guess around
3:00 or 4:00 today, around 3:00 roughly was a phone call from the D.A.`s
office that it would be announced later on today. We certainly believed
that they should have been told more than just that. In fact we believed
that they should have come in and talked to them about the process and
what`s about to take place rather than just a phone call.
But, you know, the Brown family has said to us, so often that they do not
like how they have been treated as this process has gone along.
SCHULTZ: So the Brown Family tonight they`re news consumers just like you
and me? They`re being treated just like...
PARKS: Very much so.
SCHULTZ: ... the general public that their not -- OK. I want you to
explain that. What do you think of that?
PARKS: Well it`s not good. I mean I think that the tradition in this
country Ed is when you have a person whose victim we accord victims great
rights throughout this country. Most prosecutorial offices have victim`s
advocates who go around and pretty much walk the victims through the
process at every turn. At least that`s what I`m accustomed to in our
And so, we believe in this case here that that`s what should have taken
place. However this family is very leery of the prosecutor in this case.
They are very leery of the leaks. They are very leery of the process and
the approach that he has taken to deal with this case.
For example, when you think about the fact that he has chosen to put all
the evidence in this case in front of the jury rather than what he believes
he needs to get a prosecution. The fact that he has chosen to let them
decide for themselves rather than to give them direction clearly makes this
family very leery of his desire to prosecute and to give an indictment in
this case of the officer.
So, those are concerns that they have maintained. Those concerns continue
to this day of their great concern about whether or not this prosecutor has
moved forward with zeal in trying to get an indictment in this case for the
killer of their son.
SCHULTZ: So, hours before the grand jury announces its decision, is it
safe to say or correct to say that the Brown family really isn`t happy with
anything that`s come down here. All the way from the Governor, the way
he`s handled it. The NAACP CEO and President Mr. Brooks told me today that
there were five complaints that were brought against prosecutor before
Michael Brown was ever shot, that there had been problems in the past.
But as this has gone on there really isn`t anything that the Brown family
is really pleased with when it comes to the handling of the grand jury or
law enforcement. Is that a fair statement?
PARKS: Well, I think their focus is more so on the prosecutor. I mean,
they obviously have some feelings with were other toward governor and
towards law enforcement. But I will say this here though, Ed they have two
main concerns, number one is the fact that how this prosecute has going
forward in setting the process to properly indict the person the killed
Number two, they have continued to try and make sure that they are safe as
this process is going on. Obviously they have been -- there are some in
the community there who don`t see eye to eye in terms of -- with them and
things that have taken place there in Ferguson and throughout the St. Louis
Well, I think you obviously going to have people who some side with the
Officer, some side with Mike Brown`s family. However, this family has one
main focus and their focus is this, they want to see an indictment because
they believe that the process and the trial of this evidence of this case
should not be something that`s done in secrecy but should be done in the
public trial after indictment takes place.
PARKS: And so they`re moving forward if there will be an indictment and
then that will be able to move to a public trial so that we all can see the
evidence. And one important thing Ed, in this situation, I think that its
important that the whole American public see all the evidence in this case
and that this case not be decided by one prosecutor, a small grand jury in
a vacuum in a back room. This shouldn`t be a back room situation.
SCHULTZ: All right, Attorney for the Brown family, Daryl Parks with us
tonight here on the Ed Show. Mr. Parks, appreciate your time. Thanks for
spending some time with us this evening.
Let me bring in Reverent Michael McBride who is the Director of the PICO
National Networks Live Free Campaign and also with us tonight Dr. James
Peterson, MSNBC Contributor and Director of Africana Studies at Lehigh
University, gentlemen, great to have you with us tonight.
There are expected to be protests in about 100 cities across the country
tonight. New York City is preparing. They are expecting about a thousand
protesters. Mr. McBride what are we going to see across the country
tonight given any kind of decision, your thoughts?
MICHAEL MCBRIDE, NATIONAL PICO NETWORK: Well I believe that what you will
see -- what we all will see is a continued commitment to justice, a
continued commitment to calling for the end to the rogue police officers in
our communities who continue to shoot and kill members of our communities
who are unarmed.
We`re going to continue to see non-violent and peaceful demonstrations I
believed very similar to the over 100 days of non-violent people
demonstrations that are calling for justice for Michael Brown and his
family. We continue to stand with them and pray with them, but I believe
you`ll see that spirit all across the country and we all should be so proud
that young people and people in our communities are being so engaged around
something so important at this moment in time.
SCHULTZ: Reverend McBride, if there is no indictment of the officer in
question, Officer Wilson, if he walks, are we to believe the these protests
are going to remain peaceful? And that`s a question I think everybody is
afraid of. That`s a question that we really don`t know what`s going to
happen. Do we or are we confident as a nation that we`ll be able to talk
through this and protest through this?
MCBRIDE: So, let`s be clear. All we have to go off is our history. Now,
it is clear that in the first day or so, there were indeed some elements in
the crowd who were engaging in certain acts of violence and destruction.
But those vary members were controlled by members in the crowd who were
committed to nonviolence peaceful protesting.
And this continue line of questioning continues I believe to dehumanized
these community and all of the young people who for over 100 days have been
training, having committing themselves to nonviolent protest and being met
with militarized responses and force that we think is immoral and it is an
So I am confident that the young people that we`ve been meeting with and
working with, the clergy leaders. Folks, hundreds of people going through
nonviolent training everyday to be able to hold their emotions in the face
of what we do not anticipate or can expect. None of us have a crystal ball
but we can go off of the history of 100 days, no fatalities. Less than, I
think $1 million worth of destruction compared to billions of dollars of
destruction in other cases. This has been a largely nonviolent...
MCBRIDE: ... response and I believe that will continue.
SCHULTZ: Hopefully, that`s the way it will be. Dr. Peterson, how do you
see this playing out? I want to go back to a comment that Congressman
Emanuel Cleaver said on this program the other night. He`s from Missouri,
represents the folks down there in Missouri.
He said that these protesters are not your John Lewis` protesters. He said
that these are kids who are being tired of being shot at. What`s your
response to that and how do you see this playing out tonight?
JAMES PETERSON, MSNBC CONTRIBUTOR: Well I think, a couple of things, I
think Reverend is -- that Reverend McBride is right that that there`s been
a huge effort on the part of grassroots organizers to train young people
across this nation particularly in the Ferguson and St. Louis region on
nonviolent civil disobedient and civil unrest sort of strategic moves.
And so, there`s been a lot of training. Young people are committed to it.
I understand, Representative Cleaver`s comments, he`s right, that young
people are really fed up but it doesn`t mean that they`re not committed to
sort of nonviolent civil unrest.
The real question for me Ed is what kind of presentation is the police
force going to make in the face of these protest? Because, I think a lot
of times, we`re calling for like peace or we`re calling for some semblance
of organized civil unrest on the part of the organizers.
I think we`re getting that for the proponents of the time in which we see
people protesting over these last 100 days. The real question is, are we
going to get law officers there, and do we have confidence in law
enforcement`s capabilities to interact with these folks as if they`re human
beings. And I don`t want to lose the human quality of this whole thing.
The reality of this is, at the end of the day, Michael Brown was
dehumanized and we need to humanize him in his death regardless of what
this grand jury decision is. He was a human being who lost his life for
what -- from as far as we can tell, for no good reason at the hands of law
enforcement. That is disrespectful and it`s awful, and when you look
across this country at Tamir Rice in Cleveland, John Crawford with the Wal-
Mart shooting. You will get Eric Gartner. We can list a whole host of
We have a series problem with policing tactics in these communities.
Police are charged with serving and protecting communities. And what we`re
finding is that that is not at all what`s happening. We have to protect
ourselves from the police.
And so, when I think about these protests, the confidence that I`m concern
about is having confidence in law enforcement to conduct themselves in a
way that it can interact with these protesters as if they are human beings
with the civil rights that all human beings around the world are afforded
and then have the right to in terms of organized protests.
SCHULTZ: Well Dr. Peterson, you bring up an interesting point because in
the midst of all of these there`s going to be a big interpretation made.
Reverend, how much has there been communicated from law enforcement about
what they`re going to tolerate? For every action there`s a reaction. The
first action from law enforcement is that they are heavily equipped and it
looks like there going to be writing for some kind of war zone to break
out. And I think that`s...
SCHULTZ: ... what Dr. Peterson is talking about here is that, what is the
message, Reverend, your thoughts?
MCBRIDE: It has been disappointing at best. We have been meeting members
of the community, the Don`t Shoot Coalition, other members from the ACLU,
been in meetings with law enforcement to take them to get contingency plan,
attempting (ph) to get rules of engagement. There has been a lack of
transparency over the week or so.
One of our clergy leaders out there peacefully protesting, engaging in acts
of civil disobedience and a police officer grabbed her while she was trying
to get out of the street, tore off her clergy vest and called her a devil
and then arrested her.
There`s no accountability. We are concerned about it. Meanwhile the Ku
Klux Klan comes on to this...
MCBRIDE: ... network and begins to talk about how they are planning lethal
force against protesters. It is an outrage. And I am so proud of the young
people and this whole community who have responded with large nonviolent
peaceful protests and I expect that to continue. And we`re calling on the
Governor and all of these elected officials to stand up on behalf of the
community that has elected you and protect us not from one another during
MCBRIDE: ... but from the law enforcement officers who may not be under
control and other folks who are bringing themselves to bring harm. We need
their protection. They don`t need to be protected from the peaceful
SCHULTZ: All right.
MCBRIDE: ... who for a 100 days have held great discipline.
SCHULTZ: Reverend Michael McBride, Dr. James Peterson, I appreciate your
time tonight here on the Ed Show. Our coverage will continue through the
evening here on MSNBC.
We continue to follow the developments out of Ferguson, Missouri. The
grand jury decision will come down at any moment.
Keep it here. We`ll be right back.
SCHULTZ: Welcome back to the Ed Show. We`re awaiting the grand jury`s
decision on a possible indictment of Police Officer Darren Wilson in the
death of 18-year-old Michael Brown last August. Brown`s death reignited
the conversation about police relations in communities of color in this
country. Attorney General Eric Holder traveled to Ferguson after Brown`s
death to meet with local law enforcement.
In September the Justice Department opened an investigation into the town`s
police department sighting deep mistrust between the officers and the
community. This past weekend President Obama said that Holder`s mission
extends far beyond Ferguson.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OBAMA: Part of what I`ve asked Eric Holder to do is to, not just engage
with the folks in Ferguson but to engage nationally in a conversation
between law enforcement and communities of color that often times feel as
if they are not being treated fairly by law enforcement officials.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCHULTZ: I`m joined tonight by Trymaine Lee, MSNBC National Reporter on
the scene in Ferguson. Also with us tonight Mike Papantonio, America`s
Attorney and also host to Ring of Fire Radio, and Joy Reid, host of the
"Reid Report" here on MSNBC.
Let`s go to the ground first. Trymaine is there a real sense of tension.
I don`t think there`s ever been a grand jury announcement that`s gotten so
much attention and so much anticipation before the news has come out. What
is the community like there?
TRYMAINE LEE, MSNBC NATIONAL REPORTER: Right here in Clayton outside of
the Court house it`s still a relatively calm. There are more media out here
than any one else. But just a few miles down the road in Ferguson, and
when you talk to protesters especially those who are veterans of the
protest in Ferguson, they are tens, they are anxious. They`ve been waiting
for this moment for several weeks now.
And so, while we don`t have an exact time of when this announcement will be
made or what that announcement will be. Its kind of palpable because one
thing is, you know, will you have that kind of spontaneous eruption of
angry protests that you had the first time, maybe not.
Now that this movement has kind of matured and they have become more
organized you`re certainly see acts of civil disobedience. But again, how
many people will be out here? You know, how angry will be and what will
the response from law enforcement will be?
We already know that the National Guard has been mobilized. And they`ve
been dispatched around the city to kind of help us supplement law
enforcement. But again what that looks like we don`t know.
SCHULTZ: Well Trymaine, has the relationship between the community and law
enforcement gotten better since the shooting? The visit of Eric Holder,
the mission, the comments of the President, is there more of a togetherness
within the community than what we`ve seen in the past?
LEE: I think early on when you heard Attorney General Eric Holder come out
and the President referenced what`s going on in Ferguson, it went a long
way in giving people a sense that from the highest level of government
people were supporting protester`s rights to free speech. And that there
is something I miss here, illegal, maybe not and maybe so but something was
amiss and they were here to support them.
But in terms of that big abyss, that big gap between the community
particularly the low income, and black community and the police it`s as
wide as ever. And especially that preemptive mobilization of the National
Guard went along way in stoking that kind of flame and so to say that their
But in the wake of all these, organizers and some community leaders had
been meeting with police. And there some seem to be some common ground.
And that common ground is no one wants violence. No one wants any one to
be hurt. But once we get into the thick of it, you know, only time will
SCHULTZ: President Obama put an emphasis on law enforcement building trust
in the minority community. Here it is. I want to play it for you.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OBAMA: In the end, what I have confidence in is that, if we do a better
job of training our law enforcement to be sensitive to the concerns of
minority communities, then over time trust can be built in part because
minority communities typically are subject to more crime. They need law
enforcement more than anybody.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCHULTZ: Joy Reid, there really hasn`t been a real illustration of trust
the way law enforcement has beefed up security with equipment, with
presence. It`s almost like they`re getting ready for some kind of combat
zone. So have we moved forward and have these preparations by law
enforcement been absolutely necessary as you see it?
JOY REID, "THE REID REPORT" HOST: Well it is interesting Ed, because you
have seen this hyper militarization that we saw with the initial protests
in Ferguson. And the response to this impending decision has been more
militarization, more sort of build up the police essentially as to your
point appearing prepare for the worst rather than building a those bonds
and community trust.
But I think that even for this police force, not much can be done if the
local political leadership is not trusted by the community. And I think
it`s been pretty clear from all of our coverage of Ferguson that the basics
sort of bottom line trust that the community had for its city council, for
its mayor is not there, for its police chief is not there. And so that you
wind up having the City of Ferguson have to bring in county law enforcement
and then lay it on the National Guard.
And I think the more different police agencies you bring in, look we were
talking about stories of police officers not wearing their identification
of people feeling like the police were trying to hide their identities of a
really sort of tense attitude coming from officers toward protesters. I
don`t know that I`ve seen evidence that that has changed, but we will see.
I mean once the decision comes out...
REID: ... we`ll see in action whether anything has changed.
SCHULTZ: Mike Papantonio, the legal bar here. You`re of the best in the
country. We know a lot more about this now than we did several months ago.
How was this going to unfold, your professional take on it sir?
MIKE PAPANTONIO, ATTORNEY: Well, the prosecutor in this case, the choice
is first degree murder, second degree murder, involuntary manslaughter.
And I want to add, they had a choice of armed criminal action. Those
choices Ed, are balanced against the argument of self defense and
authorized used of deadly force. In this case, the officer Darren Wilson,
testified before the grand jury.
The real question in my mind is how the prosecutor approached that
testimony. Was there an aggressive cross examination that showed all of
the obvious flaws in Darren Wilson`s story or was it simply a barrage or
softball narratives by Wilson where nobody seriously attacked those
The bar has got to be asking questions, what happened back there in that
room. If he was a believable sympathetic witness without an aggressive
cross examination, there is not indictment. That`s going to go beyond
anything that looks like reckless kind of manslaughter at best. It`s
virtually impossible Ed for prosecutor not to get the results he wants in
front of a grand jury.
The bar knows that going into this that`s why this prosecutor should have
never been the person doing this. He has months of face to face
relationship building with the jurors. The juries worked around the
prosecutor so much that they can take leads and signals form his demeanor
on how he emphasizes or de-emphasizes particular testimony or forensic
In addition to that Ed, the jury has clear understanding of what this
prosecutor wants. What`s this -- what`s the political, and social, and
moral ideologies. Now, this prosecutor said, "Well gee, I`m going to break
all the rules and I`m not going to give them any direction at all" which is
crazy, it is insane.
And the point is this I think it`s very interesting that this prosecutor
says, "You know what? If there`s not an indictment, we should open up the
record and let everybody see it." The truth is Ed, you could open up that
record and nobody would be able to tell a thing about what this prosecutor
did to get the result that he wanted in this case.
And I think, everybody that`s an attorney knows that going into it. Darrel
Parks is upset about it. He should be upset. But you know what? This
isn`t over. You still got a Justice Department concerned. You got a 1983
civil rights case. No matter what happens here. But this guy should have
removed himself from day one.
SCHULTZ: All right, Trymaine Lee, Mike Papantonio, Joy Reid, great to have
all of you with us tonight. Appreciate you joining us here on The Ed Show.
Thanks a lot.
Stay with MSNBC as we await the announcement of our decision of the Michael
Brown shooting case.
Plus, the other big breaking story of the day is Defense Secretary Chuck
Hagel. Was he forced out? He did step down. That coming up. Stay with
SCHULTZ: And this programming now tonight, we`re keeping an eye on
Ferguson, Missouri all in, as Chris Hayes will be doing his show from
Ferguson, Missouri. Tonight, the grand jury has reached a decision on
whether Officer Darren Wilson will be indicted for the shooting death of
unarmed teen Michael Brown. The Brown family attorney, Benjamin Crump says
the family has been notified. The jury`s decision is expected to be
announced later this evening.
Law enforcement officials have been preparing for possible demonstration in
response to any grand jury announcement for weeks across the country.
Protests are planned in as many as 100 cities.
NBC News has learned New York City is also gearing up for about 1,000
We`ll bring you the latest right here on MSNBC. Keep it here. We`ll be
right back on The Ed Show.
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(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHUCK HAGEL, U.S. SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: I have today submitted my
resignation as Secretary of Defense. It`s been the greatest privilege of
my life -- the greatest privilege of my life to lead and most important to
serve, to serve with the men and women of the Defense Department and
support their families. I am immensely proud of what we have accomplished
during this time.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCHULTZ: Welcome back to The Ed Show. Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel
handed in his resignation this morning after less than two years on the
job. Hagel, the only Republican on the President`s National Security team
has agreed to stay on until his replacement is confirmed. This morning,
President Obama called Hagel and exemplary Defense Secretary.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OBAMA: Chuck Hagel, I also want to thank you on a personal level. We come
from different parties, but in accepting this position you sent a powerful
message, especially to folks in this city that when it comes to our
national security and caring for our troops and their families we are all
When it`s mattered most behind closed doors, in the Oval Office, you`ve
always given it to me straight. And for that, I will always be grateful.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCHULTZ: And two played nice for the cameras, but Senior Defense Officials
told NBC News Hagel was actually forced to resign. Those official said,
the White House "lost confidence" in the former Nebraska Senator to carry
out his role at the Pentagon. Multiple sources said that Hagel was
originally brought on to "wind down the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan." And
as the fight against ISIS ramped up, he was not as well matched for the
Joining me tonight on a rapid response, Colonel Jack Jacobs, a Medal of
Honor recipient and MSNBC military analyst. Also with us tonight, John
Garamendi, Congressman from California who sits on the House Armed Services
Congressman, let me ask you first. Is it common knowledge amongst those
who sit on armed forces and in Intel committees that there was somewhat but
dissatisfaction with Hagel`s performance? What`s going on here?
REP. JOHN GARAMENDI, (D) CALIFORNIA: No, I don`t think there was. Just
last week, we had the Secretary and General there before us and though it
didn`t appeared to be any discord or any reason to assume that there was
any internal disagreements. Obviously, these are very, very tough issues,
what to do in Syria. What to do in Iraq and beyond. Tough issues of which
I am sure there`s going to be disagreement. But there was no sign of it in
any of the hearings as we`ve seen just last week.
SCHULTZ: And Colonel, what about that. Were there any conversations in
military circles that things just weren`t right between the two or does
this come from nowhere?
COL. JACK JACOBS, US ARMY IRETJ: No, I don`t think it comes from nowhere.
I think you could tell it from the very beginning that he maybe as not
well-matched, well-suited for that job. He had a very difficult time
getting, during the confirmation hearings. Didn`t equate himself very
well, he seemed confused not really on top of the issues, didn`t responds
very well to questions even among a Republicans -- from Republican.
So from the very beginning, it didn`t look right. I think he was selected
because he was compliant and the President, the White House thought that he
would have no trouble getting confirmed. The hearings not withstanding, he
was confirmed obviously, but I think it was not well-matched for the
And then when the war started to ramp up again, it became clear he was out
of his element.
SCHULTZ: Incompetent it sounds like. I mean Chuck Hagel was a successful
businessman. He spent some time obviously in the United States Senate. He
questioned America and the surge. He said, if we put those guys back in
that meat grinder, we better know what we`re doing. In fact he questioned
authority quite a bit for the Bush Administration and of course he`s a
combat veteran from Vietnam. He knows what those soldiers go through.
SCHULTZ: Do you think administratively he just wasn`t up to it?
JACOBS: Yeah. It`s not enough to be a combat veteran, indeed you had --
two guys were Secretary of Defense, neither one was a combat veteran
Panetta on the one hand Bob Gates on the other and did very, very well
indeed. I don`t think he was aggressive enough.
And he had heard -- being Security of Defense is a very difficult job.
You`re in the middle, you`ve got White House on one side, you have the
bureaucracy of the Defense Department and all these generals and commands
below you and you have to run interference also with the Congress.
The Congress writes the check. At the end of the day these are extremely
difficult times we have, an increasing number of mission, lots and lots of
danger, smaller service, more burden on the services and less money to pay
for it. I think its way beyond his capabilities.
GARAMENDI: I don`t think...
SCHULTZ: Congressman was there a...
GARAMENDI: I don`t think...
SCHULTZ: Go ahead Congressman.
GARAMENDI: I don`t think it`s a matter of capabilities at all. This guy
was very, very capability. He came to the job with a view. He came to job
with a lot of experience not only what was just said. But he also, took
care of soldiers and retirement from the Senate. No he had capability the
question is, what his view of how to precede? Was it the same as the
No, we already knew there were conflicts in the Congress with where the
Secretary thought we ought to go, you just listen to the hiring we had last
week. There were those that want to bomb, bomb, bomb. And, Secretary
Hagel wasn`t going there at least not at that time. And we also know that
the Secretary was not anxious to bring in a lot of troops on the ground in
Iraq and who knows what`s going on Syria.
Those are very significant policy issues, perhaps there was a significant
disagreement between where he wanted to go. But he was a very capable
person, doing a very, very difficult job. A quite correct the deployment
everything from Ebola to what you`re going to do about Ukraine and then the
issue in Asia. A lot of issues out there perhaps, there was a disagreement
on fundamental policy or tactics.
GARAMENDI: And one thing that`s clearly in play is to sequestration. He
made very well, have taken a let`s get rid of the sequestration and maybe
there are others said, "Well, we just going to have to live with it because
that`s the way it is", and maybe he said, "I can`t live with it. I can`t
run this department if there`s going to be sequestration." So we don`t
know, but we`re going to...
GARAMENDI: ... hopefully found out.
JACOBS: Yeah, I was going to say at the end of the subject to talk -- at
the end day...
SCHULTZ: Go ahead.
JACOBS: ... it wasn`t (ph) the Congress who fired the Hagel it was the
President. So, if there are any disagreement is it was between Hagel and
SCHULTZ: OK. Gentlemen I want to talk about what unfolded on Friday. It
was document unlike anything we`ve seen. On Friday the Republican-
controlled House intelligence committee released the results of a two-year
investigation into the 2012 attack on a U.S. diplomatic compound, the
attack in Benghazi.
They found no intelligence failures or cover ups. Republicans are already
trying to discredit the findings. What`s it going to take for Republicans
to drop this? Congressman Garamendi, you know, the news media conservative
side have spend well over 18 months going after the President, going after
Hillary Clinton. Now all of a sudden on the Friday it`s, "Oh we didn`t
find anything wrong." What do make of it?
GARAMENDI: Well, each and every one of these reports came out and they all
said that, "Yes there was a tragedy, yes it was badly handled." But they
didn`t see anybody doing anything wrong or no cover ups has never been
found. But we do know that attacks on American Embassy and councilors are
all too common.
During the Bush years there were 39 such attacks and thousand -- not
thousand but dozen of people were seriously injured and a few killed along
the way. So this is a common thing.
And do keep in mind that the administration prior to the Benghazi thing
asked for more money for security and the Congress, because of
sequestration, because of the austerity budgeting turned down over $250
million that should have gone into security. Fortunately that money after
the fact was appropriated and the embassies and councilors have been better
prepared. But we`re going to continue to see this.
GARAMENDI: These things will happen. And we just do the very best which
we have to.
SCHULTZ: Colonel Jacobs...
GARAMENDI: Go ahead.
SCHULTZ: Colonel Jacobs does anything change now that Benghazi`s been put
to rest. Has it been put to rest as you see it?
JACOBS: Well, it depends on who`s looking at it. For most people it`s
been put to rest, I think for those people who want to pin something on
Hillary its not. But by 2016, I think most people won`t be able to find
Benghazi on the map and they won`t even know where it is or what transpired
there. And I think all the evidence indicates that although mistakes were
made, things could have been done better at the end of the day.
And this is the most important thing and the Congressman brought up there
was no cover up. Its cover up at the end of the day that really make life
difficult for people and it there doesn`t appear to have been one here.
SCHULTZ: OK, Colonel Jack Jacobs, Congressman John Garamendi, I Appreciate
your time tonight. Thank you.
We are continuing the follow the breaking news out of Ferguson, Missouri.
The grand jury has made its decision in the Michael Brown shooting case.
That announcement coming later tonight. Will there be indictment?
Keep it there we`ll have the latest. Stay with us. We`ll be right back in
the Ed Show.
SCHULTZ: Welcome back to the Ed Show. OK, here`s big Eddy`s two minutes
drill. There were some huge plays in the NFL yesterday. But New York
Giants rookie Odell Beckham Jr. takes the cake. Have you ever seen a catch
like this? Beckham made an unbelievable one handed catch against the
Cowboys for a touchdown on Sunday. Many are calling it one of the greatest
catches ever made in professional football.
Giants ended up loosing 31-28. Beckham though, big day at the office 10
receptions, 146 yards and two touchdown so far this session, the rookie got
609 total receiving yards in five tidies on the years. At least the 3-8
Giants had got something to be thankful for on this Thanksgiving. They got
a great wideout.
Now I`ll tell you something. On Saturday I saw this guy play. College
football, everybody is talking about this, Wisconsin running back Melvin
Gordon. This kid is the real deal. On Saturday I sat behind the Badgers
bench where they`re playing at Iowa in Iowa City and the Hawkeyes ain`t
bad. This kid runs for 200 yards and a couple of touchdowns, Wisconsin win
on the road 26-24. The previous week Gordon set an all-time college
rushing record for single game.
The junior run for 408 years and four touchdowns as they beat Nebraska 59-
24, and so far this session Gordon`s run for over 2,100 rushing yards, he`s
got a chance to break very Barry Sanders`s record depending on what he does
the next few games. 25 touchdowns on -- let me tell you, this kid got
talent galore. If there`s a better running back at the country somebody
tell me who he is, Gordon no doubt a top contender for the Heisman Trophy.
The guy got a 2nd, 3rd and 4th gear.
We`ll be right back at the Ed Show. Stay with us.
SCHULTZ: Welcome back to the Ed Show. How can all of these stuff be
happening in the weather yet everything is just normal. The melt comes to
Buffalo. Deathly lake-effect snow storm battered Western New York last
week. Now the region is facing a new worry. Sharply rising temperatures
caused the National Weather Service to issue flood warning. Scientists are
saying climate change is obviously at work. Meteorologist Paul Douglas
told us its all part of our warming climate.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PAUL DOUGLAS, SR. METEOROLOGY, MEDIA LOGIC GROUP: And we actually have
some pretty good data going back to the 1930 showing that lake-effect snow
is on the increase and it probably has something to do with the fact that
the Great Lakes are trending warmer.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCHULTZ: Research of the National Oceanic and Atmosphere Administration
shows 2014 will likely end up being the warmest ever. The agency says
October of this year was the hottest October on record. Glacier National
Park may need a new name. The warming climate is melting the park`s
namesake that`s right, temperatures on the rise. Wildlife is endangered
and the landscape is at risk, anybody paying attention?
While evidence pours in deniers continue to put the planet at risk.
Senator Jim Inhofe of Oklahoma who said on the environmental committee
denounced climate saving action. He called the President`s goal to combat
climate change with China a non-binding charade. Inhofe sees no risk to
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. JIM INHOFE, (R) OKLAHOMA: First of all global warming is not taking
place. It`s kind of laughable right now with all the records that are
being sent -- being set.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCHULTZ: We`re reaching a tipping point for our environment. The science
is clear and the evidence is in our own backyards. For more on this
tonight let`s talk to Reese Halter Conservation Biologist at Muse School
and Author of the Spearheading the Sea -- "Shepherding the Sea" is the name
of the book, excuse me. Reese good to have you with us tonight Doctor, I
appreciate your time.
REESE HALTER, CONSERVATION BIOLOGIST, MUSE SCHOOL: Good evening Ed.
SCHULTZ: Respond to these ridiculous -- respond to these ridiculous
deniers. What`s happening on the Great Lakes?
HALTER: Well, it`s actually -- let me paint you a picture. Let`s go back
three weeks. Three weeks ago we saw one of the strongest typhoons Nuri in
the North Pacific we even seen. It hit Alaska with 50 foot waves. It was
so huge and strong Ed. Its smoke in to the polar jet stream and three
weeks ago it brought the first blob of polar cold air down well into the
Midwest and over your way.
It hit it so hard there are seven waves that go around the world the polar
jet stream. One week later the ricochets came back and last week you all
had cold weather. I`m telling you this climate disruption is very real and
it`s not just about whether, it`s about food.
Look, Buffalo is going to flood but worse around Upstate New York and
Michigan around the lake that`s fruit growing regions, those are apples and
stone fruit. And these trees are getting battered. This is global food
security and it`s laughable that the people in D.C. are sneering and
feeding the disinformation machine right now.
SCHULTZ: Yeah. All right Doctor Halter I want to ask you, there`s a new
study that shows that 40 percent decline in the Polar Bear population.
What`s happening here?
HALTER: Well, I`ll tell you what`s happening. Polar Bears have evolved to
eat seals standing on a huge clump of ice and occasionally going in the
water to get seals. The Polar Bears are now, having to go into open
oceans. They`re not open ocean swimmers. They`re drowning. They`re
And let me tell you how bad it is. My colleagues in 2004 and 2007 started
to track Polar Bear cubs, 7 to 10 years later they were tracking 80 cubs, 7
to 10 years later there is two such cubs still alive. These critters are
done. This is ecosite and by the way since 1970, 50 percent of earth`s
wildlife is gone. And we can`t...
SCHULTZ: All right.
HALTER: ... exist on this planet without Animals.
SCHULTZ: We will continue our environment and climate change discussions
with Dr. Reese Halter here on the Ed Show. I appreciate your time tonight,
thanks so much.
HALTER: Happy Thanksgiving.
SCHULTZ: That`s the Ed Show, I`m Ed Schultz.
"PoliticsNation" with Reverend Al Sharpton starts right now.
Good evening, Rev.
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