PoliticsNation, Monday, February 2nd, 2015

Show: POLITICS NATION
Date: February 2, 2015
Guest: Chaka Fattah, Jared Bernstein, Jon Resnick, Issie Lapowsky. Joan
Walsh, Dana Milbank, Dana Jacobson


REV. AL SHARPTON, MSNBC ANCHOR: Good evening, Ed, and thanks to you for
tuning in.

Tonight`s lead, President Obama releases his plan for a more fair country.
Will Republicans get on board?

The president unveiled his new budget today. An ambitious plan for taking
aim at income inequality. Building on his State of the Union address.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Middle class economics. The
idea that this country does best when everybody gets a fair shot. And
everybody`s doing their fair share. And everybody plays by the same set of
rules. That`s what this budget is about. It reflects our values. Making
sure that we are making the investments we need to keep America safe, to
keep America growing.

And to make sure that everybody is participating no matter what they look
like, where they come from, no matter how they started in life, they`ve got
a chance to get ahead in this great country of ours.

That`s what I believe. That`s what you believe. Let`s get it done.

(APPLAUSE)

Thank you. God bless you. God bless the United States of America.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SHARPTON: The budget contains tax breaks, childcare subsidies, and
education initiatives target at low and middle-income families. It invests
in infrastructure projects and it wipes away those automatic cuts forced by
the GOP Congress.

All paid for by taxing corporate profits kept in offshore havens. Closing
the trust fund loophole and raising taxes on investment gains for high-
income earners.

It`s detailed blueprint for the economy grounded in the president`s vision
of fairness. And yet, even before it was released, Republicans like Paul
Ryan went into attack mode.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. PAUL RYAN (R), WISCONSIN: What I think the president is trying to do
here is to, again, exploit envy economics. This top-down redistribution
doesn`t work. We`ve been doing it for six years.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SHARPTON: Envy economics is a new spin on their tired old claim of class
warfare. But then Congressman Ryan took it even a step further.

Quote, "The Obamanomics that we`re practicing now have exacerbated
inequality. The wealthy are doing really well. They`re practicing
trickle-down economics now."

Now that takes some brass. The same congressman who wants to gut the
safety net and lower taxes on the rich is accusing President Obama of
trickle-down economics? He`s accusing the president of making inequality
worse? Really? Republicans need to put these phony talking points aside
and talk about real solutions for giving a fair shot to all Americans.

Joining me now is Congressman Chaka Fattah, Democrat from Pennsylvania, and
Jared Bernstein, former chief economist to Vice President Biden.

Thank you both for being here.

REP. CHAKA FATTAH (D), PENNSYLVANIA: Thank you, Rev.

JARED BERNSTEIN, FORMER CHIEF ECONOMIST FOR VP BIDEN: Thank you, Rev.

SHARPTON: Congressman, Paul Ryan says the president, Barack Obama, is
practicing trickle-down economics. Isn`t that the oldest trick in
politics, accusing the other side of doing what you`re actually guilty of?

FATTAH: Well, look, these guys have to deal with reality. The president
has laid out his budget. Every dollar he lays out where we need to invest
it. He says we need to move away from mindless austerity to a smart
investment that strengthen our country. So what we have to do now is get
past the rhetoric. They have to put their numbers on the table.

He -- the president says, hey, we need to make permanent my legislation
that created the American opportunities tax credit so that right now
millions of families benefit by it, but it`s temporary. He wants to make
it permanent. He wants to invest in great programs that create workforce
development, job training. So they have to come with what they -- you have
to get past the rhetoric. They`re going to have to put numbers on the
table and join the president in this debate.

SHARPTON: Well, you know, when you talk about numbers on the table, Jared,
let`s look at what Congressman Ryan`s economic agenda is. Not really the
numbers, but his agenda.

BERNSTEIN: OK.

SHARPTON: He wants to repeal the Affordable Care Act. He opposes raising
the minimum wage. He called for cuts to Medicaid, cuts to food stamps, and
cuts to Pell Grants.

Now does that sound like a plan to combat income inequality to you?

BERNSTEIN: No. And if you combine that with his budgets which
consistently cut deeply into programs for low-income people while cutting
even more deeply into the taxes paid by the wealthy, then you have what is
actually trickle-down economics. That`s the definition of it. So he got
trickle-down upside down, and I guess that can happen if you`re just in the
business of saying whatever comes into your head.

I very much like where Representative Fattah is coming from, which is let`s
put the name-calling aside for a couple of days, sit dot down, roll up our
sleeves, and actually deal with some challenges we face.

I actually think Republicans would like to do something on infrastructure
in this country. Perhaps they`d like to do something on educational
opportunity. We know that even Paul Ryan has said he agrees that we should
expand the earned income tax credit for childless adults. So how about
actually doing some work?

I go to work, you go to work, the congressman goes to work. How about
actually stopping with this ridiculous upside-down name calling, getting
together and trying to deal with the challenges that the nation faces?

SHARPTON: Well, and dealing with those challenges, Congressman, is
actually for what the president is proposing --

FATTAH: Right.

SHARPTON: -- something the American people want. When you look at the
items on the president`s budget, 51 percent support his call for free
community college, 66 percent back his paid sick leave proposal, 58 percent
support the idea of closing tax loopholes on higher earners and giving
credits to middle-income families, 73 percent support taxing corporate
profits kept overseas.

Congressman Fattah, are Republicans worried that they`re losing the public
debate on fairness to the president?

FATTAH: Well, it`s obvious, because, you know, the president laid out a
$470 million proposal to improve our roads and our bridges, our ports, our
airports today. The Republicans have been talking about this, but now they
have to come and react to that proposal, and on the president`s point, he`s
made a budget that the numbers work out.

You know, he says, look, we want to -- we want to tax corporate profits
made by American corporations that those profits are held off shore. Let`s
deal with that so that we can fund some of these important programs that we
need funded in our country.

The president is not running for election anymore. He`s running to
strengthen the American economy. He`s done a darn good job so far and it
would be great if we could get some of our Republican friends rather than
try to tackle their own quarterback, to actually work with the president
because we`re competing with our economic competitors abroad. It`s really
not about Democrat and Republican.

SHARPTON: Now, Jared, you talked about the way that some of the
Republicans may work along with some things. You`ve even written about it.
And you highlighted infrastructure investment, raising budget caps,
expanding earned income tax credit, and upward mobility project and anti-
poverty program.

How optimistic are you, Jared, that Republicans will, in fact, come to the
table and try to work around maybe some of these issues?

BERNSTEIN: Well, I would actually put the odds on the first two that you
mentioned that somewhere, perhaps above 50 percent. And I`ll tell you why.
I`m talking about infrastructure and raising these spending caps otherwise
known as sequestration.

You know, we always have to have an obscure word here in Washington for
everything.

On infrastructure, at the end of may, the congressman knows this, the
Highway Trust Fund goes bust. And so we`re going to have to come up with
some way to prevent that from happening so that we don`t have to put a stop
to programs that are actively in place repairing our transportation
infrastructure.

Secondly, when it comes to raising these budget caps, both sides are
chafing at the bit, whether it`s on the defense side of the appropriations,
many Republicans don`t want to see that spending cap bind, or whether it`s
on the nondefense side where you`re talking about health and education
investment, in research, in science, in infrastructure, nutrition.
Obviously many people on the Democratic side want to see those caps go up.
They`ve done it before. There was actually a bipartisan budget plan, Paul
Ryan and Patty Murray did it.

SHARPTON: Yes.

BERNSTEIN: I believe they may go back to that again.

SHARPTON: All right. But, Congressman Fattah, I mean, when you`re
dealing, before we were hearing cut, cut, cut, austerity plans. It`s a
different economy now.

Do you think there can be a deal made? Do you think there can be some
coming together for what the president is proposing?

FATTAH: There will be a deal, Reverend, but let me say this. What the
Republicans want to do is lie to -- not tell the truth to their
constituency, to their base. The president is not a big spender. He`s
never spent one dollar that the Congress didn`t appropriate. That`s number
one. Number two, we`re going to come to an agreement around appropriations
because it has to be done.

SHARPTON: Exactly.

FATTAH: Now we`ll go through the shouting, we`ll go through the back and
forth but at the end of the year, there`s going to be an agreement about
how to move our country forward and the Republicans are not getting
everything they want. The president won`t get everything he asked for
today. But we`ll have a meeting of the minds. We need to make sure that
working people and those struggling to get into the middle class are not
left out.

SHARPTON: Well, I guess the devil is in the details.

FATTAH: It is.

SHARPTON: If you say the meeting of the minds, I just hope as it comes
together, it provides jobs and some basics for the poorest and the middle
class Americans that have so far not gotten the right growth in terms of
this recovery.

Congressman Chaka Fattah and Jared Bernstein, thank you for your time
tonight.

FATTAH: Thank you, Rev. Thank you.

BERNSTEIN: You`re welcome.

SHARPTON: Coming up, Governor Chris Christie and the vaccination debate.
Why he had to clarify a statement today.

And a drone lands at the White House sparking new questions about drone
safety in America.

Tonight, we`ll show you how easy it is to operate drones. Here in the
studio.

And a truly super, Super Bowl. From the catch to the call. To Katy Perry,
to the ads. We`ll talk about it all ahead on POLITICSNATION. Please stay
with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SHARPTON: It was the most talked about Super Bowl ever on Facebook and
Twitter. 28.4 million tweets were sent about the Super Bowl. And 265
million Super Bowl-related posts, comments and likes on Facebook.

The top moments were people liked and talked about Katy Perry`s halftime
show, that game-winning Patriots interception by the now household name
Malcolm Butler. And the moment the Patriots were crowned Super Bowl
champs.

Coming up, we`ll talk about the game, the show, and the controversy. But
please keep those conversations going on Facebook, or tweet us
@politicsnation.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SHARPTON: We`re back with growing questions about the potential uses and
abuses of drones. The Super Bowl on Sunday was declared a no-drone zone.
Last week, a drone crashed on the White House lawn, and another crashed
near the U.S./Mexico border loaded with six pounds of meth.

The FAA says drones can be used only for personal use, but everyone from
photographers, to conservationalist, to real estate agents, wants to use
them for commercial purposes. Amazon even wants to test drones for
delivering packages to customers.

But what about privacy? And security?

We`ve already seen that a drone can be modified to carry a paint ball gun
that accurately hit its targets. Recently I talked with Jon Resnick who
works for the company that makes the drone that crashed at the White House
and I asked what they`re doing to prevent another accident.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JON RESNICK, DJI MARKETING REPRESENTATIVE: It`s actually an extension of
our no-fly program that we started last year, and expanding it to the D.C.
no-fly zone was pretty much a no-brainer.

SHARPTON: How easy are these drones to learn to fly?

RESNICK: Well, they`re easier than older style RC aircraft, the
traditional model aircraft, but they still take some practice.

SHARPTON: Let`s see it fly.

RESNICK: Here we go. Now you can see I can control how high it goes, how
low it goes, left, right, forward, back. It normally will use GPS
technology to know its position in space, but right now we`re indoors so
it`s going to tend to wander around a little bit.

SHARPTON: But you`re controlling all of its movement?

RESNICK: Yes, I am, with these sticks right here. So --

SHARPTON: How long can one of these fly over us?

RESNICK: Our battery -- we promote our battery life for as long as 25
minutes, but in reality, it really depends on how you`re flying it, what
the weather conditions are like.

SHARPTON: All right. We`ll bring it down so we can talk a little bit.

RESNICK: Yes. Potential uses are myriad. All kinds of folks are looking
at using these, besides just, like photographers, we`re talking about
search and rescue folks, agriculture, conservation, forestry.

SHARPTON: How difficult is it to modify a drone? After the White House
incident, we heard people talking about whether you can attach an explosive
or something to one.

RESNICK: I can`t speak for other manufacturers, but we work all the time
at maintaining the security of our drones, the software security of our
drones so that they`re very difficult to actually alter.

SHARPTON: Let`s see it fly again.

RESNICK: All righty. Here we go.

SHARPTON: Jon Resnick, I appreciate the demonstration. Both of them.
Thank you for your time.

RESNICK: Not a problem.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SHARPTON: Joining me now is Issie Lapowsky, staff writer at "Wired"
magazine. The February issue of "Wired" is out now, and features an
article on the use of delivery drones. And the rise of this technology
around the world.

Thanks for being here, first of all.

ISSUE LAPOWSKY, STAFF WRITER, WIRED: Thanks for having me.

SHARPTON: Do you expect drone use to surge over the next decade?

LAPOWSKY: Oh, absolutely, and it`s only going to get more popular once the
FAA comes out with its rules around drone use. Right now, drones are sort
of in this gray area, people don`t know what is legal, how they`re allowed
to use it and once the FAA releases its rules I think people will be a lot
more interested.

Especially the more people use it and post what they`re doing with drones
on social media as they collect videos and photos. If they`re collecting
with their drones on Instagram, people see it and want to get their hands
on that, too.

SHARPTON: You know, some countries are already allowing drones for
commercialism, like a pizza delivery drone in Russia, you just enter the
coordinates and -- for your location and it lowers a pizza down online, or
an ambulance drone being tested in Belgium that could offer emergency
assistance in just minutes.

What do private companies envision for the future when they think about
drones?

LAPOWSKY: I think that there`s -- everything. I mean, we`ve seen
companies or companies in Bhutan delivering medical supplies to rural
towns. You`re seeing weather photographers who want to use this to, you
know, take really out of control photos. So I think that it really runs
the gamut. And once -- again once these rules are out, then people will
find more and more applications that we never even dreamed of today.

SHARPTON: But how will the FAA address safety concerns? Is there any way
to make sure drones don`t get where they`re not supposed to be? We don`t
seem to have our arms around this yet.

LAPOWSKY: That`s the thing. They`re going to have to release some rules
around how businesses can use it. Already recreational use is legal as
long as you`re flying under 400 feet. Again that`s pretty hard to enforce.
You can set the rule but it`s pretty hard to enforce. There is a lot of
talk of licensing. And we`re not really sure what would go into licensing.

SHARPTON: But there`s the problem, Issie, because if we -- if we`re not
enforcing it, I mean, are fears over malicious use of drones legitimate?
We`ve already seen that a drone can be equipped to deal with a paintball
gun.

LAPOWSKY: I think they`re absolutely legitimate. And this is going to be
an effort not just by the FAA but the National Counterterrorism Center.
They`re going to have to work together because the FAA is used to
regulating airspace. We`re going to need a lot more help to figure out how
to combat terrorism and other misuses.

SHARPTON: All right, Issie Lapowsky, thank you so much for your time
tonight.

And you can read more in the February issue of "Wired " available now.

Still ahead, Governor Christie and the vaccine controversy. Was it a gap
or a play to the base? Also what are people saying about the call? And
Katy Perry`s halftime show.

But first, how Speaker Boehner is a lot like Bill Murray in "Groundhog
Day."

It`s tonight`s "Gotcha."

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He says that -- that he --

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SHARPTON: Ouch. This is the mayor of Sun Prairie, Wisconsin, getting an
earful from Jimmy the Groundhog on this chilly Groundhog Day.

Of course, for many people, Groundhog Day triggers memories of the classic
Bill Murray movie, where he lives the same day over and over again. It`s
kind of like Speaker John Boehner. Threatening to repeal the Affordable
Care Act year after year after year.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. JOHN BOEHNER (R), HOUSE SPEAKER: We`ve made it clear that we want to
repeal Obamacare and replace it. The House will act next week to repeal
the job-killing health care law. This week, the House will vote to repeal
Obamacare. We have voted to repeal Obamacare. We want Obamacare gone.

The House, I`m sure, at some point next year will move to repeal Obamacare
because it should be repealed and it should be replaced. We have 47 new
members of Congress on the Republican side who`ve never had the chance to
cast their vote to repeal Obamacare.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SHARPTON: It`s the same old script year after year. And this Groundhog
Day is no different. Republicans are gearing up to hold their 56th vote to
repeal the health care law tomorrow. A law helping millions of people.
President Obama has promised to veto it, but Speaker Boehner is still
letting it happen.

I`m going to toss it over to Bill Murray to help explain how we should all
feel about this one.

Couldn`t have said it better, myself. But at the end of the movie, Bill
Murray`s character sees the error of his ways and breaks out of the cycle.

I guess that means there`s hope for Speaker Boehner, too, but until then,
as we`ve done year after year after year, we gotcha.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Measles is preventable. I
understand that there are families that in some cases are concerned about
the effect of vaccinations. The science is, you know, pretty indisputable.
We`ve looked at this again and again. There is every reason to get
vaccinated. There aren`t reasons to not get vaccinated.

UNIDENTIFIED WOMAN: Are you telling parents you should get your kids
vaccinated?

OBAMA: You should get your kids vaccinated.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SHARPTON: The issues of vaccinations is becoming political. As the
President was telling Americans to get vaccinated, New Jersey governor
Chris Christie was in England touring a flu vaccine plant, saying this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. CHRIS CHRISTIE (R), NEW JERSEY: All I can say is we vaccinate ours,
so, you know, that`s the best I can give you is my opinion. But I also
understand that parents need to have some measure of choice in things as
well, so that`s the balance that the government has to decide.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SHARPTON: It was a controversial statement that Christie tried to clarify.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHRISTIE: It depends on what the vaccine is, what the disease type is and
all the rest, so we have to have that conversation, but that has to --
that`s the move and shift, in my view, from disease type. Not every
vaccine is created equal. And not every disease type is as great a public
health threat as others.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SHARPTON: It set off a firestorm on social media. With many saying he was
putting public health at risk. Others saying he was playing politics. His
office tried to walk it back with a statement saying, "With a disease like
measles, there`s no question kids should get vaccinated. At the same time,
different states require different degrees of vaccination, which is why he
was calling for balance in which ones government should mandate."

So, what was Christie saying and why was he saying it? Joining me now are
Dana Milbank and Joan Walsh.

DANA MILBANK, THE WASHINGTON POST: Hi, Reverend.

SHARPTON: Dana, let me go to you first. What do you think Chris Christie
was trying to say with these comments?

MILBANK: Well, clearly he`s not up to date on his inoculation for foot and
mouth disease. Because it sounds like whatever he was trying to do, he
flubbed it. So, one suspects he was going at what happened to Rick Perry
in 2012 with the HPV vaccine. And he knows there`s a fringe crowd on the
rights there`s a fringe crowd on the left, too, that has declared war on
vaccine. And he was trying to make a nod to that, but he clearly stepped
in it there and he did something that would indicate to the average
American and the vast majority of Americans understand the importance of
vaccination to suggest that he`s not quite ready for primetime. Not
necessarily that he`s in cahoots with the autism anti-vaccine crowd, but
that he`s not just being very careful before speaking.

SHARPTON: Well, Joan, let me go there. Because this isn`t the first time
Christie has questioned vaccines. In 2009, as he ran for governor, he
wrote that he supported parents who thought vaccines were linked to autism.
Writing, quote, "I stand with them now and will stand with them as their
governor in their fight for greater parental involvement in vaccination
decisions that affects their children." Joan, seems like a lot of flip-
flopping from the governor on whether children should need to be vaccinated
or not.

JOAN WALSH, SALON.COM: I agree. I mean, I don`t think it`s clear at all
what he really believes given that history, Reverend Al. He should have
been careful about it. He also looks kind of frivolous. You know, he`s in
England, great. I guess it`s a trade trip. I don`t really know. He seems
not to realize that back here, back at home in New Jersey, in California,
in New York, we`re concerned about an outbreak of measles and so he seems
to think he can have it both ways, he can nod to the parental choice,
that`s always good for republicans, while saying I did vaccinate my kids.
That`s sloppy. And it`s really irresponsible. And when it`s played back
to back with the President`s clear message, it looks terrible.

SHARPTON: Well, let`s cut to the chase, Dana. What are we looking at
here? Is he playing politics? Is he trying to have it both ways? Is he
trying to not go too far to appease certain crowds as he contemplates and
many of us feel he`s going to enter this race? What`s really going on
here, Dana?

MILBANK: Well, I suspect, and we don`t know what`s going on in that great
brain of Chris Christie, that he is trying to have it both ways and he
wound up making a mistake in the way he spoke. Now, you know, it`s one
thing for Rand Paul to come out and say, you know, parents should have a
choice. He`s a libertarian. But Chris Christie, I mean, do you recall
this is the same Chris Christie who was basically imprisoning this woman
who they thought might have Ebola?

SHARPTON: That`s exactly right.

MILBANK: In New Jersey. Turned out she didn`t. But this is the same
Chris Christie saying, oh, you know, measles, that`s really no problem,
just don`t worry about that.

SHARPTON: He basically --

MILBANK: He`s not going to -- yes.

SHARPTON: He basically had this woman held because they questioned whether
she had Ebola.

WALSH: Right.

SHARPTON: Now you`re talking about children with vaccines while he`s
standing in front of a plant in England trying to look more global --

WALSH: Right.

SHARPTON: -- with his political understanding. I mean, the question I
guess is fine. Everybody does what they do to show what they`re trying to
show to run for president. All of us that have ran did. But the question
is, what do you really believe in and where are -- where`s your central
standing ground?

WALSH: Right. And in the case of Kaci Hickox, he basically defied public
health. He was not symptomatic. What he did flew in the face of what
experts were advising, Reverend Al. And now, again when he met the
continuity in both cases, he`s ignoring public health experts, his setting
his own judgment, and he`s doing something that`s not advancing public
health.

SHARPTON: Rand Paul, it`s not just Christie. Rand Paul. Listen to what
Rand Paul had to say on CNBC.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. RAND PAUL (R), KENTUCKY: I think they`re a good thing, but I think
the parent should have some input. The state doesn`t own your children.

UNIDENTIFIED WOMAN: Okay.

PAUL: Parents own the children. And it is an issue of freedom.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SHARPTON: Freedom. I mean, is this a new talking point, Dana, with the
right? Freedom?

MILBANK: I don`t know what freedom is when they`re saying you own your
children. What are they, golden retrievers? I didn`t realize that parents
own children. But look, this is a fringe element that he`s representing.
The libertarians. You expect that kind of thing from Rand Paul. You don`t
expect it from the governor of New Jersey.

WALSH: Well, he went a little bit -- he went a little beyond what we
expect and parents owning their children really is a staple of right-wing
rhetoric. He also got abusive with the CNBC reporter today in a very
touchy way. So this whole thing I think is backfiring on him. Both he and
Chris Christie seem not to have thought very deeply about the implications
of what they`re doing and when they get political pushback, they seem
unprepared for it so that seems kind of lame to me.

SHARPTON: But isn`t -- well, let me ask this. When he ran for president,
Rick Perry in 2011 reversed himself on the HPV vaccine mandate in Texas
calling it a mistake because he was getting a lot of pressure from the
right. Quote, "The vaccine would encourage promiscuity, according to many
conservatives who had long supported Perry`s views against abortion and
same-sex marriage." Dana, I think you referred to it. Is this what
they`re trying to avoid?

MILBANK: Well, they seem to be stepping right back into that. That`s
presumably why Chris Christie made this sort of statement because he knows
about the trouble that Chris Christie got himself into. He knows that --

SHARPTON: You mean Rick Perry.

MILBANK: Sorry, Rick Perry did. And he knows that Michele Bachmann had
just a field day with that. And so, you know, the problem is whether
they`re talking about vaccination or about birth control. You can see why
they want to limit the number of debates on the republican side because
they get into president 19th Century debates here in the 21st Century.

SHARPTON: But isn`t that also part of what we`re looking at here, are
these guys ready for primetime politics? The big stage. Where you`re
going to have to deal with these issues and not stumble all over yourself
in talking about it.

WALSH: Right. It really seems like they`re not. And it`s somewhat
surprising with Chris Christie because he`s supposed to be the moderate.
He should not be, you know, appealing to the Michele Bachmann demographic
but it seems like he thinks that he`s got to.

SHARPTON: Dana Milbank and Joan Walsh. Thank you both for your time this
evening.

WALSH: Thanks, Rev.

MILBANK: Thanks, Reverend.

SHARPTON: Coming up, the epic Super Bowl ending. Some are calling it the
worst play call in sports history. Do you agree?

Plus, the ad that sparked outrage online. How far is too far?

And where does Katy Perry halftime show rank? Our Super Bowl after party
is next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SHARPTON: It was a game for the ages. The Super Bowl came down to the
very end and chances are, you watched the Patriots pull it off. It was the
most watched show in U.S. television history. Over 114 million tuned in.
Including my next guest.

Joining me for the after party, MSNBC`s Krystal Ball and CBS Sports Network
Dana Jacobson. Thank you both for being here.

DANA JACOBSON, CBS SPORTS NETWORK: Thanks, Rev.

KRYSTAL BALL, MSNBC CO-HOST, "THE CYCLE": Thanks for having us here after
party. It`s very exclusive.

JACOBSON: I agree. A list of two.

SHARPTON: How did you get tickets? Anyone want to guess where we`re
starting? Seahawks fans, please look away. Seattle only had to go half a
yard to win the game, but a Rookie who wasn`t even drafted saved the day
for the Patriots with a goal-line interception.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MAN: Play clock to five. Pass is intercepted at the goal
line by Malcolm Butler. Unreal.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SHARPTON: The "Seattle Times" calls it the worst call in Super Bowl
history, and many players agree. Dana, the Seahawks coach took the blame.
What`s your take?

JACOBSON: Somebody has to take the blame. I think it`s great that Pete
Carroll took the blame because that`s what you want in your head coach,
somebody who`s going to stand up and say --

BALL: A classy move.

JACOBSON: Yes, this was my fault. It was the worst call that I have ever
seen and I listened to Pete Carroll stand up there and say, blame me, don`t
blame Russell Wilson. Also saying, don`t blame my offensive coordinator
Darrell Bevell, this was on me. It was the worst call. You have Marshawn
Lynch. Give Marshawn Lynch the football. Let him get into the end zone.
I`ve heard this stat of this season 0 for five when the Seahawks were that
close to the end zone for Marshawn Lynch to get into the end zone, I don`t
care, it`s the Super Bowl, he had the ability to be your MVP. Give him the
football.

BALL: Dana is absolutely right. And to me, it`s not just that. It`s also
amazing that everybody thought, myself included, that they would run the
ball and still the Patriots were ready which is to me amazing.

JACOBSON: Right. You don`t want to take away from the Patriots and the
defense they had, but if you`re Pete Carroll in saying, it was my call and
it was my fault, call a time-out. You did have chances. You had time-
outs.

SHARPTON: Yes.

JACOBSON: Then if you didn`t like the way it looked, then it wasn`t the
right situation to run the ball --

SHARPTON: They were ready. The Patriots were ready.

BALL: I also don`t understand, I mean, the logic was we wanted to run down
the clock, right? So that the Patriots wouldn`t have another chance. You
also have to trust in your defense that if there`s ten seconds left on the
clock --

JACOBSON: Pretty good defense, too.

BALL: Seattle`s got a great defense. They could have absolutely handled
that.

SHARPTON: Well, now, I mean the conspiracy theories are crazed, but I
mean, no one can really make rhyme or reason out of this, but I`ve got to
give Malcolm credit. He`s a household name. He said that he had a vision
he was going to make a big play, and his vision ended up being absolutely
right.

JACOBSON: You know, we`ve heard so much about Russell Wilson, talks about
the visions that he has.

SHARPTON: Yes.

JACOBSON: He sees the whole game. It was sort of interesting now on the
flip side somebody else`s vision enabled them to make the play and that`s
how guys make names for themselves, get contracts. He wasn`t the MVP.
Brady was. But that moment, that`s the moment we`re going to remember.

BALL: Memorable moment, for sure.

SHARPTON: Well, now to the best and the worst of the Super Bowl
commercials. We saw it all this year from puppies trying to make their way
home, to dads emerging in various ads. Celebrity cameos including Liam
Neeson and few social media, a few had social media on fire including this
one for toenail fungus.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MAN: Toenail fungus? Don`t hide it. Tackle it with new FDA
approved Jublia. Jublia is a prescription medicine proven to treat toenail
fungus.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SHARPTON: But no commercial got people on social media fired up quite like
this nationwide ad.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED BOY: I`ll never learn to ride a bike. Or get cooties. And I
won`t ever get married. I couldn`t grow up because I died from an
accident.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SHARPTON: Krystal, what`s your take on it?

BALL: I don`t know what they were thinking. I don`t -- I know they wanted
to make a profound point. I know they wanted to make a big splash and
start this conversation, but there was no understanding of what your
audience would be doing at that moment. I mean, everybody`s at the party
having a beer wanting to celebrate yourself is concluded. I know you don`t
do such things.

SHARPTON: Right.

BALL: But wanting to celebrate. And then this commercial comes on. It
was a very unfortunate --

SHARPTON: They had to come out with a statement today.

BALL: Yes, that`s right.

JACOBSON: They did but I got to say, I`m almost on the flip side. I know
what you`re saying. It was, everybody was in the social setting and
celebrating. But that was the point of the ad. It got everybody`s
attention. If the idea was to raise awareness and say that there are these
preventable accidents that cause us to lose children in our lives, they did
that. They may have made us mad in that moment because my immediate
thought was this is horrible, you don`t have this now. But the reason --
they got to it.

SHARPTON: Yes. I guess it goes to what the goal was whether it was
awareness or whether you wanted customers. But we have to talk about the
halftime show. Katy Perry roared and soared. She started by taking the
reins of a giant lion to sing her hit song "roar." Then she danced with
two sharks. People on social media loved these guys. Miss Elliott and
Lenny Kravitz took the stage with her and then she literally soared through
the crowd singing her hit "Firework." Dana, what did you think? Not as
big as spectacular as some performances, but still well received.

JACOBSON: Yes, I will always be -- Prince will be my favorite I think
forever, but I loved -- we were talking about this, Krystal, the way she
came out on that lion. I was horrified, that people tweeted to me as a
lions fan from Detroit that`s the closest the lions will ever get to the
Super Bowl.

BALL: I don`t buying that.

SHARPTON: That`s mean. That`s mean.

JACOBSON: This so was Katy Perry. I mean, this was vintage her. This was
exactly what I wanted to see from her.

SHARPTON: What`s your favorite halftime show from the past, Krystal?

BALL: Actually, this is first time I have to say that I`ve actually gone
back and rewound it and watched the whole thing over. I actually missed
some of the game to go back and watch it again. I thought the part where
they had the optical illusion tilting the field was just unbelievable. The
only thing I didn`t like, I didn`t like the flame dress. Everything else I
thought was incredible.

JACOBSON: Didn`t do her justice.

BALL: And Missy Elliott, that performance was spectacular.

JACOBSON: Yes.

SHARPTON: Oh, yes!

BALL: And people are downloading her songs like crazy now.

JACOBSON: Even though she was humming.

SHARPTON: Yes. Missy Elliott and Malcolm with the Patriots --

JACOBSON: Butler. Yes.

BALL: Yes, absolutely.

SHARPTON: Malcolm Butler and Missy Elliott are the stars of this weekend.
No doubt about it. Dana, Krystal, please stay with me.

When we come back, how does President Obama watch football? And we`re
having a great after party here, but Jimmy Fallon had some fun in Phoenix
last night. That`s next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SHARPTON: We`re back with our Super Bowl after party. Krystal and Dana
join me. Before the big game started, President Obama met with "Today"
show host Savannah Guthrie over a beer, brewed at the White House.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SAVANNAH GUTHRIE, NBC NEWS CORRESPONDENT: While we`re having this beer,
football or basketball?

OBAMA: I`m still a basketball guy, but I love football.

GUTHRIE: Offense or defense?

OBAMA: Always o offense.

GUTHRIE: Wings or chips and guac?

OBAMA: Now, that`s tough. You know, I`m going to go chips and guac. I`m
a fanatic about guac.

GUTHRIE: Hillary Clinton or Joe Biden?

OBAMA: Love them both. Good try.

GUTHRIE: I had to try. I had to try.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SHARPTON: Krystal, not even the beer could get him to answer that Hillary
Clinton or Joe Biden question.

BALL: He was quick, man, right? I was with that, too. That was amazing.
I mean, obviously he selected both of them to be with him, and I`ll say in
terms of the way the race is shaking out, Joe Biden not looking so strong
in the polls. Several of President Obama`s key advisers have gone over to
support Hillary. It looks like they`re kind of tacitly backing her. And
Joe haven`t said a whole lot lately. So, even though the President is
never going to weigh in, there have been some sort of behind the scenes
moves more towards Hillary Clinton.

SHARPTON: Dana?

JACOBSON: You know, to me, I`d want to see those three sitting watching
the Super Bowl. I was impressed --

BALL: Now, that would be interesting.

JACOBSON: That would be interesting, yes. I was actually impressed
because I liked the setting. And I don`t know if that`s an NBC choice or
it was the White House choice, because to me, I`ve always sat there as a
football fan and said, why am I watching the President on Super Bowl
Sunday? I get it, it`s the audience is there, but I liked that they just
sort of kept that part to what --

BALL: Very smart.

JACOBSON: -- to what anybody would just want to see. It made me laugh. It
really did. I don`t think it was a tough choice between chips and guac.

BALL: A very relaxed setting.

SHARPTON: Very good in those settings.

JACOBSON: Yes.

BALL: Yes.

SHARPTON: All right. And Jimmy Fallon had his own after party last night.
The "Tonight Show" was on the road in Phoenix and celebrated with an epic
lip-synch battle.

(MUSIC PLAYING)

Dana, who are you taking in a battle like this, Jimmy Fallon, Will Ferrell,
or Kevin Hart?

JACOBSON: I can`t take any. I mean, I`m really torn. They were all
brilliant in their own way. Drew Barrymore jumping on.

SHARPTON: Yes.

JACOBSON: Honestly, I`m such a huge Will Ferrell fan. I would lean that
way. But Kevin Hart when he was singing John Legend to Will Ferrell, and I
know that Will Ferrell helped make that in what he was doing with him. But
that`s that improve moment between the two of them that was just --

SHARPTON: Both of them very, very talented.

BALL: We`re the real winners having gotten to witness that. I mean, Will
Ferrell, though, Beyonce "Drunken Love."

JACOBSON: On the floor.

BALL: That was unbelievable. As Jimmy Fallon said, you can`t un-see that,
although I see it in a good way.

JACOBSON: Yes.

SHARPTON: And that`s what you can keep running the tape back rewinding and
watching.

BALL: You can get a laugh out of that every time. I also liked his
rendition of "Let it Go."

SHARPTON: Well, I like the concept though. The whole idea of doing the
lip-synch I thought was brilliant for Jimmy Fallon.

JACOBSON: Yes. And it was great in the beginning, and it was Will Ferrell
who was up first, they`re lip-synching and they have the microphone there,
and then he likes, moves the mic behind him like obviously not going to
need this right now. I don`t need a microphone, thank you. Yes. It`s
great.

BALL: I think you should add a segment to POLITICS NATION, we can start a
lip-synch battle.

SHARPTON: A lip-synch battle.

JACOBSON: What`s the first song you do?

BALL: Oh, that`s a good question.

SHARPTON: Don`t give it away. Don`t give it away. I might do it.

JACOBSON: I might do it.

(LAUGHTER)

SHARPTON: Tonight, I`m going to cut you off. Dana, Krystal, thank you for
partying with us.

BALL: Thanks, Rev.

JACOBSON: Thank you.

SHARPTON: When we come back, why President Obama`s budget is not just a
document. But a moral statement on who he fights for.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SHARPTON: The plan President Obama released today isn`t just a budget.
It`s his vision for America. A moral document that seeks to answer one
pivotal question.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: Will we accept an economy where only a few of us do spectacularly
well? Or are we going to build an economy where everyone who works hard
has a chance to get ahead?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SHARPTON: That`s the question right now. Do we expand the American dream
for everyone? Or do we trust in the conservative idea that wealth will
trickle down from the rich? Look at this chart. Of the last 35 years, the
top .01 percent has seen an income grow by 600 percent, but the bottom 90
percent income has been stagnant. The President wants to change that. His
budget includes new funding for policies like head start, pre-k education,
childcare tax credits, vouchers for low-income housing, free community
college. Those are tools to help close the income gap. A blueprint to
move our society forward. A budget shows our values. I hope as we
negotiate in Washington we make Americans what is valuable.

Thanks for watching. I`m Al Sharpton. "HARDBALL" starts right now.


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